Speaking of Careers: What about being highly educated but in the 'wrong' fields?

[imagine.more]

Reading over the threads geared towards women suddenly looking for jobs in new fields or after a long break to raise children, etc. it occurred to me that a lot of these fields, while great, would be tougher to break into if you had *too much* education in the wrong field. 

 

Specifically, I'm thinking of my husband and his job hunt. He's got degrees, a BS in Sociology and an MDiv from a respected seminary. But, he's no longer working in ministry for various reasons and looking for jobs in other fields has been extremely difficult. His Sociology degree qualifies him for things like social work and entry level nonprofit work, which he'd like to do, but his Masters and 5 years experience as a full-time pastor at moderate sized churches mean a lot of places are not wanting to hire him because they think he'll ditch them after a year or two for something better. Ie, he's "overqualified". Jobs for which a Masters is appropriate also often don't want him because he's got the wrong degree and/or no experience in their specific field. So it's this odd place to be in. 

 

He's considered going back to school for a degree that wouldn't take too long but would pay well, but then we worry even if he did they'd overlook him because of the Masters of Divinity, kwim? 

 

So what do you do when you have a degree in humanities or religion or liberal arts and need to just get a job to pay the bills but your degree(s) make you look like a short-term candidate? Are there any careers that want a Bachelors/Masters but are more flexible in which field those degrees are in? 

[Crimson Wife]

Maybe a certificate in the field and then leave off the unrelated M.Div. Just because you've earned a degree does NOT obligate you to list it on the resume.

 

Now if he has to fill out a job application that requires listing every single degree and job, he needs to include it. The reason why is because if the would-be employer runs a background check and there are any discrepancies, he could have an offer rescinded.

[amy g.]

I read an article that said that sometimes it is better to leave the advance degree off of the resume.

[imagine.more]

Hm, interesting. That had never occurred to me and likely not to him I bet. Has anyone else here done that when job hunting?

 

Now I do know the entry-level BSA job he just lost to someone with a BS in education did run a background check so he needed to list it there. But I bet not everything would require that. 

[amy g.]

This might help.

 

http://www.askamanager.org/2012/05/ethics-and-your-resume.html

[LucyStoner]

Hm, interesting. That had never occurred to me and likely not to him I bet. Has anyone else here done that when job hunting?

 

Now I do know the entry-level BSA job he just lost to someone with a BS in education did run a background check so he needed to list it there. But I bet not everything would require that.

They generally couldn't find degrees you took that you don't list on a background check. They are looking to verify the claims you made on the resume and checking your credit and criminal history. Also, omitting an irrelevant degree is not at all the same thing as claiming a degree you don't have.

[LucyStoner]

Has he looked at religious non-profits? The MDiv might be to his credit there. It is also my experience that management and fundraising jobs at non-profits pay more than social work. Fundraisers have all kinds of backgrounds, MDiv to phDs in Art History to Masters in Art to no degree at all. There are short term part time certificate programs in non-profit management and fund raising. If he can write, pitch ideas, use databases fairly well and is committed to the cause, he can be a sucessful fundraiser. It's very much a learn on the job type thing. Catholic Community Charities or a Catholic healthcare organization might be a good place to start- I know a lot of people pass on these jobs because they are not Catholic. It appears that you are.

[imagine.more]

Yes he's applied probably 70/30% in favor of religious non-profits because we figured he'd have more respect for his Mdiv in the religious ones and obviously it's nice to work in an openly Christian atmosphere. The problem is he has no clear experience in fundraising and hasn't found the right place to give him a chance to prove himself. He's gotten a few interviews for such positions but usually gets turned up for someone younger with a degree that maybe lent itself more specifically to fundraising skills. One told him afterwards they'd love him and would have hired him for a better position but felt the position they were looking for paid too little and with a family he'd move on in a  couple years due to low pay. They must not know how little pastors get paid   :lol:  

 

[LucyStoner]

Yes he's applied probably 70/30% in favor of religious non-profits because we figured he'd have more respect for his Mdiv in the religious ones and obviously it's nice to work in an openly Christian atmosphere. The problem is he has no clear experience in fundraising and hasn't found the right place to give him a chance to prove himself. He's gotten a few interviews for such positions but usually gets turned up for someone younger with a degree that maybe lent itself more specifically to fundraising skills. One told him afterwards they'd love him and would have hired him for a better position but felt the position they were looking for paid too little and with a family he'd move on in a couple years due to low pay. They must not know how little pastors get paid :lol:

Has he considered volunteering in the field while he looks? It can help gain not only a resume item but a reference. Also, I've hired volunteers before.

[mommymilkies]

We are pretty much in the same boat.  Dh is both overeducated and undereducated for his field.  People want to pay less for people with a BS or the jobs he wants (teaching, mostly) require a PhD.  So he's stuck in the middle.  He wants to teach, not do research and write grant proposals, and we can't afford more higher ed, so we are stuck in the middle. Plus his field (STEM, even) is really oversaturated right now.  It's a tough position to be in.  I would leave the advanced degree off the application of write a cover letter addressing his degrees and hopes for how he'd fit into the position.  Best of luck.

[LucyStoner]

Also, he can take workshops and seminars with your local chapter of AFP. http://www.afpnet.org/?noredirect=1

 

Check with United Way and Idealist.org for listings of local jobs too- many non-profits don't bother with craigslist or general job listings.

 

Another option. He can make a list of jobs in the area he'd like and then call and schedule informational interviews.

 

He can also start studying some basic fundraising and non-profit management concepts. Kim Klein was a woman who finished her MDiv, went off to intern at a church shelter, fell into fundraising because it was desperately needed for them to keep the doors open, and never looked back. She has authored a number of excellent books on the subject. I've attended workshops with her and she is amazing. Penelope Burke is another solid read.

 

It takes more than applying for jobs to break into a new field oftentimes.

 

BSA is an organization that is almost all fundraising and marketing but rapid advancement possibilities.

 

No need to tell any potential employer about having kids until after he is hired.

[imagine.more]

We are pretty much in the same boat. Dh is both overeducated and undereducated for his field. People want to pay less for people with a BS or the jobs he wants (teaching, mostly) require a PhD. So he's stuck in the middle. He wants to teach, not do research and write grant proposals, and we can't afford more higher ed, so we are stuck in the middle. Plus his field (STEM, even) is really oversaturated right now. It's a tough position to be in. I would leave the advanced degree off the application of write a cover letter addressing his degrees and hopes for how he'd fit into the position. Best of luck.

I'm sorry you guys are in the same position, and in a STEM field too, how frustrating!

[imagine.more]

Also, he can take workshops and seminars with your local chapter of AFP. http://www.afpnet.org/?noredirect=1

 

Check with United Way and Idealist.org for listings of local jobs too- many non-profits don't bother with craigslist or general job listings.

 

Another option. He can make a list of jobs in the area he'd like and then call and schedule informational interviews.

 

He can also start studying some basic fundraising and non-profit management concepts. Kim Klein was a woman who finished her MDiv, went off to intern at a church shelter, fell into fundraising because it was desperately needed for them to keep the doors open, and never looked back. She has authored a number of excellent books on the subject. I've attended workshops with her and she is amazing. Penelope Burke is another solid read.

 

It takes more than applying for jobs to break into a new field oftentimes.

 

BSA is an organization that is almost all fundraising and marketing but rapid advancement possibilities.

 

No need to tell any potential employer about having kids until after he is hired.

Yep, he's doing all those. I'll pass those books along, they sound right up his alley!

 

Unfortunately during his last interview he was asked if he had kids and what ages, so of course he answered. Hard to dodge if you're asked outright and I'm sure they'd say it didn't factor in but sometimes I think it does to certain people.

 

Funnily enough his sister is also struggling to find a job and she has an ivy league education and a masters degree and one year grantwriting experience.

[FO4UR]

We have btdt.

 

I think the stats I heard last are 1 out of 12 people with an MDIV actually make a living in the ministry a decade later.

 

 

If your dh can make it clear that he's not looking to bide his time until a ministry position opens, that might help.

 

Also, he might be able to find work at a church that is not ministerial, or at least not the executive pastor position.  In some large churches, the janitor makes a better living than most pastors of small churches.  In a large church, he could focus just on one age group or on one aspect of the church (Children's Minister or Minister of Education, Music Minister, etc...).  

 

And, it isn't right or fair, but people will look at how many kids you have and at the fact that you are currently expecting AND that you homeschool, and they will lump you into a category with the Duggars.  sigh...

 

Chaplaincy is a good option.

[LucyStoner]

Yep, he's doing all those. I'll pass those books along, they sound right up his alley!

 

Unfortunately during his last interview he was asked if he had kids and what ages, so of course he answered. Hard to dodge if you're asked outright and I'm sure they'd say it didn't factor in but sometimes I think.

He doesn't want to work for a place so unprofessional that they would ask him that. I once left an interview, politely but telling them very directly why I was withdrawing myself from consideration because they asked me no fewer than three totally illegal questions. The person who got the job quit within several months. So consider it a blessing when people wave such red flags around.

[mathnerd]

My DS's private school has a History and Logic teacher who also had a Mdiv and was working as a missionary in Africa for a few years. He wanted to enter the workforce and the school hired him for this job (private school and they train their teachers themselves, so no credentialing needed). It is a very good private school, so the benefits are good and they hired this teacher's wife for the job of elementary teacher too. I though that teaching in private schools could be an option if he is interested.

[Liz CA]

I am with "amy g" on this one. When I was just looking for a parti-time office job 7 years ago, I did not list qualifications / degrees that had no bearing on this job.

Leave it off unless the MDiv is crucial for the field he is applying to. Play up other experiences and any volunteer work of work within the ministry that contributes to the current job goals.

[Lanny]

OP: Unless your DH is applying to companies/institutions known to be friendly to those with Judeo Christian beliefs, I believe he should leave off his Religious education. Some will eliminate him from consideration, because of his Christian beliefs.

 

Has he considered becoming an Insurance Agent?  That's like selling cars, or real estate, and the majority of those who begin, fail, during the first year, but I suspect he has an interest in people and that he could help people (his customers) doing that, along with making $ for your family.

 

One of my late friends (he was a graduate of Tech, I think in Business) was an Independent Insurance Agent all of his adult life. He sold Life, Major Medical, Disability and other kinds of insurance. He liked to help people and in the process he made money.

 

Another path is to become an agent for a company like State Farm. With time, the customer base builds and builds and it is a good business.

 

GL to your DH and your family!

[G5052]

A friend of ours has a graduate degree in economics from a very prestigious university in Europe, and she leaves it off because she works in ESOL and went back and got a master's in that.  It has never come up that she doesn't list it.