More pondering on how to list foreign language on transcript

[elegantlion]

If ds continues on projected path he will have 4 years of Japanese and 2 years of Russian (possibly) in high school. However, because we've gone wider and taken our time with Japanese (assume we'll do the same with Russian), and they are both difficult languages, I don't want to misrepresent his abilities. It won't be equivalent to what I did in 4 years in high school with Spanish.

 

We'll probably get through Intermediate level books in Japanese and beginner in Russian. We can't afford a tutor and language opportunities are slim around here. We may try to do a proficiency test if offered. 

 

Instead of listing Japanese I-IV on the transcript, I'm considering listing the credits as: 

 

Beginning Japanese I

Beginning Japanese II

Intermediate Japanese I

Intermediate Japanese II

 

and probably listing Russian the same way. According to the Japanese college classes I've looked up, we're covering about the same amount in a year that they do in a semester. Listing them this way feels more honest to me. Has anyone listed language classes this way? 

 

[JanetC]

If you are covering the same amount in a year as a college covers in a semester, you are going at a standard high school level pace. You can't give him honors credit for that, but you don't have to sell it short, either. Don't make it look like you did less than a high school level class.

 

Are there any standardized tests you could use to convey his actual learning level? Otherwise, just document his level as best as you can.

[jhschool]

nm

[jhschool]

wait--I just re-read your OP.

 

You say "it's not equivalent to what I did over 4 years in Spanish."

 

When I first read it, I assumed you meant your child did more.

 

Did your child do less?  Sorry--I need clarification.  If I'm wrong, disregard

my previous post.

[kiana]

It is usual for a student who has taken 4 years of Japanese to have less conversational and reading ability than a student who has taken 4 years of Spanish, FWIW.

[Julie of KY]

Did he do four years worth of work in the four years or did you spread 2-3 years of Japanese over four years. I'd give him credit for the amount of work done. If he did four credits worth, don't shortchange him by labeling it where it looks like it might be more like two credits of work. If he did only two credits worth over four years, I'd label it like you have above and give year a half credit.

[elegantlion]

If you are covering the same amount in a year as a college covers in a semester, you are going at a standard high school level pace. You can't give him honors credit for that, but you don't have to sell it short, either. Don't make it look like you did less than a high school level class.

 

Are there any standardized tests you could use to convey his actual learning level? Otherwise, just document his level as best as you can.

 

There are a few tests, I'm not sure what I can find in this area, however, as Japanese is not a commonly taught language around here. The International proficiency test is only given 5 hours away, not sure if that will be in the budget. 

 

wait--I just re-read your OP.

 

You say "it's not equivalent to what I did over 4 years in Spanish."

 

When I first read it, I assumed you meant your child did more.

 

Did your child do less?  Sorry--I need clarification.  If I'm wrong, disregard

my previous post.

 

Well, I took four years of high school Spanish from a native speaker. Also, Spanish is a much easier language, but I have a certain perception of what four years of language instruction would look like, probably skewed by my experience. 

 

It is usual for a student who has taken 4 years of Japanese to have less conversational and reading ability than a student who has taken 4 years of Spanish, FWIW.

 

That's good to hear, and what I would expect, but it's hard to not compare. 

 

Did he do four years worth of work in the four years or did you spread 2-3 years of Japanese over four years. I'd give him credit for the amount of work done. If he did four credits worth, don't shortchange him by labeling it where it looks like it might be more like two credits of work. If he did only two credits worth over four years, I'd label it like you have above and give year a half credit.

 

At this point, we're only two years into the study. He's done enough hours to earn a credit each year. However, we've gone wider using multiple resources instead of one book, so we're not as far along in those books. It's the Goldilocks syndrome, each program has something good, but none of them fits well enough to use it alone. Plus, we're learning together. Next year I plan on cutting down to one or two programs and then using one of them his senior year. 

 

Part of the issue (which I need to check into) is that I don't want schools to assume he's at a certain level of proficiency because of 4 years of study. I guess I need to look into other high school Japanese programs and see what they cover. 

[kiana]

 

Part of the issue (which I need to check into) is that I don't want schools to assume he's at a certain level of proficiency because of 4 years of study. I guess I need to look into other high school Japanese programs and see what they cover.

 

Schools almost always do placement by placement test rather than by "x years in high school" simply because of the variability from school to school. Many students have 4 years of "Spanish" and still can't place out of Spanish 1, just because it was a bad class/bad school/student slid by/whatever.

 

[Kareni]

Are there any standardized tests you could use to convey his actual learning level?

 

I see that there is a SAT Subject Test in Japanese (with Listening).  It appears to be offered once a year in November.

 

ETA: More information and a practice test can be found here.

 

Regards,

Kareni

[SoCalLynn]

I'm so glad I read through this thread. My daughter is also taking Japanese, and because it is more difficult (seems to me anyway) than Spanish I was also wondering how to give credit. She definitely puts in enough hours for regular credit.

[Sebastian (a lady)]

Languages are so different that it's hard to say exactly where a student should be after x years across languages. Japanese has kanji and two kana to master. It has different levels of formality than other languages.

 

You might try searching for some high school Japanese syllabi to compare. An AP level is typically taken after 4-5 years of study in high school. And remember you can give details in the course description.

[jhschool]

If your student has put in 4 credits' worth in hours, but has

only covered 2 years' worth of high school credits, I would

list what you proposed in your OP and give 0.5 credits for each 

course.

 

If your student has covered between 3 and 4 years' worth of

high school credits, and has 4 credits' worth in hours, I would

list them as Japanese 1, 2, 3, 4, and give 1.0 credits for each

course.

 

Have your student take a practice Subject Test in Japanese

and a practice AP Test in Japanese.  See what happens.  If

your child does well in either, I would give the 1.0 credits

for each course and call them Japanese 1,2,3,4.

The subject tests in Spanish, French, and Latin really

need 4 years' worth of real studying to do well in them.

I will assume it's the same for Japanese.  And if your child

does well on the AP Japanese test, then it's clearly 4 

years' worth of courses and you should award 4 credits

for the work done.

[maize]

I had a friend in college who had taken 4 years of Japanese in high school but chose to take Japanese 101 when she got to college, she just didn't feel like she had learned that much in her high school courses. She was coming out of the public school system in California.

[elegantlion]

Languages are so different that it's hard to say exactly where a student should be after x years across languages. Japanese has kanji and two kana to master. It has different levels of formality than other languages.

 

You might try searching for some high school Japanese syllabi to compare. An AP level is typically taken after 4-5 years of study in high school. And remember you can give details in the course description.

 

I spent part of the morning googling. I found some good resources and everyone was different. So now, I need to read through them. I did find that spread out second year studies into multiple semesters. Yet these are all with competent teachers. We're basically doing self-study. 

 

If your student has put in 4 credits' worth in hours, but has

only covered 2 years' worth of high school credits, I would

list what you proposed in your OP and give 0.5 credits for each 

course.

 

If your student has covered between 3 and 4 years' worth of

high school credits, and has 4 credits' worth in hours, I would

list them as Japanese 1, 2, 3, 4, and give 1.0 credits for each

course.

 

Have your student take a practice Subject Test in Japanese

and a practice AP Test in Japanese.  See what happens.  If

your child does well in either, I would give the 1.0 credits

for each course and call them Japanese 1,2,3,4.

The subject tests in Spanish, French, and Latin really

need 4 years' worth of real studying to do well in them.

I will assume it's the same for Japanese.  And if your child

does well on the AP Japanese test, then it's clearly 4 

years' worth of courses and you should award 4 credits

for the work done.

 

The coverage is what I'm looking into. Because we're using multiple resources it's not as easy as say Genki chapters 1-6 for year one. I did find that many instructors also don't use one source for Japanese, so we're not alone in that. He'll have the hours no problem. 

 

 

I had a friend in college who had taken 4 years of Japanese in high school but chose to take Japanese 101 when she got to college, she just didn't feel like she had learned that much in her high school courses. She was coming out of the public school system in California.

 

Only two of the schools he is considering offer Japanese. From the info I've looked at so far and what we have covered, by that time he could possibly test out of at least a semester without issue. Then again he could say he's done and just practice on his own, he wants to cover other languages in college too. 

 

I'm sure I'm overthinking this (it's my specialty).