Shipping damage - What is the customer's responsibility? (update)

[PollyOR]

Normally I buy a book here or there.  The packages are small and light weight and therefore less likely to get damaged during shipping.

 

A few years ago I made a large order and the box arrived damaged.   I seriously couldn't believe that it was still holding together.  Quite a few book corners were bent but I didn't complain because all books were accounted for.  I remember thinking at the time they should have split the order and shipped it in two boxes.  I felt it was the business's responsibility to make sure the books made it safely to my door by packing the books properly.

 

I recently made another large order.  Even though the order was split between two boxes, one of the boxes was torn open and then reconstructed (seriously!).  Quite a few books were missing.  I have called the company I ordered from and they are working on getting the missing items to me.  But, something was said during the conversation on the phone that made me realize that it might be partially my fault for choosing to ship such a large order using the USPS's book rate.  The business representative mentioned that the boxes are often damaged by the USPS.  As the customer I did not know about the failure rate but I wasn't surprised either.

 

What is the purchaser's responsibility for items damaged in transit?  Is their more responsibility if they choose the USPS over another shipping company like UPS?

 

 

UPDATE:

I am happy to report that the company shipped the missing books to me via UPS.  They box was in very good condition and the books were pristine.  

 

In the future I will be carefully weighing the shipping options and if saving a few dollars is worth the possible loss and disappointment.  The company was great to work with  and it ended well for me, but ultimately their loss will be passed along to the customer - you and me.

[Farrar]

Since the business is the one who ends up bearing the brunt of the problem when things aren't right, and they know there's a bigger risk by shipping that way, I would think it's really on them to at the very least warn customers.  How could you be expected to know that as a casual consumer?  But this is their whole business.

[readwithem]

I have purchased a lot of books for the school where I tutor from one particular discount vendor.  They tend to have a coupon for $20 off $120 of books so I have placed a lot of orders that way.  About this time last year, I had a LOT of damaged books - books were crammed into each other in the boxes, and their boxes were extremely flimsy.  They gave me a credit of about $300 and told me they didn't want the books back.  I've noticed they have much sturdier boxes now - I like to think I had something to do with their changing their boxes :D

 

Really if it's a vendor (not an individual), they should know how to package their books so they're not damaged in transit.  I don't think it's your fault but the vendor - if their business is to sell and ship books.

[Erica in OR]

Sounds like bunk to me. Not your responsibility. If they know there's issues, they either need to change their ordering process to throw up a flag while you're ordering so you're aware of potential issues and can select accordingly, or their packaging/shipping process, or both.

 

Erica in OR

[tabinfl]

In case you don,t already: I photograph any damaged packaging on arrival, along with the contents as I open it. Depending on the shipping arrangements, the photos can help either the seller or you file a claim with the shipper. I beleive only the shipper can actually dile the claim (and in some cases only if insurance was purchased), and the shippers generally won't cover items "improperkly packaged," but the photos help. It sounds like the sellers are trying to offer a lowest-cost shipping option by packaging many books together & sending by slow boat. i'm not sure how much a buyer should be expected to know about the risks of such a choice, unless insirance is also offered and declined -- if you made the choice not to insure, I'd put more of the responsibility on your end. If the books weren't packed well, that's on the shipper.

 

USPS is very dicey in my ecperience compare to UPS, FedEx, even DHL. We ship some things priority mail, but first class and below we've had poor results with (there was a time when we were seeing above 5% loss rate on bog standard business letters mailed from our office, iIhaven't checked on it since we moved and changed POs).

[stripe]

 But, something was said during the conversation on the phone that made me realize that it might be partially my fault for choosing to ship such a large order using the USPS's book rate.  The business representative mentioned that the boxes are often damaged by the USPS.  As the customer I did not know about the failure rate but I wasn't surprised either.

 

What is the purchaser's responsibility for items damaged in transit?  

USPS doesn't really seem to take responsibility if items are damaged, maybe having insurance changes that, but ultimately it is the seller's responsibility to get items to you. It is in no way your responsibility to know which method is most reliable -- they should only use methods they are comfortable with. If a seller thinks a method is unreliable, THEY should refuse to use it. You see, for example, eBay buyers who won't ship to certain countries because they think that country's post office is unreliable. 

 

Even this business of sellers warning about purchasing insurance -- that is for the SELLER, not the buyer, because if your thing doesn't arrive, it's their problem, not yours.

 

The other thing is - they could have shipped media mail in multiple containers, not one or two enormous ones. Those are obviously more likely to fall apart. Book Depository, for instance, always sends things singly. I imagine there are multiple reasons for this, but one consequence is that there wouldn't be any giant boxes that go missing.

 

I have had multiple packages shipped via USPS (both internationally and domestic, many media mail but not all) that were damaged or items fell out (most, in my opinion, because the packaging was insufficient, for example the self-adhesive came open). In every single case where I complained, the business immediately gave me a refund. Including where the book fell out and was lost. It is NOT your fault. If they won't give you a replacement or refund, I think you should complain to the credit card with which you paid, if indeed you did use one, or PayPal. This is another reason not to use a check.

[Meriwether]

I have a big gripe against the USPS. It irks me that anyone has to buy insurance. If I contract with you to deliver a package, it should be delivered in good condition. If it isn't, you have broken the contract and should make that right.  Besides that rant, the seller, not the buyer, is responsible to get the product to the buyer in good condition. They choose the packing materials and methods as well as the shipping options. That is all on them. 

[stripe]

The USPS is including free insurance and/or tracking with a lot of their services now, by the way. And things like media mail are scheduled to be delivered a week later (my experience, based on sending across the country), rather than arriving up to 4 weeks later, or more.

[duckens]

 

I have a big gripe against the USPS. It irks me that anyone has to buy insurance.

 I would only buy insurance if the value of the item was greater than what an average package would be expected to be valued at.

 

For example:

I could mail a box of paper clips to you, or I could mail a family heirloom (4+ generations) amethyst ring to you.  Both would be about the same size, weight, and cost to mail cross-country.  However, if the ring goes missing or damaged, replacement costs are going to be a whole heck of a lot higher than to replace the damaged paperclips.

 

Another example:

I could ship a fancy modern bookshelf to you (made with bamboo, so very hip, green, and strong), or I can ship a particleboard bookshelf to you from Walmart.  Again, both probably cost about the same to ship (for size and weight), but the value inside would indicate insurance in one case, but not another.

 

The responsibility is the seller's to replace if a package is damaged.  If a seller is unhappy (and has to replace too many packages) because of a poor delivery system, then it is the seller's responsibility to not offer that delivery choice any longer.  It is not unusual at all for nearly all companies to ship solely by USPS or solely by UPS, and the buyer has no choice.

 

If the seller is unhappy with too many items needing to be replaced for damage, they need to package their merchandise better, buy insurance on everything, or change their shipping options.  The consumer has no power over the company to dictate that any of these three things happen.  Only the company can make these decisions.

 

Likewise, if a delivery service has too many damaged packages, they will lose business, and their market share and profits will take a nosedive.

 

Go, Capitalism!

[stripe]

I also try to buy from companies who have been pleasant and prompt about handling problems. Any company that gave me the run around after I bought a huge order would NOT get any repeat business. Beast Academy had a problem with their boxes coming open or something, when they first came out -- a lot of members on here posted about this, and AOPS was prompt in replacing. Amazon is also good. I have had other companies that I buy from regularly change their packaging after I had a lot of problems, so I suspect I was NOT the only one with packages popping open in transit.

[StartingOver]

If I order books, I expect them to be in good condition when they get to me, or I expect them to be replaced. But I rarely use USPS to get books. Either way, I ordered new books, I want new books.

[teeniebeenie6]

I think you have no responsibility. They should be packing their packages better. Was the bookseller betterworldbooks by any chance. 

[PollyOR]

I appreciate everyone who has replied. The business has been great to work with and they are shipping out another package to replace what was lost.  They are definitely taking a loss on this.  If I bought the items individually it would cost me approximately $250+ to replace them.

 

 

I think you have no responsibility. They should be packing their packages better. Was the bookseller betterworldbooks by any chance. 

 

The second box we received was packed well.  The damaged box had had one whole side almost ripped off.  It was only attached to the base of the box.  A postal worker had done a beautiful ;) job reconstructing the box but 1/2 the contents were missing.

[TGHEALTHYMOM]

I forgot to insure a box last year I was sending to a consignment store... it was totally destroyed and the USPS sent me a form to fill out listing the books... and the label off of the box.... I lost my list and could not remember exactly what was in it.  Now I just think I won't sell anything from November to January. If I ever do again I will make sure to get insurance.  

 

On the other end, it is up to the seller to make sure the packages are in good sturdy boxes and I use Paypal to get protection as a buyer.  It seems like buyers do have more protection.

I hate that I lost the books and money. The store was upset too but not out anything.  

 

.

[stripe]

I think you have no responsibility. They should be packing their packages better. Was the bookseller betterworldbooks by any chance. 

Better World Books shipped a GIANT order of heavy books (inc textbooks) across the world for me (combining orders, which irritated me, because I'd placed two medium sized orders on purpose -- to prevent the giant box phenomenon). The recipient informed me that it was in VERY rough shape when it arrived, and looked like it had gone to another country first, and was torn and had been patched back together. Anyway, when the recipient listed the contents, one book was missing. Better World refunded me for that item immediately, as soon as I informed them of the problem. I have ordered more than ten *large* orders with heavy textbooks and the like, from them to be shipped across the globe, and the few problems I had were handled promptly and without fuss, I definitely give them credit for that. I personally have been very pleased with them. I have the name of the shipper they use somewhere, anyway, they have some service that handles their international packages, it must give them a good discount. 

[PollyOR]

update in first post