When is music considered a course vs an extracurricular activity?

[lewelma]

I have begun planning for High School and have been reading the threads about 150 hours per course. I have also seen people count musical instruments as an extracurricular activity.

 

So here is my dilemma. My ds is definitely going for a STEM major. He is very interested in theoretical physics or engineering. He also loves his music. He practices an hour a day, and takes a 1 hour theory class, a 1 hour string quartet class, and a 1 hour private lesson with a violinist from the NZ Orchestra each week. He is also following the Royal School (ABRSM) curriculum and taking their exams (level 5 practical and level 4 theory this November). Can this be considered a course or is it just an extracurricular? It just seems that he is always out of time or exhausted with his academic course load. I don't think he is doing too much, but then again I have been considering music to be extracurricular. To get into University either here or in the US in a STEM major requires quite a few hard-core courses, and I don't know that music will count. It definitely takes up time, though.

 

Thanks for any ideas or suggestions,

 

Ruth in NZ

[regentrude]

I think you can decide whether you want to count music as a course or an extracurricular. Students in US high schools get a credit for their band or choir participation- the same as they would if the hour was spent on math.

 

You could also divide it and use part of his activities as a class (for example the theory course and lessons) and another part as an extracurricular (for example string quartet). Other divisions are possible.

 

The reason I count DD's choir as extracurricular and not as music class is simply because we need to save something to list as extracurriculars since colleges want to see some, and we have other stuff to fulfill the fine arts credit.

[Jenny in Florida]

I think you can decide whether you want to count music as a course or an extracurricular. Students in US high schools get a credit for their band or choir participation- the same as they would if the hour was spent on math.

 

You could also divide it and use part of his activities as a class (for example the theory course and lessons) and another part as an extracurricular (for example string quartet). Other divisions are possible.

 

The reason I count DD's choir as extracurricular and not as music class is simply because we need to save something to list as extracurriculars since colleges want to see some, and we have other stuff to fulfill the fine arts credit.

 

Exactly. You get to decide what makes sense for your particular student.

 

I count my son's choir participation for school credit, because it's a serious, teaching ensemble. They rehearse and perform a lot, and there is music theory instruction as well as just learning songs and singing.

 

I don't count his theatre activities for school, because fine and performing arts are already accounted for on his transcript and most of the shows he does don't have a specific or intentional academic component.

 

As regentrude said, you have lots of options. There are about as many ways to handle this as there are students, I would guess.

[Ellie]

Sounds like a course in fine arts to me. :)

[Jennay]

When I was in school, band participation was a credit per year but private lessons were considered extra-curricular. That's what I plan to do with my dc. However, I also plan to give credit for a theory course and music appreciation. However, this is a few years in the future for me!

[Rhonda in TX]

I'm leaning towards orchestra credit, but don't really have to decide yet. It will depend on if they need the elective hours. I like the idea of credit for theory, but have the quartet ensemble be extra-curricular.

[dirty ethel rackham]

I would give fine arts credit. My kids took piano with a strong theory base. I didn't care if those who went to school could only put this down as an extra-curricular. This was their only music instruction. So, for my oldest, I only gave a 1/2 credit in fine arts because that is what I felt it deserved. Also, for my son, I did it pass/fail because I didn't have an objective measurement to give a grade. Not one college questioned it.

[lewelma]

Thanks everyone for your responses. I am still trying to get my head around the system here in NZ. University entrance is based solely on exams, so I don't really need any extra curricular activities. But if we move or he decides to go to a US university, I want to make sure he has what it would take to get in to a good one.

 

I appreciate all the advice.

 

Ruth

[Ellie]

When I was in school, band participation was a credit per year but private lessons were considered extra-curricular. That's what I plan to do with my dc. However, I also plan to give credit for a theory course and music appreciation. However, this is a few years in the future for me!

But the OP's child doesn't have band plus private lessons. There are only private lessons. With the amount of time spent on instruction (three hours a week) and practice (an hour a day), plus the curriculum (which includes their exams), plus all the performances...that's plenty of hours to count as a fine arts credit. :)

[lewelma]

But the OP's child doesn't have band plus private lessons. There are only private lessons. With the amount of time spent on instruction (three hours a week) and practice (an hour a day), plus the curriculum (which includes their exams), plus all the performances...that's plenty of hours to count as a fine arts credit. :)

 

Boy, you paid attention. Yes, 3 hours of instruction, 1 hour theory homework, and 6 hours practical practice per week, plus 4 performances each year.

 

Thought you might be interested to know that the ABRSM curriculum includes:

 

Practical exam in front of an examiner from the UK,

1. scales

2. sight reading

3. aural skill

4. performance with a piano accompanist

These exams take 6 months to prep for.

 

The written theory exam is a separate 2 hour exam

 

ABRSM is challenging and great!

Edited May 26, 2012 by lewelma

[Mama Lynx]

I'd definitely count the theory as credit, if nothing else. Like others have said, my private lessons were counted as extracurricular, but my choir and theory were high school classes, and I got credit for them.

 

In the US, it might work to his credit to have such a strong musical background when going for a STEM major (as long as he also has the strong science and math required). Colleges may view him as more well-rounded. At any rate, unless his science and math aren't strong enough I cannot imagine music courses being *detrimental* to getting into college in the U.S.

[Dmmetler]

I'd list it as "Applied Piano". As a (former) music faculty adviser, I wouldn't even blink seeing that on the transcript for a student who is taking nationally adjudicated exams each year, provided the exam scores are solid. 1 hour of private studio time is considered a 3 credit hour course at the college level, so I'd have no trouble counting it at the high school level as well with a juried exam at the end. "Applied", at the college level (in the USA, at least) indicates private lessons.

 

I would not list theory as theory unless it's truly equivalent to a full-semester university course, because when we see "Music Theory" on the transcript, that's what we expect in a student, since so few schools offer theory as a high school course except to give students advanced placement (usually not a formal AP course-most music schools don't accept it, and almost all give their own exams for placement purposes). Now, since he's doing private lessons and sitting for a National exam-it may be. But I'd check with the instructor as to whether his skills are at a level that a year of theory would typically place him out of a semester of college theory before giving credit AS theory on the transcript. It could be listed as "Music reading", "Songwriting", or "Music appreciation", though, without any issue whatsoever, because most high schools offer a class for students not planning to major in music that provides basic awareness, and his exams certainly will document competence at that level.

 

 

And FWIW, it's very, very common, at least at my college, to have STEMS majors taking music courses and sometimes even getting music scholarships. It can be tough when students need to audition for placement in the music department AND take exams for placement in STEMS programs on the same weekend-and every year there are a couple who do.

Edited May 26, 2012 by dmmetler

[Xander]

I would not list theory as theory unless it's truly equivalent to a full-semester university course, because when we see "Music Theory" on the transcript, that's what we expect in a student, since so few schools offer theory as a high school course except to give students advanced placement (usually not a formal AP course-most music schools don't accept it, and almost all give their own exams for placement purposes). Now, since he's doing private lessons and sitting for a National exam-it may be. But I'd check with the instructor as to whether his skills are at a level that a year of theory would typically place him out of a semester of college theory before giving credit AS theory on the transcript.

 

The UCAS tariff for AP music theory is:

5 - 50 points

4 - 35 points

3 - 20 points

 

The only ABRSM theory exams which attract 20 or more UCAS points are:

Grade 7 distinction - 20 points

Grade 8 pass - 20 points

Grade 8 merit - 25 points

Grade 8 distinction - 30 points

 

ABRSM exams below grade 6 carry no UCAS points.

 

(UCAS isn't relevant for US/NZ college admissions, but it's a useful reference when trying compare exams from different systems.)

[Xander]

Thought you might be interested to know that the ABRSM curriculum includes:

 

Practical exam in front of an examiner from the UK,

1. scales

2. sight reading

3. aural skill

4. performance with a piano accompanist

These exams take 6 months to prep for.

 

The written theory exam is a separate 2 hour exam

 

ABRSM is challenging and great!

 

Anyone interested in the details can download the current syllabuses here:

http://www.abrsm.org/en/exams/gradedMusicExams/latestSyllabuses.html

 

AB offers graded music exams in theory and various practical subjects. It's not a curriculum as such, though some music teachers may design their curricula around the relevant exam requirements.

 

There is no fixed preparation time for the exams. Some kids might spend a year or more learning their exam pieces and technical work, but others will need only a few weeks to do it all.

 

Similar exams are offered by Trinity Guildhall and LCM:

http://www.trinitycollege.co.uk/site/?id=1045

http://www.uwl.ac.uk/lcmexams/Subjects.jsp

[lewelma]

I would not list theory as theory unless it's truly equivalent to a full-semester university course, because when we see "Music Theory" on the transcript, that's what we expect in a student, since so few schools offer theory as a high school course except to give students advanced placement... Now, since he's doing private lessons and sitting for a National exam-it may be. But I'd check with the instructor as to whether his skills are at a level that a year of theory would typically place him out of a semester of college theory before giving credit AS theory on the transcript.

Well, my plan was for him to study for and take a theory exam each year until he finished grade 8, which given that he is taking grade 4 in 7th grade has him finishing theory in 11th grade. Are you saying that I should only put it on his transcript in 11th grade because that is the year where the exam would be equivalent to University level?

 

Ruth

[lewelma]

In the US, it might work to his credit to have such a strong musical background when going for a STEM major (as long as he also has the strong science and math required). Colleges may view him as more well-rounded. At any rate, unless his science and math aren't strong enough I cannot imagine music courses being *detrimental* to getting into college in the U.S.

 

He has the math and science (see siggy). My concern is that music is taking enough time that it is stealing energy from other subjects. Lets say a student should take 6 courses in high school every year; if he can count music, then that is one less course he has to take to fulfill his graduation requirement. For example, each year he could take:

 

math

science

english

mandarin

music

history/economics/government

 

It sounds like everyone here thinks that he is doing enough music to count. And that I might even be able to count music theory as an additional course in his last year, if we need to.

 

Ruth

[Emerald Stoker]

nm