Vaccines

[toawh]

I grew up in a religious community that did not vaccinate. When I had my kids I was still in this community so they were not vaccinated. Now I'm not there anymore and not sure if I should or not. I'm not really sure why I haven't yet. I guess it's because I'm not sure why I should either. We will be moving to France in June where I know diptheria, polio and tetanus vaccines are mandatory. I don't know if I should choose to only do these which I know will be a battle with the doctors, or go with the mainstream, which I know my relatives will look down on me for. I guess I want to know why I'm pushing for this or letting it go. So...

If you do or do not vaccinate please can you tell me why. My kids are all healthy at present; there are no concerns there.

Please no taking offense at others choices, if possible. :001_smile: I want to feel I've heard both sides well before making a decision.

Thanx.

Edited April 13, 2012 by toawh
clarification

[Seeking Squirrels]

I decided against vaccinating one vaccine at a time. I researched each one and weighed all the factors together. Ingredients, rare vs common disease, serious vs mild typical outcomes. I also factored in that DD would not be in daycare and was breastfed and that DH does not have high exposure to stuff (like say a nurse or doctor would).

 

If you're unsure, I would recommend reading up about them so you can make a fully educated decision. It's not something that you can find your right answer by deciding whether to go with the doctors or family. There is no one right answer for vaccines. It depends on your specific circumstances, how you feel about the ingredients, and how you weigh the other factors.

 

I started with The Vaccine Book by Dr. Sears and from there researched further where needed. I felt he did a pretty good job of giving a solid look at things without being drastically one way or the other.

[DianeW88]

I suggest you search these forums using the word "vaccine" and see what you come up with. These threads usually end badly and almost always have posts (if not the entire thread) deleted or locked. This is an issue with passionate opinions on both sides.

 

I'm a nurse and pro-vaccine. If you are asking for yourself as an adult which vaccines you need, I suggest TDaP, MMR, Polio (although you won't encounter wild polio in this country, you may overseas), and chicken pox (if you didn't have the illness as a child...it's HORRIBLE as an adult).

 

And now, I'm going to sit back, look for some kilt photos, and wait for the fun to start. :lurk5:

[athena1277]

How old are your dc? There may be a few they don't have to worry about if they aren't very little. Dd never got the 3rd dose of HiB when she was little because of a shortage, and when I asked about it later, the doc said we didn't have to worry about it because she was older by then.

 

Also, if you are worried about your relatives looking down on you for vaccinating, just don't tell them. It's not their business.

[Perry]

Why would your relatives ever need to know? :confused:

[PeacefulChaos]

Well, I'm pro vax and we have always vaccinated on the 'approved' schedule - obviously, you would be going about things on a different timeline. :)

I'm not 100% sure of which ones are absolutely necessary, but I've always been a big fan of being vaccinated... of course, I love getting shots myself, so... :D

DH is currently getting vaccinations for his trip to Ecuador this summer. He's getting everything they recommend having for travel in that country - he actually hasn't had any vaccinations (except tetanus when he shot a nail through his foot a few years back ;) ) since before he started kindergarten!!! :svengo: (I mean no offense by that... this wasn't a decision made by his parents out of research or anything... they just were kind of lax about everything and he never went to the dr, the dentist, etc as a kid. :) ) So he's getting the hep a/b combo shot, the tdap (or is it dtap? I can never remember) and something else... I can't remember.

Anyway, I don't really participate in vax debates, so I just thought I'd leave our personal experience here for you. :) Good luck making your decision!

[toawh]

I decided against vaccinating one vaccine at a time. I researched each one and weighed all the factors together. Ingredients, rare vs common disease, serious vs mild typical outcomes. I also factored in that DD would not be in daycare and was breastfed and that DH does not have high exposure to stuff (like say a nurse or doctor would).

 

If you're unsure, I would recommend reading up about them so you can make a fully educated decision. It's not something that you can find your right answer by deciding whether to go with the doctors or family. There is no one right answer for vaccines. It depends on your specific circumstances, how you feel about the ingredients, and how you weigh the other factors.

 

I started with The Vaccine Book by Dr. Sears and from there researched further where needed. I felt he did a pretty good job of giving a solid look at things without being drastically one way or the other.

 

I'll have to put this on hold and take a look. Thanks.

[toawh]

I suggest you search these forums using the word "vaccine" and see what you come up with. These threads usually end badly and almost always have posts (if not the entire thread) deleted or locked. This is an issue with passionate opinions on both sides.

 

I'm a nurse and pro-vaccine. If you are asking for yourself as an adult which vaccines you need, I suggest TDaP, MMR, Polio (although you won't encounter wild polio in this country, you may overseas), and chicken pox (if you didn't have the illness as a child...it's HORRIBLE as an adult).

 

And now, I'm going to sit back, look for some kilt photos, and wait for the fun to start. :lurk5:

 

Searching these threads now. Should of thought of that before. I had chicken pox as a child and German measles too. I was thinking more for the kids though. Would you mind telling me why you are pro-vaccine. If you don't want to start a debate would you just pm me. I need to make up my mind soon and I want opinions. lol

 

How old are your dc? There may be a few they don't have to worry about if they aren't very little. Dd never got the 3rd dose of HiB when she was little because of a shortage, and when I asked about it later, the doc said we didn't have to worry about it because she was older by then.

 

Also, if you are worried about your relatives looking down on you for vaccinating, just don't tell them. It's not their business.

 

 

Why would your relatives ever need to know? :confused:

 

Oh, they will find out. No use hiding it! I'd rather have a clear reason why I make the decision I do than tell them to mind their own.

 

Well, I'm pro vax and we have always vaccinated on the 'approved' schedule - obviously, you would be going about things on a different timeline. :)

I'm not 100% sure of which ones are absolutely necessary, but I've always been a big fan of being vaccinated... of course, I love getting shots myself, so... :D

DH is currently getting vaccinations for his trip to Ecuador this summer. He's getting everything they recommend having for travel in that country - he actually hasn't had any vaccinations (except tetanus when he shot a nail through his foot a few years back ;) ) since before he started kindergarten!!! :svengo: (I mean no offense by that... this wasn't a decision made by his parents out of research or anything... they just were kind of lax about everything and he never went to the dr, the dentist, etc as a kid. :) ) So he's getting the hep a/b combo shot, the tdap (or is it dtap? I can never remember) and something else... I can't remember.

Anyway, I don't really participate in vax debates, so I just thought I'd leave our personal experience here for you. :) Good luck making your decision!

 

Sounds like my childhood. No doctor, dentist maybe twice, and we were healthy. This is why I'll have so much opposition if I break from the path. "It worked on you" is a favorite logic in my family.

 

It'd really help if everyone wasn't so polite. I know that sounds awful. I need some input here.

[Mama Geek]

I agree with starting with Dr Sear's Vaccine book. I am planning to homeschool so dd will not be in with the masses in public school. I have known too many people that are convinced that the vaccines harmed their children for the long term. I would selectively vaccinate if I could find a doc to work with probably following Dr Sear's schedule although now the timeline would be off.

[regentrude]

We are doing most vaccines. Many people have forgotten the diseases that used to be epidemic and cost thousands of children's lives pre-vaccine. Diphteria for example killed 15,000 kids annually in the US alone in 1920.

Polio cost lots of lives and permanently disabled thousands..

Tetanus is in soil bacteria, so it is not even a question of transmission from other humans.

I would absolutely vaccinate DTP. the only reason they have become so rare IS that people vaccinate; if not enough people do so, the disease will come back.

 

I know that many people consider Mumps, Measles and Rubella to be "childhood" illnesses without severe consequences. Which is often true. However, side effects can be severe. My brother who was unable to be vaccinated because of his disability got measles as a teenager and sustained permanent brain damage. Rubella will cause severe disabilities in a fetus if a pregnant woman is infected; this alone would be enough of a reason for me to get the vaccine so my kids do not infect anyone.

 

I do not consider Hepatitis vaccine as urgent. We would not have vaccinated against chickenpox had that not been mandatory here for school.

I actively refuse the HPV for DD.

[Peaceful Isle]

I'm for a delayed schedule for vaccines. My two oldest dd are all caught up, my son is on his way, and my baby has never gotten a shot. There are many personal reasons why I chose this method. :) I feel vaccines are very important, but I don' t believe in a "one size fits all" for shots. It depends on lifestyle, where you live, etc. I would never tell anyone one way or the other. It's a personal decision.

What I would say is, go with your gut. Don't worry about what people will say or not. They are your kiddos. If you decided to go ahead with them, the health department will do them for free, while the Dr. office charge. Believe me, I know from experience!

[DianeW88]

Searching these threads now. Should of thought of that before. I had chicken pox as a child and German measles too. I was thinking more for the kids though. Would you mind telling me why you are pro-vaccine. If you don't want to start a debate would you just pm me. I need to make up my mind soon and I want opinions. lol

 

I vax because I'm a peds nurse (and old, lol), and I've treated children with all of the above mentioned illnessess (not tetanus or diptheria...those have become rare) and it's awful. These illnesses that we vax for are not the same as the kinds of viruses we are used to seeing as mothers now. Measles, mumps, whooping cough, and even chicken pox mean your kids are sick for almost a good, solid month. Some longer than that. Also, they are REALLY sick. Some kids require hospitalization. Sometimes you get a "quarantine" sign stuck on your front door (yes, the health department still does that if necessary), and sometimes your kids develop life long health issues from these illnesses (my dh has severe hearing loss because of measles as a child). They are on the rise, because less parents are choosing to vax their kids, and so a kid's chance of coming down with one is higher than it's been in years.

 

Rubella is a mild illness for children, but if you contract it as a pregnant mother in your second trimester, the odds are frighteningly high that your child will be born with birth defects. That is why that vax is given to kids.

 

I've never seen a child with polio, but I have seen older folks with post-polio syndrome in physical therapy. That disease stole their childhood and then it comes back to destroy you in your fifties and however long you can survive with it. It is a permanent disability that leaves people unable to get around independently. It's awful.

 

I know that most of today's parents have never seen a four month old baby with whooping cough fighting to breathe, or a six year old with measles who has to be in a completely dark room because the light hurts her eyes so much, or a nine year old with mumps who's neck is so swollen they can barely move and can hardly swallow. But honestly, it's awful.

 

Every one of these illnesses can be prevented and we have the means to do it. Do children occasionally have negative reactions to vaccines? Yes. But it is rare, and it is worth the risk to me. All of my kids are fully vaxed. They all survived it and none of them has ever had any kind of bad reaction beyond the normal injection site soreness, swelling and redness (which you want...it shows your immune system is working) or the occasional low-grade fever. A small price to pay in my mind, but you have to decide what you feel is best for your family.

 

I know others feel differently about this issue, and I respect their opinions. I'm not trying to start a debate, just answering your question about why I choose to vax.

Edited April 13, 2012 by DianeW88

[Reflections]

IMHO, it is okay to pick and choose. And since you have very little choice about whether or not you are going to vaccinate with the DTP because France requires it - you could make up your mind about the rest of them later.

[SailorMom]

I say go with the odds. Research each vaccine, and if the good odds outweigh the bad odds - well - there ya' go.

There is risk - some kids are actually allergic to some of the ingredients (I do not think there is any tie to Autism)- but the risk is usually fairly low compared to the seriousness of the illness being vaccinated against.

I also think anyone who travels internationally really needs to think hard about this. In many countries there is a real risk of polio or mumps....

My kids are vaccinated to the hilt. We even got the typhoid vaccine before going on our cruise last year.

They are boys, and neither has been offered the HPV vaccine, but I wouldn't have a problem with it.

Personally I think there is far more risk in NOT vaccinating than there is in driving on the highway.

[Butter]

I would absolutely vaccinate DTP. the only reason they have become so rare IS that people vaccinate; if not enough people do so, the disease will come back.

 

The D in DTaP is diphtheria. It is very rare because of the vaccine (though it's kind of misleading to give a statistic of the number who died in 1920... there are many more treatments available today for it). The T in DTaP is tetanus. No one's quite sure if it's rare because of the vaccine or because people know to seek treatment if they get a puncture wound or just because it's rare. The P in DTaP is pertussis. It is anything but rare. The P wears off in 6 or so years after getting the vaccine. I'd vaccinate against the D and T definitely, but the P depends. My daughter almost died due to a reaction to the shot at 4 months so none of my kids get that one (doctor's orders).

 

If I was in a situation deciding which vaccines to get, I'd find a doctor I trust and have a discussion. Actually, that's pretty much what we did. We've always been delayed and selective vaxers. Many of vaccines just weren't necessary for my kids (at least the three that were older when they got shots... I felt strongly when I was pregnant with #4 to get certain shots for him young). My third child has only had dT. The doctor doesn't want to give him anything else until he's about 7 or so because he has so many allergies. My second didn't have a single shot until he was 7 and he's had 4 shots and the doctor considers him up to date. He still needs the MMR and will get it around 12 like his older sister did. Each of my kids has a different vaccination plan. I trust our doctor to advise on what is best for each of them.

[toawh]

I vax because I'm a peds nurse (and old, lol), and I've treated children with all of the above mentioned illnessess (not tetanus or diptheria...those have become rare) and it's awful. These illnesses that we vax for are not the same as the kinds of viruses we are used to seeing as mothers now. Measles, mumps, whooping cough, and even chicken pox mean your kids are sick for almost a good, solid month. Some longer than that. Also, they are REALLY sick. Some kids require hospitalization. Sometimes you get a "quarantine" sign stuck on your front door (yes, the health department still does that if necessary), and sometimes your kids develop life long health issues from these illnesses (my dh has severe hearing loss because of measles as a child). They are on the rise, because less parents are choosing to vax their kids, and so a kid's chance of coming down with one is higher than it's been in years.

 

Rubella is a mild illness for children, but if you contract it as a pregnant mother in your second trimester, the odds are frighteningly high that your child will be born with birth defects. That is why that vax is given to kids.

 

I've never seen a child with polio, but I have seen older folks with post-polio syndrome in physical therapy. That disease stole their childhood and then it comes back to destroy you in your fifties and however long you can survive with it. It is a permanent disability that leaves people unable to get around independently. It's awful.

 

I know that most of today's parents have never seen a four month old baby with whooping cough fighting to breathe, or a six year old with measles who has to be in a completely dark room because the light hurts her eyes so much, or a nine year old with mumps who's neck is so swollen they can barely move and can hardly swallow. But honestly, it's awful.

 

Every one of these illnesses can be prevented and we have the means to do it. Do children occasionally have negative reactions to vaccines? Yes. But it is rare, and it is worth the risk to me. All of my kids are fully vaxed. They all survived it and none of them has ever had any kind of bad reaction beyond the normal injection site soreness, swelling and redness (which you want...it shows your immune system is working) or the occasional low-grade fever. A small price to pay in my mind, but you have to decide what you feel is best for your family.

 

I know others feel differently about this issue, and I respect their opinions. I'm not trying to start a debate, just answering your question about why I choose to vax.

 

Thanks, Diane. This is a very helpful response.

Is anyone else up for saying why they do or do not vaccinate? Advise is appreciated, but bottom line is I'll need to decide. Knowing why others choose to or not to vaccinate would awesome.

Edited April 14, 2012 by toawh

[kareng]

First of all, let me say that I appreciate your wanting to know the truth about vaccines. I must say that I used to be in total support of trusting doctors to know and do what's right. I come from a doctor's family (both my grandfathers were doctors, my great grandfather was a doctor, uncles were doctors, my dad and step mom are doctors, my sister is a doctor...) and I was raised to just obey them and believe that they are gods. I have come to think about all these things differently now.

 

It all began when I started reading this book by Christiane Northrup:

Mother-Daughter Wisdom: Understanding the Crucial Link Between Mothers, Daughters, and Health by Christiane Northrup

 

 

As a medical student she began to question her total acceptance of vaccinations when she learned what they were made of and how they were made.

She also looked at the statistics and studied whether or not the vaccinations really had caused disease rates to go down. Also she looked at the large number of people who had reactions to the shots.

 

Then after my daughter was around 10 and had had all the recommended vaccinations up to that point, I found this book, written by a pediatrician:

How to Raise a Healthy Child in Spite of Your Doctor by Robert S. Mendelsohn

 

I LOVED that both of these books were written by medical folks. some links about what goes into vaccinations and some ingredients in

vaccines or while they are being grown:

http://www.fda.gov/BiologicsBloodVaccines/SafetyAvailability/VaccineSafety/ucm187810.htm

http://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/vac-gen/additives.htm

 

And Dr. Mercola's (a physician) view: http://vaccines.mercola.com/

 

And last there is this book:

Vaccines: Are They Really Safe and Effective by Neil Z. Miller

 

 

If you need to have vaccinations to go to France (and there are no exceptions allowed -- religious, philosophical or medical), then my recommendation is to have the minimal. If your kids are healthy, you want to keep them that way.

 

But, with all I have said, everyone needs to seek their own information and their own truth for themselves and their families.

 

God bless you as you explore this information and figure out what works for you and your family. I"m sure you'll figure out what will work. And as to what others think, let that go. This is your decision not theirs. :-)

Edited April 14, 2012 by kareng
added more info