Concerns about acclerating in afterschooling in the early elementary years

[aug17girl]

My question is how do you decide what to afterschool in the early years when almost any afterschooling ends up with a child working ahead of the school grade level?

 

I've been getting some criticism from some extented family members who are public school teachers that by doing "so much" at home, my son is going to be bored in school or "lose his love of learning".

 

I'm also starting to see my son's interests setting him apart from his peers and him sandbagging abilities. Looking forward to this summer where I will have more time at home and could possibly do more academic stuff at home (with lots of fun time). I am just hesitating in exactly what I am doing and why.

 

My oldest son is in public school JK. He will be soon be turning 5. We supplement at home because we want to encourage his desire to learn and for him to have a solid base in math. We don't push. We only do formal work 2 or 3 times a week, and we do a lot of work orally.

 

He reads well, he's inquisitive about science, and readily works on math at home. For math we are on SP Essential Math K B and miquon orange, and play with manipulatives. He is starting to try to spell words more and more so I am thinking about starting AAS.

 

How do I balance his desire to learn and providing a good base without creating problems in the classroom?

[Bang!Zoom!]

I think the activities at home are done both by concern for remediation and acceleration, and depth of understanding, and love of a subject area; so it's really a complex field of reasoning anyone would after school, and even add to that personal family values of handling and teaching material which is not allowed in a PS setting (and I mean specifically in the areas of religious studies, etc.)

 

I think the greatest take-away from working with your children at home comes into play with the area of self-discipline and work ethic. At some point, there's going to come a day of reckoning with the ability to self-learn and the skills that go with that.

 

As far as the balance question, I don't have a good answer to that. I think that it really depends on one individual child in one individual classroom with one individual teacher on any given day in one particular area. If a pattern of adversarial interaction happens down the road, you just deal with it at that time.

 

The folks that are giving you gloom and doom predictions are really throwing out some generalizations in hypothetical formatting trying to shake you up perhaps? It makes no sense in a solid argument. It might be that sense of confusion and illogical expression that leaves you confused and anxious.

 

If something made terrific sense and felt (emotionally to you as a parent) clearly something to worry about with a absolute solution, you'd be smart enough to follow your instincts for proper follow-up, right?

 

They are dealing with "what-if?" disaster idealism, you are dealing with "right-now" with YOUR child.

 

Tell em to take a hike. It's your kid.

[Bang!Zoom!]

That's a really good point Heidi. Good thoughts.

[Sneezyone]

I share your concerns. Last year was our first with formal afterschooling. I worked with DD over the summer and was shocked, SHOCKED by how much she picked up and how quickly. By the time DD went back to school, she was way ahead in some subjects and it did cause some problems.

 

While other students were trying to get back into learning mode, DD was ready to go and frustrated by the slow pace of instruction. When math topics she'd already covered came up and the pre-identified gifted kids began their pullout program DD started to doubt herself (e.g. why am I not going when I know as much or more than they do?). The school did work with us to change her placement but that meant another child was moved out of the advanced group to make room for DD.

 

On the flip side, because we move so much (DH is military) it was really important to me to have her advancement documented in her school records so that she'd be placed appropriately when we move. At DD's school this year, the entire math curric. for the grade will be covered. They move FAST. I expect they will finish phonics through the equiv. of ETC 7 or 8 too.

 

My approach for this summer will be a little different because DD's summer break will only be 6 weeks long (we're moving to a state with an earlier start to the school year). We're going to focus more on depth and breadth rather than acceleration. I don't want DD working ahead more than a year; she's right where she should be (late fall birthday girl).

 

We will cover some 3rd grade math but emphasize multiplication/divison facts with games, logic puzzles and problem solving. We're going to focus on reading, lots of reading, because there's so much variation in reading levels at that age that she'll be fine wherever she ends up. Finally we're going to do a little grammar review (parts of speech), spelling review (using all of her 1st grade spelling words from this year) and phonics review (we use ETC for this). We're not going to do a bunch of science or history enrichment. We'll probably avg. 10 hrs a week. The rest of our time will be spent at the pool! :D

Edited April 13, 2012 by Sneezyone

[aug17girl]

 

The folks that are giving you gloom and doom predictions are really throwing out some generalizations in hypothetical formatting trying to shake you up perhaps? It makes no sense in a solid argument. It might be that sense of confusion and illogical expression that leaves you confused and anxious.

 

QUOTE]

 

I think that is exactly it. To have family members who know us well, and who are not generally busybodies, adamently raising vague concerns is giving me pause.

 

I want to use this as an opportunity to make sure I am clear about what I am doing and why.

[ApronMama]

A friend of mine who is a PS teacher expressed the same concerns about the "extra" school I do with my older son. Then she talked to him, realized that he was going to be ahead no matter what I did and was losing his love of learning by being bored in the classroom.

 

It can be a legitimate concern, depending on the kids. While some kids end up "hot housed" there are many who need to be accelerated simply out of fairness to the speed with which they assimilate new information. We respect children who need to move at a slower pace, we should do the same with kids who are ready to move ahead.

 

Schools today do not cover the breadth of information they could in each grade. Go deeper rather than speed ahead (this takes more work from a parent than simply accelerating.) Pick subjects they aren't learning in school--science (schools are very weak on this), history, geography. Tackle a subject like writing from a different perspective--use a Charlotte Mason approach or SWB's WWE for instance. Read quality literature and do related projects. Keep up the math foundation you are presenting at home. These are all ways to expose your child to learning without causing problems at school.

 

If your motivation is learning for learning sake, and not to be "ahead" (and it sounds like it is) you are doing your child a great service by making your home a learning environment. A good teacher will accommodate your child and appreciate what you are doing at home. Most teachers I know wish parents would understand that educating a child is a shared responsibility between home and school.

[Spy Car]

My question is how do you decide what to afterschool in the early years when almost any afterschooling ends up with a child working ahead of the school grade level?

 

I've been getting some criticism from some extented family members who are public school teachers that by doing "so much" at home, my son is going to be bored in school or "lose his love of learning".

 

I'm also starting to see my son's interests setting him apart from his peers and him sandbagging abilities. Looking forward to this summer where I will have more time at home and could possibly do more academic stuff at home (with lots of fun time). I am just hesitating in exactly what I am doing and why.

 

My oldest son is in public school JK. He will be soon be turning 5. We supplement at home because we want to encourage his desire to learn and for him to have a solid base in math. We don't push. We only do formal work 2 or 3 times a week, and we do a lot of work orally.

 

He reads well, he's inquisitive about science, and readily works on math at home. For math we are on SP Essential Math K B and miquon orange, and play with manipulatives. He is starting to try to spell words more and more so I am thinking about starting AAS.

 

How do I balance his desire to learn and providing a good base without creating problems in the classroom?

 

If you teach subjects for depth of understanding I don't think you have anything to worry about.

 

We started with Miquon and Singapore (and MEP, and other things) in pre-K and have kept going strong. My son now in Second Grade loves math, has a deep understanding (for his age) of the subject, and thoroughly enjoys school.

 

Bill

[slackermom]

A friend of mine who is a PS teacher expressed the same concerns about the "extra" school I do with my older son. Then she talked to him, realized that he was going to be ahead no matter what I did and was losing his love of learning by being bored in the classroom.

 

It can be a legitimate concern, depending on the kids. While some kids end up "hot housed" there are many who need to be accelerated simply out of fairness to the speed with which they assimilate new information. We respect children who need to move at a slower pace, we should do the same with kids who are ready to move ahead.

 

Schools today do not cover the breadth of information they could in each grade. Go deeper rather than speed ahead (this takes more work from a parent than simply accelerating.) Pick subjects they aren't learning in school--science (schools are very weak on this), history, geography. Tackle a subject like writing from a different perspective--use a Charlotte Mason approach or SWB's WWE for instance. Read quality literature and do related projects. Keep up the math foundation you are presenting at home. These are all ways to expose your child to learning without causing problems at school.

 

If your motivation is learning for learning sake, and not to be "ahead" (and it sounds like it is) you are doing your child a great service by making your home a learning environment. A good teacher will accommodate your child and appreciate what you are doing at home. Most teachers I know wish parents would understand that educating a child is a shared responsibility between home and school.

:iagree:

 

 

I don't really get how someone could think a child would "lose their love of learning" by letting the child actually learn. :confused1:

 

DD was begging to learn more, and her 1st grade teacher did NOTHING to differentiate beyond putting her in the highest reading group (which only met twice a month). DD was so bored, and so upset that she wasn't learning anything new at school.

 

I admit I was also hesitant about teaching her things that would widen the gap, but I made a decision that I would answer her questions, and teach her what she wanted to know, and never say "you'll cover that at school," or "you'll learn about that next year."

 

DD mainly wanted to learn more about math. She is easily several years ahead of her class now, but so what? We do a lot of science too, because DD loves science. She's actually in a science-focus school, but what we do never seems to duplicate what they cover in the classroom. We also focus on history, geography, and languages, which are not covered/offered in the early years.

 

I also tried to get DD to look at her education in a more holistic way, as something that occurs around the clock, and which she has control over. She keeps a "learning goals list" which we update a few times a year. We come up with things she can do at school, at home, and elsewhere to support those goals.

 

This year, DD's 2nd grade teacher has amazed me. She has been very supportive of what we are doing, and does what she can to connect DD's at-home studies with class writing assignments at school, and has come up with independent study projects at school based on DD's interests.

[aug17girl]

:iagree:

 

 

I don't really get how someone could think a child would "lose their love of learning" by letting the child actually learn. :confused1:

 

The family member was describing dealing with Grade 1 and 2 students who had, in her opinion, "lost the love of learning" in the classroom because they already knew the skills or content being taught due to early exposure at home. :tongue_smilie: She really painted a picture in my mind of my son a few years from now as a behaviour problem in the classroom, bored and acting up. Rationally, I realize this is ridiculous.

 

Thanks everyone for your replies. Hearing about all of your approaches to afterschooling has been really helpful and affirming. It looks like this summer we will be forging ahead.

[Tanikit]

I do not think that being bored in school will make a child hate to learn. It may very well however make a child hate school or at least the educational side of school, but that happens with children who are below average in school work too. And I do not know any child who is average in everything.

 

In actual fact keeping them stimulated at home will spur a love of learning because it is what children want. My DD is alredy well accelerated - she is meant to start K next year and has more than covered all the work in K and a lot of 1st grade work. Her handwriting is not up to standard for 1st grade work, but that is because her fine motor skills are 2 years behind a 1st grader - she is actually still ahead of her age with handwriting.

 

We are trying to decide what to do with her next year - whether to keep her home or send her to school, but the decision is complicated by a number of factors. If she goes I am sure I will do some afterschooling to keep her interest in learning open.

[Bang!Zoom!]

I was thinking more about this post yesterday, talked about it at a cafe' with dd. We sketched up a logic argument on scratch paper and had a good time debating it.

 

I had her take the position of the mom, I took the position of a family member with concerns. During the debate, I only let her respond to my comments with further questions as the rule.

 

About ten minutes into it, she blurted out, "Hey Grams, just who's name is on that birth certificate anyway?" (It was a question, so it was allowed...lol )

 

Pretty funny.

 

I stopped and told her a story about how her grams had gone marching into her PS classroom to interrogate her teacher about her "concerns" on dd reading ability.

 

"The other kids are so far ahead of her that I know.."

 

There wasn't any emergency intervention warranted, it was an outrageous statement really. Now here we sit a couple years later with the situation absolutely reversed.

 

"Oh, it's not good she's so far ahead of the other kids.." :glare:

 

From thinking about it, if your situation turns out anything even remotely close to what I've experienced with former teachers which are family, there's never going to be any pleasing them no matter what.

 

Perhaps that's the pattern that might end up revealing itself in time. No matter what you do or the child achieves, there will be criticism. Some folks are just naturally grumpy.

 

Perhaps spending some time thinking of how to best train responses for the long haul would be the most useful and positive? You could get really creative in that approach.

[Pamela H in Texas]

(I haven't read the responses yet)

 

First, I don't have an issue with kids being ahead in class. They will figure it out there in the way they feel the need, but they *will* have the skills and tools I decide necessary for them.

 

Second, you DEFINITELY could go broader and deeper rather than linearly. I don't know ANY 3 or 4 year olds who have the geography knowledge mine have (though theirs is still pretty limited). That isn't going to cause an issue in the classroom and yet they benefit from the learning regardless of what it is. It gets the brain working in different ways, give them more information to stack upon later information, etc :) THat information could be anything -- Dinosaurs, Insects, Space, History, a certain time period, whatever. MOstly, it is just fun :)

 

SO there are choices.

 

We go broad, but I most certainly do 3Rs. My Kindergartener is reading at a 3rd grade level. Her math is solidly first grade. Her writing is at least a year ahead. My almost 5yo is reading as well as the average Kindergartener at our school does this time of year and I'd expect him to make it to about 2nd grade level by the end of summer. I also think his math will be at least 1st grade level. My almost 4yo should be reading simple books by the end of summer. He'll tag along with math.

 

One thing they don't do in our schools is handwriting. We definitely will spend some time there are there are some brain benefits as well as they will have much better handwriting than without spending time on it.

[cfn10]

Would you ask your family members more about what they mean by being "bored" and losing "love of learning"? What have they seen happen-negative and positive? Have they seen any students advanced? Are there gifted programs?

 

They have a different viewpoint and willingness to share it. It may be useful to explore their experiences.

[EmilyK]

There are a lot of subjects that aren't covered in school well, or at all. That was a lot of what we did afterschooling, mostly because those were my kids' passions and this was a day to meet their needs.

 

We did/do:

-- history -- story of the world, and tons of picture books and books on tape

-- science -- books and documentaries

-- music -- my kids took piano but we've done a lot of music listening and composer studies.

-- art -- art lessons/classes and then art classes with me.

-- picture books on things like mythology, fairy tales and comparative religion subjects that aren't covered in our public schools

 

We are lucky to live in a urban area with lots of opportunities for live music, plays, children's concerts, museum visits etc. We try to tie in our reading with those visits.

 

You could do all of these things much better than I did, and still not neccessarily be "ahead" except in general knowledge. My older son has been way "ahead" in reading and writing; my younger son not even though he is quite bright -- it seems to be up to the kid and learning style. Both of my kids are excited about learning and adults notice that -- even my one who is right on grade level in his reading skills.

[akalori]

I hate when educators discourage early learning. Especially since I have one advanced and one delayed child. Reading is so vital. Early reading is the best gift you can give your kid to ensure academic success. Academic failure harms self esteem. Books designed for beginning readers are uninteresting for their intended kindergarten audience. However they are perfect for very advanced early readers. My daughter began reading as a toddler. I love that she can read books that match her interests. Also it has opened up many unexpected learning opportunities, because reading allows her to learn independently. On the other hand my son is frustrated because he can't read books that match his interests without help. Schools should be academically enriching for all. I know they aren't. It is sad that some think we should deprive our children of enriched learning environment in order to prepare them for an academically dull kindergarten.

[LibraryLover]

If you teach subjects for depth of understanding I don't think you have anything to worry about.

 

We started with Miquon and Singapore (and MEP, and other things) in pre-K and have kept going strong. My son now in Second Grade loves math, has a deep understanding (for his age) of the subject, and thoroughly enjoys school.

 

Bill

 

 

I have to say that I am often stymied by such questions. Almost all of the schooled families I know are doing so much with their children...it's simply a given, a part of life. Science camp, museum visits, deep family discussions, tutoring for math and languages etc. These kids do just 'fine' in school. They end up graduating with honours, are ranked high etc. I was talking to one of my children today, and the acceptances keep rolling in. He's got friends (not hs'd, but whose parents are interested in enrichment) who are off to MIT, Yale, Harvard, Chapel Hill, UCSD, West Point blah blah blah. If you homeschool, you need to work *hard* and go above and beyond. As the years go by, I have not seen hsers having a greater advantage over thoughful schooling families.

 

I'm a hser, but honestly, if you are talking college acceptance numbers (and I am not even talking about families who allow their children to work on their own, ie, unschoolers), colleges are absolutely not putting out the red carpet for students simply because they are hsers.

 

The thoughtful schooled families I know wouldn't call themselves 'after-schoolers'. They would call themselves Parents.

Edited April 26, 2012 by LibraryLover

[Spy Car]

I have to say that I am often stymied by such questions. Almost all of the schooled families I know are doing so much with their children...it's simply a given, a part of life. Science camp, museum visits, deep family discussions, tutoring for math and languages etc. These kids do just 'fine' in school. They end up graduating with honours, are ranked high etc. I was talking to one of my children today, and the acceptances keep rolling in. He's got friends (not hs'd, but whose parents are interested in enrichment) who are off to MIT, Yale, Harvard, Chapel Hill, UCSD, West Point blah blah blah. If you homeschool, you need to work *hard* and go above and beyond. As the years go by, I have not seen hsers having a greater advantage over thoughful schooling families.

 

I'm a hser, but honestly, if you are talking college acceptance numbers (and I am not even talking about families who allow their children to work on their own, ie, unschoolers), colleges are absolutely not putting out the red carpet for students simply because are hsers.

 

The thoughtful schooled families I know wouldn't call themselves 'after-schoolers'. They would call themselves Parents.

 

I wouldn't call myself an "after-schooler" either, except in the context of this forum where it is a useful convention. But IRL, no.

 

As for the advantages of homeschooling vs thoughtful schooling I really can't say. What I do know is children with involved parents who really care and mind their children's educations have very different experiences than children who don't.

 

Bill

[LibraryLover]

I wouldn't call myself an "after-schooler" either, except in the context of this forum where it is a useful convention. But IRL, no.

 

As for the advantages of homeschooling vs thoughtful schooling I really can't say. What I do know is children with involved parents who really care and mind their children's educations have very different experiences than children who don't.

 

Bill

 

 

Yes. Btw, my mini crank there wasn't about you, Spy Car, or the other wonderful 'afterschoolers' I know who are wroking so hard. I am frustrated by hsers who think because they hs, their kids have an edge somehow. Over and over I've heard, 'Even if we do little to nothing at home, we are doing more than the schools do" etc. The notion that parents who send their kids to school are somehow not participating in helping their children explore the world is nonsense, but seems a theme for some hsers.

 

I know *some* parents shirk their parental roles, hsers and schooled. I know schooled kid whose parents have worked hard to expose them to delightful and exciting (and not always costly) experiences, and I know hsers (irl) who think the mere fact that they homeschool makes their children better, smarter, more advanced, more creative, more likely to be leaders rather than followers etc I know hsers who do bare minimum to nothing in the way of teaching particular learning skills, even with kids who have asked.

 

Being homeschooled means you don't go to school. It does not always mean you're bing inspired.

 

I'm not sure why I veered off track in this thread, excpet that this thread made 'go there' in my head again. Thanks for reading. I'm off to pour myself more coffee.

 

ETA: I always 'forget', but while I hs(d) two of my children, and a thrid for a time, two of my children attended public high school. Did I offer them enriching activities? Did we discuss politics at the table? Did we help them formulate ideas for school papers, and help them better develop the themes of those papers? Yes. Is that afterschooling? In the context of this board, perhaps not. We saw no reason to do a math program at home when they were already enrolled in excellent math classes at school. Did I complain a bit about which transaltions of Homer they were using? Sometimes. For me, it was just parenting. Further, other parents did even more. The child off to MIT has parents who are two of the most committed parents I've ever known. They didn't do dc's hw, no, but they darn sure fed the passion. They are just regular American -born parents who saw a kid with gusto for a subject, beyond even dc's bright peers, and they made sure to feed that energy. The school worked with them, and let them know of other programs available etc. Dc went above and beyond...just as some kids who are musicans do. Blah blah blah. A child needs to be motivated, but they also need assistance. They don't know all that is out there unless an adult helps them to discover it. Ok. I think I am done.

Edited April 26, 2012 by LibraryLover

[Sneezyone]

The bolded is unusual ime. We were able to access excellent math teachers some years, but the curriculum has been cut to bare bones in order to include. We had to afterschool to include the material that was done pre-NCLB and is still considered part of the grade level by the federal and state tests. The math club was disbanded in order to fund sped. Students cannot make a team and compete in the school league. Individuals can't compete in the school based science competitions when their school withdraws nor can they enter the homeschool competitions.

 

School district's educational philosophies and percentage of competent teachers vary. What you describe is what I expected...but the cry of 'elitism' is raised here when anything above core basic classwork is done on the school's dime. Students that excel academically must provide their own transportation to their events, while athletes and sped do not. One must go beyond parenting and enriching and afterschool -- i.e. teach the grade level academic units that the school omitted --if one's child is to stay on grade level and make it in to the honors program. Or engage a tutor or sign up with a learning center. Read Jay Matthew's book Class Struggle to learn how a 'winner takes all' school system works.

 

This is the norm here too. In the district we are moving to they don't start enrichment...which is only 2hrs a week...until grade 3. The rest of the time is spent in full inclusion. I'll be stunned if they cover all that dd's current school does in a year despite having smaller class sizes. Parents here have paid for an addl. 20 hrs of small group music education and children's theater programming. Much of this was done by taking up individual class collections and parent carpools. It's all content in the state standards, delivery is just not fully funded.

[LibraryLover]

Oh, I don't disagree with a word. My crank really has more to do with certain parental assumptions than anything. I am not really on topic with my posts in this thread. ;) I also know that the US doesn't have an interest in making schools in all areas excellent and equal. Not when the schools are funded with real estate taxes. The kids in the wealthier districts, with connected, well-educated parents are always going to get that they need and more. Including state- of- the- art science labs etc., and teachers with PhDs in chemistry etc. When I think of the best schools in my area, the Weston school district comes quickly to mind. You would never find a math club disbanded there, or anything that would make those kids less competitive in the college app arena. Brookline High is another place they would disband a math club...like not never.

 

The bolded is unusual ime. We were able to access excellent math teachers some years, but the curriculum has been cut to bare bones in order to include. We had to afterschool to include the material that was done pre-NCLB and is still considered part of the grade level by the federal and state tests. The math club was disbanded in order to fund sped. Students cannot make a team and compete in the school league. Individuals can't compete in the school based science competitions when their school withdraws nor can they enter the homeschool competitions.

 

School district's educational philosophies and percentage of competent teachers vary. What you describe is what I expected...but the cry of 'elitism' is raised here when anything above core basic classwork is done on the school's dime. Students that excel academically must provide their own transportation to their events, while athletes and sped do not. One must go beyond parenting and enriching and afterschool -- i.e. teach the grade level academic units that the school omitted --if one's child is to stay on grade level and make it in to the honors program. Or engage a tutor or sign up with a learning center. Read Jay Matthew's book Class Struggle to learn how a 'winner takes all' school system works.

Edited April 26, 2012 by LibraryLover