Do you use all of the Singapore books?

[Runningmom80]

I apologize for yet another math post.

 

 

Does anyone use the text and the IP book, but not the workbook?

 

In 1A & what I did of b, we ended up not using the workbook, because it was redundant, and just used IP and the text. I used the HIG, and will also order that again as well. I'm scared to not order the workbook for some reason. :D

 

(if you are following my math saga from the post about my math plan, I decided to stick it put with Singapore and Miquon. We are really comfortable with the layout of SM, and apparently creatures of habit.:lol:)

[Dmmetler]

I use the text, some of the workbook, and some of the IP. Since DD prefers the New Primary Maths series to the California or US editions, there are topics in the written for Singapore New Primary Maths that aren't in the IP (I don't think it's worked the other way). In general, she did all the textbook, and some practice depending on how much she needed-if she was solid, we went straight to the IP, and often the challenge section there, if she needed more, we'd do the workbook first, then the IP.

 

If I'd been using the California edition, where I could have gotten the workbook next day shipping on Amazon or from the local teacher's store, I might have not bothered to buy it, but since I was buying the books when I found sellers on Ebay (to avoid shipping from Singapore), I'd buy whatever bundles I could find,which were usually text/workbook. For 5a, I had not only text/workbook but the singapore equivalent of the EP. Since my DD basically only did the IP challenge problems for all but about 2 topics of Singapore 5a/5b since she decided she was going to accelerate and get to Algebra about at the end of 4a, that one was WAY redundant. In two cases (3a and 5b, I think) I wasn't able to get the workbook, and found it didn't matter-I was able to find enough practice from the IP and online to make up the difference.

 

 

I stopped buying the HIG after SM 1 because I realized that I was already teaching the Singapore way and that I could come up with the ideas-however, I have a degree in math ed and have done two specific classes on teaching Singapore Math, so the HIG was more support than I needed. If I hadn't had the SM specific classes and training, and hadn't already had a large file on my hard drive of notes and resources from said classes on how to teach model diagrams and the like, I might have continued buying the HIGs.

[Runningmom80]

I use the text, some of the workbook, and some of the IP. Since DD prefers the New Primary Maths series to the California or US editions, there are topics in the written for Singapore New Primary Maths that aren't in the IP (I don't think it's worked the other way). In general, she did all the textbook, and some practice depending on how much she needed-if she was solid, we went straight to the IP, and often the challenge section there, if she needed more, we'd do the workbook first, then the IP.

 

If I'd been using the California edition, where I could have gotten the workbook next day shipping on Amazon or from the local teacher's store, I might have not bothered to buy it, but since I was buying the books when I found sellers on Ebay (to avoid shipping from Singapore), I'd buy whatever bundles I could find,which were usually text/workbook. For 5a, I had not only text/workbook but the singapore equivalent of the EP. Since my DD basically only did the IP challenge problems for all but about 2 topics of Singapore 5a/5b since she decided she was going to accelerate and get to Algebra about at the end of 4a, that one was WAY redundant. In two cases (3a and 5b, I think) I wasn't able to get the workbook, and found it didn't matter-I was able to find enough practice from the IP and online to make up the difference.

 

 

I stopped buying the HIG after SM 1 because I realized that I was already teaching the Singapore way and that I could come up with the ideas-however, I have a degree in math ed and have done two specific classes on teaching Singapore Math, so the HIG was more support than I needed. If I hadn't had the SM specific classes and training, and hadn't already had a large file on my hard drive of notes and resources from said classes on how to teach model diagrams and the like, I might have continued buying the HIGs.

 

 

 

I had no idea there was a "new primary maths," I'm intrigued.

[Dmmetler]

It's the version from the current Syllabus used in Singapore. I first got into it by accident-I bought a lot of Singapore maths 3rd grade books on Ebay, and it turned out to be the Singapore version-which, as it turned out, DD liked better. There really isn't much difference in content-the Singapore versions have more on currency conversions and metric measurement (and, I assume, less on English measurement, although there is some included), and the names and examples are...well...Singapory, which I believe is one reason why it appeals to my DD (it's led to some frantic googling to figure out what the heck they were talking about in a few word problems, too).

 

Here's the site I have bookmarked. So far, I've never ordered from them-I've always been able to find sellers within the USA-but if I ever do, I swear I'm going to order the entire music textbook series. I LOVE looking at music curricula, especially since part of my professional life has been spent writing it, and I'd LOVE to see what they're teaching and how they approach it!

 

http://www.sgbox.com/

[Crimson Wife]

Yes, there are plenty of folks who use the text + IP + CWP.

 

I have found that for a few topics where I wanted better explanations & more practice getting the relevant MM "blue" worktexts made more sense than shelling out for the Singapore workbooks.

[KirstenH]

We use all of the books, but not all of each one, if that makes sense. We switch between the various books depending on how much review or challenge DS needs with a given concept.

[EKS]

We used the textbook and CWP.

Edited April 10, 2012 by EKS

[Runningmom80]

thanks! I don't know why I'm fretting over this, I can always order it later if I think we need it.

[Spy Car]

We use them all. I would not dream of skipping the Workbook. The "Textbook" is our teaching/learning book. It is done interactively with lots of discussion, Socratic questioning, probing for understanding, and conceptual work. It is not "independent" work, although my child answers the questions.

 

The Workbook is independent work (or semi-independent in the early levels). I really think my child needs this independent practice to master the topics. There is no way I would skip the Workbooks.

 

We do the IPs and CWPs as well. I do not think they replace the Workbooks for mastering basic skills and developing procedural competency. Nope.

 

Bill

[Jen in PA]

We used the textbook and CWP.

 

Same here.

[Runningmom80]

We use them all. I would not dream of skipping the Workbook. The "Textbook" is our teaching/learning book. It is done interactively with lots of discussion, Socratic questioning, probing for understanding, and conceptual work. It is not "independent" work, although my child answers the questions.

 

The Workbook is independent work (or semi-independent in the early levels). I really think my child needs this independent practice to master the topics. There is no way I would skip the Workbooks.

 

We do the IPs and CWPs as well. I do not think they replace the Workbooks for mastering basic skills and developing procedural competency. Nope.

 

Bill

 

 

Hmmm,I'm wondering if the level we are on is not challenging enough, because the workbook along with the text was not helpful, it was like drill. This is only grade 1 we are talking about, so that could have something to do with it.

[Spy Car]

Hmmm,I'm wondering if the level we are on is not challenging enough, because the workbook along with the text was not helpful, it was like drill. This is only grade 1 we are talking about, so that could have something to do with it.

 

The problems in the Workbooks are generally not "challenging," they are not intended to be. They are designed to give a child the chance to practice the stratagies being taught and to cement the lessons. It is "basic" foundational work.

 

We have always added "challenge" work from multiple sources so math did not seem like it was always boring or mundane, but for my son I think it helped to do the basics. He has always preferred the "mind-stretching" work (and I can not blame him) but I've felt like it is important to work both the upper level of cognitive thinking and do the lower level work as well.

 

Singapore is not overly demanding in the number of practice problems, and if they are "easy" for the child they can move through them swiftly. My son often ripped though 10 pages in a sitting in Level 1 (an "sitting" is not his strong suit ;)) and once did 20. That left time for other, more challenging, things. But the basics were practiced too.

 

We are running into a similar thing with piano lessons recently. My son likes challenging new pieces, but is less enamored of the basic counting, proper fingering, playing patterns, and other foundational work. But his teacher is demanding it get done.

 

You obviously know your child better than any of us do. You have to determine what is productive and what is counter productive. I'm just playing Devil's Advocate based on our experience.

 

Bill

Edited April 10, 2012 by Spy Car

[brownie]

We skip the text book :) I only look at it to see if there is some specific method I am supposed to be teaching. We almost never do any of the problems. The boys do the workbook. I guess that would explain why ds6 finished 2A+2B in under 4 months. Next I'm going to pick up the IP at convention in 2 weeks for the respective books they have just finished because we have 6 more weeks of school and nothing to do :) ds6 will IP 2B and ds9 will do IP 5A to round out the year and then we will move on in the fall. We've done CWP and LOF here and there too.

 

I honestly don't know how people have time to individually teach math to multiple kids at different levels. And my younger 2 are yelling "enough already...let me try" when I do sample problems for them, so I have time to monitor 3 kids while they do math and help as needed.

 

Brownie

[Runningmom80]

I definitely appreciate your insight. I will probably just buy it, because I'm not expecting him to fly through 2A & B like he did with this, but maybe that is just wishful thinking. :lol:

[nmoira]

 

We use them all. I would not dream of skipping the Workbook. The "Textbook" is our teaching/learning book. It is done interactively with lots of discussion, Socratic questioning, probing for understanding, and conceptual work. It is not "independent" work, although my child answers the questions.

My youngest needs and thrives on this. OTOH, my eldest just soaked up the material, so any "teaching" on my part was usually superfluous. [she ended up leaving Singapore during 4A because it wasn't introducing enough new material each level to suit her.] We cut out the workbooks during 2B, and she was fine with IP/CWP only.

[Crimson Wife]

Singapore is not overly demanding in the number of practice problems, and if they are "easy" for the child they can move through them swiftly. My son often ripped though 10 pages in a sitting in Level 1 (an "sitting" is not his strong suit ;)) and once did 20. That left time for other, more challenging, things. But the basics were practiced too.

 

This really, really, really depends on the individual child. With my students, it is absolutely like pulling teeth to get them to do a page of "easy-peasy" equations in the Singapore textbook practices but they will gladly do the same math when embedded into a word problem (we use the Kumon books in addition to Singapore CWP), one of the Mindware maze/coloring books (Addition Adventures, Subtraction Secrets, Multiplication Mosaics, etc.) or a coordinate graphing hidden picture book (my oldest is using this book and I'm thinking of getting DS this one).

 

The basics do need to be practiced, but some gifted kids need something a bit more intellectually stimulating than the Singapore basic workbook.

[Spy Car]

I definitely appreciate your insight. I will probably just buy it, because I'm not expecting him to fly through 2A & B like he did with this, but maybe that is just wishful thinking. :lol:

 

Have you looked at the MEP materials? In K we were able to do Miquon (which you have), Singapore 1A/B, and MEP 1A/B. MEP added a nice complement of of generally thought-provoking "puzzely" problems that were an nice antidote to more "mundane" practice (although MEP has a small share of these too). And still have time to play around with other fun things.

 

In any case you'll figure it out. Having a child who is "too math adept" is one of those problems one can only hope to have :D

 

Bill

[chepyl]

We use all four books. We do the text and workbook together. At first I tried to mesh the IP and CWP with that....but it was a pain and too much repetition at once. He got bored quickly.

 

This semester, with 2b, we did the text and wbk alone and went quickly. Now, I assign him a few problems from CWP or some IP pages. Some he does on his own and some we have to work through together. We do enough to do 20 minutes a day. We should finish most of the problems by the end of this month, when we are done for the year.

[Spy Car]

This really, really, really depends on the individual child. With my students, it is absolutely like pulling teeth to get them to do a page of "easy-peasy" equations in the Singapore textbook practices but they will gladly do the same math when embedded into a word problem (we use the Kumon books in addition to Singapore CWP), one of the Mindware maze/coloring books (Addition Adventures, Subtraction Secrets, Multiplication Mosaics, etc.) or a coordinate graphing hidden picture book (my oldest is using this book and I'm thinking of getting DS this one).

 

The basics do need to be practiced, but some gifted kids need something a bit more intellectually stimulating than the Singapore basic workbook.

 

I think what you are saying about math-adept children not relishing "easy-peasy" problems is often correct. I'm not saying my son didn't groan at much of the work in the Workbooks for being too easy. Despite his protestations I felt the exercise did him good. I believe the independent practice is beneficial for a host of reasons.

 

It gets a the child used to following directions and develops "work-habits" for completing a range of work, from the more mundane to the truly challenging.

 

I don't thinking anyone on this forum would confuse me for someone who thinks math should be boring or unchallenging. I savor those "intellectually stimulating" aspects of our math program as much as anyone, and strive to make sure we get plenty of that sort of work in. But I also think there are lower-order skills that benefit from a reasonable amount of practice and repetition.

 

I think that because gifted kids show facility (and often disdain) for basic work that it is often a path of least resistance to require none. I question whether that is a good idea. If I'm going to error, I'd rather error on the side of "balance."

 

I hope it doesn't sound mean but as we've been finishing up Level 3 I keep looking for those "conceptual leaps" you've mentioned in many posts. I'm not seeing them, nor is my son having any difficulty following the progression. I can't say this is due to including the basic practice in the Workbooks, but I surely believe that that grounding in basic procedural competence and the reasonable amount of practice had helped make sure he did not have "holes" in his understanding.

 

Being gifted has many upsides (obviously), but a downside, from my perspective, is that kids can want to "skate" on those abilities. Getting them to do the "boring" work or the "easy" work can be a challenge. Giving them only "boring" work is a recipe for disaster. If I though I had a child who was truly undermined by the requirement of doing the practice problems in the Workbook (as easy as they might seem) I might be convinced to let them go. But it would take a good deal of convincing.

 

Bill

[FairProspects]

Being gifted has many upsides (obviously), but a downside, from my perspective, is that kids can want to "skate" on those abilities. Getting them to do the "boring" work or the "easy" work can be a challenge. Giving them only "boring" work is a recipe for disaster. If I though I had a child who was truly undermined by the requirement of doing the practice problems in the Workbook (as easy as they might seem) I might be convinced to let them go. But it would take a good deal of convincing.

 

Bill

 

I'll lend you my kid for a week and you will be convinced. :tongue_smilie: Truly.

 

This kid has the weirdest deal with attention. He can spend hours of focused time on difficult problem solving if it is interesting, but will have you zinging off the walls in 10 minutes because of his inattention (constant eye rubbing, wiggling, itching, distracting with different more interesting conversation topics) if he is bored and it is not worth his time. Since he will intuit the standard concepts anyway from the more difficult work, why put all of us through the ringer? Just so he can experience some busywork? Plenty of life is boring and about waiting as it is.

 

I used to think the way you do, and then we had an eval from experts who were able to describe exactly why ds hated school. It is just a personality and processing thing for some kids. My guess is your ds is probably on the compliant end of the spectrum (which is a great trait to have). :D

[Runningmom80]

I'll lend you my kid for a week and you will be convinced. :tongue_smilie: Truly.

 

This kid has the weirdest deal with attention. He can spend hours of focused time on difficult problem solving if it is interesting, but will have you zinging off the walls in 10 minutes because of his inattention (constant eye rubbing, wiggling, itching, distracting with different more interesting conversation topics) if he is bored and it is not worth his time. Since he will intuit the standard concepts anyway from the more difficult work, why put all of us through the ringer? Just so he can experience some busywork? Plenty of life is boring and about waiting as it is.

 

I used to think the way you do, and then we had an eval from experts who were able to describe exactly why ds hated school. It is just a personality and processing thing for some kids. My guess is your ds is probably on the compliant end of the spectrum (which is a great trait to have). :D

 

 

My DS definitely has the inattentive traits well, which is why I skipped the workbook or textbook most days. We are still trying to tease out if there is a 2E thing going on or not, so that definitely weighs on how I structure school. I truly think he was past the material and that was my main problem, not which books I was using.

 

In the end, it's a $13.00 book, and I can thankfully afford it, so I'll just buy it, and see how it goes.

 

I do appreciate hearing how everyone else does things. This is the end of my first year of HSing, and we officially withdrew from the school DS was enrolled in for next year, so I'm having a bit of panic about everything. Kind of like a "OhmygodI'mreallydoingthisandIhopeIdon'tscrewupmychild," kind of moment. :lol:

[Embassy]

I use the teacher's manual for mental math facts and helping teach any concepts where my ds might need more instruction than the textbook.

 

I also use the textbook, workbook, Intensive Practice book, and the Challenging Word Problems book. The IP and CWP might not always match up with what is currently being covered in the textbook and workbook.

[Crimson Wife]

I hope it doesn't sound mean but as we've been finishing up Level 3 I keep looking for those "conceptual leaps" you've mentioned in many posts. I'm not seeing them, nor is my son having any difficulty following the progression.

 

Bill

 

You're using Standards edition, correct? The SE HIG's do a much better job addressing these conceptual leaps than the U.S. edition HIG's do. When I switched over to the SE at 4A, I had much less of a problem because the HIG's give guidance for helping the student through those. The U.S. ed. just gives an answer key and leaves the parent to deal with a child who is:willy_nilly: about the fact that Singapore has leaped from point A to point D without first walking her through points B & C.

 

I also get the impression that your DS is much more of a VSL than my oldest DD is. My VSL is much, much better than his sister about intuitively understanding concepts that he has not yet been formally taught.