s/o lying to American Students

[Mom22ns]

Do you think homeschoolers are as guilty of this lie as public schools?

 

I have to admit, I couldn't make it through that thread. I read a few pages at the beginning and a few pages at the end, so this may have been discussed somewhere in the middle.

 

In this area, homeschoolers primarily are conservative Christians. LifePacs or SOS are the most popular curriculums. The parents say they are giving their kids an education better than what they would be getting in the public schools. Kids believe they are getting an education equal or better to that in the public schools. The truth is our public schools are well above average. By tests scores and most benchmarks they would be among the very top in our state and well above average nationally. I don't think average homeschoolers here get an education even equivalent to the public schools let alone a high quality education.

 

So, what says the hive? Are homeschools perpetuating these lies just as much as public schools?

[GoVanGogh]

Sadly, I have come to the realization that some homeschoolers do think they are providing a superior education simply because they are homeschooling.

 

A good friend homeschooled her oldest child through high school. He flunked out of college the second semester.

She talks openly about how much he hated learning and never initiated studying/learning. She didn't require him to read any books because he hated reading (does not read fluently) and complained about it so much. I want to ask her how she thought he could keep up with the reading requirements in college if he didn't like to read and wasn't reading at an adult level! She did not attend college herself so I really think she just doesn't know how hard college classes can be.

 

Another example: I just received an e-mail from my homeschool group regarding math. A mom said that her middle school child does two 10-minute sessions of math a day. Personally, I don't think that is enough.

 

I have been thinking about homeschooling through high school quite a bit lately and I keep coming back to the importance of building stamina in our children. Doing math in ten minute sessions will not build you up for college level trig or calculus, in my opinion. Letting your child slide and not even attempt to read an unabridged classic will not prepare them for college level reading.

[katilac]

Yes, many home schoolers are guilty of this also. I *cringe* every time I hear, "Well, anything we do is better than public school!"

 

Even if the local schools are so bad that anything whatsoever is an improvement, shouldn't we all set our sights higher than "slightly better than the truly awful alternative?"

 

It's sad, and some people are setting themselves and their kids up for a nasty surprise.

[msjones]

Yes, many home schoolers are guilty of this also. I *cringe* every time I hear, "Well, anything we do is better than public school!"

 

Even if the local schools are so bad that anything whatsoever is an improvement, shouldn't we all set our sights higher than "slightly better than the truly awful alternative?"

 

It's sad, and some people are setting themselves and their kids up for a nasty surprise.

 

:iagree:

[regentrude]

Yes. I know homeschoolers IRL whose kids receive an education that is inferior to public school education academically.

The parents may of course think that the benefits of avoiding the "institution school" or avoiding exposure to different world view outweigh the lack of rigorous academics.

Our local schools are not great, but many homeschooled students I know learn definitely LESS than they would in ps.

[msjones]

I have been raked over the coals on this board for making this very claim. I absolutely see homeschoolers deluding themselves about the quality of education they are providing their kids. And, of course, the "anything I do is better than ps" remark...ugh!

 

Now, I am quite biased. I taught ps for 8 years and my husband is on his 18th year of teaching public high school. In the schools where I taught and at his school, there is no chaos while teachers look the other way, there are well-prepared teachers who care deeply about students and about effective teaching, there is meaningful work to do, and students who are learning.

 

I often hear that "they" do "nothing" in public school. False.

 

Of course there are real problems, and some truly terrible teachers and schools out there. I don't deny that.

 

I do believe that a good homeschool education is most often better than a good public school education. But a bad homeschool education...

[Lang Syne Boardie]

Well, yes. Lots of us are coming from less-than-ideal public school situations, ourselves, and we don't have a good grasp on what a good education is. Which is why we buy books like The Well-Trained Mind, if we really want to know.

 

I think we all know homeschoolers who are doing nothing. They shouldn't call themselves homeschoolers. I call them not-schoolers.

 

I think lots of us do what I do and obsessively study education. I fear that I am fooling myself, both about the state of American public education and about the quality of my own homeschool. I'm a paranoid person with low-self esteem, so I can't help reading everything anybody ever writes about education. I'm always comparing, always researching, always pushing my kids slightly harder than I have to. And pushing myself to an early grave, probably.

 

Homeschooling is just another educational setting. Whether public, private, or home, every type of schooling has the whole spectrum. Some are amazingly high-achieving, most are average, some are struggling, and some are definitely failing. But just like public schools, most homeschoolers never admit to failure.

[msjones]

 

Homeschooling is just another educational setting. Whether public, private, or home, every type of schooling has the whole spectrum. Some are amazingly high-achieving, most are average, some are struggling, and some are definitely failing. But just like public schools, most homeschoolers never admit to failure.

 

Great point. I think you hit the nail on the head.

[chepyl]

I constantly wonder if I can provide a better education. Especially with how easy I have taken it the last couple of months. Then I remind my self of his age and that if I am concerned, I will push through. I think that someone who thinks anything they do is better, or is "100% sure" they are.doing better, may not be. Those who constantly question and study and work to know what PS does and what colleges want will be successful. Being concerned makes you work harder.

[Mom22ns]

Being concerned makes you work harder.

 

:iagree:

 

I spend a lot of time researching, planning, implementing, and evaluating our educational choices. Not everything we choose is the most rigorous, but we do seek a thorough, challenging educational experience that will prepare our kids for what they want to do next.

 

I also agree that there are a full range from bad to excellent in any type of school. I guess I just wish homeschooling was immune to the lie. I cringe everytime I hear the "anything is better than" line. It just isn't even close to the truth. I desperately want homeschooling to be viewed as a choice of excellence and instead find excellence to be as rare among homeschoolers as it is public schools. It is discouraging.

[creekland]

Yes, many homeschoolers think they are doing well, but aren't. They usually are those who won't test to see how they are keeping up and/or complain about the tests when the scores show "needs improvement."

 

We see homeschoolers who are very behind often when they get enrolled in ps. Sometimes their parents are astounded when Johnny or Susie isn't in the top classes or is put there and can't keep up. Sometimes Johnny and Susie can't read. Many of the ps teachers' stereotypes about the negatives of homeschooling come from seeing too many of these examples.

 

Two or three years ago when we started the college search for oldest I had an adcom tell me that homeschoolers are either the best or worst students - they very seldom are in the middle. His job was to determine who would be in which category - hence the additional look at test scores, etc. I thought that was interesting at the time. The more I see IRL, the more I think he's probably basically correct in his assessment.

 

It's also why I may be more into testing than most here. Of course, I also have easy access to our ps tests. The first couple of years I had my boys doing them to ensure they were keeping up with their peers. Even now, once in a while I bring home a question to ask or something that I want to make sure we've covered. But, in general now, middle son (my last homeschooler) has surpassed our ps.

[8filltheheart]

I think it boils down to the individual homeschooling family and their individual goals and objectives. In reality, I know very few homeschoolers that homeschool with the goal of academic excellence. I live in a large city w/a large homeschooling population. I have attempted to form some sort of support group for families that are academically oriented and only have 5 active families. (academics isn't my only goal, but it is completely compatible w/my other goals. I don't find them mutually exclusive.)

 

FWIW, the number of homeschoolers I meet who actually teach their children at home is far outnumbered by the number of co-op educators. I believe co-ops tend to disconnect the homeschooling parent from their responsibilities toward the subject/content.