An honest question about marriage

[bbkaren]

Unless a person has lived in this kind of situation, they will never understand how it can happen. And should withhold judgement.

[bbkaren]

Sewingmama, I can hear the sadness in your words as you describe your life. I was there, and I'm sorry you are now.

[kalanamak]

 

If the men behave like well adjusted people and then wait for the moment of marriage in order to completely change their demeanor, obviously there is no way you can anticipate that. If they are capable of maintaining that facade for that period of time, well what can you do?

 

 

As to this "forbidding" stuff -- at what point in the dating/marriage cycle does someone get to forbid things? My parents did forbid things, but after that unless you are voluntarily handing over the keys to your kingdom I don't see where someone gets to forbid things.

 

Many abusers are smooth operators. My mother had a German saying: street angels, house devils.

 

As to forbidding, I'm happy you have never had your eyes opened as to the how. I "stayed" until my folks left the country for 4 months. He said he'd kill them, he bought a gun, he held it to my head, he continued to be incredibly charming to everyone so that people I'd been friends with for years overlooked a black eye and bruises like dinner plates, he said he'd kill anyone who helped me. I plotted and plotted, and as soon as my folks were on that freighter, I "disappeared" leaving my cats, my plants, my clothes, my car, and my money.

 

And while I'm blunt about this (though it rarely comes up. I probably discuss it about twice a year), I've heard that I must have gotten my rocks off on being beaten, that my father must have molested me and I just don't remember it, that only people who are insecure have these things happen to them, that I must have called him fat, and, my favorite, that the responder "hates women like me" and walks off. However, quite often, someone in the group will come up later and whisper "I had a boy friend like that in college, and I'm still afraid he'll find me."

[Jean in Newcastle]

Many abusers are smooth operators. My mother had a German saying: street angels, house devils.

 

As to forbidding, I'm happy you have never had your eyes opened as to the how. I "stayed" until my folks left the country for 4 months. He said he'd kill them, he bought a gun, he held it to my head, he continued to be incredibly charming to everyone so that people I'd been friends with for years overlooked a black eye and bruises like dinner plates, he said he'd kill anyone who helped me. I plotted and plotted, and as soon as my folks were on that freighter, I "disappeared" leaving my cats, my plants, my clothes, my car, and my money.

 

And while I'm blunt about this (though it rarely comes up. I probably discuss it about twice a year), I've heard that I must have gotten my rocks off on being beaten, that my father must have molested me and I just don't remember it, that only people who are insecure have these things happen to them, that I must have called him fat, and, my favorite, that the responder "hates women like me" and walks off. However, quite often, someone in the group will come up later and whisper "I had a boy friend like that in college, and I'm still afraid he'll find me."

 

:grouphug:

 

I had it easy in that I wasn't actually married to my abuser but even so I had months of middle of the night death threats. And on occasion the knock on the door and foot forcing the door open. Fortunately I was then able to flee out of reach but it was still frightening the first night the phone rang in the middle of the night and I realized that he now knew where I was. . . It was only God's grace that the police got wind of him on another matter and he had to disappear for awhile himself.

 

It's been over 20 years and I've changed my name and still I have a small core of fear inside that one day I'll get that call or a knock on the door.

[SweetMissMagnolia]

:grouphug:

[Harriet Vane]

Well this is all very close to me. I finally separated from my husband after 16 years last July. I was VERY afraid of the repercussions from my church, kids, family & friends. I was very afraid of losing my home, my way of life, even my relationship with God.

 

I was right to be afraid. I have lost my church, disciplined out only 1 week ago although they asked me to leave 2 weeks before Christmas. They didn't care that I had endured years of emotional abuse. They didn't care that my ex had not changed one bit. They only cared that I didn't have one of two biblical reasons for divorce.

 

I have lost several friends. See above. HOWEVER several friends have come forward in the last year to let me know that they have had concerns for some time and that they support me.

 

I have NOT lost my children. They are doing amazing. I mean really amazing. They have not been this good in years. They still love their dad (and I would expect them to) but they are happy he lives somewhere else now.

 

I have NOT lost my family. They are 100% supportive of me and wonder why I didn't leave earlier.

 

Unlike you, I didn't lose my home. I stayed and he left.

 

So far I have not got a job other than teaching art out of my home and selling things online. I will have to do something soon however as I just can't make it forever like this. I will probably pick up something part-time.

 

And as for God, I realize now that I am even more important to Him than my marriage. YES, God desires that two joined together should not part, but in this fallen world it happens. I can feel His grace more than ever before and I know he loves me. He has taken care of me through all of this. I praise Him for all He has done for me.

 

God bless you, Michelle. Sorry the road has been rough. I respect your courage. :grouphug:

[AngelBee]

 

And as for God, I realize now that I am even more important to Him than my marriage. YES, God desires that two joined together should not part, but in this fallen world it happens. I can feel His grace more than ever before and I know he loves me. He has taken care of me through all of this. I praise Him for all He has done for me.

 

This is very timely for me. Thank you for sharing ur heart so openly.

[PinkInTheBlue]

Many of the women who use the Bible as a reason to stay are being told in churches or by books written by Christian authors that if they stay, and if they do their part, and if they obey enough and love enough and give of themselves enough, God will change their husbands for the better. That their husbands will see the unconditional love of their wives and it will change their heart. That all they need do is be patient and trust God and eventually, their marriage will be transformed. It's a lie that keeps women in bondage to abusers without real answers or support for fixing the real problems that they have.

 

:iagree: This is exactly why I stayed. Oh the sermons I heard talking about if I stayed God would reward that by making things right. The guilt of breaking the family. How I would be held accountable for the "sin" of divorce. The worst thing I did was stay when I realized within the first 2 months what the truth is. The other worst thing I did was listen to the preachers and churches and not only stay but ended up bringing 2 children into the marriage. However, the presence of those children is what made me realize I had a responsibility outside of myself now and it was irresponsible for those boys to grow up with that continual example.

 

It was very, very scary but the right thing for me. I just wish with all my very being I had done it at the very beginning and NOT brought children into it. I just believed it would get better and *I* was the guilty one. Ugh!

 

So sorry Michelle. I'm glad your children are doing better. I truly know its easy for me to say from the outside but the church and friends you've "lost" are ones you really needed out of your life to make it healthy. :grouphug:

[Josie]

For instance Malachi 2:16 says:

 

"I hate divorce," says the Lord God of Israel, "AND I HATE A MAN'S COVERING HIMSELF WITH VIOLENCE AS WELL AS WITH HIS GARMENT," SAYS THE LORD GOD ALMIGHTY

 

Amazing how often the fact that God HATES it when men hit their wives as much as he hates divorce is often glossed over in the church. But it is true, God loves women and does not want them to be doormats for this junk.

 

AMEN!!!!!! This is so true, people only see what they want to see in the Bible.

I hate it when people quote Ephesians 6:1-3 but don't even mention Ephesians 6:4, for example.

[lionfamily1999]

It's the nature of the abuse cycle to stay. That is what the abuse cycle *does* to women. They don't enter the relationship that worn down, damaged. They come out of it that way.

 

The nature of abuse (power and control) works to keep you in.

 

The Christian/Bible part of it feeds the abuse dynamic, but is not the "reason" women stay. Women stay because of the abuse dynamic and the Christian culture is co-opted by the abuse dynamic, serving to keep them there.

 

It is not a matter of:

 

1. How strong the woman is/was

2. How smart the woman is/was

3. How "bad" he is

 

Once the dynamic develops, breaking that pattern is dangerous. No, truly. Women are safer IN the relationship than newly out of it.

 

(Edited to add, OP, that I regret staying. I believed that "divorce was not an option" and I only hurt myself and my kids more by staying. I didn't know what I didn't know.)

:grouphug: Strength, not physical (although that might help) but inner strength does have something to do with it. Joanne, you're courageous and you're strong. I don't agree with you much of the time, but I look at you and hope that if I came to a situation where the RIGHT thing is also the most DANGEROUS thing, I would have the strength that you do.

 

I'm going to slaughter a Charles Dickens quote, for you ;)

 

Worth her weight in gold? God forbid. She's all metal.

 

That's you, toots.

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ETA, you're a total revolutionary. You stood up to a tyrant, a tyrant a heckofalot closer than a government, and you chose liberty. Go you!