Ds wants to be a general..

[Kate in Arabia]

So my ds 10 wants to be a general. This has been his career choice for probably the past 5+ years? With no overt coercion from us, he is a very patriotic child -- the national anthem was his favorite song for years, his favorite holiday is July 4th, favorite subject is American history, etc. etc. .. and his favorite pastime is wargames, like the computer diplomacy/battle planning games. Off the computer, he has developed his own role-playing game he calls Alliances.

 

Since this has been a constant (and really only increasing) over a number of years I asked him whether he'd like to find out a) what a general really does and b) what it takes to become a general. He was avidly interested.

 

So short of simply googling "how does one become a general", anyone have links (age appropriate or not) that would talk about this some? Do most generals start at West Point (don't laugh at me, I know I'm ignorant in matters military)? Any recommended kids books on the military (historical or current)? His current favorite books are a series on the US Presidents and pretty much any books about American history.

 

tia!

[aggieamy]

I'd have him read a lot about generals also. We've had some great men that were generals and some real characters. I suggest some great men from WWII (Patton, Omar Bradley, Douglas MacArthur, and Eisenhower) to start.

Edited October 2, 2011 by aggieamy

[asta]

Have him check out the Coast Guard as well. People always forget about them, but they have Admirals, too.

 

Then there is the old joke: What's the best way to become a general? Be the son of a general...

 

 

a

[Kate in Arabia]

Thanks for the comments so far.. it sounds to me like he's most interested in being a military strategist, I don't know that that is really the job of a general? Is it (maybe it is, I told you I'm ignorant)?

 

I like the idea of having him read some biographies of generals, I'll do some surfing of Amazon to see what we could pick up in the summer.

 

They'd be too young for him reading-wise, but COFAs have a lot of generals...

 

Umm.. I don't know what COFA is?

[scrapbookbuzz]

I am a veteran and come from a long line of veterans. Allow me to just say that when your ds gets to the actual stage of being able to pursue that goal, I would highly advise him, in whatever branch of the military he chooses to join, to start out enlisted for a few years and then pursue being a commissioned officer. Liken it to wanting to be a CEO but starting out as a dishwasher or cashier to really get a feel as to the real working conditions are. Your son, and those in his charge, will be better off for it.

 

Now, at this point, all I can think of are things to do if you're stateside, which I don't think you are at the moment?

[Mom in High Heels]

Good for him! The link listed above is what I was going to post.

 

Most generals are WP grads,but not all of them. In fact, General Ham (who Indy is good friends with) was commissioned through ROTC. He's a 4 star and was until recently commander of US Army Europe (he lived across the street from us) and is now commander of US Army Africa. Our new general is LTG Hertling (3 star) and graduated from WP. They both have loads of education, which seems is standard for generals (most hold 1 or more Masters), but much of that education comes from military schools necessary for promotions War College, Command and General Staff College, etc).

 

If possible, have him write a general a letter and ask him what he thinks is important in becoming a general and what he thinks your ds should do to fulfill his goals. There's no guarantee he'll get a response, but most generals are very accommodating and appreciate hearing from children and will write them back. Indy has 4 letters (and a birthday card) from General Ham and 2 letters from LTG Hertling. In fact LTG Hertling came to our door to meet Indy, but he and I were in Paris at the time and missed him. James Bond was quite shocked to find a 3 star standing at our door. :lol:

 

For his 7th birthday, Indy invited the Hams to the party. We were all shocked when the RSVP'd that they would come. We happened to be outside when they left their compound to come over to our section. We're behind a different gate so they had to go through the gate guards (a contract company, not military) and they made Gen Ham show his ID before allowing him access. We all thought that was hilarious. Christie later told me that that was the first time he had ever walked out the gate. He was normally in a car with guards. He's an avid motorcyclist, but doesn't ride much over here because he has to have a car in front of and behind him, and that apparently isn't much fun.

 

There are only 320* generals (1-4 star) in the entire army and they (especially the 3 and 4 star) serve at the discretion of the President. Christie told me that if the Pres decided tomorrow that he no longer wanted/needed Gen Ham, that that would be that. They'd retire him. There are only twelve 4 stars in the army. Right now we're down one since Gen McCrystal retired. They haven't come up with a replacement yet but odds are on LTG Hertling (our neighbor) as almost every CG of US Army Europe has been a 4 star since 1953. Actually there was one 3 star, but he was an interim commander and was only in command for 2 months in 1971.

 

Wow, I wrote a novel there, didn't I? Oh, another thought! Have him write to the Joint Chiefs. Gen Dempsy is the Chairman of the JCS and Gen Odierno is the army Chief of Staff. HTH!

 

 

*There are only 11 generals on active duty in the U.S. Army. Fewer than one-half percent of commissioned officers make it to the top three ranks of Army general. In all, there can be only 302 general officers (generals, lieutenant generals, major generals and brigadier generals) in the U.S. Army.

 

The president nominates officers for the rank of general, and the U.S. Senate must confirm the appointment. When a general retires or loses the rank for some other reason, the president suggests a replacement from a list of nominees. The mandatory retirement age is 62, though it can be pushed to 64 in some cases.

Edited October 3, 2011 by Mom in High Heels
To fix numbers because I was too lazy/tired to do it when I realized it was wrong.

[In The Great White North]

Allow me to just say that when your ds gets to the actual stage of being able to pursue that goal, I would highly advise him, in whatever branch of the military he chooses to join, to start out enlisted for a few years and then pursue being a commissioned officer.

 

I disagree.

 

There are mandatory retirement dates for each rank. If you have twenty years and are a captain you will be forced to retire, 24 years for a major, etc. (I've been out for a few years, so I could have the numbers wrong but the idea is still there.)

 

It takes more than 20 years to become a general. If he wants to be a general, he needs to start with West Point or ROTC. Statistically, he needs to start at West Point.

 

Yes, generals are military strategists. However, the job includes much, much more. Generals have to be good leaders, good managers, good public speakers, good role models, good planners, etc. West Point teaches you how to do this.

 

The idea that one must start as a private to be a good officer is heard a lot but has no basis in reality. Off the top of my head, I can't think of ANY famous generals who started as privates.

[eternalknot]

I don't know how old your son is, so you'll have to check for appropriateness, but there's a magazine called Armchair General that might be an interesting read for him :) I've only seen it once at an airport in the US Midwest and I didn't pick it up then LOL but it's stuck with me. I'd imagine you can google it to get an idea or peek at it.

[kiana]

Thanks for the comments so far.. it sounds to me like he's most interested in being a military strategist, I don't know that that is really the job of a general? Is it (maybe it is, I told you I'm ignorant)?

 

I like the idea of having him read some biographies of generals, I'll do some surfing of Amazon to see what we could pick up in the summer.

 

 

 

Umm.. I don't know what COFA is?

 

Childhoods of Famous Americans.

 

FWIW, I continued reading them long after they were "too young" for me reading-wise. Heck, sometimes today I still pick one up and get distracted :P

[wapiti]

when your ds gets to the actual stage of being able to pursue that goal, I would highly advise him, in whatever branch of the military he chooses to join, to start out enlisted for a few years and then pursue being a commissioned officer.

 

A very close relative who enlisted and is now a CSM strongly recommends against such a plan. He recommends WP or ROTC instead for his kids.

 

Generals have to be good leaders, good managers, good public speakers, good role models, good planners, etc. West Point teaches you how to do this.

 

My DH would agree ;). With regard to this list of qualities, WP had a large role in making him who he is, in ways that are important to his life now even though he is no longer in the army.

[Mrs Mungo]

I agree with those who recommended a service academy or ROTC. It generally takes 30 years of service to make general, most OCS officers will max out before they reach general. Also, your chances are better at making general if you are combat arms.

 

Mom in High Heels, you are a bit confused, there are 230 generals in the army. There are forty four star generals across all of the services.

Edited October 2, 2011 by Mrs Mungo

[seraphina]

I have no advice but I think it's great that he has such a worthy goal and you are doing a great job of trying to help him on his path towards reaching it. Yay to both of you.

[tntgoodwin]

Keep in mind that one could be a General in the

 

US Army

US Air Force

US Marine Corps

 

You aren't limited to West Point. ;)

[In The Great White North]

Keep in mind that one could be a General in the

 

US Army

US Air Force

US Marine Corps

 

I suspect that the military strategy he is thinking of involves armies on the battlefield; therefore, West Point.

[Mrs Mungo]

I suspect that the military strategy he is thinking of involves armies on the battlefield; therefore, West Point.

 

All of the services are on the battlefield, even the Air Force. Not all airmen fly in planes. Not all seamen travel in boats. Strange, but true.

 

Eta: Many of the BIG two-four star commands are joint jobs, and the command rotates between the services.

Edited October 2, 2011 by Mrs Mungo

[WTMCassandra]

By the way, if he is very serious, then you should do four things starting at least in junior high school:

 

1) Ensure he is very fitness minded, has some sort of exercise program, and possibly even gets team sports experience. Military academies look for this. Team sports can possibly be very important if the applicant is a homeschooler.

 

2) Find him leadership opportunities. Military academies look for this.

 

3) Find out ASAP what branch of the service he wants to go into and check the medical requirements. This can be tough to really find out, but you can if you persist. No one will be happy if you and your son work toward these goals for YEARS and then he doesn't make it because he's color blind, has flat feet, or whatever.

 

4) Find out ASAP what military academy he wants to go to and keep abreast of requirements for homeschoolers. The academies, particularly the Air Force Academy, can be tougher for homeschoolers to get into than regular colleges. Keep very excellent records. Jump through all the hoops. Maybe twice. And keep checking to see if the requirements change over time.

[HS Mom in NC]

The Art of War by Sun Tzu is a must.

[Mrs Mungo]

My other suggestion? We are heading toward a drawdown in a poor economy. He will need ways to stand out. A language (or two), a high level of physical fitness, leadership roles in team situations, a diverse portfolio.

[gardenmom5]

currently, I believe they must have at least a MS, it should be good motivation for education. learning about government as well, as it takes an act of congress to make a general, and there are NEVER two promoted on the same day so there is never a conflict of time in rank.

 

many undergraduate degrees offered at military academies are engineering related. so lots of math & science. needs to know how to write well. (I looked at AF for my daughter, and my brother was stationed at Peterson so I had toured it)

 

2dd did cross country - one of her teammates went to the Naval Academy.

Edited October 3, 2011 by gardenmom5

[Mrs Mungo]

currently, I believe they must have at least a MS, it should be good motivation for education.

 

But, they only need a BA as lieutenants. They will get the chance for a Master's while serving, most of them get their MA at ILE or the War College.

[gardenmom5]

I disagree.

 

There are mandatory retirement dates for each rank. If you have twenty years and are a captain you will be forced to retire, 24 years for a major, etc. (I've been out for a few years, so I could have the numbers wrong but the idea is still there.)

 

It takes more than 20 years to become a general. If he wants to be a general, he needs to start with West Point or ROTC. Statistically, he needs to start at West Point.

 

Yes, generals are military strategists. However, the job includes much, much more. Generals have to be good leaders, good managers, good public speakers, good role models, good planners, etc. West Point teaches you how to do this.

 

The idea that one must start as a private to be a good officer is heard a lot but has no basis in reality. Off the top of my head, I can't think of ANY famous generals who started as privates.

:iagree:, though it is possible to move up, it's not very likely. fil had a good friend who started enlisted (during WWII) and went out with a star. there's a reason for the British toast of "here's to bloody battles and sickly seasons" as it meant it was more likely to move up ranks when higher ranks were KIA.

 

West Point, AF, and Annapolis all teach those leadership skills, as they are all training future generals (or Admirals in the case of Annapolis - which is also for Marine officers). If he *really* wants to be a general, I'd stick with one of those academies, only planning on ROTC through a GOOD university as a back-up.

 

It is being willing to stick your neck out. Jimmy Stewart had a trainer help him gain weight to get into the Army Air corps when WWII broke out (he already had a degree from Princeton and knew how to fly) - then he was twisting someone's arm to actually let him fly bombing missions over germany instead of just being a PR prop. (he would not allow the army to count his missions as he didn't want to be used that way) he eventually went in to the reserves, but retired with a star.

[Kate in Arabia]

Thank you so so much for this discussion. I know ds is young (I mentioned in the OP that he's 10 yrs), but he has seemed so focused on this area for so long, and I want to encourage/support him in pretty much wherever his dreams lie.

 

My other suggestion? We are heading toward a drawdown in a poor economy. He will need ways to stand out. A language (or two), a high level of physical fitness, leadership roles in team situations, a diverse portfolio.

 

I think his background is a double-edged sword (growing up here with the language-culture exposure, and to an extent his faith background); the other things he can definitely focus on.

 

I was chatting with an expat friend here who homeschooled her kids (they are grown and gone), and one was accepted to Annapolis; I think she sent him for his senior year of hs to one of the military prep-type schools which helped segue him in? I'm not necessarily thinking of that, but that was something she did.

 

I also mentioned to ds the possibility of being a military historian, although I suppose "historian" doesn't have the ring of economic guarantee about it, lol.

[Mrs Mungo]

I think his background is a double-edged sword (growing up here with the language-culture exposure, and to an extent his faith background); the other things he can definitely focus on.

 

But, does he only speak Arabic and English? There are currently a lot of translators who speak Arabic (fewer that speak Farsi or something like that). Try adding another language like Chinese.

[Kate in Arabia]

Arabic, English and Urdu (Urdu is dh's native language); I've been looking into a tutor for Urdu, the kids have never studied it formally but have picked up a fair amount.

[Mom in High Heels]

 

Mom in High Heels, you are a bit confused, there are 230 generals in the army. There are forty four star generals across all of the services.

 

Yep, I realized it later, but I was too tired to fix it. Off to edit now, but I read it was 320, not 230.

Edited October 3, 2011 by Mom in High Heels

[Mrs Mungo]

Yep, I realized it later, but I was too tired to fix it. Off to edit now, but I read it was 320, not 230.

 

There are only 230 currently allowed by the US Code (Title 10, subtitle A, part 2, chapter 32, section 526).

 

Current version of the code:

http://www.gpo.gov:80/fdsys/pkg/USCODE-2010-title10/html/USCODE-2010-title10-subtitleA-partII-chap32-sec526.htm

 

eta: A lot of articles online contain old information.

[Mrs Mungo]

Concerning the edit:

*There are only 11 generals on active duty in the U.S. Army. Fewer than one-half percent of commissioned officers make it to the top three ranks of Army general. In all, there can be only 302 general officers (generals, lieutenant generals, major generals and brigadier generals) in the U.S. Army.

 

Just to clarify, there are currently 11 *four-star* generals on active duty, I know that is what you meant by typing, "generals," because O-10s are Generals, but then it is capitalized. I am not tryig to nit-pick, just making it more clear for those unfamiliar. :)

 

The 302 number of generals allowed in the army is the *old number*, it has been reduced to 230. I provided the current and correct source in my other post. Most expect that this number will be reduced by about another 50 during the next drawdown round.

Edited October 3, 2011 by Mrs Mungo