TT Alg 1 ----> Foerster's/Jacobs...what should I do?

[Rosy]

DD10 is finishing up TT Pre-Al. We already have TT Alg 1, but now I'm trying to figure out what to do after that. She'll be in about 6th grade, and I'm trying to figure out what would be a good balance of rigor and age-appropriateness. As it is, she tends to get frustrated with how long it takes her to finish a math lesson...usually about 45-60 min. It seems that middle school math texts are made for a middle school attention span and maturity level...she's mostly there, but I don't want to push her too hard.

Edited July 25, 2011 by Rosy

[8filltheheart]

I voted for moving into Foersters. I have taken all of my older kids through MUS's alg and geo prior to moving into Foerster.

 

I'm doing it again this yr with my 5th one. I just wrote her 1st 8 weeks worth of math lesson plans and she will complete almost the first 5 chpts in those 8 weeks. The beginning of the book is mostly review which is great b/c they develop pure confidence in their abilities to tackle algebra. ;) And, we get to reduce the pace and really dig in on the harder topics later in the yr.

 

FWIW, I have had a 10 yos complete Foersters and do extremely well.

[Capt_Uhura]

I'm not there yet so I'm not qualified to give advice but if I may ask 8filltheheart a question. When you say you wrote lesson plans for the first 8 weeks, what does that entail? Can't you just open Foerster's and start on page 1 and move through or are you assigning days to the various chapters?

Edited July 25, 2011 by Capt_Uhura

[8filltheheart]

I'm not there you so I'm not qualified to give advice but if I may ask 8filltheheart a question. When you say you wrote lesson plans for the first 8 weeks, what does that entail? Can't you just open Foerster's and start on page 1 and move through or are you assigning days to the various chapters?

 

I write plans for exactly what has to be completed every day. So these plans tell which sections and which problems need to be done.

 

I cannot go with the "open the book and do the next thing" philosophy when it comes to high school level materials. :tongue_smilie: I set the pace and they have to keep up. Or if it is too slow, they are lucky for that set of plans ;) (which I normally write in 6 week chunks, but this yr we are starting late b/c of our granddaughter living with us until mid-Aug). When I write the next set, the pace would increase.:D

 

FWIW, pace and output are inflexible criteria for me when it comes to giving high school credit at younger ages.

 

Also, you cannot follow Foerster's TM and get through the book in a single yr unless you skip sections. His daily pace means it takes something like 220-230 days to get through the book. I only schedule 34 weeks, so we finish the book in 170.

[Capt_Uhura]

8Filltheheart - Thank you! We're not even to high school yet and I think sitting down and writing plans out for 6-8week blocks might ensure that it all gets done. Unfortunately, it's been another crazy summer but there is still time lol for me to get it together...I hope. :001_smile:

[abbeyej]

I think it makes sense to do TT Alg 1 and then move on to a more rigorous algebra 1 text. (I've used Dolciani with my first and expect to repeat that with dd, but certainly Foerster's is well-respected too.) I doubt most kids would be prepared for Foerster Algebra 2 by TT Algebra 1, though as a pre-algebra course, I think it would work well.

 

If it reassures you at all, ds started Dolciani right before he turned 10 and finished it that school year. It was challenging, absolutely, but that was my goal for him and he did really well with it. He's a very strong math student, certainly, but he's also a normal kid. He went on to Jacobs Geometry this past year and enjoyed it.

[Rebecca VA]

The Foerster's problem sets are very long. We often broke up a lesson into two or three days' worth of work. Not only that, but each of the (many) problems had numerous steps. If you go with Foerster's -- which is a wonderful text -- be prepared to go very, very slowly through it with your young child.

[8filltheheart]

The Foerster's problem sets are very long. We often broke up a lesson into two or three days' worth of work. Not only that, but each of the (many) problems had numerous steps. If you go with Foerster's -- which is a wonderful text -- be prepared to go very, very slowly through it with your young child.

 

I think this is going to be more dependent on the individual vs. the age. My younger kids have not had any problem adjusting to the text and have managed to keep the same pace as my older kids.

[Rosy]

Thanks, everyone, for your input! How long does a Foerster's problem set take?

[PeterPan]

Well this isn't what you asked for, but my first thought with your post was to suggest she go back and do the same level she's already doing (pre-algebra) with new materials so she can get faster. MM would be good for that.

[wapiti]

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[8filltheheart]

Thanks, everyone, for your input! How long does a Foerster's problem set take?

 

That is not a question that can just be answered. It is sort of like asking how long it takes to read 30 pgs. My kids spend approx an hr on math/day. But, my kids all tend to be strong math students, and according to a friend, I have a very skewed sense of normal. :lol:

[AngieW in Texas]

I would actually recommend that you look at Kinetic Books Algebra I. I know TT Algebra I doesn't cover nearly as much as KB does. The simulations in Algebra I are a lot of fun and there are games as well.

 

Rather than doing the program as lessons, my girls have always done it on a timer. Usually 45 minutes/day has been enough.

[Rosy]

I'm pretty committed to TT Alg 1. She likes it, she is learning, and the pace seems right for now. I know it's not as rigorous as other curric and we'll have to redo a year before she does Calc, it's just a matter of deciding which one. She's only in 5th so even if I have to redo 2 years it's not the end of the world. If Foerster's is going to be too demanding, I'd rather wait until she's older. But if it's not going to be painful for her, I don't mind starting it when she's still young. I probably just need to look at it and figure out if she's ready for it yet.

[HSMom2One]

I said "Other" because the closest option to staying with TT that I saw on your list gave a reason I didn't agree with. I would recommend staying with TT because she is currently using the curriculum and obviously advancing.

 

Moving around with curriculum is something that I've found from experience to frequently cause big gaps in learning. (We've had this happen in both grammar and math programs, and now I am in the process of rebuilding solid foundations in both.) In my opinion, it would be better to stay with TT and supplement with another choice if you feel that it's necessary.

 

FWIW,

Lucinda

[8filltheheart]

I'm pretty committed to TT Alg 1. She likes it, she is learning, and the pace seems right for now. I know it's not as rigorous as other curric and we'll have to redo a year before she does Calc, it's just a matter of deciding which one. She's only in 5th so even if I have to redo 2 years it's not the end of the world. If Foerster's is going to be too demanding, I'd rather wait until she's older. But if it's not going to be painful for her, I don't mind starting it when she's still young. I probably just need to look at it and figure out if she's ready for it yet.

 

My kids didn't find the transition to Foerster's painful. However, they did find it much more challenging than MUS by the 6th chapter.

 

FWIW, if you are going to switch out of TT into any other program, I think the best time would be to make the transition after she finishes the alg 1 and then go back through a more challenging alg 1 program. It will really solidify algebraic concepts which are the foundation for all upper level math.

 

HTH

[Rosy]

My kids didn't find the transition to Foerster's painful. However, they did find it much more challenging than MUS by the 6th chapter.

 

FWIW, if you are going to switch out of TT into any other program, I think the best time would be to make the transition after she finishes the alg 1 and then go back through a more challenging alg 1 program. It will really solidify algebraic concepts which are the foundation for all upper level math.

 

HTH

That does help and is kind of what I was thinking. I really do like TT, but I wouldn't feel comfortable going from TT Pre-Calc into a college-level calc class...and I'm thinking I can either switch her after Alg 1 and redo Alg 1 with a more rigorous curric, or switch her later, but then I'd feel like I had to redo both Alg and Geo/Trig to get her up to speed.

 

Thanks for helping me think this through!

[PeterPan]

Rosy, not to dissuade you, but I'll just mention that I've seen posts by several people (creekland, Sandy in Indy, etc.) whose kids have done FINE going from TT into calc in college. I also know someone locally whose boys did TT. The oldest is now at Rose-Hulman, an exceedingly fine engineering school, and he was just fine. I think there's something to the idea that very bright kids can take that bit of instruction and run with it. I don't really know why you see the discrepancy. In any case, if it crosses your mind to stay, here's a link to a thread. http://www.welltrainedmind.com/forums/showthread.php?t=282302

[8filltheheart]

Rosy, not to dissuade you, but I'll just mention that I've seen posts by several people (creekland, Sandy in Indy, etc.) whose kids have done FINE going from TT into calc in college. I also know someone locally whose boys did TT. The oldest is now at Rose-Hulman, an exceedingly fine engineering school, and he was just fine. I think there's something to the idea that very bright kids can take that bit of instruction and run with it. I don't really know why you see the discrepancy. In any case, if it crosses your mind to stay, here's a link to a thread. http://www.welltrainedmind.com/forums/showthread.php?t=282302

 

Just b/c students do well does not mean they have the same level of understanding. I have written at length about how I **know** that my oldest does not possess the same theoretical understanding of math that my 15 yos does even though he will be graduating cum laude with a degree in chemical engineering in 2 weeks and my 15 yos hasn't taken calculus yet.

 

What you use does impact understanding. It does not necessarily impact the ability to do the problems, but big picture theory, yes. I have seen it. My oldest was perfectly capable of having achieved the same level of understanding that younger ds has achieved. The difference is simply in what they have been exposed to.

[Maverick_Mom]

I voted to go with Jacobs because we're using TT Algebra right now and I really want to try Jacobs next. Definitely no conflict of interest in my answer. :lol: