Extremely negative personality?

[Renee in NC]

Here are the symptoms. Any ideas?

 

 

• Only sees the worst thing in a situation. If he does something fun, when someone asks later he'll only mention the worst thing that happened.
   
  
• Perfectionist to the extreme - if it isn't perfect, it is terrible. This applies to himself mostly, but also to situations and things. Always wants to replace things because they aren't perfect. He doesn't take meticulous care of anything, though, so it doesn't translate into that.
   
  
• Complains constantly about everything - the way he feels, noises, what people are doing, etc. Everything annoys him. His hearing is so sensitive that the sound of the electricity in the walls annoys him. He constantly complains that his back hurts, or he feels sick, or something along those lines.
   
  
• Can't take the perspective of others. This hurts friendships as he can't say, "I'm sorry" because he can't see where he did anything wrong.
   
  
• Doesn't see a true picture of himself. He thinks he is absolutely the best at something, but really he isn't or he is good at something, but can only see his failings. This also means he isn't willing to work hard at anything since either he is already the best or there is no point because he is so terrible.
   
  
• Will not take coaching or counsel from anyone about anything. He always knows better than they do.
   
  
• Gets obsessed with topics and/or activites and doesn't want to do or talk about anything but that.
   
  
• Argues over absolutely everything and not just in a normal sense. He will tell you that you are wrong about just about anything. This makes some family members refuse to be with him because his constant correction is annoying.
  

 

 

He has been like this since he was a preschooler. He is diagnosed ADD (and is most likely dyslexic), but stimulant meds make his "quirks" much, much worse. He has a neuropsych eval. next week, so I wanted to be prepared.

 

Any ideas?

[thescrappyhomeschooler]

Have you read anything about Narcissistic Personality Disorder? Your descriptions fit some of the signs.

[BamaTanya]

My ds with most of these symptoms was diagnosed with Asperger's Syndrome when he was 10 years old. We love-love-love our boy, but oh. my. goodness. It can be challenging to deal with some of his quirks.

 

I don't know how old your son is, but our relationship is improving with our ds. I don't know if it's because maturity is helping or if it's because we're just learning him better -- adjusting our expectations, "accepting the things we cannot change," and giving him more room to be himself.

 

The autism spectrum disorder diagnosis was the first one that made sense to us. Prior to that, he had been diagnosed as ADHD (and a non-stimulant medication was more helpful than the stimulant), OCD, and bipolar. He is hyposensitive to many sensory systems, especially sound and touch. And "theory of mind" is the explanation for why it is so difficult for him to consider the perspectives of others.

 

In our journey, we consulted two pediatricians, three pediatric neurologists, two pediatric psychiatrists, two counselors, and a physical therapist.

 

Find someone who will listen to you -- not just in the initial evaluation, but also in the course of treatment. I could not work with the two neurologists who told me I was making my son worse by homeschooling (?????? Really? Homeschooling causes autism???) or who said, "OK, we'll double the dosage -- see you in four months" when I said his behaviors were getting worse on the attempted medication.

 

Blessings to you both. Please keep us posted. :grouphug:

[Renee in NC]

Have you read anything about Narcissistic Personality Disorder? Your descriptions fit some of the signs.

 

:001_unsure:

 

I am very familiar with NPD as we have a family member who has it. Can NPD be genetic? Maybe this is why I worry so much about this particular one as he is JUST LIKE the NPD family member. The ADD, the dyslexia, the other traits....

[Renee in NC]

My ds with most of these symptoms was diagnosed with Asperger's Syndrome when he was 10 years old. We love-love-love our boy, but oh. my. goodness. It can be challenging to deal with some of his quirks.

 

I don't know how old your son is, but our relationship is improving with our ds. I don't know if it's because maturity is helping or if it's because we're just learning him better -- adjusting our expectations, "accepting the things we cannot change," and giving him more room to be himself.

 

The autism spectrum disorder diagnosis was the first one that made sense to us. Prior to that, he had been diagnosed as ADHD (and a non-stimulant medication was more helpful than the stimulant), OCD, and bipolar. He is hyposensitive to many sensory systems, especially sound and touch. And "theory of mind" is the explanation for why it is so difficult for him to consider the perspectives of others.

 

In our journey, we consulted two pediatricians, three pediatric neurologists, two pediatric psychiatrists, two counselors, and a physical therapist.

 

Find someone who will listen to you -- not just in the initial evaluation, but also in the course of treatment. I could not work with the two neurologists who told me I was making my son worse by homeschooling (?????? Really? Homeschooling causes autism???) or who said, "OK, we'll double the dosage -- see you in four months" when I said his behaviors were getting worse on the attempted medication.

 

Blessings to you both. Please keep us posted. :grouphug:

 

My ds *did* go to public school and he was happy there, but he was only there for 9 weeks. Academically he was *bombing* and they didn't seem to be particularly worried about it. I am not totally against school for him if it would make things better, but our local schools are not.

[thescrappyhomeschooler]

:001_unsure:

 

I am very familiar with NPD as we have a family member who has it. Can NPD be genetic? Maybe this is why I worry so much about this particular one as he is JUST LIKE the NPD family member. The ADD, the dyslexia, the other traits....

 

I don't know if it's genetic or not. I'm definitely not an expert. When I was describing my relationship with my mother to my therapist, she's the one who told me it sounded like my mother had NPD. When I read more about it, it certainly fits. For my aunt, too, but I think it has more to do with the atmosphere in their house when they were growing up rather than genetics.

 

I also have a son with Asperger's, and he does display some of these behaviors, too. Except it's done in a very different way from my mother. Hard to explain.

[Jan in SC]

I wouldn't worry about NPD. It sounds like there is untreated anxiety, possibly OCD, along with the ADD. You might have to get a psych to try different combos of medicine. It also sounds like there is some underlying sensory issue.

 

Aspergers can fit, but sensory and aspergers can overlap so much, so it might be a -treat the symptoms- sort of dx.

[DawnM]

hmmm.....my oldest has some of these tendencies, but he has Asperger's.

 

Dawn

[Renee in NC]

I wouldn't worry about NPD. It sounds like there is untreated anxiety, possibly OCD, along with the ADD. You might have to get a psych to try different combos of medicine. It also sounds like there is some underlying sensory issue.

 

Aspergers can fit, but sensory and aspergers can overlap so much, so it might be a -treat the symptoms- sort of dx.

 

The stimulants did make his anxiety worse. He has always been the "worrier" of the family. He is having a neurosych eval next week, so we will see what they say.

[ereks mom]

hmmm.....my oldest has some of these tendencies, but he has Asperger's.

 

Dawn

 

Asperger's is what I was thinking too. I know several people with Asperger's, and they fit the OP's description.

[emeraldjoy]

Is he your oldest? (if you don't mind sharing)

e

[Renee in NC]

Is he your oldest? (if you don't mind sharing)

e

 

No. My oldest is the exact opposite!:tongue_smilie:

[emeraldjoy]

shoots my theory right out of the water...ha, ha...

Some of what you described can be applied to our oldest and I have often felt responsible for it..like we just expected too much of her for too long and she became overly critical of herself and the world.

This does not sound like your situation at all.

 

By the way, good for you momma for tring to figure it out!! and blessings on your journey:grouphug:

 

e

[Renee in NC]

Asperger's is what I was thinking too. I know several people with Asperger's, and they fit the OP's description.

 

How does ADD fit into that? He has definite ADD characteristics, too. He jumps from thing to thing, leaves a disaster in his wake (tools, clothes, trash, etc.), easily distracted, not wanting to do anything that requires sustained attention, etc.

 

Can someone have both?

[Terabith]

I'm sure one can have both.

 

However, I have to say, if I was so hyposensitive that the sound of electricity in the walls bothered me, I would probably be very grumpy and irritable as well. Add in other sensitivities and a personality that is anxious/ perfectionistic/ and prone to depression/ maybe Aspergers, and I could see how these traits would be perfectly understandable.

 

No fun to live with, however. For him, or for you. :grouphug:

 

Personality disorders cannot be diagnosed in a child under 18, for good reasons, although tendencies can be there. But that would not be my first thought in this case.

[BamaTanya]

How does ADD fit into that? He has definite ADD characteristics, too. He jumps from thing to thing, leaves a disaster in his wake (tools, clothes, trash, etc.), easily distracted, not wanting to do anything that requires sustained attention, etc.

 

Can someone have both?

 

Yes, absolutely. In our ds, Asperger's has characteristics of OCD, ADHD, and depression. (Does he have clinical depression or does his knowledge of how he is different make him feel isolated and misunderstood? -- We may never know.)

 

We gave school several tries with varying success. He had a couple of amazing special ed teachers in elementary school but middle school (changing classes, keeping track of assignments, etc) was a disaster. Even though he had an IEP, his regular ed teachers just didn't want to deal with him and his issues. We could have forced them (we are educators and know our rights), but our ds was miserable. Of course, a lot of kids in middle school are miserable, right? :tongue_smilie: We're homeschooling again . . . we're taking it year by year.

[Renee in NC]

shoots my theory right out of the water...ha, ha...

Some of what you described can be applied to our oldest and I have often felt responsible for it..like we just expected too much of her for too long and she became overly critical of herself and the world.

This does not sound like your situation at all.

 

By the way, good for you momma for tring to figure it out!! and blessings on your journey:grouphug:

 

e

 

I tend to blame myself for my kids issues all the time. Then I blame homeschooling. That is my fault as well, since I am doing the homeschooling.:tongue_smilie: He *is* the oldest child of my dh, so he does have some "oldest son" issues going on.

 

I don't really have a need to "fix him" per se, but I hate to see him so unhappy. If this is simply the way he is, then I'll have to learn to accept it. He has great qualities, too - it's funny how adults either really, really like him or he drives them absolutely nuts.

[emeraldjoy]

.

 

I don't really have a need to "fix him" per se, but I hate to see him so unhappy. If this is simply the way he is, then I'll have to learn to accept it. He has great qualities, too - it's funny how adults either really, really like him or he drives them absolutely nuts.

 

I love this attitude so much. It is inspiring for me...not to "fix them" but to address their unhappiness.....

[thescrappyhomeschooler]

Just want to apologize for maybe causing you grief! I didn't mean to say that your kid has NPD. I hadn't had my tea (the caffeinated kind) yet this morning when I posted, and your list just rang a bell in my head, so I posted without thinking. :blush: A lot of symptoms can be cross over for lots of different things. A lot of those things ARE very Asperger-y, too.

[Renee in NC]

I'm sure one can have both.

 

However, I have to say, if I was so hyposensitive that the sound of electricity in the walls bothered me, I would probably be very grumpy and irritable as well. Add in other sensitivities and a personality that is anxious/ perfectionistic/ and prone to depression/ maybe Aspergers, and I could see how these traits would be perfectly understandable.

 

No fun to live with, however. For him, or for you. :grouphug:

 

Personality disorders cannot be diagnosed in a child under 18, for good reasons, although tendencies can be there. But that would not be my first thought in this case.

 

That really does describe him. And I *do* understand how sensory issues can bother you - I have sensory issues and they can be miserable.

 

He is alot like me in some ways, so maybe that is why I want him to get help while he is young?:tongue_smilie:

[BamaTanya]

 

I don't really have a need to "fix him" per se, but I hate to see him so unhappy. If this is simply the way he is, then I'll have to learn to accept it. He has great qualities, too - it's funny how adults either really, really like him or he drives them absolutely nuts.

 

We sought help when we would hear our ds crying instead of going to sleep -- obsessing over missing our old house and insisting that he must not be part of our family since he was not like anyone else. :confused: We really really tried to accentuate the positive, but he was smart enough to realize he had social struggles. The perfectionism adds its own stress.

 

Our friends think he's terrific. He's smart and funny and has a unique perspective. His teachers? Sigh. He doesn't conform and he wasn't motivated to try to please the teacher. If something was difficult, he didn't want to do it. (Same with homeschooling.)

 

I hate that we had to have the "label," but it actually was a relief to me to be able to explain his struggles.

 

You're so right. I don't want to "fix" him. I just want to help him find his way in a world that is set up for a different kind of person. (School is very difficult for dc with "bionic" hearing!)

[RobinF]

I tend to blame myself for my kids issues all the time. Then I blame homeschooling. That is my fault as well, since I am doing the homeschooling.:tongue_smilie: He *is* the oldest child of my dh, so he does have some "oldest son" issues going on.

 

I don't really have a need to "fix him" per se, but I hate to see him so unhappy. If this is simply the way he is, then I'll have to learn to accept it. He has great qualities, too - it's funny how adults either really, really like him or he drives them absolutely nuts.

 

I have an extremely negative child and while I don't want to "fix" his personality per se, I do think that attitude (negativity) is a choice. My dh comes from a very negative family and I one of my grandparents was a negative nelly. We have both made a conscience decision to not be that way. It isn't that bad things never happen but we will not dwell or live in that mindset.

 

One thing that we do is listen to lots of positive thinking stuff. I know it isn't popular and I don't agree with his theology but Joel Olsteen is great for this. Also Zig Ziglar is another favorite in our house. We use things like this to encourage an positive outlook on life.

 

We also will correct any negative comments that are untrue and will reiterate the positive. ("I am ALWAYS wrong." No, you are incorrect now but remember when you said this and you were correct.) Things like that. We tend to point out the positive in things around us and encourage the boys to see the positive also.

 

It is making a difference in our home.

[elfgivas]

I

 

One thing that we do is listen to lots of positive thinking stuff. I know it isn't popular and I don't agree with his theology but Joel Olsteen is great for this. Also Zig Ziglar is another favorite in our house. We use things like this to encourage an positive outlook on life.

 

It is making a difference in our home.

 

"learned optimism" is different from positive thinking.... you may want to check out just about anything by Martin Seligman. one is "learned optimism: how to change your mind and your life". it helps give us new ways of looking at things. eg. take any picture. change the colour of the frame around it. the colour of the frame draws out different aspects of the picture even though the picture itself is the same. so then you spend time re-framing different things that happen. not denying them, or attributing them to a higher power, but simply noticing different things in them.

 

fwiw,

ann

[RobinF]

"learned optimism" is different from positive thinking.... you may want to check out just about anything by Martin Seligman. one is "learned optimism: how to change your mind and your life". it helps give us new ways of looking at things. eg. take any picture. change the colour of the frame around it. the colour of the frame draws out different aspects of the picture even though the picture itself is the same. so then you spend time re-framing different things that happen. not denying them, or attributing them to a higher power, but simply noticing different things in them.

 

fwiw,

ann

 

Dh has read some by Seligman. I mentioned Ziglar and Olsteen because listening to positive thinkers (and we prefer religiously based ones) seems to help change the attitude around here.

[trailofsparks]

"learned optimism" is different from positive thinking.... you may want to check out just about anything by Martin Seligman. one is "learned optimism: how to change your mind and your life". it helps give us new ways of looking at things. eg. take any picture. change the colour of the frame around it. the colour of the frame draws out different aspects of the picture even though the picture itself is the same. so then you spend time re-framing different things that happen. not denying them, or attributing them to a higher power, but simply noticing different things in them.

 

fwiw,

ann

 

Yes, in fact, Seligman's name/book was mentioned in an excellent book I just finished rereading for the 2nd time: The Childhood Roots of Adult Happiness by Hallowell.

 

I have 2 friends who have sons w/Aspergers. Both families have really worked hard w/their sons to overcome quirks and social inadequacies. Neither son is medicated. One family used to medicate when their ds was in ps, but he stopped growing so they took him off meds and out of ps. He is doing very well.

 

All the best as you prepare for your mtg and search out the best service for your son.

[kubiac]

I don't have a diagnosis, but on the off-chance there's an underlying mood disorder or brain imbalance, I'd make sure he's taking a good omega-3 supplement every day. If your brain is malnourished, it's very hard to be reasonable and measured.

[JudyJudyJudy]

I suspect that the doctor will diagnose him as being on the spectrum. However, I would address environmental issues to ease things for him as well. As a previous poster suggested, Omega 3s might be a good idea. Also, if you aren't already doing so, a change in diet might make a tremendous difference (if you're interested, I'll be happy to post more).

 

As someone who "hears" electricity, I can tell you how nerve-wracking it is. I, as an adult, have cried when I couldn't sleep because of it. Both ds and I hear it, but dh doesn't. Do you have power lines nearby? Do you keep your cell phones on? Do you have Wi-Fi? Did you recently get a Smart Meter? All of these things can make his problems worse.

 

We live near large power lines, and when ds and some friends were playing close to them one day, they actually made ds's jaws clench and hurt; he now knows not to go near them. Because of this and many other reasons, if we could afford to move, we would.