Gardasil Redux

[WTMCassandra]

Gardasil is in the news again today: http://news.yahoo.com/s/hsn/20080505/hl_hsn/manymomsunwillingtohaveyoungerdaughtersgethpvvaccine;_ylt=Auehac8hnyfKBMSNkScy8nes0NUE

 

I know this was discussed on the old board, and I did a search here and found a little bit of discussion, but could someone indulge me and lay out the pros and cons again?

 

I will need to make a decision on this soon, and I cannot remember the pros and cons. Sigh.

[kRenee]

Here are my notes.

 

Gardasil - protects against HPV 6,11,16 & 18

 

They claim it will provide herd immunity, but it won’t unless all boys, adults, US visitors and illegal immigrants are also vaccinated.

 

They claim it will eliminate cancer, but

a) cancer can be prevented by other means (pap tests),

b)only 1.6% of the population has HPV type 16 or 18,

c) there are more than 12 other strains of HPV that can cause cancer.

 

Most women who get HPV can successfully fight off the virus. A very small percent infected with HPV develop cancer and that can be caught with PAP tests.

 

Long-term consequences are unknown.

1)clinical trials lasted less than 4 years,

2) length of immunity is not known,

3) clinical trial included only 1600 girls under age 16, very few 10-12 year olds,

4) the vaccine appears to increase the risk of other autoimmune diseases

 

Every woman needs a periodic pap test whether or not she has been vaccinated with Gardisil.

 

Pap tests virtually eliminate death by cervical cancer.

 

Therefore getting a Gardisil vaccine is of no value.

 

And don’t forget that Merck lost a lot of money on Vioxx.

[elbac]

I didn't take notes when we made our decision not to vaccinate dd with Gardasil, but a lot of the information that kRenee posted sounds familiar.

 

I also remember - pardon me but I'm going to have to paraphrase from memory - something to the effect that although it would protect against specific strains, it would open the door wider for other strains to come in and cause cancer. And that it was basically an unknown on what the longer term benefits (or potential problems) might be.

 

Anyway, we decided - for us - that the unknown variables outweighed any benefit. We did get some strange looks from good friends who had their two oldest daughter's vaccinated as soon as it was available, and were just a hair shy of bursting with pride over the fact!

[elizabeth]

I am also very concerned about a false sense of security -there are many other STD's that can only be prevented by barrier B control. Treating Hpv is hellish and often requires laser surgery but I remain concerned about long term effects as well. I really feel uneasy without a longitudinal study regarding the efficacy of the vaccine and the plethora of other deadly and painful diseases that can only be prevented by barrier birth control remain far more of a concern to me. Unfortunately in our practice (law ssd and work comp)we are seeing a lot of hepatitis and HIV-it breaks my heart.

[6packofun]

"Of the 77 women who received the Gardasil vaccine while pregnant, 33 experienced side effects ranging from spontaneous abortion to fetal abnormities."

 

With no idea how long the effects of this drug last OR the true effect on fertility, there is no way my daughters will get this. The FDA says that the 11 deaths, the miscarriages, birth defects and the contradictory info from Gardasil itself about WHO should get this vaccine aren't enough reason to do ANY further study on Gardasil's safety. (Not to mention the other info posted here!)

 

Yeah, who's lookin' out for my kids' health? ME.

[momofkhm]

(1) They haven't done long term studies to prove to me that my dds' fertility will not be at issue. (that's enough for me!)

 

(2) There have been a few cases of girls getting the vaccine that ended up dieing that day. (Yes, let me protect my dd from cancer so she can die from the prevention of it.)

 

I wasn't aware of the strains issue or the contradictory info from the company. Really the fertility issue is enough for me.

 

OH! and my girls, dh, my folks and the IL all know that I do not want my girls getting this vaccine. (I did not want the grands thinking they had a temporary medical ok and getting them vaccinated, not that they would!) DH wouldn't have known about the issues. He would have been at the doctor's office, it be recommended and gotten it. Our ped is one who is all for the vaccine so it was important for dh and the girls to know how I feel and why.

[WTMCassandra]

Wow, such fabulous responses. You guys are the best! I had a nagging feeling I didn't want DD to get it, but I couldn't remember why. I will print this out!

 

THANK YOU!

[KidsHappen]

http://www.welltrainedmind.com/forums/showthread.php?t=24304

[Pamela H in Texas]

I want to say that pap smears are not a prevention for cancer. When you have cancer you have cancer. I had carcinoma in situ from HPV and ended up having a LEEP (basically cut off a piece of my cervix). Luckily this is just a sort of pre cancer and it is easily treated. But if a person has full blown cancer they would have to have radiation (usually the treatment for cervical cancer), and probably a hysterectomy and who knows what else. If someone offered me a chance to prevent that, I would probably take it.

 

IF your chance of a healthy pregnancy went under 50%? Depending on the information you look at, it's lower than that. Even the above stat though "only 33%" of 77 women would be pretty darn bad, doncha think?

 

I just CANNOT risk my daughter's fertility. She may claim she's not getting married or having biological children (she's a teenager), but what if she changes her mind? What about the fact that both her mother and grandmother couldn't have babies after a time in their earlier 20's and she has similar autoimmune issues to her mother...both these issues could already affect her fertility. I just CANNOT risk her fertility ON PURPOSE.

 

Well, maybe I could if the chances of alternative negatives were much greater. But in this case they aren't. The majority of girls won't get HPV (even less likely if they live by certain values which I DO realize we can't guarantee). If they get even semi-regularly pap exams, the HPV they might catch can be detected and easily treated (the LEEP procedure is all of 20 min start to finish unless they've changed it significantly in the last 15 years). It is rare that it gets all the way to cancer that would need greater treatments and even more rare that a death would be caused by it.

 

Those are risks enough for me to drop my daughter's chances of having a healthy child significantly. They also aren't risks enough for me to cause her additional autoimmune issues. They aren't risks enough for me to risk her life.

 

I just can't justify it. However, I do hope and pray that those who do won't have any of the horrible effects, having their children grow into women who are happy and healthy and able to bear healthy children.

[Pam "SFSOM" in TN]

IF your chance of a healthy pregnancy went under 50%? Depending on the information you look at, it's lower than that. Even the above stat though "only 33%" of 77 women would be pretty darn bad, doncha think?

 

 

 

Wait, these women, these 33%, were PREGNANT while getting the vaccine, right? That stat has nothing to do with fertility. I'm not saying that there's no consequence for future fertility, though I'm doubtful that it would be impaired. I'm just saying that what you're quoting is not about fertility. I can, for example, take Accutane or coumadin as a young teen and then later get pregnant without the drug affecting my baby. But taking those drugs WHILE I'm pregnant is a different story -- and while the drug causes horrible side effects if taken during pregnancy, they won't cause them later just because I took them before.

[Carpe Diem]

I don't think I will be getting this vaccine for anyone in my family.

 

As a previous poster said there have been a few deaths after receiving this vaccination. If you want to wade through the data you can look at VAERS (I think it is Vaccine Adverse Events Reporting System)to see how many deaths as well as other side effects have been reported. I've read that it is estimated that only about 10% of all problems are actually reported. It is interesting although sometimes chilling to read. People giving 6 shots to sick babies who later die. People giving completely wrong vaccination, etc.

 

It isn't a cancer vaccine. It stops 4 strains of HPV. In most cases HPV clears on its own. Some people need the LEEP procedure to remove pre-cancerous cells. In a small amount of cases, mostly people who get paps very infrequently, it leads to cancer.

 

I remember reading about HPV about 15 years ago. It didn't sound all that scary. Now, there is a vaccine and people are making HPV to sound horrible.

 

People seem to be scared about an illness after there is a vax developed for it. Prior to a vax it doesn't cross our minds. (Okay well I am afraid of Scleroderma Disease LOL because I saw a made for TV movie about it with Dana Delaney!! LOL And Leukemia scares me, too.) People don't worry about Fifths Disease but what if a vax comes out for it? Then for sure the powers that be will start a fear campaign. I also believe diseases cycle. You probably aren't afraid of Scarlett Fever. It can cause horrible damage to your heart to the point of needing a heart transplant, so can Strepp Throat. Scarlett Fever went away on its own. Well I believe there was a vaccine for awhile but it was pulled due to problems. If there is a vax for Strep Throat would we be afraid of that? Would it become mandatory vax like the chicken pox?

 

The point about Vioxx is very good. This company lost millions? Hundreds of millions? They probably would be very happy to have Gardasil widely accepted across the world for all ages and both sexes. You might need a booster in a few years, too.

 

Also, the lack of long term studies and that they are pushing this on young girls I believe outside of the study age ranges.

 

Okay, I'll stop taling. I don't want to sway any one away from something they think is right for their family and what they feel comfortable with doing. I believe everyone has to make their own informed desision.

 

To the OP and anyone else. You don't have to decide now. You can postpone. You can always give it later but you can never take it away.

[Perry]

"Of the 77 women who received the Gardasil vaccine while pregnant, 33 experienced side effects ranging from spontaneous abortion to fetal abnormities."

 

 

Could you tell me where you found this information?

[Perry]

"Of the 77 women who received the Gardasil vaccine while pregnant, 33 experienced side effects ranging from spontaneous abortion to fetal abnormities."

 

 

Where did you find this information?