HS math credit on transcript??

[dkholland]

I need some advice concerning my ds math sequence and how to report it on the transcript.

Here is what he has had and what we are planning for his last two yrs:

 

9th - Alg. II

10th - Alg. III with AoPS (went from June 2010-Nov.) We are having him begin Precalc with Limits by Lial for the rest of the school year...maybe give him half credit if we get through half the book?

11th - Precalc at the cc the first semester and then Calculus the 2nd semester.

12th - ?? mayabe economics, statistics??

 

He loves math and has no problem moving forward at this pace. The questions is how would you list it on the transcript? I was going to list in the 10th yr:

Advanced Alg. 1 credit

Precalculus - .5 credit (I want to give him credit for doing some math this spring)

 

Then for 11th yr:

Precalc (at cc) - 1 credit

Calculus (at cc)- 1 credit

 

Then what for 12th??

Should I spread out the maths in reporting them? The problem is that the cc is going to give dates for when he took classes there and it will show both pre-calc and calc in the same year.

 

The reason we are having him begin Precalc now is because we don't want him to stop all math until the fall. He loves math and we want the material to be fresh when he goes to take the math placement test at the local cc this spring (for him to get into the fall precalc class.) I guess we really want him to have cc classes on his transcript, so that is why we are having him do that. He plans to go into engineering of some sort.

 

How would you report these classes? Thanks!

[regentrude]

If he is interested in engineering, I would continue with calculus in 12th grade. Calculus is not "over" after one semester of CC.

Be prepared, however, that he may have to retake calc at the university anyway.

[dkholland]

Yes, I was thinking that he would take calc again at whatever universtiy he goes to. I just want him to be well-situated for acceptances into the colleges he is intrested in and also, to be well educated in high school math, KWIM? I just don't want to raise any red flags with admissions people to see so much pre-calc on a transcript. I guess I don't have to list the work we are doing now with the Precalculus with Limits. That could just be beneficial without it going on the transcript....

I just can't tell him that because then he would probably feel like "why even do this if I'm not getting credit!"

 

Thanks!

[Jann in TX]

Algebra 3 is the SAME as College Algebra which is the SAME as the first semester of Pre-Calc-- (and the first half of the Lial text).

 

He should do Trigonometry at the CC and NOT the CC Pre-Calc course-- which is a nightmare of a course-- all of Pre-Calc crammed into one semester-- the CC one-semester Pre-Calc course is more of a REVIEW. The majority of students take Pre-Calc over 2 semesters (College Algebra and then Trig)... to confuse things more some CCs call this Pre-Calc A and Pre-Calc B...

[Kathy in Richmond]

I put my kids' online AoPS classes on their transcripts at the bottom of their math course lists, following the math courses they took at home with me. I used the exact title of the AoPS class, and I referenced where the course was outsourced on the same line. I had a box at the side of the transcript explaining what "AoPS" and other abbreviations meant.

 

So in your case I would have:

 

Precalculus ....grade earned...0.5 unit

Algebra 3 (AoPS)...grade earned...1.0 unit

 

In my course descriptions, I noted where the outsourced classes were taken, including the web address if appropriate, and I copied the AoPS course descriptions from their website.

 

My question is this: Why have your ds take precalculus at the community college next year? We're in the same county, and I can tell you that the Algebra 3 class from AoPS is miles above the cc class in depth. Is it to get the trig portion? If he understood the AoPS material, why not use the rest of his time this year on the trigonometry portion of Lial's precalculus book? Then I'd transcript that as 1/2 unit of trigonometry. He ought to be able to go straight to calculus next year then. I think that any college would recognize that Algebra 3 plus Trigonometry is the same as Precalculus.

[dkholland]

Kathy and Jann....Thank you for your responses!

 

That is a good idea concerning Trig. But, being a non-math mom, I am not sure where in the Lial's precalc book trig topics begin or end?? Is trig more of the second half of the text?

 

It makes sense to list Alg. 3 and Trig in the same school year on the transcript, and leave off the precalc title. And, I did plan on denoting that the Alg. 3 course was outsourced.

 

What is a rub for me is....I don't want to rush him through high school math. He struggled much in the AoPS class, but came through with a "B". Since he didn't sail through it, I thought it might be beneficial to have him go through a precalc text at a regular pace and see how much we could get done by the end of the school yr. If he takes the math placement test at the cc in May, then we can see where he places. I guess it's conceivable that he might place right into Calculus. So, he would be a junior taking calc at cc...is that rushing at all?

 

I think I am getting hung-up on having the right titles for math in the right yrs. on his transcript!! I do struggle with thinking outside the educational box:001_huh:!

 

Thanks for your responses and helping me work through my muddled thinking.

[regentrude]

Algebra 3 is the SAME as College Algebra which is the SAME as the first semester of Pre-Calc-- (and the first half of the Lial text).

 

Is this really the case for the AoPS algebra 3 class? They cover quadratic equations, conics, polynomials, functions, logarithms, clever factorizations and substitutions, systems of equations, sequences and series, symmetric sums, advanced factoring methods, classical inequalities, functional equations.

Their precalculus, OTOH, has entirely different topics (trig, complex numbers, vectors and matrices.)

 

Do CCs not cover this for their pre-calc??? And does College algebra really include all the material of AoPS algebra 3?

[Kathy in Richmond]

I don't own a copy of Lial's precalculus myself. Maybe Jann can tell you which chapters cover trigonometry. Or, if you link me the Table of Contents, I'd gladly help with that.

 

OK, I understand now. The AoPS courses are much harder than typical courses of the same name. I can see that you want your ds to have a solid background before moving into Calculus, and I agree with you that it's a good idea.

 

I ended up with some overlap of math course titles on my dd's transcript. For example, she had Algebra 1 and 2 at home with me, and Intermediate Algebra with AoPS online (that class is now renamed Algebra 3). I was just careful to annotate where each class was taken & include complete course descriptions. Most of the colleges where my dd applied were well aware of the level of AoPS classes. AoPS Algebra 3 and Precalculus are extremely challenging courses. Even with a PhD in math, this old dog learned many new tricks going through them with my children.:D

[vonfirmath]

What happened to Geometry?

 

I ran out of math in my HS, so had no math on my transcript after Calculus BC my 11th grade year -- but I had taken Geometry in summer school so ended up with 4 years of math anyway.

 

Alg 2, Geometry, Trig/Analytic Geometry, and AP Calculus BC

[cbollin]

 

I ran out of math in my HS, so had no math on my transcript after Calculus BC my 11th grade year -- but I had taken Geometry in summer school so ended up with 4 years of math anyway.

 

 

sounds similar to my dh's high school experience. in 12th grade he ended up taking differential equations (college sophomore level) at a local university for dual enrollment.

 

glad to know he wasn't the only one who ran out of math after calc in 11th grade. :)

 

-crystal

[dkholland]

Ds actually had Alg. I in 7th and geometry in 8th. I am not including them on the transcript. I assume that any admission person looking at his courses would assume that he had them before high school.

 

I'm hoping there are more math courses for my ds to take after 11th grade. I'll have to look around at the universities and other cc in my area...if it ends up that way.

 

Thanks

[regentrude]

D

I'm hoping there are more math courses for my ds to take after 11th grade. I'll have to look around at the universities and other cc in my area...if it ends up that way.

 

 

Oh, there is plenty of math. I have never understood the ideal of "running out of math".

He could follow the traditional progression (Calc 2+3, Differential equations), throw statistics in the mix. If you like AoPS, I'm sure their calculus will be way more than what the community college teaches.

Or, if he is so inclined, he could explore some areas of math that are not on the typical sequence - some discrete math, topology...

[Lori D.]

Everyone else has given you great help in what to call the different math courses, or what is equivalent to what! :)

 

I will just throw in that you do not HAVE to list courses on a transcript chronologically (9th, 10th, 11th 12th), but it is very acceptable to list coursework by subject (math, english, social studies, etc.). This greatly simplifies the transcript from having to list partial credits in one year and remaining credits in another year.

 

Example of one way you could do up the transcript:

 

SOCIAL STUDIES

course...............credit.....grade

World History..........1.0..........B

American History 1...1.0..........A-

American History 2...1.0..........A

AP Government*......0.5..........B+

Economics..............0.5...........A-

 

TOTAL....................4.0 cr. ....3.575 GPA

 

* = name of AP approved course, AP scoring or other proof

 

MATH

course...............credit.....grade

Algebra 2...............1.0..........A

Trigonometry..........0.5..........A

Pre-Calculus...........0.5...........A-

Algebra 3*.............1.0...........A-

Calculus*...............1.0...........B+

 

TOTAL....................4.0 cr. ....3.7125 GPA

 

* college course, taken at Smith Community College

 

 

BEST of luck! Warmly, Lori D.

[8filltheheart]

Karen,

 

An alternative path you might want to consider is EPGY. The courses use more standard textbooks than AoPS yet are going to be much better than he will get at the CC.

 

http://epgy.stanford.edu/courses/math/

 

I would not recommend the CC classes for budding engineer. Our 18 yos made an A in precal at the CC this past semester after not even placing into precal (only alg 2) on their entrance placement test. After the first day in alg 2, the teacher told him that he knew too much for his class and he needed to be in pre-cal. He made 100s on tests in the precal class where the class avg was below 50. :tongue_smilie:

 

A child that has done AoPS alg 3 and made a B is going to be out of place at the CC.

 

I think that some universities even recognize the credits from EPGY. :confused: I can't remember for sure. I vaguely remember something, but I don't remember what. I am sure EPGY could easily answer that question, though.

 

ETA: I just found this on their website:

What sorts of credits can I get for EPGY courses?

 

All students successfully completing courses with EPGY are eligible to receive transcripts from the Stanford University Continuing Studies Program. These transcripts, which bear the seal of the Stanford University Registrar, show the courses that a student has completed from EPGY, together with the grades obtained.

 

Students who wish to transfer this credit to their school may do so. Decisions concerning whether or not the credit is accepted by the institution to which it is transferred are up to the receiving institution.

 

Students who complete courses at the Advanced Placement level are encouraged to take the corresponding Advanced Placement Examinations.

Edited January 15, 2011 by 8FillTheHeart

[dkholland]

Karen,

 

An alternative path you might want to consider is EPGY. The courses use more standard textbooks than AoPS yet are going to be much better than he will get at the CC.

 

http://epgy.stanford.edu/courses/math/

 

Thanks, Karen, I was no aware of these courses and I will definately look into them.

 

Our thinking about getting cc classes on his transcript is to back up our ''at home'' grades. Ds is not a good test taker and we're not sure he would do well on some of the stanardized math tests. But he does excel in a classroom setting with a live teacher and other students. Online classes have not been the best for him though. There is so much to think about with testing and transcripts and helping your child be competitive with other students applying to college....it's just hard to take it one step at a time. There is a element of planning ahead that needs to be done. That's where I am at!

I may email you privately if i have more questions....Thanks:001_smile:

[Kathy in Richmond]

Quick thoughts on our experience with EPGY college level math classes:

 

My daughter took the EPGY college level Number Theory course last year. It had only precalculus as a prerequisite, but it turned out to be on the same difficulty level and as work-intensive as an intermediate-level AoPS course.

 

She was given a textbook, lessons on an interactive CD (there are quizlets as you go; you can't progress till you answer correctly), and access to a tutor at Stanford's EPGY office. Challenging weekly homework sets were assigned and had to be typed up neatly (time-consuming when it's math!) and emailed to the tutor for grading. The midterm and final (long tests!) were take-home with a time limit. No proctor was required.

 

Our evaluation: The class was well-organized and the materials used were terrific. You can start on the first of any month, and the student has six months to finish the class. Since it is time-flexible, you're not in an online class of any sort, but you're on your own. My dd is an independent learner and it suited her very well. She learned a lot, performed well, and was satisfied. The tutor was next-to-useless, however. He took forever to grade anything, neglected to grade some homeworks, and was not communicative in a timely fashion. :tongue_smilie: I suppose that this can vary depending on the tutor assigned to the student. Some of her friends had different tutors and it worked out better that way, but other friends had the same tutor and the same opinion of him. If you're counting on the tutor's help, this might not be the way to go.

 

Credit transfer: This has been a nine-month nightmare for her. She just wants to transfer the credit from Stanford School of Continuing Studies to Stanford University (same course offered at each; same course description and course number). It should be automatic according to their materials, but it has been very difficult in practice.:) She's still following up emails w/o luck. We've heard also from her friends that transfer to other universities can be a mixed bag. One friend's university in particular won't accept the credit because the exams weren't proctored.

[8filltheheart]

Well, Kathy, that is very frustrating to hear!! Goodness, those classes certainly aren't cheap! I was considering the AP physics offering for next yr, but now I am going to re-think that as an option.

 

Jeepers. I think I am going to play ostrich and put my head in the sand about just how ds will get the courses he needs next yr. I really need to outsource some topics. :tongue_smilie:

[Kathy in Richmond]

Well, the AP physics probably has a different tutor from the advanced math courses.:) In fact, dd's friend who took AP physics and Multivariable calculus from EPGY liked the physics & was equally frustrated with the multivariable calc.

 

hope that's better news!

 

ETA: For anyone put off by the high price, just be aware that EPGY offers very generous financial aid. You have to ask about it, though; it's difficult to find info on their website.