pqr Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 (edited) http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/01/07/michigan-sikhs-want-religious-swords-school/?test=latestnews This is an interesting read. "Religious freedom" vs no weapons on school property. One does wonder how they manage to fly on commercial aircraft if the requirement to carry a weapon is adhered to. Edited January 8, 2011 by pqr Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tap Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 I don't think it should be allowed on school grounds. I am sure there are parameters within the religion that would allow either the sword to be left at home, or a token version to be worn in appropriate moments. There are many places that I assume they wouldn't be allowed ie courthouses, airplanes, secured facilities....etc. Unless the followers of this faith never are in a situation to pass through a metal detector, there many times they would be expected to be sans sword. This should be extended to the person attending school, by the religious leaders. If the child and their family feels that this part of his/her religion is not negotiable....I guess they should consider homeschooling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
katilac Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 Religious freedom means that the government does not imprison you or chop off your head if you don't follow the 'right' religion. It does not mean total freedom to follow all of your religious requirements in all venues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs Mungo Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 I could go either way. (I am on my phone, waiting for dh please excuse bad typing) 1a It is a small symbol that resembles a sword. What does that even mean? What is it made of? What does it look like? 1b If kids are getting expelled for having a Lego minifig with a gun, then what do you expect? 2a Zero tolerance policies and blanket policies are generally bad policies. 2b I agree with Kati. I also partially agree with tap, although I'm not sure she is correct that they couldn't go through a metal detector since I don't think this is an *actual* sword. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dangermom Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 I'd err on the side of religious freedom, myself, but I can see why zero tolerance and kirpans don't mix well. The Sikhs traditionally carry a sword/knife (kirpan) at all times, and for most purposes it's a little teeny ceremonial thing. It carries a lot of religious symbolism and significance, and it's one of the things they're willing to really get stubborn about. Apparently some Sikhs are willing to go with a pendant, but others say it has to be real, if tiny. From Wikipedia: The kirpan is both a defensive weapon and a symbol. Physically it is an instrument of "ahimsa" or non-violence. The principle of ahimsa is to actively prevent violence, not to simply stand by idly whilst violence is being done. To that end, the kirpan is a tool to be used to prevent violence from being done to a defenseless person when all other means to do so have failed. Symbolically, the kirpan represents the power of truth to cut through untruth[citation needed]. Not all those who identify themselves as Sikhs carry or recommend carrying a kirpan usable as a weapon. Hardeep Singh Kohli, who identifies himself and most of the Sikhs he knows as secular Sikhs, criticised UK Sikh judge Sir Mota Singh QC for calling for Sikh schoolchildren to be allowed to carry the kirpan, saying "he thinks it's OK for kids to take knives to class. ... I'm simply not comfortable with knives being allowed into school. ...small, symbolic kirpans are attached to combs that Sikhs keep in their hair. Similarly, small kirpan-shaped pendants are worn around the neck, again fulfilling the criterion of the faith that the dagger be ever-present.[1] Other Sikhs consider that a kirpan must be viable as a weapon to fulfil religious criteria. I think zero tolerance is idiotic, and I have a lot of respect for Sikhism, so that probably colors my opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcconnellboys Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 Well..... according to one recent commercial, if you have a Super Bowl ring you can easily fly wearing a sword..... Actually, I'm wondering if this is just a model, because that's what it looks like, rather than an actual weapon in a sheath..... If it's just a symbol and not an actual blade, then I don't see what the problem is.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs Mungo Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 Well..... according to one recent commercial, if you have a Super Bowl ring you can easily fly wearing a sword..... Actually, I'm wondering if this is just a model, because that's what it looks like, rather than an actual weapon in a sheath..... If it's just a symbol and not an actual blade, then I don't see what the problem is.... It's the same problem that the kid with the Lego gun (not a gun made I'd Lego, a tiny gun made for a Lego person) had. It's dumb, but that is the sort of dumb stuff you get when you make a blanket rule instead of relying on people to use common sense, discretion and allowing them to do their job. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcconnellboys Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 I don't think I heard about that one, LOL. Those guns are all of a quarter to half an inch. And they have no missile that loads into them as the barrel is solid......geesh...... maybe it's the ol' "you'll poke your eye out" rule.... In that case, I think pencils should be banned, too..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justamouse Posted January 8, 2011 Share Posted January 8, 2011 pqr, what history spines are you using this year? Or are you using something else? :001_smile: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pqr Posted February 2, 2011 Author Share Posted February 2, 2011 (edited) Update http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/02/01/michigan-school-district-allows-sikh-students-wear-religious-dagger-school/ Michigan School District Allows Sikh Students to Wear Religious Dagger to School Edited February 2, 2011 by pqr Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Punchie Posted February 2, 2011 Share Posted February 2, 2011 We had a small contingent of sikhs at my military school, and I remember some of them would wear a kiran. But then, the school also trusted students w/swords (certain ranks/positions carried swords). I know this isn't necessarily directly related, but it made me remember it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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