Has anyone read Angela's Ashes?Appropriate?

[Garga]

Comparing the bible and it's depictions of horrible acts committed by people to Angela's Ashes is ridiculous.

 

Yes, the bible states that the acts happened, but that's it. If children are killed as sacrifices to Molech it says, "And they offered their children as sacrifices to Molech." It doesn't go on and on about the stench of their bodies burning, the blood, the screaming mothers.... The bible mentions people's darker actions in a clinical way.

 

Books like Angela's Ashes give a crude blow-by-blow account of how it all looked, how everyone felt, etc. (Like the vulgar quotes in the OP about the trembling toes and the spout.)

 

I not just defending the bible for any other reason that to say citing the bible doesn't strengthen your argument, it weakens it. The two are apples and oranges.

 

 

 

While I personally don't like to read books like that, I think there is a place for them and I don't begrudge them being written and it's fine with me if other people read them. My issue is with forcing people to read them or it affects their grades. People should be allowed to say "no" to books that are just ::too much:. Too much violence, too much child abuse, too much language, whatever. Especially for a minor without parental consent. (Like someone said, that book is an R rated book, and 14 year olds aren't supposed to see R rated movies w/o a parent or guardian.)

 

That book could have been among a choice of books, with a few tame ones thrown in. Like a PP said, Dickens or Austen etc.

[elizabeth]

Comparing the bible and it's depictions of horrible acts committed by people to Angela's Ashes is ridiculous.

 

Yes, the bible states that the acts happened, but that's it. If children are killed as sacrifices to Molech it says, "And they offered their children as sacrifices to Molech." It doesn't go on and on about the stench of their bodies burning, the blood, the screaming mothers.... The bible mentions people's darker actions in a clinical way.

 

Books like Angela's Ashes give a crude blow-by-blow account of how it all looked, how everyone felt, etc. (Like the vulgar quotes in the OP about the trembling toes and the spout.)

 

I not just defending the bible for any other reason that to say citing the bible doesn't strengthen your argument, it weakens it. The two are apples and oranges.

I respectfully disagree. The story of Isaac, Lot's daughters, the mass murders of inhabitants , rape, sodomy, and the like are peppered throughout . True, there is a lack of adjectival description but generally it is just as terrible in terms of sex and violence in my opinion.

 

 

While I personally don't like to read books like that, I think there is a place for them and I don't begrudge them being written and it's fine with me if other people read them. My issue is with forcing people to read them or it affects their grades. People should be allowed to say "no" to books that are just ::too much:. Too much violence, too much child abuse, too much language, whatever. Especially for a minor without parental consent. (Like someone said, that book is an R rated book, and 14 year olds aren't supposed to see R rated movies w/o a parent or guardian.)

 

That book could have been among a choice of books, with a few tame ones thrown in. Like a PP said, Dickens or Austen etc.

I think a reading list with choices along a continuum as you suggest would be very reasonable. I do think that some books are selected solely for their ability to shock the conscience I absolutely do not consider Angelas Ashes to be one of them as it has artistic merit. That is the trouble with nitpicking another instructors choices and part of what you relinquish when you let someone else educate your children.

[woolybear]

I loved the book. I find it inappropriate for her age, however. I am continually amazed at the books that are assigned by the public schools for many different reasons. Based on that alone, I am glad we homeschool.:001_smile:

 

What do people do when the school assigns a book they don't want their child to read?

[plansrme]

That is the trouble with nitpicking another instructors choices and part of what you relinquish when you let someone else educate your children.

 

This is an excellent point.

 

This has been an interesting thread, and gold stars all around for civility.

 

Terri (who is debating whether to tell her 12 yo who is reading AA that it is the topic of this thread--this might be the only time ever that my daughter can say that I am more lenient than some other mother)

[Mergath]

I certainly hope she is not reading the Hebrew Bible or Old Testament as I read it again over the past few months to prepare for a course and there is more deviant sex, egregious violence and the like in the OT than you can shake a proverbial stick at.

 

Amen, sister. Don't forget the genocide. I'd much prefer my dd read a book that depicted sex and swearing than one in which a deity commands his followers to slaughter entire nations (and of course, the slaughtering is then seen as a good thing).

[Mergath]

I also wanted to say one more thing. I don't believe you have to expose yourself or children to the evil/negatives of the world to teach them empathy. I don't believe that they have to read explicit details of such things to know they exist. By not teaching them these things in that way, I am not sticking my head in the sand but chosing to limit their exposure. This is my choice as their parent.

 

I disagree. I, like most other kids, heard bits and pieces about the poor, starving, destitute people of the world my entire life, but they were always a distant, abstract sort of thing. It wasn't until I saw them with my own eyes that I really, truly began to care and to want to make a difference. You can't understand the horror of something just by hearing it vaguely described.

[Garga]

I respectfully disagree. The story of Isaac, Lot's daughters, the mass murders of inhabitants , rape, sodomy, and the like are peppered throughout . True, there is a lack of adjectival description but generally it is just as terrible in terms of sex and violence in my opinion.

 

 

After musing on this, I think I see where you're coming from. You're saying that these topics are in both the bible and books like AA, so they are comparable. They both deal with human kind's darker, depraved side.

 

I'm coming from the point of view that, yes, these atrocities are discussed in both books, but one is pretty terse and to the point (bible) and others give lengthy, in-your-face descriptions (AA), and I have a problem with the descriptions.

 

So maybe they're not apples and oranges. Maybe they're more like apricots and peaches. They taste a lot alike, but one is smooth and the other is fuzzy. :)

[Mrs Mungo]

Imo, the school has no place choosing a book as requirred reading when there are so many parents that would find it inappropriate especially without prior parents' knowledge.

 

Did you know that Eloise in Paris was on the list of challenged books one year? Someone took offense to the line drawings of nudes in the Louvre. It would be nigh impossible to come to complete agreement with dozens of families.

 

Two, there are plenty of books that are great literary works without the language/sexual content and yet aren't fluff either.

 

This year I'm helping teach a literature course for high school students with a focus on ancient history. It's all sex, war and death. What's the difference?

 

It's impossible to find a book that no one would find inappropriate.

Just look at the lists of banned books - including To Kill a Mockingbird and Huck Finn.

 

:iagree:

 

 

There are two separate questions here. 1) Whether a school should assign books that may or may not be appropriate to a particular child and what to do about it and 2) whether Angela's Ashes is appropriate for your child.

 

I think a reading list with choices along a continuum as you suggest would be very reasonable. I do think that some books are selected solely for their ability to shock the conscience I absolutely do not consider Angelas Ashes to be one of them as it has artistic merit. That is the trouble with nitpicking another instructors choices and part of what you relinquish when you let someone else educate your children.

 

:iagree:

 

IAfter musing on this, I think I see where you're coming from. You're saying that these topics are in both the bible and books like AA, so they are comparable. They both deal with human kind's darker, depraved side.

 

I'm coming from the point of view that, yes, these atrocities are discussed in both books, but one is pretty terse and to the point (bible) and others give lengthy, in-your-face descriptions (AA), and I have a problem with the descriptions.

 

 

Have you checked the ninth grade reading list from TWTM?

[LibraryLover]

Did you know that Eloise in Paris was on the list of challenged books one year? Someone took offense to the line drawings of nudes in the Louvre. It would be nigh impossible to come to complete agreement with dozens of families.

 

 

 

This year I'm helping teach a literature course for high school students with a focus on ancient history. It's all sex, war and death. What's the difference?

 

 

 

:iagree:

 

 

 

 

 

 

:iagree:

 

 

 

Have you checked the ninth grade reading list from TWTM?

 

Checkmate.