Oh, Nancy dear... I hate to burst your bubble but there is a difference between a pet and a contained animal! LOL On second thought, maybe this is a good solution for Colleen's problem with a son who badly wants an indoor pet :). Sorry, couldn't resist!

LOL! I was just getting ready to say that when I read the title of the thread, I thought she was asking about *us*. LOL

But Joanne, your position is really not much different from mine. Yet, I still feel that some of the reactions were completely over the top. Not all. Just some. We're commenting on the ones who were over the top, that's all. You are aware that there are homeschoolers who are very upset and writing letters and boycotting Subway because they have been denied the opportunity to win $5000 worth of athletic equipment for their personal use in their own back yard, right? Because after all, they are a school too, right? Yes, they have a right to that reaction and I'd fight for that right any time any day, as I would my own right to say what I think about it :).

Vegsource? Girl, I thought you got banned for having a pop up blocker (or some such infraction)! LOL

I requested it from the library. Got it in. At first I thought "Oh Bother!" because I realized that you were probably recommending the one by Victor David Hanson, and I ended up with a book with the same title by someone named David Marc. NOT the same book. But, I decided that since the book was there and it wasn't a very big book and I needed something to read anyway, I'd give it a whirl. Guess what? To my pleasant surprise, the book is brilliantly written, thought provoking and genuinely hilarious. Just my cuppa! :) I'm only on the third chapter, but I'm enjoying this book very much. So thanks for the recommendation, even if I'm not reading the book you actually recommended (and I recommend this one to anyone who wants to read about literacy today). I can give you a few funny quotes, if you're interested. :). This guy is really, really funny. Robin

I guess that would be me, although I didn't word it like that. I said what I felt... that I understood what their original intent was, and that I supported their right to promote a contest amongst children who attend a school to win equipment for said school. I also suggested that if they wanted to do a contest like this again in the future and include homeschoolers somehow, to make the grand prize go to the local school (or park) where the homeschooler lives. The student would still get the basket of goodies. Sounds reasonable to me!

Jami, this is a good point, but this is probably why the donation is so modest ($5,000). It's not about doing a complete makeover of an athletic program... it's about encouraging a child to write an essay and enter it in a contest and trying hard at something that will potentially benefit the greater good in their immediate community. Which I think is a good thing. OF course, as anj said, it's about corporate image as well.

They could also install basketball nets and completely outfit a baseball program. I guess the point I was trying to make is that at least they have chosen this (fitness, particularly children's fitness) to promote. Unlike another store I was in last week that tried to get me to buy expensive bottled water so that $0.10 could go towards building a well in an undeveloped country. Not that that isn't a noble cause, but still... I agree with you completely on the HSLDA thing. We've got an alternative organization in Texas, thankfully. They present themselves with much more respect and civility, imo.

Technically, though, if you're going to argue that someone has the right to voice their opinion, then you have to argue that others' opinions about those opinions have the right to be voiced as well.

Maybe, but I'm not comfortable telling a donor that their donation is just not great enough, kwim? I'm sure there are plenty of schools that would love to have the equipment that $5000 could buy. Oh, I agree with that, but those are deserved images. When I say I appreciate Subway's efforts in this regard, it's because I *do* eat there often and I really *do* appreciate the way they have kicked off a healthy kids promotion offering fruit, yogurt and baked chips as the sides. More and more fast food companies are doing this, but Subway is the bomb when it comes to being able to get a kid friendly healthy meal. And they have a website with info about healthy food choices and exercise. All companies are in it to make a buck, but when it comes to the image as a healthy fast food restaurant, Subway has a well established reputation. . I honestly don't think that Subway's bottom line was going to be impacted by this one way or the other. We're not that large of a group, and most of us (from what I can tell) are not frequent customers of Subway anyway. The majority of the public probably doesn't know about this... but I believe it's gotten more press than you realize. Yes, it does bother me when a group like HSLDA gets a hold of an issue like this and acts as though they represent most, if not all, homeschoolers. I'm sorry, but it made me feel like homeschoolers were being portrayed as having a collective chip on their shoulder. There are those who are saying that they should be able to not only compete in the contest, but that if they won the contest, they should be able to keep the $5000 worth of equipment that was clearly intended for a school. They have the right to voice that opinion, true... and I have the right to say I think they're being unreasonable. Which I do. :)

That's a good point, Jackie. ETA: My only irritation is with the complaints that really have been that juvenile (the few I've seen), only because I feel like it makes me look bad, too, because the complaints were worded as though they represent a collective homeschool mindset. Those complaints *were* whiney. And they did come across as a foot stamping preschooler who wasn't getting his way. I don't mind calling that for what it is, because it allows me to publicly distance myself from it.

I'm really glad this came up because it shows that there ARE differences of opinion on this, and that we aren't all in lockstep. If someone from Subway's PR group googles "homeschool subway" just to feel our "pulse" (and I betcha they are doing so), hopefully they will be led to this message board where they will see that there is a variety of opinions on this issue, and that we're not all a bunch of "you better give me a chance to win that equipment or I'm never buying a sandwich from you again" types.

I don't think the company was spineless in its response, either. I just think they're trying to smooth things over, and answered the complaints as honestly as they knew how. I mean, would it *really* have been better to have responded with "Sorry, folks, this is the way it is. If you don't like it, you can go pack sand"?? I don't necessarily think that everyone who wrote letters were whiners, but I've read some of the letters that have been circulating and THOSE particular letters sure did come across as whining to me. I think that anyone who honestly believes that their kid should have the right to compete for $5000 worth of exercise equipment for their backyard/in home/personal use in a contest developed to donate fitness equipment to a SCHOOL is being at best unreasonable, if not a little selfish. The problem with this whole thing and the tendency to *appear* as whining (even if some weren't), is that homeschoolers are being painted with a broad brush. Unfortunate, but that's the way it is. Did HSLDA actually get involved and go to Subway to fight for our right to compete in contests like this? Goodness, I hope not.

Agreed! I even wrote Subway earlier this week and told them so. I also told them had we been included and miracuously won, I would have been thrilled to win the prize for the local public school. After all, it's the school all my neighbors' kids go to and it's funded by my tax dollars. If the school has excellent facilities, then all the better for my neighborhood kids and all the better for my property values. I think it's great that of all the different charitable things they could have done, they chose fitness equipment for schools. At least they're promoting health and fitness to children. It's a lot more than I can say for other "fast food" restaurants. We really appreciate Subway's efforts in this regard.

... elsewhere. Good news! Apparently no problems where he is - all appears to be well/normal. I know some here are concerned, so I thought I'd pass along the info.

A long, long time ago there was this country variety show with guest entertainers, and the entertainers would share their favorite recipe. The one time my dh and I watched it, the guest entertainer (can't remember his name... Graham something... sort of a Billy Ray Cyrus type - you know, had only one or two hits) shared his recipe for "Cheesy Spam Bake." Seriously!! My dh and I laughed so hard we were hurting. To this day, we can't think of the word spam without thinking about that recipe being demonstrated, step by step, oh so seriously, on national tv. LOL I used to eat Spam sandwiches as a kid. HAven't eaten it since :). I have to wonder, though, how many people are buying it as part of an emergency stockpile. When we are threatened with major hurricanes, canned meats (yes, Spam!) fly off the shelves. Non perishable fully cooked foods are second in importance behind water. It never fails. When hurricanes threaten, there goes the pork and beans, spaghetti-o's, tuna and spam. I still have a can of corned beef from Hurricane Rita that not only do I fail to phathom why I purchased in the first place, but I can not bring myself to throw away either :). So I can't help but think that people are buying it not to eat now, but to start building up a supply of food in case of disaster or food shortage or energy failure (there does seem to be a lot of concern about that right now).

I was going to post that the word effect is used anywhere it can be replaced by the word "cause", but when everyone else said that effect is not a verb, I decided to keep quiet and not appear the fool. I'm still not sure what affectation means in Jane Austen novels. :)

Is there a rule for when to use effect vs. affectation?

As a teenager, all my crushes were on real life acquaintances :), but as a younger child/adolescent I was madly in loved with Davy Jones.

YEs! I sorta liked LizzyBee's response better than mine, though :).

Starbucks is a free market retailer. Oil prices are monopoly/cartel driven. Ergo the reason why Starbucks is expensive is not the reason why oil is expensive. Consumers can choose between Starbucks and Folgers. Gas doesn't come in "designer" and "cheap" label options. Coffee prices do not have an effect on every other segment of the economy. Oil prices do. Coffee is not needed for production or transportation of goods or services. Oil is. I could go on.

Just did an 80th for my mil. Sit down dinner at bil's house. Catered by very nice restaurant. Used linens and card tables to make room for all 30-35 in attendance (we had to make it adults only, no kids... just not enough room for everyone). There were nice appetizers served cocktail style, wine, good bread and salad, a sit down entree, gourmet cake and a champagne toast. Family movies were transfered to DVD and played continuously in the background (sound turned off) and everyone enjoyed that very much. We requested cards only, no gifts, and collected them in a basket which mil took home with her to open later. It was elegant, but relaxed and enjoyable. My bil and sil did an excellent job making it just right... flowers on every table, very nice all the way around. Grand total, food and flowers, etc., was around $750, split between the three boys. But I suspect the bil spent more than his share on a few extras. It was truly one of the nicest afternoons I've had in a long time. Good luck and have fun, whatever you do! Robin

Oh, my goodness... oh, my gosh... this looks serious! Thank you so much for typing all that out and for sharing your secret! This is the recipe I'm going to try first! RE: the coffee ice cream (oh, that sounds soooo good) - what about espresso? Would I use the same measurement? There's a few Starbucks around here and I'm wondering what I should get -- espresso or really strong coffee? I can't wait to try this. Honestly. Thanks soooooo very much!

Fascinating! I'll check the Cake Bible... I have that book. So, I can use some vodka to make vanilla, and then pour the rest into the ice cream? Sounds like a plan :) Thanks!

I'll check the library for that... thanks!