Because this ain't Burger King and you can't always have it your way. Most of the United States consists of people who like having a fun holiday for our children to enjoy.

But see- if *I* made the choice to have my child in those lessons, and it was not my child's choice to do that it would be excluding my child because of MY desires. My child sacrifices a lot because of dance. She has to make some hard choices sometimes. But, those are HER choices. They key words in what you wrote are these: deciding what is important to you and what you're willing to sacrifice for. I sacrifice shopping for myself as much as I'd like so we can pay for dd's dancing. I sacrifice my time to be at the studio. That's my part of the sacrifce. But just because my daughter has a talent for performing doesn't mean I am going to force her to be at the studio if that's not something SHE is willing to sacrifice for. Lol on the school dance thing. I wasn't allowed to date without a chaperone until I was 16. But I never felt left out. I hated that rule, yes. The rule I hated even more was when a boy (other than a friend who was male- I had a few gay male freinds and the rule did not apply) called my house my father got out the egg timer and I had 3 minutes. However, my parents went out of their way to make sure these rules didn't interfere with my having a normal life. They helped me see ways that I COULD still fit in and obey the rules at the same time. I never felt like I had to sneak around them or that they were imposing their will on me with no recourse.

Um- I am a Christian. I teach Sunday School at our church to 4th and 5th graders, am on the education committee and head of the Children's Ministry team. :confused:

I don't consider what you are doing to your kids abuse. I think it's great they have decided not to eat animals. This is an issue my daughter has struggled with on and off for about a year now, so I can appreciate how hard it is for your children to make this decision. I do think though, that making a huge deal about decorating a cookie is. I say this because any normal child is going to see it as just that- it's the ADULT that is going to put all the extra "stuff" on it that makes the child feel bad or wrong for wanting to participate in what she sees as a fun activity that is not going to hurt her or anyone else. Now, if the child was allergic to nuts, the cookie contained nuts, and the child could die if she touched the cookie and touched her mouth, that is a safety issue and is another matter altogether. Again, the child could decorate a paper plate.

Oh PUHLEEZE. My child is a perfectly normal, healthy (physically and psychologically), and happy kid. As for my "hands off" method- I keep my child safe, I make sure she minds her manners, and I make sure she fulfills her responsibilities. My child faces consequences when she does not behave or meet her responsibilities. My child is 7 years old, she is a top kid on her dance team, she is working from a 4th grade level up to a 7th grade level in all subjects. She has received many awards. She sings and acts, plays the piano, is a good cook, and is very popular. I take my child to church. My child has a Bible. She is not sure how she feels about the whole "God" thing yet and that is perfectly okay. She has plenty of time in her life to make those decisions. I think you need to keep your mouth shut where my child is concerned. You seriously do not to go there.

ITA with this. In classes I've taught, I've been put on the spot many a time with parents who suddenly show up and for some reason are shocked that the kids are having something special for a mainstream holiday though. While I try to do my best and will come up with SOMETHING to keep the child included, it would be nice if parents would "read the memo" and give a bit of advance warning so that I as a teacher can be better prepared. Teachers are not mind readers.

In this case, the kid wasn't allergic to the cookie. Most places nowadays ask if the children have allergies or dietary restrictions. Also, not being able to eat the cookie would not prevent the kid from decorating the cookie and letting a friend eat it. If allergies prevented decorating the cookie, the child could have decorated a paper plate. The mother and teacher could have put their heads together to find a way for that kid to be included. But no- the mother put her OWN needs above that of the child. If the kids are choosing for THEMSELVES not to eat certain things, or are choosing to believe certain things, that is one thing. However, when the parent makes the choice for the child, and the child has no other choice BUT to be excluded, that's abuse IMO. BTW- I love the kids who come over here and tell me what they can and can't eat. One little guy is vegan (his parents are not and I think is totally cool for a 9yo to make that decision totally on his own) and reads all my food labels. He's not rude about it at all, he just knows I'm oblivious to such things and I leave it up to him to pick their snack when he's here. http://eqi.org/eabuse1.htm#Signs%20of%20Abusive,%20Authority%20Based%20Relationships I agree that our kids are missing out and that SOME homeschool parents are abusing their children. I continue to write to my state representatives for laws like FL has, where parents are held more accountable and kids are able to participate in programs at the public school. If my child did not enjoy homeschooling and begged to go to public school for valid reasons, I would not force her to continue homeschooling. I am not going to keep my child in a situation where she's not happy just because *I* might feel homeschooling is better. Parents need to use COMMON SENSE. My 7yo is allowed to watch R rated movies. I don't allow other kids to watch them at my house because I know that is outside the normal parameters of what the majority of kids are allowed to do. Blues Clues is designed for a certain age group, and if here are kids here in that age group, it does not breach the boundaries of common sense to turn that on. I hate Barbie. I mean I really hate Barbie. I hate the whole image and the messages she sends to girls. I hate all the accessories and the materialism of it all. But, I have a daughter and Barbie is- well- Barbie. I don't have to go out and buy Barbies, but it is ridiculous to assume that I can forbid my daughter to play with Barbie ever. What I can do is talk to her about why I feel the way I do about Barbie and then let it go. Maybe she agrees, maybe she doesn't. Or maybe she doesn't right now, but when she's 20 she will realize mom had a point- or not. The point is I'm not going to allow my own feelings to get in the way of her enjoying a perfectly normal thing for girls her age to enjoy. She is not going to fall over dead or have any other physical or emotional harm come to her because she dresses up a Barbie. At holiday time, there is a pretty good chance any classes your children take are going to do something special to celebrate mainstream holidays. I think it is ridiculous for a parent to be shocked when they show up on Christmas or Halloween and the class is doing something fun related to the holiday. I think it is a shame that parents would be upset by this. Whenever any kid I've ever met has come to class to find it's a holiday fun day, they have been EXCITED and HAPPY. Again- these things are for CHILDREN. They have their whole lives to learn music or whatever it is. They only have a short time to be children. In case anyone missed the memo: At Halloween time, people put out pumpkins and ghosts, children dress up in costumes and go out to collect candy. At Christmas, people put up trees, ornaments, and children eagerly await Santa. There are special songs we only sing at Christmas time, and a lot of them have to do with Jesus because that is the dude that caused Christmas to be celebrated in the first place. At Thanksgiving, you see turkeys and pilgrims, and a lot of fictional stories passed off as "history". People usually eat a lot of food and watch football. At Valentine's Day, people give each other little cards and candy to show love. You will see hearts and cupids all over the place at this time of year. At Easter, people decorate eggs and hide them. The Easter Bunny comes and leaves a basket of goodies for kids. You will also see lots of crosses around because Easter is a Christian holiday involving the story of the crucifixion. On St. Patrick's Day, people wear green. There are shamrock decorations all over the place and folks drink beer. On Mother's day and Father's day, kids celebrate that particular parent on that day. So- these are the mainstream holidays that we celebrate here in America. Now you are prepared in case you show up at class and there is something going on to celebrate. Even if you don't celebrate the holiday, though, there are many ways you can keep your child from being excluded. One of my dd's friends has two dads, so Father's day has become "Roger Day" and she celebrates one parent on each day. That's just one example. I guarantee that whatever your religion or life situation, if you and your child's teacher put your heads together, there are many ways your child can keep from being excluded.

Children need to be children. They have plenty of time to decide FOR THEMSELVES what religion they want to practice and how they want to practice it. They don't see things the same way adults do, and they shouldn't- because they are CHILDREN. Decorating a cookie should be no more than that- a fun activity. Unless the parent has issues and is making a big deal out of it, Halloween should be nothing more than a fun day for children to be children and enjoy fun activities- like decorating cookies. Setting children up for exclusion is a form of emotional abuse IMO. Some people do things differently than I do. They aren't trying to "sabotage my convictions" or do anything negative whatsoever. They are enriching my child's life by allowing her to see different ways of doing things. Some of these are good, some not so good- but that's just my opinion. I think it's great my dd has so many different paths to choose- FOR HERSELF- and that she will have a wealth of experiences to draw from in adult life.

I planned for an off day today.

If my kid was ages 1-3 (and 3 would be iffy) I would say yes. If she were 5 I would say no (and I did) because she wouldn't get a whole lot out of it before she was too mature for such a thing.

We are cutting back on other things so that we don't have to cut back on Christmas. We did charge the bulk of dd's gifts this year so all we have to do is pick up a few more small things for her, my in laws' gifts, and things for each other and not have to shell out a grand all at one time in Nov/Dec. I bought one of dd's big gifts over the summer which helps a lot too.

You left off the yes answer with 1000 exclamation points after it.

99% of the families that go to the trunk or treat at our church don't attend our church. Quite a few of us that DO attend aren't there that night because we are out doing other stuff with our own kids. We just make cupcakes or donate other prizes, or help set up beforehand to help out.

I would not be happy about the going somewhere without permission. That alone would make me inclined not to allow the sleepover this time. However, I would trust my dd's ability to pick her friends wisely. My dd is 7 and has spent the night with friends whose parents we don't know well. I have met the parents of course, and if I had not, I would make a simple call to do so. Usually for a first time sleepover it is common for the parent of the guest to bring the child over. It would not bother me a bit that the friend had a brother or sister. Again, either I have done my job with dd and she has the sense not to do anything stupid or I haven't/she doesn't. But, like I said, not being able to sleep over with the friend this time would be a natural consequence of going somewhere without permission.

Well, whenever I have questions about dd's academic progress, I ask one or more of my teacher friends. We also have dd evaluated regularly to make sure she is on track. As far as the rest of it goes, I just make sure my dd is happy and this is what SHE wants. Is she making friends, does she have enough time away from me, is she independent, does she exhibit any signs of stress or other issues.

Amen ;)

Well- to put it this way- yes I want to know where my 7yo is and who she is with. I send her out into the neighborhood, but the rule is she has to stay outside so she can hear me call her. If she wants to go into another kid's house, she needs to tell me where she is and I will tell her what time to be home. I would want to meet the parent if it was a new family- just to make sure there is an adult there and that adult is okay with my dd being over, and to get a phone number. But, just because I may not like the parents or the parenting style, I don't prevent a friendship. If my dd goes to another kid's house and does something stupid, I don't blame the kid's parents. My dd knows how to act. With freedom comes responsibility. If she needs other people's parents to make sure she acts appropriately, I need to do some work here at home. There are some kids she hangs around who I really don't like. I mean- I REALLY don't like. When she got her Nintendo DS, one of the neighbor boys was over here every day. I knew he was using dd for her video game. I didn't say a word. 2 weeks went by and dd wised up. When the boy came over, she told him she didn't feel like playing Nintendo. He left. She learned a really valuable lesson there that she wouldn't have learned if I had intervened. Here is what I tell my dd- the chances of something bad happening are very very very small. If we educate ourselves about the possible dangers and take the precautions necessary, the chances get even smaller, but it will never mean nothing bad will ever happen. Still, we need to live our lives and not be afraid. I just read about a town this morning that is allowing kids to trick or treat after 15 years. A girl was a victim of a stranger abduction and murder 15 years ago. I think it is sad that so many kids had to suffer because of a bad occurrence that happens so rarely.

Helicopter parents are the ones who are afraid of the big bad world, who are afraid to let their children fail or make mistakes. They try to control every aspect of the child's life. The kids don't know what it's like to play without direct adult supervision and a snack. Helicopter moms often have a "vision" of what they think the child and/or the child's life should be like and exert control in an attempt to make that vision a reality. They are often very fearful of normal, everyday activities and can sometimes be germaphobes. I would consider the mom described in the OP as a helicopter parent. How much is too much? When the child does not have the opportunity to develop his own identity, separate from that of the parent. When the child has few friends because the parent is finding something "wrong" with most of the neighborhood kids. When the child does not have freedom to be in situations without the parent and not controlled by the parent. When the child is taught not to listen to other adults and authority figures, only to the parent. Sometimes this goes as far as moms who override Dad's input.

Yeah I heard it. I was an early reader and have no vision problems. My daughter also has no vision problems. One of the neighbor kids who didn't start reading until she was 4 has glasses.

Um- there are a ton of people who don't homeschool who are responsible and don't control every move their children make. Anyway- my point was there are a LOT of us out there trying to change the stereotype. :001_rolleyes:

Yes. I know quite a few public school moms who are WAY over invested in their kids. I agree with the friend who said motor skills and social opportunities are important for children. I also agree that being around your kids 24/7 is not usually a good thing for parent or child. However, it doesn't sound like this guy is aware that homeschooling parents can have time away from the kids and that the kids can have opportunities to socialize freely. Homeschool children can have the same wonderful opportunities for growth and development as public school kids- if the parents choose to put the work in. Homeschool moms can have a full and fulfilling life if they have a good support system around them. I run into a lot of people who still equate the word homeschooler with religious fanatic who is anti public school and over-controlling. I think it will take quite a few years, now that plenty of mainstream parents from different backgrounds are homeschooling, for the public perception to change. I always welcome such conversations as a way to help educate people. A lot of people I have met who have pre-conceived notions about homeschooling have come away from conversations with new understanding. I also learn a great deal from these encounters too. People pointing out areas that may be deficient is great for analisis and promting change where needed.

What it means is that Obama wants to raise the level of taxation on those who make over 250,000 per year to the same levels they were under Bill Clinton. According to a family member who is an accountant, if you make $250,000 per year, your taxes will probably increase by under $20. If you want less money to go for taxes and more money to go to charity, make sure you get a receipt. This "redistribution of wealth" thing is is smoke and mirrors. It's an attempt to make people afraid to vote for the scary liberal black man. ;)

It depends on the restaurant. I made $8 an hour back in college at one place I worked. On a Sat. night I could come out with a few hundred in tips too. BUT- I had a lot more advantages than - for example- someone working at an IHOP. My father tipped everybody- right down to the bagger at the grocery store. I couldn't imagine not tipping at a hotel. I just wasn't brought up that way. I remember once we took some friends out to eat, and the other lady and I went to the bathroom. There was a restroom attendant in there, and our "friend" made a huge stink about how she wasn't going to tip the woman - it was like she had never seen a bathroom attendant before. I was so embarrassed. I will never go to a nice restaurant with those people again. Last time we went out to eat, we went to Ruby Tuesdays. :glare:

Um, that would probably be because Obama DOESN'T want to require it. :banghead:

This, along with the one about people assuming that all homeschoolers are homeschooling for religious reasons and/or choosing to pull their kids out of society, would be on my list also. Then there is the one about homeschooling=I must be Holly Homemaker, Supermom, or something. Um- no.