We are in WA too and DH is retired from the Army so I know what you mean about weather as well as weird military schedules. I have 2 at home but if I were just to look at what the 4yo does in a day, I would think you could easily get your preschool done in a matter of 1-2 hrs. DD4 does 15-30 minutes each of math-type activities, 15-30 minutes of LA activities, and at least an hour of readalouds every day. Her "school" activites include workbooks, cutting and tracing activities, manipulatives, games, DVDs like LeapFrog Letter Factory and Schoolhouse Rocks, writing numbers and letters, art projects, piano lessons, and so on. I'm not a big one for formal "school" before kindergarten or first grade, but DD likes to have "homework" when her older brother does. On days that I know we aren't going anywhere, we fit more in to make up for the random nice day where we go to the zoo or the park. I have a plan for what I want to get through in a week and let the week ebb and flow.

:iagree:

My family does not support my choice to homeschool at all. I've managed to avoid the conversations for the most part by skillfully circumnavigating the topic when they bring it up. Their collective feeling is that I should have taken the school's option of going in to the school for 2 hrs/day every day to do "enrichment" with DS while paying for daycare for DD because she is not allowed on school grounds during my volunteer time. Their feeling is that I did not give the PS enough time to work through a "problem" like DS. The "problem" was that he excelled and was bored but the school policy was to sit him in a corner with a book while the rest of the class caught up. Grrr.... Still makes me angry. I do pick the librarian's brain frequently though. She has always been a bookworm and has had a goal of reading one book per day since she was a teen. She is the Youth Librarian at the public library in Ames, Iowa, and if anyone wants some great suggestions for books for their kids, ask for Danielle!

Personally I find the no-socks-with-tennis-thing a bit odd-looking. It makes your feet look HUGE, especially in shorts. Or maybe it's just that my feet ARE huge. I don't know.

That's an interesting point. I wonder if there is some type of readily available form that I could fill out. I could just keep a "grade book" of his math and LA work, or a folder of the quizzes we do. However, she never asks when we are here. It's always at their house. She is a teacher's aide at a very expensive private school and thinks that's where DS should be going. Not only is money a deterrant, but I have looked at their 2nd grade curriculum and know that what we are using is advanced in comparison. It's just frustrating. I get to go home to WI in August and be watch him be quizzed by my family of PS school teachers. My 3 brothers are teachers, their wives work in the school system (speech pathologist, school psychologist, and preschool aide), two of my nephews are teachers and married to teachers, one niece is a teacher and another is a youth librarian... Oh it's gonna be a fun visit, lol!

My MIL does this to DS constantly. We can't have a nice family meal without her asking him to spell some random word (and spelling is his weakest subject) or throwing some math problem his way. She didn't do it when he was in PS but now it seems like she feels the need to check on us constantly. I sincerely hope that when I he finishes his assessment/test on Friday, I have a piece of paper I can tell her to shove where the sun don't shine. Ahhhhh. I feel better now.

I voted over 10 times but feel I must explain. Both Regal and Century theaters have summer programs. Regal has 2 movies each week and they are free. Century has 10 movies throughout the summer and you can buy a "Season Pass" for $5. The movies are second showings at best, but it is "going to the movies." We also have an outdoor theater about 15 minutes from here that shows double features during the summer and one night each week its $10/carload. Last weekend we loaded up the Suburban with DH, me, the 3 kids and my inlaws and watched "How to Train Your Dragon" and "Ironman 2." As for the "regular" theater at full price, the teenager sees 10 or more movies, the 8 yo sees 5-6, and the 4 yo will be seeing "Toy Story 3" as her first full price feature.

My oldest doesn't even have that one job that he thinks is worthwhile. He doesn't feel college is worthwhile because many of the people he knows aren't even doing what they went to college for in the first place. He's the first person on his mother's side to even try to graduate from high school. His in a strange place. This may offer some "peace" to you. MANY of his PS friends' parents' say their kids are the same way. They are graduating in droves with no earthly idea of what they want to do. They have no goals or direction for the future. They figure they'll figure it out in college. For many, college has become the new high school. Everyone is expected to go in some form and they will "grow up" there. Again, I can identify with this. DS has said that he wuold be happy working in some repetition factory job for the rest of his life as long as it gives him enough money to do the things he likes to do. We are trying to find him some type of mundane manual labor job for the summer. Maybe he will be happy. Maybe he will decide he wants more. Honestly, as long as he is happy and finds a life in which he can support himself and hopefully some day a family, I don't care if he digs ditches or writes for the NYT. I agree. We don't pay our kids an allowance. There are chores they are expected to do and they get paid only for what they do above and beyond their "family responsibilities." DS18 had no idea how much it cost us to have him on our car insurance (it more than doubled our premium) or how much it cost each month for his gas until we showed him on paper what his "extras" cost. He was trying to determine how much it would cost him to live on his own. He looked up apartment prices in the area and we figured in food, power, water, phone, car insurance, gas, etc). Then we figured out how many hours he would have to work each month at minimum wage in order to pay for it all. It was an eye opener. DS18 moved in with us when he was 14 so even though I've known him since he was 3, the house he was raised in was much different than ours. However, I think summer jobs and/or part-time jobs at a menial wage as well as being responsible for at least some of their expenses goes a long way to show a child what life may hold in store for them.

Lands End and Eddie Bauer are my "go to" t-shirts. Eddie Bauer's tend to be a little thicker. Both last forever and are really soft. If you have a Sears near you, they sell LE.

I got my degree in 1995. The program at that time was a 3 yr Masters post B.S. It's a lot of hard school (and a lot of math and science pre-reqs followed by a lot of science and statistics within the program) for a career with a relatively low 'glass ceiling' as far as pay is concerned. I was topped out for salary (managing a clinic) within 4 yrs of obtaining my degree. The only way I can command a higher 'salary' is to own my own clinic, and then you run the risk/reward scenario of owning a small business that is also medically-related. Those are not good odds at this time. However, all of that aside, it is a rewarding career. You just have to find a population you enjoy working with.

Well said.

Yup, that's my boy! Couldn't tell you that Attila the HUN was the leader of the HUNS but he knows how the man died.

Well... It's easy to tell someone they need to go see the doctor but you can't make someone seek treatment. It's possible he is fearful of letting someone else in and he already trusts your sister with the information and is comfortable dumping on her vs. a stranger. It doesn't help her. But it may be how he sees it. My husband has PTSD (Gulf War related and he's 80% disabled and medically retired from the Army due to that and some physical injuries during his years of service) and he struggles with Depression from not being able to serve any more. He was on anti-depressants for a while but he found they just made him numb and that was more depressing than the depression. Anyway... He had gone through some counseling but every time he got comfortable with a counselor the VA would change his counselor and he'd have to start all over with a new person, reliving all of the things that gave him the PTSD in the first place. After the last counselor was transferred, he stopped going for counseling. He just couldn't start over again. Honestly, he was doing for OK for the last few years... And then his ex-wife and (DS's mom) committed suicide in January. (I posted about this situation yesterday in Re: to DS's issues.) Anyway... The two of them are both in a bad place right now and trying to work their way out of it. I chose the family counseling route for DH this time around because we can focus on the family dynamic vs. drudging up painful memories specific to DH. It felt 'safer' for DH and honestly I need some help in dealing with all that goes on around here too. So maybe family counseling as a place to start that feels 'safe' for the brother-in-law?

I'm sorry. This made me laugh. But only because I feel your pain. Today I read from SOTW1 about Attila the Hun. Our review sounded like this: ME: "Who were the barbarians from Asia who tried to invade Rome?" DS: "The Celts?" ME: "No, the Celts were from Britain. The Huns were from Eastern Europe and Asia. Who was the leader of the Huns?" DS: "I don't know." ME: "Attila was the leader of the Huns. Who did Attila the Hun lead against Rome?" DS: "The Romans." "No. Attila the Hun was the leader of the Huns. He led the Huns against the Romans." DS: "But he died of a nosebleed! I had a nosebleed once and didn't die! I'm stronger than he was!" AAAAAHHHHHH!!!!

This thread has been a blessing to me today. Thank you all! Truly, yes. You have really said so much that has helped. He does seem to find some sort of peace in physical labor. That is one of the reasons we have tried to encourage him to claim the garage as his own, and to find a part-time summer job that is physical or outdoors. He has only cried twice, once when we got the phone call that she had died and once when they called to tell us how she died. Otherwise, we have not seen him cry. That doesn't mean he hasn't. I know he's hurting and I want to fix it but I know I can't. Thank you for that. Sometimes it just doesn't seem like enough. Sometimes I feel like I'm banging my head off the wall.I want to do more for him but I know it's really a matter of time and him figuring out how to deal. I know she loved him. It's so hard to understand where she was in her life that she made that choice. But we have talked with him about how low she must have been to have taken her own life. I think he understands that to a certain extent but the circumstances just feel like a kick to the stomach when you look at them from outside. Thank you again everyone. You really are wonderful.

The kit would primarily be for the 8yo (3rd grade) but the 4yo will tag along. We did units on plants, animals and the human body this year so I'm considering the Physics or Chemistry kit. Which was more fun and why?

Yes. I'm sorry. I forgot to say. He called about an hour ago. He is at his grandparent's house helping them clean up their yard. He has not come home but at least we know where he is.

Yes. He had many of the same issues prior to her death. We had him in counseling and were doing some family counseling even before she died to deal with his childhood as well as how he was integrating into the family. There are a few subtle changes since her death, like his attitude toward me and women in general. When left unchecked he will treat me like something that should be scraped off his shoes. I think he is directing his anger at his mom toward me, and I'm a big girl so I can handle it and understand where it's coming from but I will not allow it to go unchecked.

His mom died this January. He's still in high school. He may or may not graduate in 3 wks. If he doesn't graduate on time, he will most likely take summer school classes to catch up and get his diploma at the end of summer. However, there is another option on the table whereby he could go to the technical high school for another year as a "super senior" and learn some trade skills. We are OK with either option but want him to choose rather than having life choose for him. We have told him he is welcome to live here (by our rules) and go to the community college or work while he figures things out. He cannot just hang out. He has to have a plan, a schedule, a purpose so to speak.

Gentle range of motions exercises like the pendulum exercises in are safe and often reduce pain.

Chucki, I do believe it's time for another sit down talk, on a good day. He is an important part of the family but he also needs to see that his attitude and behavior are a negative influence on the youngers. I don't think he's really allowed himself to grieve yet but when we or his counselor try to get him to talk his response is that he is done thinking about it. My dad died over a year ago under very different circumstances and I'm not done thinking about it. But I think there are maturity issues at play on the subject and he doesn't fully understand that grieving is a cyclical process. Anyway, I do agree that a sit down is necessary, but on a good day for him. As far as additional space, we cannot build on to the house (neighborhood covenants). He would enjoy it, but it's not feasible. We've encouraged him for 2 years to turn our garage into a game room for him and his friends but he has not yet taken the initiative on that. It remains an option though. Re: his time with his dad, DH started a Venture Crew to spend more time with him and he also got DS involved in Boy Scouts (which he loves, and will hopefully receive his Eagle after his board in June). On weekends, DH will try to do something one-on-one with him but DS either refuses or invites a friend or does something to get himself in trouble so he doesn't have to go. I don't think he is comfortable being alone with his dad because DH tries to get him to talk about things that make him uncomfortable (i.e. his mom, school, future plans). Re: the military, DS has been overweight since he was a young child (5-6 yo) and some significant weight to lose to enlist. Rather than use it as an incentive, he uses it in a "sour grapes" type mentality. I took him to a nutritionist and signed him up for a gym with a personal trainer. He did well for about two weeks and then gave up saying he didn't want to join the Army anyway. I continue to cook healthy foods, keep the junk food out of the house, and encourage activity but he tends to use food for comfort and that's something he's needed a lot of over the last few months. I too have had the fleeting "he's 18 and he needs to go" thoughts but they are just glimmers because he is emotionally a child who is hurting and where he would go, left to his own devices, would most likely not be good.

I see my younger two wander off (much as DH and I do) for alone time now and then. Our lifestyle is more a matter of circumstance (small house, open floor plan, business run out of the home, homeschooling) than a matter of choice but it seems maybe the eldest child has more difficulty expressing his needs (and has more intense needs) than the rest of us. When he moved in, DH and I gave up our office space in the home (moved it into our bedroom--I do not recommend that) so that he could have his own space within the house. We installed doors so that he could have privacy. We don't allow the other children in his room without his permission. We knew he would have to adjust to the way our house is vs. how his mother's was. We do try to let him have space but perhaps it's not so much the physical as the emotional space that he needs. The situation is heartwrenching on a daily basis. Not only knowing what he went through before his mom died, but then having to deal with that on top of everything. It's so unfair for him. It's just so hard to watch your child flounder, suffer, punish himself, dig himself holes he can't get out of. So hard. And at the same time I am trying to keep DH and his relationship from suffering (DH gets really frustrated with the fact that he doesn't seem to learn from his mistakes or want to try to do better) and trying to maintain a healthy relationship between all of the kids and trying to keep the stress from negatively impact our marriage and ... It's just a lot some days. Thank you so much for your kind words and suggestions. I really want him to feel like he is an important part of the family. He is. He is as important as the other children whether he realizes it or not. We've tried to have several heart-to-hearts but he seems to have difficulty knowing where he fits. It's obviously time for another one though. Our together time is excessive but brought about by our business, the size of our home, homeschooling, and our choice of activities (primarily scouting). I think since he always had a lot of physical personal space at his mom's house, he doesn't know how to create his own space within the current constraints. Something to work on for sure. Thank you all again for your suggestions and kindness. I'm almost in tears from how wonderful you all are.

I'm wondering outloud now. He has said before that his life in GA was very different because it was just him and his mom (and sometimes a boyfriend) in a house twice the size of ours and that they each basically had their own bedrooms, living rooms and bathrooms. The only space they shared (and the only time they shared regularly) was dinner time. I wonder if some of his problems stem from the fact that we do EVERYTHING together and he was not really brought up that way. We run a business from our home. DH and I work together. We homeschool the kids. We spend most of our freetime together. We eat 2 if not 3 meals together daily. Is it too much "together" for him in general? I mean, we give him the choice as to whether or not he goes with us on outing (and he's always welcome to bring a friend) but our family unit spends a lot of time together and my inlaws live 8 houses away in the same neighborhood and we see them at least 2-3 days/wk for meals and such. I mean, it doesn't justify the lying and disrespectful behavior but maybe rather than trying so hard to include him in the family stuff and make him feel like he is part of the family, we need to just let hiim go. We haven't really wanted to leave him alone since his mom died (because we are afraid of what he might do to himself), but maybe that's what he needs, at least in part. Hmmm...

Still can't figure the multiquote thing. Bah. Yes, his mom killed herself. I do think he blames himself on many levels. He chose to move here when he was 14 (age of choice in GA) for numerous reasons. He had not seen her in almost a year (refused to go because of the mother's boyfriend). Before Christmas, he and I talked at length about his relationship with his mother and the fact that since he planned to join the Army right after high school (those plans have since changed) he might want to go spend some time with her, either at Christmas or in the summer, before he went to basic training. He spent what he described as a wonderful Christmas with his mom and 2 wks after he got back here she shot herself... with a pistol she had asked him to load for "self defense." It's almost like she wanted to stick it to him, right to the very end. It's awful. Imagine the guilt he feels about the entire situation. I cannot. While logically he knows that he is not to blame on any level for the choices she made, he still blames himself. So yes, everything goes deeper than just lying or just being an introvert or just testing his boundaries or just any one thing. It was like this before her death and has intensified ever since. There have been safety issues in the past with the younger children, the animals, tools, etc. There is a sense of self-hate that manifests in self-sabotage, alienating behaviors, trust issues, etc., that existed prior to his mom's death. I understand that he needs compassion and love and a feeling of acceptance. I try to offer that to the best of my ability. I have known him since he was 3. He grew up around me. I love the boy. I truly do. I want him to be happy and healthy and well-adjusted. I want him to love himself like we love him. The awkwardness of my position comes from wanting the same for the entire family and watching one member repeatedly do things that upset the rest of the family. I want to protect everyone, including protecting the 18yo from himself. Does that make sense?

You all make valid points, and I appreciate them all. I wish I knew how to multiquote but I can't seem to figure it out. I did put a call into the psychiatrist to give him a heads up for when DSS gets home. We need to sit down again as a group and go over boundaries and expections. I am concerned for DSS and how he is choosing to deal with things in his life, but I am also concerned about the example he sets for the younger children in the house. They have already picked up some to the "screw you" attitude he displays toward DH and myself as well as the rules of the house and this needs to be nipped. I also don't want them thinking it's OK tell tell different versions of "their truth" to people as they see fit. So we have an appointment to talk with him on Tuesday. Beyond the family as a whole unit, I am concerned about DS and how he is dealing (or rather choosing not to deal) with events and realities in his life. I want him to understand that he is OK as he is, warts and all, but he needs to accept that and move forward accordingly rather than try to paint a pictures of himself that is based on lies. He's a likable person. He just sabotages himself time after time. Hornblower, I know what you mean about the questions. MIL was just genuinely interested in what his plans for the future are. She fields a lot of phone calls from relatives who are interested in what he is doing after high school and she wanted to tell them the right thing. I'm sure it was annoying for him though. She annoys me sometimes, lol. Openminded, he (in front of his peers) takes great pleasure in the fact that he has a 3% in one of his classes that "no one" fails. His initial plan after his mom died was to fail on purpose so he could go to the technical high school for another year and gain some job skills but then he decided he didn't want to do any of those jobs (computers, culinary, construction, auto mechanics, etc.) so he would try to graduate and go to the community college for a few years in order to get a set of grades or associates degree that may get accepted into a college for forestry. That's the plan that I know of as of now. Starr, he may be feeling badly. I honestly think he doesn't have a clear idea of what he might like to do with his life so it is easier to do nothing rather than try and fail. That's just my thought though. Jana, I really appreciate you sharing about your childhood. Your sister sounds similar to my son and I hope that we can help him or find help for him that will allow him to have the life he deserves. He has a lot of potential, he really does. He just can't seem to accept himself and find a path.