Does that include the cost of the square footage of your house that is used for homeschooling? (livingroom, kitchen (table), kids' bedrooms, bathrooms, and yard) Does that include the heat and air conditioning and electricity to maintain that percent of your home? Does that include 45c/mile for all educational transportation to the library, zoo, science center, nature center, coop, Grand Canyon, and the Lincoln Memorial? Does that include music lessons or gym/sports? Does that include a sewing machine and kitchen resources (home ec)? "Shop" is pricey, too, if your kids learn to do woodworking, or to change a tire or the oil in the car. Does that include library fines? Does that include birthday gifts that are educational? An ant farm? A book on the periodic table? A lego kit? A game like Monopoly that teaches your children how to add doubles and count money? How much more would it cost if one of your children was special needs? Anything from dyslexia to major physical ailments that require ramps and other special equipment? Just wondering.

Our totally awesome nature center profiled ants several years ago in their Naturalist's Lunchbox. (Families pack a sack lunch and eat it under the trees while the naturalist does a program). The Naturalist had several children as volunteers to do the different jobs as ants. She had a prop for each child. She also had laminated drawings of what each type of ant would look for. Examples: type -- prop -- laminated drawing 1 Queen -- tiara -- eggs 2 Nurse ants -- nurse hats or red cross armbands -- babies (larvae) 2 Guard ants -- military gear -- enemy ants or other predators 2 worker ants -- ?little basket for collecting food? -- food Who else am I missing? Are there digger/tunneling ants? The Naturalist dressed up each child and explained what their job was. Then, one type at a time, she sent them over to a general area in the grass to collect the items (drawings) that pertained to their type of ant. Playing "dress-up" may seem a little young for the age you are teaching, but I'll bet they remember this lesson! Also, instead of using "drawings" you could use our real life items from around your house to teach the lesson. Use baby dolls instead of a picture of larvae. Use a carton of (boiled) eggs instead of a picture of ant eggs. Use play food from your 5yo's play kitchen instead of a line drawing of picnic food. ------------------------------- For one of the art projects, the teacher had red and white checked paper (printer stationary?) like the standard red-checked picnic tablecloth. The kids used inkpads and their fingers to make ants. Markers are used to add legs and antenna. This art project is a little juvenile for your age, but I just put it out there for your use.

Maybe I should be more offended than I am when people ask this question. I'm not. As many PP have pointed out, this is THE question. Homeschooling is more mainstream than ever, so people are tripping over us as homeschoolers more than ever. However the public doesn't even know the right questions to ask. I wouldn't expect a non-homeschooler to ask: "Are you an unschooler, classical method, CM, or something else?" "Have you read the WTM?" "Which math curriculum do you use?" "Are you planning to dual enroll (in public school or community college) when your child is in high school?" "Do you feel the state regulations are reasonable?" "Who do you use as a visiting teacher?" "Did your kids take the ITBS?" These questions are off the radar for non-homeschoolers because they just. don't. know. Yes, some people are malicious in their questioning of socialization, but I believe that most are just trying to figure out how this homeschooling thing works. They are curious.

Thoughts on this topic: --Loverboy and I met online. --Dating online is like speed dating: you can meet a LOT of people in a short period of time. You may not know when meeting them that, "I'd like to spend the rest of my life with that person, " but you can certainly decide whether or not you want to spend 10 more minutes with them. --It is hard to be alone. It is nice to have someone who thinks you are special in your life. --I have already started grooming my daughters to: Plan for a life without a partner. Fill it to the brim with things you love to do. Create your own financial security. Build many friendships for support. Life will be rich whether or not someone special comes along. --One of the happiest couples for whom I nannied met after the husband completed Medical School. --I assure you: She is out there looking for you just as hard as you are looking for her.

Best advice for potty training: "Very few children leave for kindergarten not potty trained." Stages of potty training: 1) Child informs parent after child has peed or pooped. 2) Child informs parent AS they are peeing and pooping. (This is the most frustrating stage because parents usually holler, "WELL, GIT ON THE POTTY!") 3) Child informs parent before child needs to pee or poop. Little boys tend to potty train later than little girls. It's not their fault. Physiologically, some of the nerves at the base of their spines (for controlling the bladder) develop a little later. Dd2 has been much easier to potty train than dd6 was. Loverboy and I believe that it is because of our "superior parenting style." :rolleyes: Of course, our superior parenting style consists of letting her run around buck naked most days.

"No tolerance" policy = no good judgment.

Order a meal and cut it in half (to share).

We are not at science fair age, but we are working on dd6's poster for 4H communications contest. At this -- Clover Kids --level, everyone gets a green "participation" ribbon. There are no blue, red, or white ribbons. I think that you need to use your best judgment of how much to participate based on: 1) Your child's age 2) Has your child ever done this before, or even seen a science fair before 3) What are you hoping your child will get out of this project? Points for a college admissions form? To learn about the scientific process? To demonstrate a component of science or answer a specific question of science? To communicate? If you are worried about competing with other moms, have a discussion with your son about what the true goals are, and that you are proud of him as long as he works hard. Here's how it has worked in our situation: Dd6 chose the topic: Snow Leopards. Mom sent in the paperwork for 4H and requested books from the library. We read the books together. Dd6 dictated 4-5 "captions" to Mom. Mom wrote them on scrap paper. Mom set up Google on the internet and typed in "Snow Leopard Photo." Dd6 chose several photos, and learned how to cut and paste photos from the internet into Powerpoint. Dd6 learned how to manipulate the photos within Powerpoint to the correct size. She added a text box, too, and moved photos from one slide to another. Mom bought special photo paper from the store, and prepped the computer for quality and which slides. Dd6 pressed the print button. Dd6 cut the photos out. Dd learned what a mat was. Together we discussed good color choices based on the colors in the photos. She measured her pictures, added 1", and learned how to cut out her mats using Mom's fancy cutter for scrapbooking. She learned about rubber cement as an adhesive. Mom pulled out her Cricut machine, and dd6 learned how to add a cartridge, put paper on the cricut mat, enter the mat into the machine, and program the machine to cut letters for a title. Mom wrote out "SNOW LEOPARDS", and dd6 entered the letters. Mom helped with pointing out the button for capital letters. We repeated the process using the "Shadow" button in a compatible color of dd6's choice. Dd6 used rubber cement to put the cricut letters together with their shadow letters. Two letters were put together backwards (also a learning experience!), so Mom pulled out the cricut again, and dd6 cut out replacement letters. Mom cut white cardstock to the right size and drew light lines on it. Dd6 has been using her best writing using a pencil to copy captions from what Mom wrote on the scrap paper. Mom will direct dd6 to trim the captions. Dd6 will cut mats for the captions as she did for the photo. Mom will find references for the photos we used and print them out to add to the poster. At this age, I don't expect dd6 to understand the full importance of the references required for our poster. We will discuss it. Dd6 will cut, paste, and print a 4H emblem for the poster (required). Dd6 will assemble and glue the poster. For us, snow leopards are the secondary goal. The true goal is for dd6 to learn a little about the internet, Powerpoint, Cricut, color choices/mat cutting, references, and assembling a poster. Understanding that many small steps that make a big project (for us) is also a good goal. Next year, I don't expect dd6 to know how to do all of these things independently, but I hope that she will say, "Hey, I remember that from last year!"

Why do I think it is important to read music? (The following is just my opinion). 1) Reading music is a part of being well rounded. I put it in the same category as knowing how to play a specific sport, change the oil in one's car, be science literate, being historically literate, etc. You don't have to major in it, but there is a minimal level of proficiency for these subjects. 2) Knowing how to read music indirectly helps one to converse semi-intelligently on musical topics....and make polite conversation. One may not be able to sight read, but one would still know the difference between a whole note and a 16th note, piano and forte, and largo vs. presto. 3) A mom wiser than I listed the traits of a well-rounded child: --academics --a sport (or exercise) --music or art --something that can be developed as a second income like swimming (lifeguarding, swim lessons), instrument (teach basic piano or instrument lessons), woodworking (carpentry, build/repair furniture), etc. Piano meets that goal.

I haven't gotten to read everyone's responses yet. It's been a busy day! But I wanted to thank everyone so far for responding with such clear and gentle words! I'm so glad I posted this question! I KNEW the Hive would be full of good advice and experience!

Older dd is 6. She is a hard worker and plenty smart. She is of Kindergarten age, but finishing up 2nd grade math and 1st grade phonics. Younger dd is 2. Though not talking a lot, she is identifying letters and sounds. Last night, she picked up a penny off the ground and identified it. There are other things that point to her being able to blow us all out of the water in her problem solving abilities. Loverboy is concerned that the time will come that dd2 will pass dd6, and that this will be more likely and more evident with homeschooling. I believe this is inevitable because usually younger siblings DO pass older sibling in some skills (but not in others). I know this is entirely possible because I was also a second child who could beat my older sister in chess, take math classes a year earlier than she did, and solve a rubik's cube in high school. My question is: How can we set up our family NOW to help both girls reach potential without having the older one feel discouraged and give up? What words and practices do we need to start using NOW. Things I believe: 1) I'm less worried about intelligence than in what you do with it. 2) We're luckier than most. Loverboy always felt that his brother were better at school than he was. (One graduated h.s. with a 4.3 GPA and as best soccer player in the state). And yet, he is the only one who earned a PhD. Working hard makes a difference. Thanks in advance!

I was a child like this. Dd6 often has meltdowns by trying to do things with which she needs help. We speak often that it is a good skill to know WHEN to ask for help.

Ask him what he wants to color. My 2yo has limited interest in coloring. We DO have coloring books, crayons, markers, etc in the house and readily available. But What she likes is when I ask her, "What do you want to color?" If it is a rabbit, I type into Google: "Rabbit free coloring pages". I let her pick which one she wants to color, copy + paste to powerpoint (and adjust for size), and print. She can't wait until it comes out of the printer, and she always colors more intently if it is something she picked out. Color with him/her. I have babysat dozens and dozens of kids. Some like to color. Some do not. Coloring with the child does make a difference in their interest level. Wait until your child turns 6. Some kids are just not interested in coloring at a preschool age. Dd6 never was. However, she has the most beautiful handwriting you've ever seen a 6yo write. Don't despair; there are other ways to develop fine motor skills.

Many, many hugs to the OP. First, buy a big pile of paper plates. It's not the end of the world to live off of paper for as long as it takes. I have friends who work part time and their youngest child is 7. Paper plates are part of their daily survival plan. Second, just survive on the housework. We just do dishes and laundry around here. Vacuuming occurs when we get to it. My kitchen floor hasn't been properly mopped for 3 years. I just spot clean it with a rag when something drops on it. Third, the best advice I got when pregnant was to just "Know that you will fall behind for a year. Get over it." Even now, our toddler is 2yo, and there are days that she just needs to nurse and nurse. I try to set dd6 up with independent work before I go nurse the baby, but that has its limits. I don't begrudge the toddler this because I know she needs me in this way. Older dd6 will be fine. We rarely do science or other extras. We do read as much as we can, and we do watch a lot of PBS (PBS kids, Nova, and Nature). Fourth, Please find some support for yourself. Do you have a church friend who would come twice a week to fold laundry for you and sweep/mop your floors? Many church communities have boards set up to minister to members in need. Please go for a PPD screening, too. That baby needs you at your best. We've all been there.

Another vote for 4-H, even if you have to start your own club. This is not your mother's 4-H. Things that have changed since our parents were 4-Hers. --There are more specialized clubs. Ours is science driven, has Clover Kids and regular 4-H together, and no animals. Our kids give demos on legos, computer programming, and the science of pancakes. There are also plenty of sewing, woodworking, crocheting, art, baking, and gardening projects. --4H has become a big communication program. Formerly, one was judged for a beautiful project. This is still true, but now the write-up and presentation are just as important. One answers questions like "What did you learn?" and "What would you do differently next time?" You are docked for points if you are asked a question in a group setting, and you don't repeat the question before answering. --Annual Communication program is held next month. --If you start a group, they will come. We found our group by looking online at the County 4H website. A second vote for IEW's Speech Boot Camp. We haven't used it yet, (dd is only 6), but I have heard it referenced in Pudewa's talks. We plan to use it when dds are older. --------------------------------------- A poor idea well communicated always gets more traction than a good idea poorly communicated.

I think when people make comments like, "That's great you homeschool, but I could never do it," they are offering a compliment. They are acknowledging that you have skills (teaching + organization + goal setting + negotiation with kids + patience) that they are not confident of in themselves. At least, I've always taken it as a compliment. .......Maybe I should be more offended......? :laugh: People who talk about the one family that is "not well socialized" should look at the behavior of the kids in public school. Most are fine and polite young men and women....but the unsocialized ones are Reason #438 why we homeschool!

The discussion you may need to have is, "What kind of life do you want in 20 years?" Working hard now (at a young age) pays off big time when it comes to college and good jobs. It's rather like a baseball game. You wouldn't screw around for 7 innings, and then expect to win the game. Winning the game would be a good and comfortable life. There IS a difference between those who complete college and those who don't. I don't need to tell you, but someone may need to tell your son: Usually those who don't complete college work harder for fewer rewards. Their work is more physical, less financially rewarding, less personally rewarding, and they are more likely to have an abusive work environment (bosses or the public). Consider Loverboy, who is a scientist: If he wanders into work 30 minutes late, unless he missed a meeting, no one cares as long as the work gets done. He comes and goes on his own lunch schedule or if our family needs him or if he has a dental, doctor, or financial appointment. He has generous medical and vacation benefits. Educational opportunities (that will help him get an even better job) are provided. This is the same for his brother the accountant, his brother the HR representative, my friend the vet. Or you could do my job: No education. Bosses that refuse to pay you. Injury on the job that your boss doesn't mention,"Worker's Comp will pay for a doctor for that." You lose your job if you are late by even a minute 3X ever....no matter the weather or the fact that your kid threw up on you just before leaving the house. No benefits or raises or insurance. My daughters see the two lives before them. They know that hard work now makes a difference. Has anyone had this conversation with him?

1) Procrastination is the inability to understand the true benefits of doing something. Are there any more immediate benefits than, "In over 10 years, you'll be done with college!" NOBODY would or could work in the business world with that as motivation. "You're working on developing a new cancer drug. We'll pay you when it comes out in 10 years if nothing goes wrong between now and then!" People NEED incremental motivations. For ADULTS, they need weekly or monthly motivations (paycheck). College students need those motivations (feedback on tests or papers) weekly or monthly, too. I had an English professor that required a writing assignment at every class. This is fair: it's English class. We didn't get ANYTHING back until after the semester mid-terms, and that was only after a revolt in class. Some students had been told they were failing, but had not had any feedback by getting their papers back to tell them they were failing. Children are much younger and less elastic in their ability to work without reward or meaningful results. Our dd6 is extremely motivated by rationed tv and money (distributed in conjunction with schoolwork accomplished). What will work for your son? 2) Is there something you're missing? My parents loved me and did the best they could for me, but they missed a couple of big things when I was growing up; and it would have been easy for them to label me as lazy and inactive. From their pov: Duckens sleeps until the last minute in the morning before going to school. Although she does morning chores (chickens), she skips breakfast. When she comes home from school, she eats a snack (~100calores) set out by her mom and sits in front of the tv the rest of the day until evening chores and bedtime. She does homework then. From my ADULT pov: I would wake in the night several times a week (from as young as 2nd grade or younger) and cry myself back to sleep. I did this all through my childhood and teens. I was never hungry in the mornings for breakfast. I still am not hungry as an adult, but as an adult, I can get a snack an hour later. Starting in 3rd grade, for social reasons, I quit eating lunch. This continued for 8 years. It would have been 9, but I really didn't have a Senior year. Summary: No breakfast, no lunch, minimal snack, and interrupted sleep was a system that resulted in behavior that was seen as laziness. I must have genuinely been at my energy limit by the end of the school day. As an adult, I usually worked 2-3 jobs WHILE going to college, so no -- not lazy. My parents love me, but still are in denial about my childhood. "We didn't help you more because you made different choices as an adult than your siblings." So the question is: Is there something dietary or sleepwise that you may be missing? Does he need more protein? Less protein? Is he getting enough sleep? Is this a result of food additives? (Some kids are just more sensitive than others to those things).

Equipment: 2 pieces of paper, a stack of pennies Write 1 - 12 on each piece of paper. Take turns rolling a 12-sided die (found in comic book stores or online). You may also use 2 6-sided dice and omit 1 in your list. Example: We are learning 3s. I roll an 11, so I [count up or announce] that 3x11 = 33. I put a penny on my 11. dd rolls a 9, so she [counts up or announces] that 3x9 = 27. She puts a penny on her 9. I roll a 4. so I [count up or announce] that 3x4 = 12. I put a penny on my 4. Whoever covers their numbers first wins. ---------------------------- For nines: Open up your ten fingers and look at the palms of your hands. Let's do 3x9. With your palms open, count to your third finger (middle finger on left hand). Put that third finger down, but keep the remaining 9 fingers up. Notice that there are 2 fingers to the left of the down finger, and 7 fingers to the right of the down finger. So: 2 and 7. 3 x 9 = 27. :hurray: Let's do another. Open your palms again so all 10 fingers are up. 7 x 9 Put down your 7th finger (ring finger on right hand). Notice that you have 6 fingers to the left of the down finger and 3 fingers to the right of the down finger. So, 6 and 3. 7x9=63 ****This only works for 9s!!!!***** ------------------------------------------------ I have made several columns on a sheet of paper for dd to write the 3s, 4s, and 6s skipcounted again and again and again. She will do 1-2 columns each day. It is similar to Math-U-See's system. I've used it with other children. I'm not sure how much this is working for my own dd. She may just need to get a little older.

--If we are hosting, then we do not expect others to bring something. Possibly dessert if they persist. --If we are guests, I ask what we can bring. --If the hosts say, "Nothing," then we swing by the grocery store for a $10 bouquet of flowers for whomever is cooking!

I'm still reading it, too. Everyone in our household is introverted. After my experience in public school, I am happy to be homeschooling, and this book re-affirms that (at least for now) this is the right choice for us. 1) I'm curious: how do you view your family members: extroverted or introverted? 2) Has Quiet changed or reaffirmed how anyone else is raising an introverted child? *apology for awkwardly worded question* ETA: 3) If your child is introverted, how do you balance outside activities with staying home to re-charge?

I am not a vet. Is the normal time for the boys to wean? Many mommy animals get grouchy at weaning time as a way to say, "You've had enough! Leave me alone! I mean it!" I've seen (on film) mother bears chase their 2yos up trees repeatedly when it is time for them to be independent (and not travel with her anymore). I have seen mother dogs, horses, and giraffes nip at and walk away from their babies at weaning time. Can you telephone the vet and see what they say?

Disclaimer #1: I haven't read all of the other posts. Disclaimer #2: Older dd is not an impulsive child. She is thoughtful and careful in all she does. Unknown about toddler dd. I would like my children to receive their permits (and subsequent licenses) asap because I would like them to have as much chance to practice driving while under our roof. This includes not just support for act of driving, but support in navigating our town and unfamiliar roads out of town. They will also have extra years of having to follow Mom and Dad's rules about driving: --no cell phones while driving --no smoking in car --where will you be? --drive safely --who can ride in our car We hope that if our children get their permits at 14, they will have 4+ years of these rules to develop into habits. IMO, that is much better than a 17yo getting their license and moving out a year later to navigate all of these car choices on their own. At this point, we plan to share cars within the household. I would rather have two working cars (what we have now) compared to three undependable cars (what I grew up with). We are also lucky to live in a town with fairly good public transportation and bike routes.

Welcome! This is the second installment of the Monthly Book Club. We voted on books to read, and the selection to discuss during March 2013 is Quiet: The Power of Introverts in a World That Can't Stop Talking by Susan Cain. Please feel free to drop in and join us if you have EVER read this book and have something valuable to add to the conversation. First, some housekeeping: 1) Future books (according to the vote): April 2013: The Hobbit by J.R.R. Tolkien 2) If you are not interested in reading specific a book, then skip that month. Our time is too valuable to be reading things we resent reading. Likewise, we welcome those who are only participate sporadically. The ideal is that many voices will result in a good discussion. 3) Keep in mind suggestions for future books clubs (if we can make it through the first few months). We'll take suggestions to vote in the last half of March. This will most likely occur on a separate thread. 4) Play nice. I don't want to get banned! PSA: I have never run a "book club." I am not planning to start now, beyond the basic organization of voting and starting monthly threads. However: --Please feel free to pm me if I miss something mechanical. --Don't take it personally if I don't get right back to you. Sometimes life gets busy, and I am absent from the boards for a week or so at a time.

I would graciously buy a bigger gift for your two children to share. However, I think we need to STOP THE MADNESS, and that starts with everyone here who is tired of sending gifts to birthday parties. 1) When we have parties, we specifically list "No Gifts" on the invitations. My children have plenty of toys in our house already, and get many gifts from their parents. Most people I know have at least some of their kids' toys packed away because their kids have so many material goods. (Our household is included in that assessment). 2) If my children want a party to be with their friends and celebrate their birthday (or graduation, or Confirmation, or whatever), then we will invite people to come an eat a piece of cake in honor our our child. If my children want people to bring them a pile of swag, then save your money and take yourself to the store. We don't like our friends for what they can buy us. 3) I don't want an invitation to my child's special day to be like a getting a bill in the mail for other families. It is rare that items given at these parties are stuff "needed" by the child. When is the last time you saw a child receive (not from a family member) clothing, safety equipment for a sport, or a reference book? 4) We give consumables for birthday gifts. Usually a nice set of markers or crayons, and possibly some oversized or otherwise special drawing paper. Playdoh for younger kids. It makes it easy to give the exact same thing next year, and they will wear out and not clutter up the house within a finite amount of time. 5) Some moms I know who are good friends have the blatant agreement to buy clothing for each others' kids for birthdays. This is at least useful as children grow to a larger size.