Urgent Covid Advice Needed - updated advice question in first and last post (repeated)

[ktgrok]

38 minutes ago, Kassia said:

@ktgrok a couple more things

gf has a degree in psychology and a master's degree in human resources (that's her career) so I would think she should be able to navigate communication and relationships better.

ds1 is incredibly selfish/self-centered, etc. in addition to the lack of empathy.  I'm thinking more about the spectrum idea but I just don't see it anywhere else like I do with my other son.  Interesting perspective, though.  

Ok, she definitely should know better!

As for DS1, you know him best, but remember that no two kids on the spectrum are alike. I'd definitely explore the idea that he lacks empathy vs doesn't express it the same way as other people. 

I remember watching the show Parenthood, which had a kid on the spectrum. The scene was taking place in a hospital waiting room - they normally go to get pancakes on Sunday mornings, but the boy's cousin was in the hospital after a car accident. The boy kept getting more and more upset that they were not going to get pancakes. Everyone was mad at him because he seemed to have no empathy for his cousin. But his response was that there was NOTHING they could do to help her, they were not even allowed in to visit her yet and wouldn't be for a while, so they could worry about her while eating pancakes just as well as worry about her at the hospital. It wasn't that he didn't CARE that his cousin was in surgery, it was that he saw no benefit, logically, in waiting to find out the news there at the hospital vs while eating breakfast. And really...he's not wrong,lol. My Aspie son watched and totally agreed with the kid - which horrified me for a moment, but really....they are not WRONG. And they DO care - they just don't feel the need to act illogically just because they care. The kid wanting pancakes appeared selfish...but when you pick it apart, him wanting pancakes didn't mean he cared less than people wanting to stay in the hospital waiting room. That's just our own filter on it. 

[Kassia]

12 minutes ago, ktgrok said:

] I'd definitely explore the idea that he lacks empathy vs doesn't express it the same way as other people. 

] but really....they are not WRONG. And they DO care - they just don't feel the need to act illogically just because they care. The kid wanting pancakes appeared selfish...but when you pick it apart, him wanting pancakes didn't mean he cared less than people wanting to stay in the hospital waiting room. That's just our own filter on it. 

Thank you for offering such a different perspective on things.  It's really nice to get other viewpoints - especially when it comes to behaviors in your own children that you are disappointed in.  ❤️

[Catwoman]

9 hours ago, Kassia said:

Thanks everyone!  Your advice was very helpful (as always).

Sent the text and got a "Happy New Year" reply from gf.  Glad I sent something and relieved I heard back.  🙂

YAY!!! You must be so relieved!

 

1 hour ago, Kassia said:

Hmm...this is something to think about.  He doesn't really have any other qualities of ASD other than a disturbing lack of empathy.  I do have a son on the spectrum who does express appreciation for things, though.  

But ds1 has told us many times that he doesn't like gifts.  He certainly enjoys thoughtful gifts we give him but he doesn't like gifts just given because it's his birthday or Christmas or whatever.  And there are certain things I know he likes and those are always hits.  He's delighted with some gifts. 

ETA:  his gf never thanks us for anything unless it's in person.  she doesn't acknowledge any gifts we send at all.  

 

 

I might think that if this were an isolated incident, but she does have a history of creating drama.  I always feel appreciative that she comes to stay with us since we obviously cause her a lot of stress and we drive her crazy after a while, so I am understanding if/when she has a meltdown.  She's even done it on family vacations when she and ds1 have had their own rooms and the freedom to do whatever activities they wanted all day.  Eventually, we must make her crazy but I accept that because I'm grateful that they join us at all.

 

Have you ever considered the possibility that it's not you, it's her?

What I mean is, maybe she has meltdowns all the time, and the fact that she melts down when she's with your family has less to do with being with your family than it does with the fact that she is a person who has frequent meltdowns. You're assuming it's you because you're seeing it when she's with you... but that may not be the case at all. 

Obviously, I'm not suggesting that you shouldn't try to make her comfortable when she's with you. I'm just saying it might not even be possible if she is a very anxious person and doesn't have a handle on how to manage her stress levels. So do what you can do to help her, but try not to point the finger at yourselves for being the cause of her meltdowns and drama. 

[ktgrok]

22 minutes ago, Kassia said:

Thank you for offering such a different perspective on things.  It's really nice to get other viewpoints - especially when it comes to behaviors in your own children that you are disappointed in.  ❤️

Well, it seems hard to believe someone who is showing as much empathy as you are had a kid with none, you know? I think most people have it, barring trauma stuff that has caused them to shut down. 

[Kassia]

Thanks, @Catwoman  I do know that she tends to get anxious and overwhelmed easily (I'm the same way).  But she's brave enough to come and stay with us and I do appreciate that a lot and keep that in mind when she does cause drama.  I couldn't do that with my own in-laws but they were really mean to me (and DH).  I always try to be welcoming and friendly and hope that she feels that from me.  I always longed for a close relationship with her but she's always been very aloof with me.  I got the impression that she's close with her own mom and just doesn't desire a better relationship with me.  It hurts, but it is what it is.  We have nothing in common either except that we both love ds1.  

 

 

Edited January 1, 2022 by Kassia

[Kassia]

5 minutes ago, ktgrok said:

Well, it seems hard to believe someone who is showing as much empathy as you are had a kid with none, you know? I think most people have it, barring trauma stuff that has caused them to shut down. 

He's been that way since he was a kid.  I remember telling DH that we could be dying of thirst on the ground and he would step over us with a big cup of water and not offer us a sip.  Sad, but true.  I just have to accept him the way he is and be pleasantly surprised when he does act thoughtful or kind or whatever because it's so unexpected (but it does happen!).  I've seen him that way with gf too - I don't know how she puts up with him.

ETA  my other kids (esp. my twin sons) are SO darn sweet and nice.  It's weird how different they are all! 

Edited January 1, 2022 by Kassia

[ktgrok]

Just now, Kassia said:

He's been that way since he was a kid.  I remember telling DH that we could be dying of thirst on the ground and he would step over us with a big cup of water and not offer us a sip.  Sad, but true.  I just have to accept him the way he is and be pleasantly surprised when he does act thoughtful or kind or whatever because it's so unexpected (but it does happen!).  I've seen him that way with gf too - I don't know how she puts up with him.

I'd definitely lean toward spectrum, just a different presentation, given it has always been that way AND you have a family history of it! 

Also don't downplay ADHD type stuff - some people just don't NOTICE the needs of others. It isn't ignoring them if you don't even really notice or register them, you know?

[Kassia]

2 minutes ago, ktgrok said:

I'd definitely lean toward spectrum, just a different presentation, given it has always been that way AND you have a family history of it! 

Also don't downplay ADHD type stuff - some people just don't NOTICE the needs of others. It isn't ignoring them if you don't even really notice or register them, you know?

Thank you so much!  I've always just assumed it's selfishness/coldness but maybe there's another explanation...I'll have to look into it.

[Lanny]

When your thread began I thought about suggesting to you that you suggest to them that they do not return directly to your house after the big shindig with so many people. Possibly they should have waited a week or 2 before coming to your house.   Seems rude but they didn't seem to care about the health of the people in your house at all, so that is quite rude of them.

I think you wrote that your DD 19 had Pfizer but more than 6 months ago. She should get a booster. Pfizer is IMO the best. (DW and I had AstraZeneca, which possibly was produced in a factory in the USA, under FDA supervision there, but it isn't administered in the USA)

I think you wrote that your DS had the Janssen (J&J) vaccine. One of my cousins in California had that last April 1st.  April Fools Day.  He should move away from Janssen ASAP IMO...

And the girlfriend has had 2 jabs of Moderna or something but no Booster and it has been more than 6 months? She should get a Booster.

[Kassia]

54 minutes ago, Lanny said:

When your thread began I thought about suggesting to you that you suggest to them that they do not return directly to your house after the big shindig with so many people. Possibly they should have waited a week or 2 before coming to your house.   Seems rude but they didn't seem to care about the health of the people in your house at all, so that is quite rude of them.

I think you wrote that your DD 19 had Pfizer but more than 6 months ago. She should get a booster. Pfizer is IMO the best. (DW and I had AstraZeneca, which possibly was produced in a factory in the USA, under FDA supervision there, but it isn't administered in the USA)

I think you wrote that your DS had the Janssen (J&J) vaccine. One of my cousins in California had that last April 1st.  April Fools Day.  He should move away from Janssen ASAP IMO...

And the girlfriend has had 2 jabs of Moderna or something but no Booster and it has been more than 6 months? She should get a Booster.

Dd refuses a booster (I've begged)

Ds1 had Moderna booster after J&J.

gf knows she should get boosted but hasn't yet.  I specifically asked ds1 about this before their visit and he didn't answer.  I didn't find out until they were already here - I assumed she got it.  

They couldn't come later since they were doing a two week road trip but they should have spent the first week here and then gone to gf's house for the big party and stayed there after the party was over.  That's what they did last year.  They chose to do it this way this year because gf's mom had the first week of their trip off from work so gf wanted more time with her.  It was just very poor planning and communication.  

 

[ktgrok]

2 hours ago, Kassia said:

Thank you so much!  I've always just assumed it's selfishness/coldness but maybe there's another explanation...I'll have to look into it.

I was considered a snob by most people all my life - turns out I have face blindness and social anxiety and ADHD so didn't recognize people, or if I did I didn't remember their name anyway, so was just avoiding talking to people. But no one really got that, they thought I was a snob and just didn't want to be their friend. It taught me that behavior is NOT always a clue to motive. 

[Kassia]

@ktgrokthank you so much for sharing this.  I need to keep this in mind when judging ds1 and also other people...

 

 

[Catwoman]

10 minutes ago, ktgrok said:

I was considered a snob by most people all my life - turns out I have face blindness and social anxiety and ADHD so didn't recognize people, or if I did I didn't remember their name anyway, so was just avoiding talking to people. But no one really got that, they thought I was a snob and just didn't want to be their friend. It taught me that behavior is NOT always a clue to motive. 

I am glad you posted this, because it’s such a good reminder to those of us (myself included) who might misjudge someone without even thinking of the things you mentioned!