Not making the team - Dance - Talk us down from the ledge!

[Plagefille]

My DD has been dancing for 10 years at dance conservatory in many styles. Around age 9-10 she started taking multiple ballet classes a week and dancing 8-10 hours a week. (This is a common amount of studio time here. There are not pre-professional programs in town). She does not plan on becoming a professional dancer, but would like to dance in college and own a studio one day. She has been talking about owning a studio since she was like 8. Besides dancing on companies and teams at our studio, she has never auditioned for a dance company/team outside of our studio. She has however done many dance auditions for children's and community theater, and has been praised by many chorographers, although she has not always been cast. (Maybe that means she is a good dancer for a theater kid, but not a good dancer for a dancer?)

Our dance studio has been going downhill for a few years now and the pandemic has basically killed it. So we need a new dance studio or option, but only for 1 year before she leaves for college. Because of the decline in the studio, most of the girls my DD grew up dancing with are now on high school cheer, drill, and dance teams with there schools, which are not a option for my DD.

Recently, we were happy to here that the local Adult company decided to start a high school company along with extra classes focused on ballet and contemporary, my DD best styles. Also, her main ballet teacher from our studio teaches for the Adult company, so she would still get to see her. The company is starting in conjunction with a local charter school, but it is not officially associated with the school, just using some of their teachers and space.  A few of my DD studio friends (along with most of the girls who auditioned for the company) grew up going to that charter school and auditioned for the company with my DD. My DD was excited about the option to still dance with her friends.

Well, my DD thought she did great at auditions, especially compared to others' ballet technique. Also, they were taking 80% of those who auditioned. They were also told that availability would be important. DD's schedule is wide open and most, if not all, other girls who auditioned are on high school drill teams that limit their availability. We really thought DD would make it.

Well, she was shocked to not make it. DD's main ballet teacher was very surprised she didn't make the team. And now it is making us question her life plan! 

She is planning on an open enrollment dance college program, but she would like to audition for college companies and shows. But now we wonder if she is really not very good. And if she can't make any of the college shows/companies than she wonders if she really wants to pursue this path. We know she shouldn't change her dream because of one failed audition, but it is hard to feel positive right now.

So, she now has no where to dance, and no friends who aren't busy with other stuff.

The company she didn't make did say she could take all the technique classes with the company, just not the company class or be in the shows. But, because of all the conflicts the drill team girls have (and what we know of the girls' past attendance at our studio) they are likely to miss a number of classes and my DD will be there every day. It just seems like setting her up for hurt feelings.

Most other studios in town are competition focused and don't have good  ballet technique, so it really only leaves her with one other studio option. So I guess she will probably go there or not at all? We are feeling really negative here right now. So any positive thoughts would help.

 

 

 

 

[Farrar]

First, what a let down! I'm so sorry for you dd!

Dance can be rough. And sometimes it can be really random seeming. My ballet dancer has had some rejections that we were shocked by and some acceptances that we were shocked by - sometimes in the same year in back to back auditions where he got into the "better" program and rejected by the "worse" one.

Surely she has had some training outside this studio though? I hope? Summer intensives elsewhere? Or at least competitions? I guess I'm thinking... just bluntly... if she's never been evaluated as a dancer specifically by a variety of programs, then maybe she is missing key things for her level. But if she has done other programs or competitions, then perhaps this was just a weird fluke.

Regardless, if she wants to stay the course, I'd say she should try to get some outside training very soon.

[mommyoffive]

8 minutes ago, Plagefille said:

My DD has been dancing for 10 years at dance conservatory in many styles. Around age 9-10 she started taking multiple ballet classes a week and dancing 8-10 hours a week. (This is a common amount of studio time here. There are not pre-professional programs in town). She does not plan on becoming a professional dancer, but would like to dance in college and own a studio one day. She has been talking about owning a studio since she was like 8. Besides dancing on companies and teams at our studio, she has never auditioned for a dance company/team outside of our studio. She has however done many dance auditions for children's and community theater, and has been praised by many chorographers, although she has not always been cast. (Maybe that means she is a good dancer for a theater kid, but not a good dancer for a dancer?)

Our dance studio has been going downhill for a few years now and the pandemic has basically killed it. So we need a new dance studio or option, but only for 1 year before she leaves for college. Because of the decline in the studio, most of the girls my DD grew up dancing with are now on high school cheer, drill, and dance teams with there schools, which are not a option for my DD.

Recently, we were happy to here that the local Adult company decided to start a high school company along with extra classes focused on ballet and contemporary, my DD best styles. Also, her main ballet teacher from our studio teaches for the Adult company, so she would still get to see her. The company is starting in conjunction with a local charter school, but it is not officially associated with the school, just using some of their teachers and space.  A few of my DD studio friends (along with most of the girls who auditioned for the company) grew up going to that charter school and auditioned for the company with my DD. My DD was excited about the option to still dance with her friends.

Well, my DD thought she did great at auditions, especially compared to others' ballet technique. Also, they were taking 80% of those who auditioned. They were also told that availability would be important. DD's schedule is wide open and most, if not all, other girls who auditioned are on high school drill teams that limit their availability. We really thought DD would make it.

Well, she was shocked to not make it. DD's main ballet teacher was very surprised she didn't make the team. And now it is making us question her life plan! 

She is planning on an open enrollment dance college program, but she would like to audition for college companies and shows. But now we wonder if she is really not very good. And if she can't make any of the college shows/companies than she wonders if she really wants to pursue this path. We know she shouldn't change her dream because of one failed audition, but it is hard to feel positive right now.

So, she now has no where to dance, and no friends who aren't busy with other stuff.

The company she didn't make did say she could take all the technique classes with the company, just not the company class or be in the shows. But, because of all the conflicts the drill team girls have (and what we know of the girls' past attendance at our studio) they are likely to miss a number of classes and my DD will be there every day. It just seems like setting her up for hurt feelings.

Most other studios in town are competition focused and don't have good  ballet technique, so it really only leaves her with one other studio option. So I guess she will probably go there or not at all? We are feeling really negative here right now. So any positive thoughts would help.

 

 

 

 

No, you shouldn't change her dream because of one audition.  All of my kids dance, so I have a little experience.  My oldest is a bit younger than your dd.   I am sorry that this happened to her.  The disappointment from auditioning does suck.  Weather it be for a level, show, or intensive.  You just have to get used to it though.  

This studio is the only place to consider?  Or do you have one other one?      If this is the only one and she wants to dance do it.  You never know what is going to happen in a month or two.  She would be getting great training and it could open doors later.  Maybe a spot opens up.  Maybe she joins the adult company in a year.  Maybe she focuses more and trains more and comes back stronger from the dedication put in.

It think it is normal to get down when you get a rejection from an audition.  But usually it ends up being a good thing in a way.  Dance is so subjective.  Even if she did well that day they might have been looking for something else.  Size of person.  You just don't know.  It makes you question everything, but you really have to train your mind to not do that.  

Is there anywhere else she can train?   We drive 1 plus hour one way for dance in non Covid times 6-7 days a week.  Not ideal but for a year doable.

Can she take virtual classes?  There are so many amazing places teaching these. 

Could she do private lessons? 

Is she doing a summer intensive right now?   

 

[teachermom2834]

I am really not very informed on all this dance stuff. My dd does dance very recreationally, but I know kids planning to try to go professional and basically I am around it a lot even though for my own dd we are not serious or pursuing a college dance or dance career path.

A couple thoughts- I have heard over and over through the years whenever kids change studios how they are set back levels, have bad habits to break etc. I think there is often truth to that and kids going to a better studio from a rec studio are going to be behind. However, it also seems like the natural inclination of teachers/studio owners to pick apart students from other studios. So I don’t know if this is the situation but maybe? 
 

I don’t know much about college dance programs but I do know our state flagship has multiple dance clubs/teams/troupes that are open to all comers. I know some kids that grew up dancing and enjoyed that experience.

Also, as far as owning a studio goes, I don’t think she has to change that goal based on her skill, even if it truly is lacking from what she thought that it was. I have known multiple studio owners with limited dance experience. My dd’s current studio owner danced locally through high school and then started teaching at the school she grew up in and then opened her own studio. She never did anything super impressive. I know another owner with the same story. An owner of a previous studio really was just a fan of the arts. None of the studio owners in our town have any kind of impressive personal dance experience to brag about. So I don’t think this negates that goal at all. 
 

I can understand being gutted and disappointed by this experience. As I always tell my kids there is no accounting for what goes into the decisions of any committee or hiring manager, etc. You never really know what is going on behind the scenes or what biases are at work. 
 

 

 

[mommyoffive]

3 minutes ago, Farrar said:

First, what a let down! I'm so sorry for you dd!

Dance can be rough. And sometimes it can be really random seeming. My ballet dancer has had some rejections that we were shocked by and some acceptances that we were shocked by - sometimes in the same year in back to back auditions where he got into the "better" program and rejected by the "worse" one.

Surely she has had some training outside this studio though? I hope? Summer intensives elsewhere? Or at least competitions? I guess I'm thinking... just bluntly... if she's never been evaluated as a dancer specifically by a variety of programs, then maybe she is missing key things for her level. But if she has done other programs or competitions, then perhaps this was just a weird fluke.

Regardless, if she wants to stay the course, I'd say she should try to get some outside training very soon.

Yep, same here.  Very confusing sometimes.  It is hard to understand.  Dh and I were athletes so you know who won the contest by the score or the clock.  With dance it isn't like that at all. 

[Farrar]

Just now, mommyoffive said:

Yep, same here.  Very confusing sometimes.  It is hard to understand.  Dh and I were athletes so you know who won the contest by the score or the clock.  With dance it isn't like that at all. 

I get it in the abstract - Every dancer has strengths and weaknesses in both technique and artistry. And every studio has things they're willing to "fix" and things they're not, and it's not the same thing. Like, some studios really value specific body types and others don't care. But on the ground, it's always confusing. Like, you got a full ride to which internationally famous SI and you got rejected from the midsize city you auditioned for as a backup? Say what?

In the case of the OP, I have to say... this isn't like getting evaluated by SAB or something. This is some random small town dancers whose knowledge is at a level corresponding to their position as people starting a studio. As in, it's probably fine and they might have a lot to teach your dd, but also, maybe they don't know everything.

Also, since it's dance and it's a dance team... is there a chance that this is related to her body? Not even necessarily in an unhealthy weight way, but some dancers want specific heights and so forth or want a specific range. Like, is it possible this is a combination of preference for the girls they know coupled with having already filled the "slots" for her height? When ds has auditioned for professional performances, that's typically the number one reason dancers get rejected.

[mommyoffive]

6 minutes ago, teachermom2834 said:

I am really not very informed on all this dance stuff. My dd does dance very recreationally, but I know kids planning to try to go professional and basically I am around it a lot even though for my own dd we are not serious or pursuing a college dance or dance career path.

A couple thoughts- I have heard over and over through the years whenever kids change studios how they are set back levels, have bad habits to break etc. I think there is often truth to that and kids going to a better studio from a rec studio are going to be behind. However, it also seems like the natural inclination of teachers/studio owners to pick apart students from other studios. So I don’t know if this is the situation but maybe? 
 

I don’t know much about college dance programs but I do know our state flagship has multiple dance clubs/teams/troupes that are open to all comers. I know some kids that grew up dancing and enjoyed that experience.

Also, as far as owning a studio goes, I don’t think she has to change that goal based on her skill, even if it truly is lacking from what she thought that it was. I have known multiple studio owners with limited dance experience. My dd’s current studio owner danced locally through high school and then started teaching at the school she grew up in and then opened her own studio. She never did anything super impressive. I know another owner with the same story. An owner of a previous studio really was just a fan of the arts. None of the studio owners in our town have any kind of impressive personal dance experience to brag about. So I don’t think this negates that goal at all. 
 

I can understand being gutted and disappointed by this experience. As I always tell my kids there is no accounting for what goes into the decisions of any committee or hiring manager, etc. You never really know what is going on behind the scenes or what biases are at work. 
 

 

 

I agree on the being a studio owner and not having high flying dance experience.  I don't think that is something you have to have.  We have been at rec level places and private studios where the owners did not have big dance experience.  

We have seen and heard different things when people change studios and we have experienced it too.  Most of the places we have changed to it has been a positive going from one to another.  They didn't put my kids back a level or anything like that.  Now some places teach a different style of ballet so that was a change from the style that the were doing.  So they had to change and relearn things.  But I think it makes them a better dancer when they know more than one style of ballet.   We have heard of some owners being really mean to people who switch studios.  

[Plagefille]

She has done some other training. Mostly the local dance festival and Master Classes. She has also done some virtual classes. The year before Covid she auditioned and was in a ballet production at a studio an hour away, but we did not want to make that a long term thing Plus they don't do other styles. She also did competitions one year because our studio thought it would be a good experience for the girls her age.

She planned on doing a SI at one of the colleges she wants to go to, but the year she planned on going they cancelled the program. Then there was Covid. And this year we looked around but none of the colleges she wants to go to do a SI and she doesn't want to be a professional ballerina so I didn't really look at the professional companies that are a reasonable distance away. In this area not very many dancers go to SI.

Height could definitely be a factor. She is almost 5'11". It has definitely hurt her abilities to get parts in some theater productions. But her height was an asset in one production.

We are thinking of just doing the other ballet focused studio in town. They have some good teachers she has done other stuff with. And they teach a variety of styles. We just have avoided them for years because of their large classes sizes and the school/factory like environment. Levels are determined more by age then by skill level. But at her age now it probably won't matter.

 

[Plagefille]

59 minutes ago, mommyoffive said:

I agree on the being a studio owner and not having high flying dance experience.  I don't think that is something you have to have.  We have been at rec level places and private studios where the owners did not have big dance experience.  

We have seen and heard different things when people change studios and we have experienced it too.  Most of the places we have changed to it has been a positive going from one to another.  They didn't put my kids back a level or anything like that.  Now some places teach a different style of ballet so that was a change from the style that the were doing.  So they had to change and relearn things.  But I think it makes them a better dancer when they know more than one style of ballet.   We have heard of some owners being really mean to people who switch studios.  

Thanks. That's what I keep telling myself. It is just that all the teachers she has worked with do have great resumes. But definitely many of the other studios in town have less skilled teachers. Really, she mostly wants to be a mother and raise her kids, so a small simple studio is more what she wants anyway.

[Farrar]

She's a rising senior now? Or junior?

Professional studio SI's aren't just for kids aiming to go professional - they also look great on a kid's resume in applying to colleges. Plus, they do a great job of preparing kids to succeed in college auditions. I know you're saying that she'll do an open enrollment school, but if she's even thinking about some slightly more competitive programs, then this would be a way to prepare. Or just preparing future dancers for success in general. To be a successful studio owner or dance teacher, she should seek out as many dance experiences as possible while they're available to her.

[Farrar]

Adding... if dance is what brings her joy and she wants a small time career teaching dance, running a studio, maybe working at a studio... I really don't think she should give it up. Dance is for everyone. And hopefully her experiences at this other studio that you're looking at will be more positive.

[teachermom2834]

Just a thought on the studio ownership angle- there is totally a market, imo, for a sweet recreational studio. I have a dd who loves to dance and it is a positive activity for her and I am happy to support it. I haven't really cared much about the credentials of the owners and teachers. I have cared about the atmosphere, body positivity, age appropriate music/dancing/costumes, calm low drama/reasonable cost recitals, lack of emphasis on competition, etc. My dd has been part of some fun and creative recitals and is in pretty good physical shape, and been able to express herself creatively. 

I have actually paid more for her to attend this kind of recreational studio than some people do for more intense training. But that is where our priorities were. She just now, at 13 yo, is wanting to experience a little bit more intensity. She is attending a couple local intensives this summer to stretch her wings and see what else she might want to do. It's too late for her to ever become a serious advanced dancer but I don't regret at all the time spent in a couple of purely recreational studios. It was as right for her as intense training is for others. So I don't think your dd has to give up on her dream at all and I also think she can be very successful. We actually left one recreational studio because it became too large and too expensive. So there is a career to be had without a fabulous dance resume. 

[Kanin]

Classes for adults are important, too. I'd like to get back into taking ballet classes, but the place near me looks a bit intimidating. Somewhere a bit more chill with a good teacher would be amazing.

I took ballet classes in college and I had the most amazing teachers. It was so good for my physical, mental, and emotional health. I loved my teachers, and was so impressed that they chose to teach people like me instead of doing something more fancy. 

[Dmmetler]

When I restarted my studio, after a multi-year hiatus due to homeschooling, I also changed from a University school of music prep department, where even parents of preschoolers were very goal focused on getting their kids into a good college, to a community rec center. The difference is night and day. It is just so much more FUN to teach when people are there to enjoy and have a good time, and yes, that means there is a place for adult beginners, adults who took lessons years ago and want to come back, teen beginners, etc. My most recent project is to work on developing winds classes and a community music program for senior adults who either played years ago and want to play again, or who want to learn something new. There is definitely a place for rec programs-and I know that dance, along with music and visual art, is one of the programs that my center prioritizes having available and has dedicated studio space for. 

 

I will say that rec doesn't necessarily pay as well as pre-pro, but at the same time, it is far easier to juggle around a family and other responsibilities, because parents understand "I can teach Tuesday and Thursday, because my kid has cheer on Monday, Weds and we have to leave weekends free for travel", while at the pre-pro school, parents definitely assumed that your top priority was their child, even over your own children and spouse. 

 

On the audition results, in my area, certain dance schools (and cheer gyms) are essentially feeders for a specific school's dance or cheer team, and tend to support that, even in their elite teams/companies that are high school aged kids. Even if auditions do not have a policy of favoring those kids, being a known quantity (and having your schedule be a known quantity, where they KNOW which kids will be out due to dance team at school, while kids from other schools will have a different schedule) is a big plus. It can be very frustrating to homeschoolers, especially. 

 

[SKL]

Couple questions.

1) Can you/she ask for feedback about the reasons why her skills were not what was wanted?

2) Can she try again after working on specific skills they didn't see?