how to increase processing speed?

[Miguelsmom]

Other then accommodations what can help increase processing speed?  

[Storygirl]

https://www.understood.org/en/learning-attention-issues/child-learning-disabilities/information-processing-issues/can-processing-speed-ever-improve

There are some helpful ideas in that link.

DS15's processing speed has improved a lot over the last three years. However, he had nowhere to go but up, as his processing speed was less than the first percentile. (not a typo-- less than 1% compared to peers).  It's now the 7th percentile, which seems like a minor change, but represents something like a 40 point increase in his raw score.

And what did we do to improve it? Nothing. Except that he is a drummer and plays bass guitar and also runs. I do think that the countless hours that he spent on those activities over these years made a difference for him.

Some people on the boards have tried Interactive Metronome therapy, which can be done through occupational therapy but evidently is expensive.

Ha! Interesting. I googled and found an article plugging Interactive Metronome that compares the program's benefit to the benefits of playing the drums. https://www.interactivemetronome.com/let-the-drummer-kick.html

DS15 is very committed to music and typically practices for several hours per day. I see a therapeutic impact for him, without a doubt. But I will say that he is more intense about practicing than most kids would be.

 

 

Edited July 4, 2019 by Storygirl

[Storygirl]

@Miguelsmom has your child had testing by a psych who says the tests show slow processing speed? If so, it may help you to understand how those test scores are determined, and I can tell you a little more about that. There is more than one kind of issue that might be present that can cause low processing speed scores.

Or are you asking out of observation, because you see evidence of slow thinking? If that is the case, you might get some more helpful answers if you describe the specific kind of things that you observe.

[Miguelsmom]

13 minutes ago, Storygirl said:

has your child had testing by a psych who says the tests show slow processing speed?

Not yet, I was asking how to improve his test scores and how he takes 3+times longer to do anything. Someone mentioned processing speed may be slowed. What I've read it sounds like him. He's always taken hours to do things that should take 15 min. We would spend most of the day on Daily Grams when he was younger. Getting dressed takes him about a half hour or longer even if his clothes are set out. Bathroom takes him well over an hour. This wasn't even on our radar. He gets good grades and is in dual enrollment but everything takes him so long to do. We've tried setting timers but all that does is raises his anxiety. Even "rushing" is slow. We always just did modifications our self and were setting it up so college wasn't as stressful. Now that we know the name I can ask questions (and I have a ton.) I do plan to talk to his Dr about this but I for now I'm looking for ways to help him without accommodations. 

[PeterPan]

We've had a few stories on the board of people doing Interactive Metronome and having processing speed scores go from single digits to 30s for percentile. As Story says, when it's that low, an increase that leaves the dc in disability range relative to overall IQ is still a HUGE improvement. 

If he's doing DE, are you wanting psych testing and a paper trail to get accommodations? He may need them and he would definitely qualify for extended time on testing. Even if he's getting by now, having it in college will be essential. My dd uses her accommodations (limited distraction testing, extended time, etc.) for all her classes at the university, and she's a good student. She just needs that time for things to come out.

If he qualifies under ADHD, the meds seem to bump processing speed. At least my dd says they does. I don't have data on that, just saying how it seems to her.

You can develop what they call splinter skills, where you improve the processing of one particular thing by working on it and doing therapy for it. So you can improve visual processing speed for instance, yes. But if his overall processing speed is low, it's probably brain speed and not something you're going to "fix." Dyslexic Advantage by the Eides goes into the spacing of the mini columns. 

[Miguelsmom]

12 minutes ago, PeterPan said:

If he's doing DE, are you wanting psych testing and a paper trail to get accommodations?

 We're hoping to have accommodations if he qualifies and proper medication. He does well in school but he takes an enormous amount of time to get anything done. 

[PeterPan]

Yup. You can check to see if in your state the ps will write an IEP/504 when you're not enrolled. Our state will not. They're obligated to *eval* under federal law, but the writing of a 504 is the next step, more hours, and decided by states and sometimes decided at the district level. IF your ps would write a 504, it would be handy legal paper trail to have. If not, get a really kick butt private eval and take that documentation to college, definitely.

Yeah, you'll just have to try things. My dd's processing speed was in the 30s, so she fatigues easily, carries a reduced load, etc. She subjectively feels like the meds help her processing speed, which they probably do. And I wish I could say yeah xyz will fix it, but I have no evidence on that. The only data I've seen with overall processing speed going up was those super low kids who bumped with interactive metronome. If $$$ metronome is not your pricepoint, Heathermomster has posted instructions on how to do a hack version at home for free. You never know and the price would be right.

[Miguelsmom]

The school does not do a 504 plan for homeschoolers. I tried a couple years ago. We're getting him re-evaluated for ADHD privately Do I just ask what his processing speed is too? We use to have a metronome but I don't know if we still have I'll look. How reduced is her course load?

[Storygirl]

An ADHD evaluation will not test for processing speed. Depending on who you are seeing for the ADHD evaluation, they may be able to also do additional testing, but it would also cost extra. The standard test is called WISC and is run by an educational psychologist. The WISC is an IQ test, and it produces several subscores, of which the processing speed is one.

Private testing is expensive. Testing through the public school is free. Even if your school will not write a 504, they are required by law to evaluate ALL students who are suspected of having a disability and give you the test results.

The key is convincing them that there is a problem significant enough that they have to evaluate. If you can have whomever does the ADHD evaluation write a letter for you to give to the school, stating that other learning issues are a concern and need to be evaluated, that letter can serve as the proof that the school needs to do the other testing.

That is, as long as your son is still age 18 or under and has not yet graduated from high school. And you need to request the evaluations in writing, not a phone call. If you decide to do this, there are ways to learn about the process, so that you know what to do.

Here is a link about testing processing speed:

https://www.additudemag.com/slow-processing-speed-test-evaluation-diagnosis/

[PeterPan]

1 hour ago, Miguelsmom said:

The school does not do a 504 plan for homeschoolers. I tried a couple years ago. We're getting him re-evaluated for ADHD privately Do I just ask what his processing speed is too? We use to have a metronome but I don't know if we still have I'll look. How reduced is her course load?

The processing speed will be in the IQ testing. 

You can try a metronome app. You can download one for free.

The psych suggested 14 hours. At this point all her classes are 3 hours each, so that means either 12 or 15. She has done 15, but the semester she tried that along with multiple on-campus offices she was constantly sick. So 12 is more healthy for her when she's doing other things as well.

[Lecka]

This is my understanding of getting improvement rom ADHD medication:  for some people, the slow speed is considered to be caused by ADHD, and improves with medication. 

It might seem just like slow speed from having a slow processing speed, but it won’t be considered “slow processing speed” if it is helped by ADHD medication. It will be considered having a slow speed because of difficulty focusing.

I don’t know if this is something they can tell from testing, or if it is something where if they see a need to recommend medication, then you find out what all the effects are when you try it.  

My impression is — if this is the main ADHD symptom, medication might not help much.  Or it might not help much, anyway.

If you see other symptoms of ADHD (or by chance), then there could be a huge improvement in speed in everyday life.  But — that won’t be considered “improved processing speed” because that is not how it is looked at technically.

So basically — I have heard of huge improvement in practical terms with ADHD medication, but I have also heard that if it’s not really an effect of ADHD, there is very little that can be done for it.

But I have also heard of improvement with age/development.

Here is the thing with that:  it is always impossible to know, without some kind of study, if that improvement with age/development is really just from age/development, or if it is from doing something that does improve it (like music/gymnastics like is mentioned).  

It makes sense for it to help, but it’s not officially a way to help, and — this is where you can hear “well some kids do improve with age/development,” but — nobody knows.

It’s kind-of always a frustrating thing, that sometimes you don’t know “did this therapy work?” or “did this practice work?” or, “this practice was done but really the improvement came from age/development.”  

It’s not possible to know, on a certain level.

On another level, if there was a way to have a study and that study has been done — maybe you could know.  But even that is not likely to be 100% because — it’s not likely to have a study that happens to be just like your life and just like your child.  

But anyway — that is just how it goes.  There can be a lot of doubt about whether a therapy caused improvement, or if the improvement was natural and occurred at the same time.  And this is how you can hear it both ways, with officially maybe there is no sense that “this led to that,” but it’s hard to tell what happened with any specific person.  

I have a lot of examples of this for my younger son..... he had reduced sensory issues at an age where quite a few kids have reduced sensory issues because of age/development.  He also did a lot of OT-type stuff to work with his sensory issues.  So did the OT-type stuff work for him (specifically for him), or did he grow out of it, and would have grown out of it regardless?  There’s no way to know in one case — as far as it being official.  But there’s no way to know it wasn’t that, either.

That’s just one example but we have several like that, where officially it’s not known, and it’s basically just “how do you know?” And there isn’t an official way to know, because you can’t have it both ways, that your child went through certain ages with and without a therapy, and then you compare the two.  

But there is a point to where a lot of people will say — it makes sense for something to have helped, even if it’s impossible to have “proof.”  Or to then say — the same thing would help other kids in a predictable way.  

For something to be really recommended it has to help other kids in a predictable way, but not everything helpful works that way.  

[Miguelsmom]

8 hours ago, Storygirl said:

Private testing is expensive. Testing through the public school is free.

I'm going to call the testing center to see exactly what they are testing and see if they can test for learning disabilities too through our insurance. If not I will call the school and find out their process to get him tested.

 

8 hours ago, Storygirl said:

that letter can serve as the proof that the school needs to do the other testing.

I can have his different Dr.'s write several letters.

 

8 hours ago, Storygirl said:

 

That is, as long as your son is still age 18 or under and has not yet graduated from high school.

He just turned 17 and is a senior.

 

8 hours ago, PeterPan said:

The processing speed will be in the IQ testing. 

They maybe doing an IQ test because it's a 4 hr test. I have to call and find out.

 

8 hours ago, PeterPan said:

So 12 is more healthy for her when she's doing other things as well.

We're thinking of having him do 12 at a time too. That's the plan right now.

 

In our state it would be on us to get help. So there would be no OT just us trying to find tricks that help. We'll try the metronome but if I remember correctly he hated the noise but that was 12 years ago. 

[Heathermomster]

Universities, College Board, and ACT want to see very specific testing that the public school system does not typically provide, and they post their testing requirements on their official websites.  

OP, I don’t know of any way to increase processing speed. In fact, my son’s numbers have gone down; however, he works quicker now, and I attribute that fact to motivation, remediation, accommodation, and maturity.  At university, he receives extra test taking time and types his work. 

[Miguelsmom]

I don't think we'll be able to get SAT accommodations but we will be able to get college accommodations. IF the tests show there's an issue.  How do slower students do with working?

[PeterPan]

3 hours ago, Miguelsmom said:

They maybe doing an IQ test because it's a 4 hr test. I have to call and find out.

Yes, typical testing is 4-6 hours and includes IQ, achievement, and screening for things like ADHD, depression, SLDs, etc. 

3 hours ago, Miguelsmom said:

We'll try the metronome but if I remember correctly he hated the noise but that was 12 years ago. 

See what happens now. My ds at 5 couldn't clap to a metronome at all or even do a single clap but would just hyperclap really fast. So there definitely can be issues with the EF (executive function that controls the timing) but also the auditory processing, etc. So it gives you important data if it's still hard. Is anything else going on with his auditory processing?

3 hours ago, Miguelsmom said:

In our state it would be on us to get help. So there would be no OT just us trying to find tricks that help.

I don't understand what you're saying. If he's having sensory symptoms, an OT who works with teens would be happy to see him. If a dc is having sensory symptoms, a good OT eval where they get to talk about that can be extremely helpful. You don't even have to do therapy, just the eval process. If he's having sensory problems, it would be worth doing. It can put words to what he's feeling and make him more aware of how to problem solve. 

36 minutes ago, Miguelsmom said:

I don't think we'll be able to get SAT accommodations but we will be able to get college accommodations. IF the tests show there's an issue.  How do slower students do with working?

You should be able to get ACT/SAT accommodations for extended time once you have your documentation. 

Working? You mean like a job? LOL They're slow. So I know this guy who is the slowest human I've ever known. Bless his heart, he even talks more slowly than anybody I've EVER heard. He works a living wage job, does just fine. He's just not going to sign up to be an auctioneer or ER doctor. He needs time to process and get his thoughts out. 

The psych should do some career counseling, yes. It's part of what they'll do, looking at the tea leaves and making suggestions. Some will have career testing. If he's DE, he can go to that cc/univ and do career testing. I compelled my dd to do that thorough career testing before I let her pick a college. She was looking at two, one that was more liberal arts and one where she would have been going for a specialized program. She did the testing and realized what we had been telling her was true, that she had more facets and was not only ONE thing. She ended up going liberal arts to develop all her strengths, and she's having a good experience. She still likes that technical stuff (costuming), but she had more parts to develop. 

So yes, the cc/univ will do the career testing for free. You can probably do it this summer if the office is open. If he's DE, he's legally entitled to any services other students receive. 

[PeterPan]

2 hours ago, Heathermomster said:

Universities, College Board, and ACT want to see very specific testing that the public school system does not typically provide, and they post their testing requirements on their official websites.  

They're accepting 504/IEPs from the ps, which are based on the testing the ps does. 

Typical ADHD testing with no SLDs on the table is only 1-2 hours. It's not like so much is necessary.

As far as the cost, going through a hospital is 3X the cost of private. You can get a straight ADHD, no SLDs, eval around here for $1k. It goes up when you're wanting neuropsych, more hours, etc. It's all in how many hours it bills, but private bills lower than hospital, definitely. If you're paying for it yourself, it's the thing to watch out for. We have an HSA, so we could never afford hospital evals, mercy.

[Miguelsmom]

2 minutes ago, PeterPan said:

Is anything else going on with his auditory processing?

Honestly he's had so many dx we have no idea what's going on. This will be his second evaluation. He had one about 8 years ago. I don't believe he's ever been tested for a learning disability. He's always been "ahead" even though it takes him all day. He's the one pushing to get tested to find out what's really going on with him. I'm worried because one place said 6 hrs and the other said 4 hrs but the 6 hour place is an hour away and a 6+ month waiting list. The 4 hr one is right here and sees him at the end of the month.

 

32 minutes ago, PeterPan said:

If a dc is having sensory symptoms, a good OT eval where they get to talk about that can be extremely helpful. You don't even have to do therapy, just the eval process. If he's having sensory problems, it would be worth doing.

He has some SPD symptoms (i just looked them up) What I was saying is OT is usually through the school system and because we home school we don't qualify. It's unlikely our insurance will pay for an OT evaluation.

 

42 minutes ago, PeterPan said:

You should be able to get ACT/SAT accommodations for extended time once you have your documentation.

We will try but it looks really complicated.

49 minutes ago, PeterPan said:

the cc/univ will do the career testing for free.

He knows what he wants to do but his pace may be an issue with bosses. 

 

52 minutes ago, PeterPan said:

. If he's DE, he's legally entitled to any services other students receive.

That's good to know.

[PeterPan]

3 hours ago, Miguelsmom said:

Honestly he's had so many dx we have no idea what's going on. This will be his second evaluation. He had one about 8 years ago. I don't believe he's ever been tested for a learning disability. He's always been "ahead" even though it takes him all day. He's the one pushing to get tested to find out what's really going on with him. I'm worried because one place said 6 hrs and the other said 4 hrs but the 6 hour place is an hour away and a 6+ month waiting list. The 4 hr one is right here and sees him at the end of the month.

Unfortunately sometimes the wait is a big clue as to who is doing a better job. Not always. 

3 hours ago, Miguelsmom said:

We will try but it looks really complicated.

Try both tests and do the one he scores better on. My dd did well enough on the ACT + meds that we didn't need to bother with accommodations. You can do the practice tests and see what difference the extended time will make. In her case it would have bumped her math 1 point and math was such a small component that we just gave up.

[kbutton]

18 hours ago, PeterPan said:

If he qualifies under ADHD, the meds seem to bump processing speed. At least my dd says they does. I don't have data on that, just saying how it seems to her.

 

12 hours ago, Lecka said:

This is my understanding of getting improvement rom ADHD medication:  for some people, the slow speed is considered to be caused by ADHD, and improves with medication. 

It might seem just like slow speed from having a slow processing speed, but it won’t be considered “slow processing speed” if it is helped by ADHD medication. It will be considered having a slow speed because of difficulty focusing.

I don’t know if this is something they can tell from testing, or if it is something where if they see a need to recommend medication, then you find out what all the effects are when you try it.  

My impression is — if this is the main ADHD symptom, medication might not help much.  Or it might not help much, anyway.

If you see other symptoms of ADHD (or by chance), then there could be a huge improvement in speed in everyday life.  But — that won’t be considered “improved processing speed” because that is not how it is looked at technically.

So basically — I have heard of huge improvement in practical terms with ADHD medication, but I have also heard that if it’s not really an effect of ADHD, there is very little that can be done for it.

I've seen a lot of low processing speed, ADHD, and combinations of the two in real life. It can be hard to see where one ends and the other begins. And as people have noted, it depends a LOT on what type of ADHD is involved, if the slow processing seems to be across the board, and if the processing is low by overall percentile or just relative to IQ. 

So, one of my favorite low processing speech people is a slow and steady kind of person who overall selects strategies that work for her, so she just has to keep at things to get them accomplished. Processing speed hasn't done her any favors, but it's also not a really big deal except when she did piecework at a factory. Then, she would make rate, but if she'd been faster, she'd have gotten a lot better pay. She probably does have ADHD, but it's more the impulsive type, maybe a little hyperactivity. Honestly, the hyperactivity probably helps her keep at things, lol!

One of my kids is a hot mess. Low processing speed objectively, very low relative to IQ, lots of motor issues, planning and sequencing issues, auditory processing issues (temporal processing specifically!), ADHD (combination of types) etc. But he's great with music, and like Storygirl's son, he does percussion (though he does a lot more with piano). I honestly think he would do everything steadier if I could install a metronome in his brain. Like several members of my husband's extended family, unless there is something going on to carry him forward, he gets mesmerized, and he just stops moving forward. Sometimes it seems like ADHD, sometimes it seems like processing. It's hard to tell. There are times though when one of my inlaws LITERALLY gets stuck much the way a record will skip and play a little the same words over and over. There are certain tasks that this person starts to do, and then they are stuck. They will do that task LONG PAST when it stopped being effective, and when they are stuck, they are also being very ineffective in that they've usually chosen a very, very poor strategy to do the task. It's excruciating to watch.

Then I have a couple of family members with relative processing deficits, and they can be slow or super efficient--it depends on the task. For one of them though, there are certain tasks where they know they can go into that stuck mode like I just mentioned, but they know it, and if they are thinking, they can stop themselves. They have come to realize (through other people being flabbergasted, honestly) that certain repetitive tasks make that happen, and they talk themselves into a better strategy/rhythm. It's pretty wild.

5 hours ago, Miguelsmom said:

How do slower students do with working?

Working and schooling, or just working?

Just working--they need to guard their time at work and not be overly social/distracted, actively seek out strategies that are efficient, consider their type of job carefully, or, if salaried and unable to change, plan to "live to work." I do know someone that has a hard time working less than 50-60 hours per week at a salaried job because they are inefficient, friendly, and a slow processor. 

Work plus school--be careful with number of hours for either. Try to find a job that will give some stress relief to add variety. If that works out, sometimes the job will actually be kind of refreshing and a break.

I do think that music is solid intervention. I do think that specific intervention for specific problems can improve things--there are too many times that my kids have done therapy for something, only to get a bump in processing, even if the therapy had NOTHING to do with processing, lol!!! 

ADHD meds can help, but it's hard to know under what conditions. I suspect that ADHD and slow processing are negatively synergistic, and meds can potentially keep one problem from exacerbating the other. But if they are manifesting relatively separately for a person, they probably don't do much for the processing itself.

That's my two cents, and it's truly mostly anecdotal.

[kbutton]

3 hours ago, Miguelsmom said:

He knows what he wants to do but his pace may be an issue with bosses. 

So much of this can be about how he handles it--what he says, how he responds, demonstrating that he's not wasting time, etc.

If he has an objective deficit, the school doesn't have to give him a 504 to get 504 accommodations in college and on the job. 504 provides federal guidelines for school and employment. It's intended to be protective. 

[PeterPan]

Slower thinkers can have a skill set that appeals to employers. It's not like every job should be done quickly. Someone who is slower, more pensive, who reflects, who thinks divergently, who is steady, etc. can be very employable. I have a relative like this, who talks slowly, needs time, and employers LOVE him. He went into accounting btw. So there it isn't his speed but his thoroughness, skill with people, etc. that makes him so valuable. 

That's something the evals should be doing is talking about his strengths, not just weaknesses, and giving you a sense of how they come together. It's interesting that he's asking for evals btw. He might need more than evals. After the evals, he might want sessions with a psych, educational therapist, whatever to work on EF skills, time management, emotional regulation, whatever is on his mind that he's seeing he has deficits in. That will be money well spent. 

[Miguelsmom]

5 hours ago, PeterPan said:

You can do the practice tests and see what difference the extended time will make.

I'll have him take an extended time practice. He tried an ACT practice and didn't like it.

 

5 hours ago, kbutton said:

"live to work."

He's much more of a "work to live" guy.

 

5 hours ago, kbutton said:

Work plus school--

We're going to avoid that if we can but financially we may not be able to avoid it.

5 hours ago, kbutton said:

music is solid intervention

  I like the idea of learning music for him.

5 hours ago, PeterPan said:

After the evals, he might want sessions with a psych, educational therapist, whatever to work on EF skills, time management, emotional regulation, whatever is on his mind that he's seeing he has deficits in.

Hopefully testing will be the first step to get him to where he wants to be.