California PSA folks

[shinyhappypeople]

When you apply to a college, do you apply as a homeschooler or as a private school?  Is there an advantage to presenting an applicant as one versus the other?

 

Just curious...  

 

FYI: PSA = Private School Affidavit.  One of the ways to teach your kids at home in CA is to file a PSA that establishes your home as a very tiny, super exclusive :) private school.  Legally, your child is a private school student and you, the parent, retain total control over everything.

[Arcadia]

Homeschool. The college app's school profile and student class rank would show homeschooling anyway. Besides my kids score reports has the homeschool clearinghouse as their high school name.

 

CollegeBoard's high school profile sample which is similar to my local schools high school profile on their webpages https://professionals.collegeboard.org/guidance/counseling/profile/sample

PSA filing starts October 1st this year.

 

The Canadian universities we visited and asked said to apply as homeschoolers because their expectations/perceptions are different for private school candidates. À la carte vs a more in the box choices.

 

My last name is not the same as my kids last name but I assumed it would still be obvious that I am the parent.

[learners4life]

We homeschooled via the PSA the whole way through.  College applications/transcripts were as a homeschool.

[shinyhappypeople]

We homeschooled via the PSA the whole way through.  College applications/transcripts were as a homeschool.

Did you apply to any CSU campuses?  How did you deal with a-g requirements?  

[Jilly]

We did PSA and we applied as homeschoolers. My son applied to the UC schools and not any Cal State schools. I have heard that it is harder for homeschoolers to gain admittance to CSU vs. UC schools. 

[quark]

Did you apply to any CSU campuses?  How did you deal with a-g requirements?  

 

The question was not directed at me. I just wanted to share that there are several ways to fulfill a-g as a homeschooler.

1. Look up approved courses on the Doorways website. You can perform either an Institution or Course search. https://hs-articulation.ucop.edu/agcourselist#/list/search/course
2. Create your own classes and validate them with SAT subject testing or AP (some students self study just for the exams without actually taking a full class).
3. Take community college classes. If you plug in the CC's name, the Doorways site will show a list of courses that are a-g approved.

My kiddo used a combination of the above but mostly went through the CC dual enrollment route. Like Jilly, I've heard that CSUs tend to be more picky about a-g.

[mirabillis]

My kiddo used a combination of the above but mostly went through the CC dual enrollment route. Like Jilly, I've heard that CSUs tend to be more picky about a-g.

 

wow, i'd never heard that before. ok, then UC or bust - LOL! ;-)

[shinyhappypeople]

We did PSA and we applied as homeschoolers. My son applied to the UC schools and not any Cal State schools. I have heard that it is harder for homeschoolers to gain admittance to CSU vs. UC schools. 

 

Well, crud.

 

Is there a way for a homeschool course to be seen as meeting a-g requirements or does it have to be an approved online course or dual-enrollment at the CC?

 

I've been doing net price calculators and dying a little inside.  CC and CSU are all we can reasonably afford.  Even the UC is out of our range.  I do not want her to saddle herself with student loans.  

 

This is for the 7th grader, btw (I'm planning ahead.  Don't judge.) The 9th grader has no interest in college, just wants to take art classes here and there.  At first this disappointed me a little.  Now, I'm kind of relieved.

[Arcadia]

Is there a way for a homeschool course to be seen as meeting a-g requirements or does it have to be an approved online course or dual-enrollment at the CC?

...

This is for the 7th grader, btw (I'm planning ahead. Don't judge.)

My current 8th grader knock of some of the a-g requirements through SAT subject tests and AP exams last year in 7th grade. He knock off two years of the math requirements, one lab science and an elective. So 7th grade is not too early to plan.

 

ETA:

For the sole purpose of checking the box, the SAT subject tests are much cheaper especially if your child takes three subject tests in one morning. We did AP exams for the subjects my kids are keen on.

Edited September 15, 2017 by Arcadia

[shinyhappypeople]

:cursing:

 

Searching the UC's a-g online course providers and many of the providers, like AoPS, have this: "Note: These courses are “a-g†approved for schools and districts to adopt onto their “a-g†approved courses lists and to teach at their local school sites. These courses are not "a-g" approved for individual students to directly enroll in or to complete through this online publisher."

 

Why the crap NOT?  Do they just not like homeschoolers?  

 

I don't like living in California on a good day.  This nonsense doesn't improve my opinion of my state.

[Roadrunner]

:cursing:

 

Searching the UC's a-g online course providers and many of the providers, like AoPS, have this: "Note: These courses are “a-g†approved for schools and districts to adopt onto their “a-g†approved courses lists and to teach at their local school sites. These courses are not "a-g" approved for individual students to directly enroll in or to complete through this online publisher."

 

Why the crap NOT? Do they just not like homeschoolers?

 

I don't like living in California on a good day. This nonsense doesn't improve my opinion of my state.

Whaaaaat? I was so hoping their geometry class was going to be it for a through g.

 

 

So if you homeschool through a charter school in CA, then it's a through g. But if you homeschool through private school, can't we say our private school adopted it as an a through g course? I mean why not? We are legally a private school, no? 😤

Edited September 15, 2017 by Roadrunner

[Arcadia]

Searching the UC's a-g online course providers and many of the providers, like AoPS, have this: "Note: These courses are “a-g†approved for schools and districts to adopt onto their “a-g†approved courses lists and to teach at their local school sites. These courses are not "a-g" approved for individual students to directly enroll in or to complete through this online publisher."

 

Why the crap NOT? Do they just not like homeschoolers?

My guess is that it has to do with no B&M teacher to oversee and especially no proctored exam.

 

Stanford Online High School has proctored exams and doesn't have that disclaimer note compare to AoPS.

https://hs-articulation.ucop.edu/agcourselist#/list/details/3799/

 

My 8th grader took the AP Calculus exam so we don't need the worry about AoPS calculus being not a-g approved for home use. He has opt to go for the validation by exam path if we apply to UC/CSU.

[Roadrunner]

My guess is that it has to do with no B&M teacher to oversee and especially no proctored exam.

 

Stanford Online High School has proctored exams and doesn't have that disclaimer note compare to AoPS.

https://hs-articulation.ucop.edu/agcourselist#/list/details/3799/

 

My 8th grader took the AP Calculus exam so we don't need the worry about AoPS calculus being not a-g approved for home use. He has opt to go for the validation by exam path if we apply to UC/CSU.

It's $4,500 per class for an online class! There isn't a chance in the world I can find that type of money to pay for one class! This is when free AP courses at local high school start to look extremely attractive to me. I mean Stanford Online High charges for one class almost the tuition for the entire year at the local CSU. I feel like if I had that type of money, I would refuse to pay on principle.

[Crimson Wife]

Did you apply to any CSU campuses?  How did you deal with a-g requirements?  

 

We are doing dual enrollment at the local community college in order to get around a-g. I didn't want to rely on standardized testing even though my DD is a good test-taker. She will meet the IGETC as part of her associate's degree.

 

[Arcadia]

Whaaaaat? I was so hoping their geometry class was going to be it for a through g.

AoPS Academy San Diego isn't in the UC a-g doorways system either. Maybe they might go for a-g approval in the future.

[quark]

Saying this from the PoV of someone whose kid did follow a lot of bunny trails in homeschooling but also validated with test scores and CC classes...plus, we were very cheap until kiddo desperately wanted to DE at the university. To add, I also moderate a small support group of families with UC hopefuls and accepted students...

 

Follow a-g to the extent you can but please don't let it control everything you do. There have been lots of exceptions among the homeschooling families I know. A-g is one part of the puzzle only. It really is things like test scores and gpa that attract the UC adcoms' attention first. Beef that up with good records, being complete in the application and explaining all the extra stuff in the comments boxes they provide. Provide as much info as your student can. Write good personal insight essays to explain other things that might have prevented them from following actual approved a-g classes. If you look up the application, there is no place to enter anything non a-g so go ahead and enter whatever classes completed as a-g and explain the homeschool scenario in the comments.

 

Go in and do a pretend application now. You'll see what I mean.

Edited September 15, 2017 by quark

[Jilly]

Saying this from the PoV of someone whose kid did follow a lot of bunny trails in homeschooling but also validated with test scores and CC classes...plus, we were very cheap until kiddo desperately wanted to DE at the university. To add, I also moderate a small support group of families with UC hopefuls and accepted students...

 

Follow a-g to the extent you can but please don't let it control everything you do. There have been lots of exceptions among the homeschooling families I know. A-g is one part of the puzzle only. It really is things like test scores and gpa that attract the UC adcoms' attention first. Beef that up with good records, being complete in the application and explaining all the extra stuff in the comments boxes they provide. Provide as much info as your student can. Write good personal insight essays to explain other things that might have prevented them from following actual approved a-g classes. If you look up the application, there is no place to enter anything non a-g so go ahead and enter whatever classes completed as a-g and explain the homeschool scenario in the comments.

 

Go in and do a pretend application now. You'll see what I mean.

 

:iagree:

 

Many of the UC schools are becoming more flexible about the a-g requirements. My son got into UCLA and UCI without fulfilling half of them. His essays were very strong as were his test scores. 

Edited September 16, 2017 by Jilly

[daijobu]

 

Follow a-g to the extent you can but please don't let it control everything you do. There have been lots of exceptions among the homeschooling families I know. A-g is one part of the puzzle only. 

 

This is great.  But can I also say I hate rules that aren't really rules at all?  

[Arcadia]

This is great. But can I also say I hate rules that aren't really rules at all?

Well, the catchphrase in college admissions is "holistic" :lol:

[mirabillis]

 

 

Go in and do a pretend application now. You'll see what I mean.

 

 

yes do! when i did this last year preliminarily, it was a bit of a shock how as a homeschooler, you really are just self-reporting your a-g stuff anyway. it's an eye-opener. do a pretend app! i'll be working on another this year and see what more i can glean.

[Roadrunner]

Saying this from the PoV of someone whose kid did follow a lot of bunny trails in homeschooling but also validated with test scores and CC classes...plus, we were very cheap until kiddo desperately wanted to DE at the university. To add, I also moderate a small support group of families with UC hopefuls and accepted students...

 

Follow a-g to the extent you can but please don't let it control everything you do. There have been lots of exceptions among the homeschooling families I know. A-g is one part of the puzzle only. It really is things like test scores and gpa that attract the UC adcoms' attention first. Beef that up with good records, being complete in the application and explaining all the extra stuff in the comments boxes they provide. Provide as much info as your student can. Write good personal insight essays to explain other things that might have prevented them from following actual approved a-g classes. If you look up the application, there is no place to enter anything non a-g so go ahead and enter whatever classes completed as a-g and explain the homeschool scenario in the comments.

 

Go in and do a pretend application now. You'll see what I mean.

But sometimes they do audits, correct? With my luck, my kids will be chosen for it. I feel like it's a risk I don't want to take even if the chances are slim. I will sleep better with test scores or approved classes.

[Jilly]

My son stated very clearly in his essays that he did not take a-g classes. They still let him in. It is not such a hard rule anymore especially for a few of the UC schools. I heard that UCLA and UC Berkley have the most flexibility. 

 

 

[quark]

But sometimes they do audits, correct? With my luck, my kids will be chosen for it. I feel like it's a risk I don't want to take even if the chances are slim. I will sleep better with test scores or approved classes.

 

Marking those classes as a-g is not a lie so I did not worry one jot about kiddo doing so in the application. Each class falls into required a-g categories. Kiddo did not claim that the classes were from a-g approved vendors. There is a difference. A-g categories are different from a-g approved. A was very clear about some classes being pure independent self-study. A's *overall* performance more than made up for any perceived lack of a-g approved classes. UCs don't bat an eyelid about out of state students not taking a-g approved classes so why should our in-state, homeschooled kiddos be held at a disadvantage? After a while, you start realizing that you can't worry so much about things like that if you want your child to keep loving to learn. All of this of course, is assuming your child has the test scores. If your child does not have something like that going for them, it's prudent to apply more widely, taking note of the advice to always identify safety, match, and reach schools.

 

I think people panic a lot about a-g because they worry test scores etc will not match up to what the more selective UCs ask for. Based on what you've mentioned here about your kiddo, I really don't believe you need to worry. Just don't misrepresent yourselves and don't throw away anything for the next 10 years. :001_smile:

 

 

[learners4life]

Ditto everything Quark has said.  I think the UCs are going to give a huge amount of weight to those test scores - SAT, ACT, and AP. They are going to look at the coursework and I really feel it is a good idea to make sure it comes from a mix of sources, not just all taught at home.  Others may disagree, but I know when we sat with the two admissions people at UCD in dd's junior year, that is what we saw.

 

The first counselor was really of the frame of mind that, as homeschoolers, we should go to community college (probably in her mind to gain credibility) then transfer to the UC system.  As such, she spent very little time with us, but, at the last second, thought to pass us on to another admissions guy who had been a vet school aspirant and was working there after finishing his undergrad. 

 

This young man talked to us some about undergrad prep for vet school.  We also talked quite a bit about why he decided not to apply and what his goals were now (interesting). I think he was pretty much wrapping the conversation up, but I kept finding ways of slipping in info about her academic background,  Hearing that she was taking a lot of AP courses, and that she had gotten 5s in all the ones she had thus far finished, he started paying more attention. I think he liked that we had skyped with a tutor for French for years, used my AP exam design, and that she got a 5 on the exam. I think he liked that she had taken some AP courses online and gotten 5s.  I think he liked that she had taken her first SAT subject test, under my instruction, in 9th grade and got an 800. At this point, he told us "you are NOT like the average homeschoolers" that he had come across.  I think he also liked hearing she had extracurricular activities that showed long-time interest.

 

I'm quite thankful to this young man.  We were feeling dejected, and he turned that around.  He gave us his card and said to contact him with any questions as time went on. He even gave us one hint about essays, which was to NOT write about loving the books by James Herriot (All Creatures Great and Small), as he reads that all the time from Animal Biology/Animal Science majors. :)

 

I think being able to do well from a mix of class types gives the admissions people a chance to see that the student can perform well in a venue other than one that is perfectly tailored to that individual student. When the student does well in other coursework outside of that taught at home, such as AP online courses, I think it shows shows admissions that the coursework taught at home is probably of a high standard in that it prepared them well for those courses.

 

Hope this helps.  Good luck to all applying to UCs!

 

 

Edited October 21, 2017 by learners4life