Audrey Posted October 31, 2008 Share Posted October 31, 2008 Ds switched from MUS back to Saxon and we're a little behind grade level for the catching up. It's been good for him to back up and get the concepts and facts down better. He's finally got some confidence back in math. Now, we're coming to the close of Saxon 3. I have 5/4 on order, but haven't received it yet. I notice from the descriptions that it is a bit different. How much of a change is it? I know there aren't any more manipulatives. I also noticed the TM is just called the text book. Is it written for the student? Could I still help him through it? He isn't independent enough yet and does rely on encouragement through a math lesson. Will the format of 5/4 allow room for that? Any comparisons, observations, advice, and suggestions are most welcome. Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julieofsardis Posted October 31, 2008 Share Posted October 31, 2008 It goes from a workbook format to copying the problems out onto a separate sheet. You probably will find the first 1/3 to be very easy coming out of Saxon 3. If fact, you might want to skip some of it. The one thing that is different is the addition of investigations lessons. My dd was not ready for copying out, so we used R&S 4, writing in the book, and then went back to Saxon 6/5. HTH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gailmegan Posted October 31, 2008 Share Posted October 31, 2008 We just transitioned from 3 to 54 this year and I have to agree that it is ALL review so far and we are on lesson 30. The booklet with tests and workbook pages does have a master sheet in the back that you can copy which guides the students in copying the problems from the main text. I didn't want to waste the money when we have so much scrap paper around here, so while my son does the warm up stuff and worksheet that is in the book, I look at the lesson and copy down parts of the questions (and usually only odds) on another sheet of paper for a guideline of which ones to do. It took him about a week to catch on, but now he has no problems with copying the problems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Audrey Posted October 31, 2008 Author Share Posted October 31, 2008 Could one copy out problems on a white board? Ds hates writing out stuff, but will do so on a white board with no complaint. Or are there too many problems? I thought it came with a workbook, though? What is in the workbook then? Extra problems? Or....? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fractalgal Posted October 31, 2008 Share Posted October 31, 2008 Could one copy out problems on a white board? Ds hates writing out stuff, but will do so on a white board with no complaint. Or are there too many problems? I thought it came with a workbook, though? What is in the workbook then? Extra problems? Or....? If you purchase the Home School Kit, it comes with a test/timing sheets/drill sheets in one book, the student textbook, and a solutions manual. I find Saxon 5/4 less work for the teacher than Saxon 3. I really like it, and the transition went smoothly in our experience. It does train the student to work more independently. I also use Singapore Math so some weeks we only do a few days of Saxon, and I combine lessons which hasn't been a problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sheryl Posted October 31, 2008 Share Posted October 31, 2008 We'er coming up on being half way through Saxon Math 5/4. I'm not an expert, but I believe there is the hard back version and the paperback/homeschool version. We have the later, and my dd works the problems in the book if there's space or on the back side of the previous lesson which is blank. How's that for frugality?? ;) Yes, up to this point, half way, it's alot of review. I've looked ahead and that's pretty much the entire year. People choose to opt out and go to 6/5, but my dh and I agree that this year of review is important. It's foundational to really know these facts before going on, and we're finishing early, so we'll be in 6/5 around March. Teacher = Solutions Manual Student = I don't believe there's any name on the front. The book is not in front of me and I don't remember. Student = Tests/Worksheets book 3 books in all. HTH. Sheryl Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Audrey Posted October 31, 2008 Author Share Posted October 31, 2008 If you purchase the Home School Kit, it comes with a test/timing sheets/drill sheets in one book, the student textbook, and a solutions manual. I find Saxon 5/4 less work for the teacher than Saxon 3. I really like it, and the transition went smoothly in our experience. ... ... We have the later, and my dd works the problems in the book if there's space or on the back side of the previous lesson which is blank. How's that for frugality?? ;) Yes, up to this point, half way, it's alot of review. I've looked ahead and that's pretty much the entire year. People choose to opt out and go to 6/5, but my dh and I agree that this year of review is important. It's foundational to really know these facts before going on, and we're finishing early, so we'll be in 6/5 around March. Teacher = Solutions Manual Student = I don't believe there's any name on the front. The book is not in front of me and I don't remember. Student = Tests/Worksheets book 3 books in all. HTH. Sheryl Thanks, both of those are very helpful descriptions, too! I purchased the "Home School Kit" which is supposed to include all parts. I agree about review being important -- at least for us it is. MUS was a mistake and we've had to go back to make up for that. It's actually been a very good thing, because it has made me see that PATIENCE is truly a virtue when it comes to teaching math. Ds just wasn't 'getting it', but now that we've switched back, he has built real confidence. If you ask him, he'll say his fave subject now is math. It surprises me every time I hear it. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5Youngs Posted October 31, 2008 Share Posted October 31, 2008 Audrey, I have one son 1/2 way through saxon 54 and one that is in saxon 76. It's not a huge transition, though there are more problems in each lesson. We've bought the DIVE discs for 54 and up and they are well worth the $50. You can easily sell it for $40 when you're finished with it, too. They watch the lesson for 5-10 minutes and then they do the even numbered problems for me. I allow them to miss one problem, or they must correct them. If they don't "get it", they watch the lesson again and do the odd ones. My 10yo gets brain melt when I make him do all 30 problems, and he just cries and freaks out that he'll never be finished. So, since quality is my aim, I am fine with our method...... The DIVE cd just allows him to watch and then work vs. reading, figuring out the practice problems and then work. It means less time sitting in the same chair, feeling like he's never going to finish. YOu don't have to have the DIVE dics, though! It's fully explained in the text. Hope this helps! Dawanna Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Audrey Posted October 31, 2008 Author Share Posted October 31, 2008 Audrey,I have one son 1/2 way through saxon 54 and one that is in saxon 76. It's not a huge transition, though there are more problems in each lesson. We've bought the DIVE discs for 54 and up and they are well worth the $50. You can easily sell it for $40 when you're finished with it, too. They watch the lesson for 5-10 minutes and then they do the even numbered problems for me. I allow them to miss one problem, or they must correct them. If they don't "get it", they watch the lesson again and do the odd ones. My 10yo gets brain melt when I make him do all 30 problems, and he just cries and freaks out that he'll never be finished. So, since quality is my aim, I am fine with our method...... The DIVE cd just allows him to watch and then work vs. reading, figuring out the practice problems and then work. It means less time sitting in the same chair, feeling like he's never going to finish. YOu don't have to have the DIVE dics, though! It's fully explained in the text. Hope this helps! Dawanna Thanks Dawanna, can I ask you a little about those DIVE CDs? Are they software or something you watch on tv? If it's software, are there interactive opportunities (like doing some problems on the computer)? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EKS Posted October 31, 2008 Share Posted October 31, 2008 5/4 is very different in that it is a textbook and the problems need to be copied out of the book. For some kids this is a real doozy of a difference. If it is a problem, you can copy the problems yourself (where appropriate) while your child gets used to the new format. In our case, my son is almost finished with algebra (not Saxon) and I'm *still* copying problems. He has issues, what can I say. I told him that when he hits geometry, he's on his own in the problem-copying department. More than you wanted to know, I'm sure! Also, I always did the lessons with my son and I still do. He did the mental math orally with me then we went over the lesson together, with me reading it aloud and us discussing whatever the topic was. We did some practice problems on the white board and then he did the mixed practice on his own. I still approach math lessons this way, as a thing to do together, rather than something he is doing on his own. I hope this helps! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris in VA Posted October 31, 2008 Share Posted October 31, 2008 Audrey, I just wanted to add that there is a Saxon 4--just two workbooks are offered by a homeschooling catty I have. It is first edition, so I'm thinking it's probably older and that the TM isn't available. But it might give you something else to work with in case Saxon 5/4 doesn't work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5Youngs Posted November 1, 2008 Share Posted November 1, 2008 Thanks Dawanna, can I ask you a little about those DIVE CDs? Are they software or something you watch on tv? If it's software, are there interactive opportunities (like doing some problems on the computer)? http://www.DiveIntoMath.com They are "interactive video lectures". There is a lesson taught in 5-10 minutes of the lesson explanation in the textbook. So, instead of them reading the lesson explanation, they hear it and see a "blackboard" that is actually blue, and there are problems worked out for them. It's ingenious, really. And one less thing that I have to teach.;) One complaint I've heard is that the parent doesn't teach the lesson, so they aren't sure how to show their kid how to work a problem that they aren't sure of. Well, EVERY problem in the saxon text has (1,2...etc) in parentheses under the problem number. This tells you what lesson the concept was introduced in. So, my boys have to look at that lesson BEFORE I will come and help them with it. 90% of the time, this works; for the other 10%, we watch the lesson together, bc I have visual learners. It also teaches them that they are perfectly capable of figuring anything out! A great confidence booster~ Dawanna Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Titus.Two.Five Posted November 1, 2008 Share Posted November 1, 2008 How much of a change is it? I know there aren't any more manipulatives. I also noticed the TM is just called the text book. Is it written for the student? Could I still help him through it? He isn't independent enough yet and does rely on encouragement through a math lesson. Will the format of 5/4 allow room for that? Hi Audrey, right now I am using Saxon 2 (same format as 3), 5/4 and 8/7. Going to 5/4 will be a breath of fresh air! :lol: The lower grades are so teacher intensive...which for some is fine, but hey, I have 5 kids. ;) Anyway, the textbooks are written to the student, more or less, but it would not be hard to jump in and teach at all, I have to do that for my student in 5/4. She needs ME to help teach her. You'll do just fine...really. Yes, you can teach your son using this more independent format just the way he needs you to. In fact, I bet that you helping with muchly with 5/4 will transition him to be more independent with 6/5 later. The Dive CD's do look very handy...I did order them for my 8/7 and 5/4 kids, so we'll see. My 8/7 kid will do fine with it, but my 5/4 will still need mom I wager for this year. And, that's ok. :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
emeraldjoy Posted November 1, 2008 Share Posted November 1, 2008 (edited) This week was our first week of transition. Obviously we are very early in on..... but....what I have observed is that we will go through some of the lessons very quickly and I even thought about skipping some of them. However, it seems that they are taking some of review and adding more mature math language to it. For example, one of her next lessons is on patterns that they now are calling sequencing...I am not sure if this is the trend for the entire book, but is what I have noticed so far. Another example is they are adding letters (more algebra-y) to the "missing addends" questions. The questions are virtually the same as 3 but they are making it more technical I guess I could say in 5/4. This makes me a bit leary of all together skipping lessons, because I want her to know the language, but makes it so I can go through it quickly with her....you know what I mean? Also, the end of 3 is pretty heavy on the mutiplication and division facts and I feel like she could handle a bit more practice of these. Because the beginning of 5/4 is going back to addition, etc. I have chosen, so far, to supplement her current work with some multiplications and division sheets from 3 so she can keep her handle on that. Also we are not doing all of the end of lesson problems on 5/4 just evens or odds and I don't make her write them out, just the answers. Enough from me. You are an encouragment to me though. It is kind of cool in a surreal sort of way knowing that someone else is going through almost exactly what we are....wierd..... Emerald Edited November 1, 2008 by emeraldjoy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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