Tan Homeschool Story of Civilization

[Beaniemom]

I came across an announcement of this curriculum and wondered if anyone had seen it at a convention. It is described as a Catholic Story of the World. I like the idea and what samples are on the website but need more info. Does anyone have any insight? I know it's a long shot since it is still in pre-order stage.

[SarahW]

I went through the samples on the website, including the additional youth of Alexander audio.

 

Overall, I liked it. Most of what I heard on the audio was simply basic historical artifacts in narrative form. Greeks v. Persians largely follow Herodotus. Narmer's Victory just tells what is shown on the Narmer Palette (which is pretty much all we know of Narmer, so there you go). On the one hand, you have the issue that this is history as written by the victors, but on the other hand I believe it can be worthwhile to start learning history by hearing what some of the people living then thought about it. I did deeply appreciate the fact that "directly in the shoes" of historical figures means presenting what the historical record does say about them, and not just making stuff up (like so many history books for kids are apt to do when they try to be "fun"). The inclusion of Shukallituda in the sample chapter was nicely done, for instance.

 

The sample video was nice. It would be a nice option for those whose kids need more A/V support for their learning.

 

My only quibble is philosophical - positing farming and writing as superior to hunting-gathering and oral tradition. I know the name of it is Story of Civilizations, so it is obviously selecting for that stream of history. But anthropologists have been working hard to show that nomadic, "primitive", and oral cultures also have their own forms of advanced knowledge and social structure. I don't expect kid history books to teach advanced anthropology or anything, I just thought the vis. a vis. to be a bit unhelpful. It also makes me vaguely worried about how he'll handle Imperialism and Colonialism.

 

But this is on my "consider to buy" list. Thanks for mentioning it!

[Beaniemom]

Here is one review I came across. No information on imprimatur though.

http://www.catholicsistas.com/2016/05/review-the-story-of-civilization/

Edited May 23, 2016 by Beaniemom

[ElizaG]

Going by the timeline, samples, and blurbs, there seems to be no mention of ancient Eastern civilizations.  [ETA:  in the sense of India and China, not the Near East]

 

I wasn't looking for the same amount of coverage that's in SOTW (which was a bit much for our family), but, well, they did exist.    And as if that weren't reason enough to include them, recent popes have said that understanding them is very important to the task of evangelization.

 

This would appear to be a deal-breaker for our family.  Not so much for the missing information, but because it's a big red flag.   And what SarahW mentioned, about oral vs. written cultures etc., would be another one. 

 

TBH, Catholic history books written in the US before Vatican II often come across as more broad-minded and thoughtful than recent ones.  Some of them are even more current.  (IIRC, the Catholic Textbook Project's junior high US history text stops almost 100 years ago.)   Are people just not able to deal with anything outside some mutually agreed-on comfort zone, so they avoid huge areas of the subject matter?  I worry about this.  :huh:

Edited May 23, 2016 by ElizaG

[SarahW]

Going by the timeline, samples, and blurbs, there seems to be no mention of ancient Eastern civilizations.  [ETA:  in the sense of India and China, not the Near East]

 

I wasn't looking for the same amount of coverage that's in SOTW (which was a bit much for our family), but, well, they did exist.    And as if that weren't reason enough to include them, recent popes have said that understanding them is very important to the task of evangelization.

 

This would appear to be a deal-breaker for our family.  Not so much for the missing information, but because it's a big red flag.   And what SarahW mentioned, about oral vs. written cultures etc., would be another one. 

 

TBH, Catholic history books written in the US before Vatican II often come across as more broad-minded and thoughtful than recent ones.  Some of them are even more current.  (IIRC, the Catholic Textbook Project's junior high US history text stops almost 100 years ago.)   Are people just not able to deal with anything outside some mutually agreed-on comfort zone, so they avoid huge areas of the subject matter?  I worry about this.  :huh:

 

 

Yes, this is another instance of what I term the "move West" curriculum. Next we'll move further West to Europe. Then we'll move even further West to America. And then we'll get even further West when Pearl Harbor gets bombed. But we'll never quite make it full circle, unless we're suddenly brave enough to discuss Sykes-Picot and the recent unrest in the Middle East.

 

Honestly, if I were to make a history curriculum, I'd dump the Mesopotamia-Sack of Rome parameter and stop the "ancient world" at right before Julius Caesar. The Roman Empire has as much to do with later Byzantium and European history as it does with the old Roman Republic, if not even more. Breaking the "ancient world" at an arbitrary and honestly small event like the sacking by the Visigoths is a rather modern idea and one that I find singularly unhelpful in people's understanding of the Middle Ages. 

 

Plus, by pushing the Roman Empire into the "Middle Ages year" you free up a lot of time in year one to discuss ancient India and China, and even introduce nomadic cultures(!). 

[ElizaG]

The Roman Empire has as much to do with later Byzantium and European history as it does with the old Roman Republic, if not even more. Breaking the "ancient world" at an arbitrary and honestly small event like the sacking by the Visigoths is a rather modern idea and one that I find singularly unhelpful in people's understanding of the Middle Ages. 

This occurred to me when I was trying to line up our "fun Latin" books with the history cycle.  For instance, Minimus is set in Roman Britain.  Where does that fit?   It sort of doesn't.   Chronologically, it goes at the end of year 1, but culturally, it goes at the beginning of year 2, right before the monasteries and all that.  

 

Even as an adult, I get all mixed up about people I've read about, like St. Martin of Tours and Aelfric the Grammarian.  I just looked it up, and the former lived in the 4th century, the latter in the 10th.   If anything, I would have placed them both in the 5th or 6th.   It's sort of a bin where I put anything murky.  Apparently the "dark ages" are still going on in my mind.  :leaving:

[Beaniemom]

Going by the timeline, samples, and blurbs, there seems to be no mention of ancient Eastern civilizations. [ETA: in the sense of India and China, not the Near East]

 

I wasn't looking for the same amount of coverage that's in SOTW (which was a bit much for our family), but, well, they did exist. And as if that weren't reason enough to include them, recent popes have said that understanding them is very important to the task of evangelization.

 

This would appear to be a deal-breaker for our family. Not so much for the missing information, but because it's a big red flag. And what SarahW mentioned, about oral vs. written cultures etc., would be another one.

 

TBH, Catholic history books written in the US before Vatican II often come across as more broad-minded and thoughtful than recent ones. Some of them are even more current. (IIRC, the Catholic Textbook Project's junior high US history text stops almost 100 years ago.) Are people just not able to deal with anything outside some mutually agreed-on comfort zone, so they avoid huge areas of the subject matter? I worry about this. :huh:

 

Now that you pointed this out I looked back at the TOC for History Odyssey which was my original plan for next year and the gaps become obvious. I might be back to my original plan again.

[MargaretG]

I used Tan's Story of the Bible OT this year with a few kids and we LOVED it!

The audio was so well done! The kids played with Thinking Putty as we listen and then we listen to the DVD follow up lessons.

It was really such a special way to share the Bible stories. We all enjoyed listening and talking about the Bible stories.

My 3,5,8, and 11 year old all listened and enjoyed. The activity book and test were excellent too but we did not use all of the activities pages or tests.

 

I am looking forward to the new History program from Tan.

I pre-ordered and I am really excited about it! :hurray:

I plan to supplement with real books and some resources I already own. I will review the program and plan to add as needed to clarify and expand the topics covered.

I think it is AWESOME that there are some new catholic choices and I want to support Tan as they expand the offerings for home-school families.

Hope this helps :-)

 

 

[RootAnn]

Has anyone received their copy of this yet?

A friend was just reminding me of this the other day & I wondered how it looked in person.

 

Her oldest is the same age as my youngest. We were both wondering what grade level this is really geared for -- in terms of the text book. (Obviously, the tests are more middle grades & the activity book can be for lower elementary through middle elementary.) The sample chapter looks rather long (vs. SOTW 1's section lengths). One wonders how it flows for the youngsters and how much the older kids might feel talked down to.

 

Any insights from those of you who preordered & have it in hand?

(And, today only, Tan is having a 40% off flash sale using the code FLASH40 if you were thinking of ordering but hadn't gotten around to it.)

Edited June 25, 2016 by RootAnn

[hhm]

Has anyone received their copy of this yet?

A friend was just reminding me of this the other day & I wondered how it looked in person.

 

Her oldest is the same age as my youngest. We were both wondering what grade level this is really geared for -- in terms of the text book. (Obviously, the tests are more middle grades & the activity book can be for lower elementary through middle elementary.) The sample chapter looks rather long (vs. SOTW 1's section lengths). One wonders how it flows for the youngsters and how much the older kids might feel talked down to.

 

Any insights from those of you who preordered & have it in hand?

(And, today only, Tan is having a 40% off flash sale using the code FLASH40 if you were thinking of ordering but hadn't gotten around to it.)

 

Mine is supposed to arrive today! I will report back after I've had a chance to review.

[Monica_in_Switzerland]

Thanks for the heads-up.  I'll be following this hoping for some reviews as people get their materials!

[CanadianAlison+3boys]

I am so torn on this. We already own the books and activity guides for SOTW 1 and 2 and I have bookmarked resources to fill in the parts in SOTW 2 that are problematic from a Catholic perspective. We like SOTW so far and it would be a large financial outlay for us to buy the new curriculum especially when we own SOTW already.

 

On the other hand it would be nice to own a set that I can just use without worrying that I am teaching my kids something against the faith (especially since we as a family are new to being Catholic). Plus supporting a company producing Catholic options is appealing.

 

I will be watching reviews closely. I think I'm decided on doing SOTW for ancients but I am very undecided for what we will do for the Middle Ages.

[Monica_in_Switzerland]

Still waiting for reviews, but I think I may do something similar to what we've done for SOTW- just invest in the audio books and perhaps the lecture series.  I like the idea of a dramatized audio version.  :-)

[Monica_in_Switzerland]

Just want to add the audio dramatized book is available on Audible!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[hhm]

Still waiting for reviews, but I think I may do something similar to what we've done for SOTW- just invest in the audio books and perhaps the lecture series.  I like the idea of a dramatized audio version.  :-)

 

I haven't had a chance to review in-depth, but my initial reaction is that we will go this route. The audio and lectures seem really well done, but the book is maybe a tad dry...maybe. Other than the Catholic POV, one of the main reasons I chose this curriculum was to make history come alive! I believe between audio, streaming lectures and coordinating literature, this will fit the bill. I did want to mention that my dd (11.5) leafed through the activity book and got very excited. There are coloring pages, of course, but also some mapping activities, word puzzles, decoding hieroglyphics, etc.

[CanadianAlison+3boys]

Just want to add the audio dramatized book is available on Audible!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Thank you so much for pointing this out!!! Off to there now :)

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Teresa in MO]

Can anyone who has ordered and received this curriculum give an opinion on grade level?  Thanks.

[SkateLeft]

I just discovered that the Kindle version of the book is available on Kindle Unlimited!

[ElizaG]

Thanks - reading it now on Kindle Unlimited. 

 

The author mentions ancient India & China specifically in one sentence, then goes on to write several paragraphs about general characteristics of ancient civilizations.  After that, he says (paraphrasing), "out of these civilizations, the ones we're going to study are Sumer and Egypt."   I'm not exactly happy with that, and would prefer a few more specifics -- maybe a picture or two? -- but at least he does acknowledge them. 

 

I actually have much more concern about the way the book treats prehistoric man, for instance:

 

"Whatever God or gods were in control had not revealed themselves to men.

 

Until the day of Abraham."

 

There's no mention of God's self-revelation to Adam and Eve, or to the covenant with Noah, which are significant parts of our faith (here's a relevant bit from the CCC).   Whatever the author meant to say, it seems to me that there's a serious problem with the wording.   I wonder why nobody noticed this.  

 

Come to think of it, this actually seems to go along with ignoring the East, through the implicit suggestion that "they didn't know God, and their civilizations didn't lead to the coming of Christ, so why should we learn about them?"   But this isn't the Church's attitude, which I think is much better reflected in the following article.

 

"The Original Revelation Made to Adam and Eve" by Anthony Zimmerman (1995)

 

I wish we had more of a true missionary focus in our textbooks.   There's so much potential there - it could be great.   Instead, we just seem to get haphazardly Catholicized versions of mainstream curricula.  :huh:

[J&JMom]

I used Tan's Story of the Bible OT this year with a few kids and we LOVED it!

The audio was so well done! The kids played with Thinking Putty as we listen and then we listen to the DVD follow up lessons.

It was really such a special way to share the Bible stories. We all enjoyed listening and talking about the Bible stories.

My 3,5,8, and 11 year old all listened and enjoyed. The activity book and test were excellent too but we did not use all of the activities pages or tests.

 

I am looking forward to the new History program from Tan.

I pre-ordered and I am really excited about it! :hurray:

I plan to supplement with real books and some resources I already own. I will review the program and plan to add as needed to clarify and expand the topics covered.

I think it is AWESOME that there are some new catholic choices and I want to support Tan as they expand the offerings for home-school families.

Hope this helps :-)

Thanks for this review as it affirms my plans to use OT and NT books this year.

[AimeeM]

Thanks for the review!

What age group would say this is geared to (as a read aloud)?

 

I know Tan's bible history is all ages, but I'd head the Story of Civilization is geared more toward middle school?

Thanks - reading it now on Kindle Unlimited. 

 

The author mentions ancient India & China specifically in one sentence, then goes on to write several paragraphs about general characteristics of ancient civilizations.  After that, he says (paraphrasing), "out of these civilizations, the ones we're going to study are Sumer and Egypt."   I'm not exactly happy with that, and would prefer a few more specifics -- maybe a picture or two? -- but at least he does acknowledge them. 

 

I actually have much more concern about the way the book treats prehistoric man, for instance:

 

"Whatever God or gods were in control had not revealed themselves to men.

 

Until the day of Abraham."

 

There's no mention of God's self-revelation to Adam and Eve, or to the covenant with Noah, which are significant parts of our faith (here's a relevant bit from the CCC).   Whatever the author meant to say, it seems to me that there's a serious problem with the wording.   I wonder why nobody noticed this.  

 

Come to think of it, this actually seems to go along with ignoring the East, through the implicit suggestion that "they didn't know God, and their civilizations didn't lead to the coming of Christ, so why should we learn about them?"   But this isn't the Church's attitude, which I think is much better reflected in the following article.

 

"The Original Revelation Made to Adam and Eve" by Anthony Zimmerman (1995)

 

I wish we had more of a true missionary focus in our textbooks.   There's so much potential there - it could be great.   Instead, we just seem to get haphazardly Catholicized versions of mainstream curricula.  :huh:

 

[ElizaG]

Well, bearing in mind that most of the advice and textbooks I've been reading recently are 70-100 years old...

 

To me, the style of this text seems to be aimed at mid-elementary age:  simple sentences, dramatic scenes in the pictures, some attempts to make the story seem exciting or relatable.   The content seems more advanced, in the sense that it mentions a lot of topics that wouldn't traditionally have been taught to children before high school.   But they're presented in a shallow way. 

 

I've seen some recent homeschool history curricula meant for middle schoolers that meet the above description, so in that sense I guess it could be considered "middle school level."   But I wouldn't use this style of book for that age.   It's too much spoon-feeding of information, IMO, at an time when they're ready to start following their own interests.   The quality and complexity of the language aren't great either. 

 

Given what's currently available, my preference would be to read a vintage elementary text aloud for the narrative, and also do Bible history.   Then we could put out books for free reading at various levels, including high school and popular adult history (minus any mature content).   If some of the older children aren't getting into the subject and seem to need more structure, we might add in some parts of ABCs of Christian Culture. 

 

This is pretty much what we're planning on doing in the upcoming year, so we'll see how it goes.  :001_smile:

[ElizaG]

BTW, my preference for vintage elementary texts isn't because they're old, but because - compared to this new series, and many others - they're better written, and their authors are more qualified.    

 

For instance, The Old World's Gifts to the New (1932 & 1948) was written by Sister Mary Celeste Leger, R.S.M., Ph.D. (CUA), who was the chair of social sciences at St. Xavier College, and was also part of a teaching order that's known for a "call to higher education and professional excellence."  (Sister Prudence Allen, who was recently appointed to a Vatican theological commission, is also part of this order.)   

 

And our favorite series, which includes Before Our Nation Began, was co-authored by Fr. Philip Furlong, a college professor, prolific author, and future bishop.   

 

I can't imagine either of them informing their readers that there was no revelation to men before Abraham -- a claim that, BTW, is repeated several times in this book.   (DH is still shaking his head over it...) 

 

Given that our intellectual resources seem to be much more limited these days, and the older history texts are still serviceable, IMO it would make more sense for homeschool publishers to focus their efforts in other areas, such as modern literature, 20th century history, and cultural geography, where there really is nothing suitable.  

 

I realize that the older texts don't come with all the worksheets and doo-dads -- if they were ever created, they've been lost in the mists of time -- but with all the technology available to us today, we can make and share our own quite easily.  No need to sell our birthright for a mess of crossword puzzles.  :001_smile:

[AimeeM]

NM. Thanks!

Well, bearing in mind that most of the advice and textbooks I've been reading recently are 70-100 years old...

 

To me, the style of this text seems to be aimed at mid-elementary age:  simple sentences, dramatic scenes in the pictures, some attempts to make the story seem exciting or relatable.   The content seems more advanced, in the sense that it mentions a lot of topics that wouldn't traditionally have been taught to children before high school.   But they're presented in a shallow way. 

 

I've seen some recent homeschool history curricula meant for middle schoolers that meet the above description, so in that sense I guess it could be considered "middle school level."   But I wouldn't use this style of book for that age.   It's too much spoon-feeding of information, IMO, at an time when they're ready to start following their own interests.   The quality and complexity of the language aren't great either. 

 

Given what's currently available, my preference would be to read a vintage elementary text aloud for the narrative, and also do Bible history.   Then we could put out books for free reading at various levels, including high school and popular adult history (minus any mature content).   If some of the older children aren't getting into the subject and seem to need more structure, we might add in some parts of ABCs of Christian Culture. 

 

This is pretty much what we're planning on doing in the upcoming year, so we'll see how it goes.  :001_smile:

 

Edited July 19, 2016 by AimeeM

[quietchapel]

BTW, my preference for vintage elementary texts isn't because they're old, but because - compared to this new series, and many others - they're better written, and their authors are more qualified.

 

For instance, The Old World's Gifts to the New (1932 & 1948) was written by Sister Mary Celeste Leger, R.S.M., Ph.D. (CUA), who was the chair of social sciences at St. Xavier College, and was also part of a teaching order that's known for a "call to higher education and professional excellence." (Sister Prudence Allen, who was recently appointed to a Vatican theological commission, is also part of this order.)

 

And our favorite series, which includes Before Our Nation Began, was co-authored by Fr. Philip Furlong, a college professor, prolific author, and future bishop.

 

I can't imagine either of them informing their readers that there was no revelation to men before Abraham -- a claim that, BTW, is repeated several times in this book. (DH is still shaking his head over it...)

 

Given that our intellectual resources seem to be much more limited these days, and the older history texts are still serviceable, IMO it would make more sense for homeschool publishers to focus their efforts in other areas, such as modern literature, 20th century history, and cultural geography, where there really is nothing suitable.

 

I realize that the older texts don't come with all the worksheets and doo-dads -- if they were ever created, they've been lost in the mists of time -- but with all the technology available to us today, we can make and share our own quite easily. No need to sell our birthright for a mess of crossword puzzles. :001_smile:

I love this. And agree.

[Beaniemom]

I e-mailed customer service and got a quick reply. Unfortunately the reply confirmed that the series remains focused on Western Civilization the whole way through. Now to see if I can return mine....drat.

[MargaretG]

I agree with the comments about Vintage Catholic textbooks! I really love them! I have a number of them.  They are however, not at all politically correct and at times I have to explain some of the old language to my kids. I think this is very do-able but it is something to be aware of.

I will use Tan's new Story of Civilization as a spine and add chapters from several of the vintage texts I own.

We will also read a few real books and add some Evan Moor History pockets too!

While not Catholic, I really like The Book of the Ancient World by Dorothy Mills ( reprinted by MP) . I will also read some of that to my kids.

I think it will be a fun and interesting year.

 

[MargaretG]

Do any of you use the textbooks from Catholic textbook project and have you been happy with them?

I have a few on the shelf but have only used them as a reference so far.

Would love your thoughts....

Thanks!

[quietchapel]

I love them, though find each book to be its own entity. What I mean is that the style of one is not replicated in another. This may not be a negative, though, as there seems to be variety across the series.

[MargaretG]

Thank you!

Did you use the workbooks and TM also?

Thanks again!

Blessings :-)

[quietchapel]

TM yes, workbooks no.

You're welcome!

[ktgrok]

I know this is an old thread but I was wondering if anyone ended up using it and how they liked it. I’m thinking of switching, though probably just using the audio component.

 

We are using it, really just the audio component, for when we are in the car. LOVE it. Really good level for elementary level or beyond. My only complaint would be sometimes myths are woven into history..so I had to explain to my kids that Icarus didn't actually fly, etc. But it is interesting, and my 7 year old asks for it. And I'm learning to pronounce a lot of names, lol.

[ktgrok]

Thanks! I’m thinking of using it with my 6th grader actually. Plus maybe some rabbit trails? Not sure. Do you think it would be too young?

No, my 18 year old said he thinks it is interesting!