financial decision for dd's friend...

[bettyandbob]

Anyone up to puzzle this out. It's much easier to weigh variables for someone else's kid.

 

Student has three options to study civil engineering (other big name acceptances removed for financial reasons*):

1. Virginia Tech (VT).  Full pay in state tuition.
2. Virginia Commonwealth University (VCU). Big merit package brings cost to same as cost of attending cc.
3. Local cc, which is apparently different from other VA ccs and has a really good direct transfer plan for engineering students. Do this 2 years to save money, transfer to VT.

Considerations:

VT is really good and has been nationally known a long time. It is hard to get into. If this student weren’t solely focused on engineering he certainly would have applied to and gotten into many other schools. His transcript is tip top GPA with heavy courseload, including multivariable calc,  and 2200 SAT. He's also fluent in 3 languages. However, in VTs engineering program he’d be just another smart kid.

 

VCU has been pouring money into its engineering school in recent years.  It is in the process of “trying harder†and to be more. So, a student could come in and possible get more opportunities because of this push by the school. Additionally, a student getting that kind of money should probably be in an honors program with access to more research opportunities and a chance to build closer relationships with professors. He may have a chance to be a standout in a smaller, newer program.

 

I think student should put aside cc plan, even with a good direct transfer program I'd been concerned about transferring to an engineering program as a junior. I could see one year of cc working out for defraying costs in engineering, but not 2.

 

Money is tight, but he can come up with the money to attend VT without massive loans. So, he just needs to weigh VCU and VT. I think student should contact both programs and ask specific questions about research opportunities. He also needs to verify the scholarship is renewable for 4 years.  If it is not I’d go with VT, unless there was something hugely special in the way of research available.

 

Student’s decisions are almost purely financial. He is not thinking about rural/urban, weather, big name sports, social scene. In addition to the front end cost, I’ve suggested he consider longterm ROI. I really like no loans, but I think he needs to consider the possibility of missed opportunities at VT.

 

What do you think the student should consider?

 

*One of the big problems with living in a high COL area is your parents income looks high and there seems to be no consideration for how much of that income is left after paying living expenses. This issue has been on many threads.

 

For various reasons, student did not and will not likely consider ROTC to defray costs, so that's not an option to throw at this problem.

 

[JanetC]

Without numbers (both cost of attendance for the various options and the family financial situation) this question is impossible to answer.

 

I was recently doing a spreadsheet for a friend who was sad that her daughter was leaning towards the local CC rather than the merit scholarship she got to the local Catholic college. When I laid it out in numbers, the daughter was absolutely right. Even with a 17,000 merit scholarship, the costs over 4 years were way too high, even if the daughter still lived at home.

[8filltheheart]

The campuses are vastly different. If he doesn't mind VCU's urban, city runs through it environment, I would recommend VCU if the cost is significantly less. Engineering is not a field that gives a large variant in ROI based on school name. ABET accreditation is the key factor. Opportunities as an UG, especially research and co-oping, and GPA are going to be the main factors for gaining employment. Once employed, job performance is all that matters.

 

Fwiw, our oldest attended a small, only regionally ranked public university. He co-oped alongside students from much higher ranked schools--GA Tech, VA Tech, and NCSU. Of the co-op students with ds at his coop job, ds and only 1 other of the 4 was offered a job with that company. Ds had 4 job offers.

 

Today ds works alongside engineers from across the full spectrum of schools. All were hired in at the exact same pay. He has been promoted a couple of times bc of his job performance, not his school's name.

 

Hth

Edited April 8, 2016 by 8FillTheHeart

[retiredHSmom]

My daughter is a Senior mechanical engineering student at VCU.  I have been very impressed with their program (I have a degree in electronics engineering).  They are the first school the state to have a PhD program in Mechanical Engineering.  Their bi-annual career fairs have been excellent with many opportunities to get actual engineering internships ( an engineering internship is required for graduation).  She has had 2 excellent internships and actually turned down paid internship opportunities this summer because she had multiple offers.The honors program is very good too with interesting classes and frequent, great seminars.  There is a significant effort to prepare students for employment from professional dinners with engineering companies to resume and interview sessions with useful feedback.

 

With all of that being said you also cannot discount the CC transfer program here in VA.  I personally know  two students who have used the CC engineering transfer program and transferred to UVA to finish their degrees.(1 electrical, 1 civil)  If you follow the program class requirements and maintain the required GPA it is truly a guaranteed transfer and the CC engineering classes are identical to what is offered at the 4 year universities.  Both students transferred seamlessly and maintained very high GPAs through to graduation.

Edited April 8, 2016 by Tania

[Dmmetler]

I agree that the campus/city needs to be considered. There's a BIG difference between Blacksburg and Richmond!

[bettyandbob]

I agree that the campus/city needs to be considered. There's a BIG difference between Blacksburg and Richmond!

 

 

Student is aware. He is fine with very urban and also fine with rural. Both schools have diversity in student population (more so at VCU, but still visible diversity at VT). That would be good for this student. While touring VA schools we notice some popular schools were not visibly diverse at all.

[Elise]

Was he awarded the Provost scholarship at VCU?   If so, it is renewable for all four years as long as he remains full-time and maintains a certain GPA (pretty sure it's 3.2).  Dd1 is a freshman there on Provost, and she lives in the Honors dorm and loves it.  If he's interested in the Honors College, they also award additional scholarships (you must apply separately), but this might bring his costs down even more.  I can't speak to the engineering aspect since dd is an artist, but she has a great group of friends (of all majors) in the Honors College, and we couldn't be happier with her choice.  All of her courses have been extremely challenging.

[Elise]

Oops!  Renewal requires a 3.3 GPA (not 3.2.)  Here's the blurb from the VCU website:

 

 To be eligible for scholarship renewal, students must complete at least 28 credit hours on a full-time basis over the fall and spring semesters and maintain a cumulative grade-point average of 3.3 or better.

[ThisIsTheDay]

I'm in VA, and our local cc has a very good direct transfer plan, particularly for engineering students.  I know several who are graduating this spring; all but one are going to Tech. The other is going out of state (foreign student following family). I know two others who transferred last year.  And I know two more who transferred in the last year or two to UVA (former homeschoolers).

 

But something you posted indicated to me that you and I are referring to different cc's.

 

If it's a purely financial decision, and he can live at home while attending a solid cc for two years, I don't know that any four year uni at this point would even be considered.

[Nan in Mass]

I would go to the school where the student can have a bad semester or class without losing their scholarship and having to transfer. Especially with an engineering major at a good school. So many things can happen - flu, prof with bad English or a curmudgeonly attitude, family death, breakups, etc. i would want my child to be at a school where if they accidentally flunk thermo or fluids, they can just take it again and finish their degree. One of mine has a large scholarship and even though the terms allow for repeating the occasional class, the stress of the situation is high. If the student is high strung, this can contribute to meltdowns.

 

Nan

[bettyandbob]

Update. In case you are interested.

 

Friend is headed to VCU. Parents infomed him how much they are limiting financial help (they are doing FAFSA and whatever else is requested for their son get his merit awards, but they aren't giving cash themselves). Parents also informed they don't want him living with them if he chooses cc. So, VCU is they only place to go.

 

He'll be in an honors program. VCU has given him full tuition. He has some dorm fees, but his honors program puts him in a single room. He has to buy books, which will be painful.

[JanetC]

Parents infomed him how much they are limiting financial help (they are doing FAFSA and whatever else is requested for their son get his merit awards, but they aren't giving cash themselves). Parents also informed they don't want him living with them if he chooses cc. So, VCU is they only place to go..

Wow. The parents waited until April to spring this on him? That's awful. He's lucky to have a place to go at all.

[bettyandbob]

Wow. The parents waited until April to spring this on him? That's awful. He's lucky to have a place to go at all.

Definitely late. I'm glad he applied to VCU. I'm not sure it was in his list to begin with.