Who is Schooling their AL in a 2nd language?

[Gil]

Hi guys, as I go into "3rd grade" with the boys, we are preparing to take the plunge and commit a lot more time to growing and developing our Spanish language abilities. We'll be doing 50-75% of our school work in Spanish and almost all leisure digital media is to be in Spanish.

 

We're going to be doing a Spanish language elementary level curriculum--we're going to compact and accelerate the 1st and 2nd grade lessons from a Mexican PS curriculum. This year the boys have decided to par down the list of "Official School" to just Spanish and math, with the option of re-evaluating throughout the school year. They'll continue to free read in English of course--but they would really like to see a big jump in their Spanish abilities between this year and next.

 

If it goes well, then they said they'll probably do Mexican 3rd-6th grade also, but at a slower pace. Has anyone else tried this with their Accelerated learners? How did it go? Do you have any tips for us?

 

 

 

[Gil]

Well I'm not fluent. Once upon a time I was a child with oral fluency appropriate to my age/grade/peer level, but that is mostly all gone now. I'm willing but unable to move to a Spanish language area, so for now, we just immerse ourselves where and when we can. We take every opportunity to speak Spanish and we spend a few hours in 100% Spanish every day, I try and get them speaking and reading Spanish for several minutes right before bed time also.

 

Spanish is only our 2nd language. We are very much Anglophones living in an Anglophone American community and our English isn't at risk of going anywhere. Hopefully by the end of 8th grade, they'll be able to pass for native Spanish speakers. My ambition is to do intensive Spanish study for a few more years. I'd like for the boys to do a language exchange as soon as Pal is old enough to go.

 

If I get the chance, then we are moving to a Spanish speaking country.

[SeaConquest]

My oldest DS went to immerson preschool and summer camp in French and Spanish. I'm teaching my son to read in French this year and letting Papa and Grandma (native speakers) run with it. When his Hebrew improves enough, I plan to put him Israeli scouts, which is conducted entirely in Hebrew.

[Pegs]

I'm all ears. It is oftentimes suggested to me that DS would benefit from and excel at learning another language. Embarrassingly, I don't feel up to the task. I'll just sit here and bask in the collective wisdom of this board until inspiration strikes. :/

[Gil]

Did the lower level of academics prove a problem for your AL?

[Mabelen]

In my opinion, the main concern is the lack of a native or at least a quasi native language model in that set up. I understand you are trying to give your children the enormous benefit of a second language, but the main problem with this set up is that mistakes may go unchecked and become fossilized, something to be aware of and to find a way to prevent. Search Nan in Mass, I believe she attempted something similar to this in French. I don't remember all the details, maybe her kids started older? She has graduated her kids already but she still hangs out at the college board. She may be have feedback that interest you.

[Arcadia]

Math was the subject hubby and I had unintentionally explained in our heritage language. That is because the technical vocabulary used for k-algebra is limited and so easy for kids to pick up.

Our kids cello teacher speaks our heritage language to our kids. Again there are not many music terms in the lower levels so kids are comfortable being taught in their heritage language.

 

I have not tried for science but physics would ve the easiest for me to explain in my heritage language. Chemistry would be next in difficulty because of translating the uncommon elements names. Biology would require me to buy a bilingual science dictionary because I don't know all the anatomy terms in my heritage language.

 

My older actually translates in his head to all other languages. So if we speak english, he is thinking what it translates to in chinese or german. If we speak in german, he translates mentally to english or chinese. It is his idea of fun.

 

Have fun :)

[Tress]

Did the lower level of academics prove a problem for your AL?

 

Yes! I know your sons are very accelerated and I don't presume to be able to speak for your situation, but yes, this proved to be a big obstacle for us.

 

English is a foreign language for us, we are not a bilingual family. I used Singapore Science gr 3&4, including all the extra supplements, with my then 7yo dd and she was bored out of her mind, but I couldn't accelerate her to grade 5&6 or higher because she couldn't handle that level of English input. She begged me to stop using English science materials and go back to Dutch curriculum.

 

I used Classical Writing Homer A&B with her at 9yo, I don't think she learnt a thing except for some diagramming, but I couldn't accelerate her to the next level, which caused massive frustration.

 

I'm a bit too tired at the moment to remember other situations, but I have had this exact same thing several times. Untill I stopped trying  :blushing: . 

 

I know other families who have succesfully done this, so I know it can be done, but I haven't managed to do it.

Either my kids are too accelerated, or their foreign language learning skills are too slow, either way the combination proved to be too difficult.

 

On the bright side, from what I read about your sons, I would guess their foreign language learning skills will probably be very good/fast and the gap between the level of academics they need and the level they can handle in Spanish will not be too big. So don't let my experience prevent you from trying!

[madteaparty]

When DS returns from France I plan to do history/geo and about 1/3 of literature in french.

We will be traveling full time then but he will still have his Skype tutor. I am also studying French and can thus far keep up.

Edit: I feel like my posts on this forum need a special signature "my kid is not nearly as accelerated as yours. Mildly hothoused"

[Gil]

When DS returns from France I plan to do history/geo and about 1/3 of literature in french.

We will be traveling full time then but he will still have his Skype tutor. I am also studying French and can thus far keep up.

Edit: I feel like my posts on this forum need a special signature "my kid is not nearly as accelerated as yours. Mildly hothoused"

Can you tell me more about the exchange program that your son is in? I think that my boys are a little younger than yours. I'm interested in hosting and sending them on an exchange as elementary/middle school students when they are a little older, but am having a hard time finding anything.

 

Once I found a company that took elementary aged students but have been unable to find that page/company/site again. Also, can you summarize what you guys do for French? (Or, if you feel like it, share in full detail. The FL is the most pressing part of our educational goals at the moment.)

 

[Jackie]

Can you tell me more about the exchange program that your son is in? I think that my boys are a little younger than yours. I'm interested in hosting and sending them on an exchange as elementary/middle school students when they are a little older, but am having a hard time finding anything.

 

Once I found a company that took elementary aged students but have been unable to find that page/company/site again.

I have this page bookmarked for future reference, maybe it's what you're looking for? http://www.enfamille.com

 

Or this one? http://www.rassias.com/program-ms.shtml

[madteaparty]

Can you tell me more about the exchange program that your son is in? I think that my boys are a little younger than yours. I'm interested in hosting and sending them on an exchange as elementary/middle school students when they are a little older, but am having a hard time finding anything.

 

Once I found a company that took elementary aged students but have been unable to find that page/company/site again. Also, can you summarize what you guys do for French? (Or, if you feel like it, share in full detail. The FL is the most pressing part of our educational goals at the moment.)

My DS is doing the En Famille program that has been discussed here a couple of times. I'm currently hosting my French "son" and DS goes there soon. So I can't speak to that experience yet but I will say all interactions with En Famille organization have been great and extremely professional. Thus far, I'm very happy with the program.

We have done various things with french, self study at home with Galore Park (highly recommend), a high school level class online, a weekly Skype tutor in France (who assigns a good amount of work), books with the audio simultaneously, etc.

[Monica_in_Switzerland]

I'm glad I stopped by the AL board, I don't visit too often, but like to browse now and again.  :-)

 

Clarification- my kids are accelerated, but not what I would consider "profoundly gifted"- 3rd grader doing 4th grade SM, reading at a 6-8th grade level in French and in English, excellent writing style, horrible spelling, excellent science.  1st grader reading at 3-4th grade level, not quite a year ahead in math.  

 

BUT, we are very, very bilingual!  We have the advantage of living in a French speaking country, and dh is French speaking as his first language.  Our family language is French, but I speak to the kids in English almost exclusively.  Because our situations are different, I'm not sure how far my ideas will go for you, but here goes:

 

- Get the book Fluent Forever from your library- Anki for vocab acquisition is not working that well for us, but there are many, many, many other good ideas for language acquisition inside.  

 

- Do comparative grammar.  Comparing the languages directly is one of my favourite ways to teach the similar, but not identical grammars of French and English.  German soon to follow.  :-)  You can find texts on comparative grammar, or just make it up as you go along, as I do.  

 

- Work on content in both languages.  Having a basic understanding of a subject will make it easier to understand in another language.  You can also look at frequency dictionaries, which can give you top x number of words in a particular domain, which could be enormously helpful.  ex, Get your "astronomy" vocabulary first, THEN read your Spanish astronomy book.  

 

I would continue math in English, but make sure kids can "read" math in the foreign language.  So, can they say, in Spanish, "245 - 170 = 75" or whatever.  This is how I do math, and also make sure the facts are down cold in both languages.  Chances are good your boys will ALWAYS do math in English though, and just sate their answers in Spanish, even if they go through immersion.  I have been living in a French speaking country for 10 years, I'm perfectly fluent, but I calculate mentally in English then just spit the answer out in French.  

 

- There's a few studies out showing that the fastest way to acquire foreign language is through reading.  The Fluent Forever book suggests picking a high interest series (ex Harry Potter) and reading along with the audio book.  After we've done a year of German, I plan to do the Percy Jackson series in German, as I think it's absurd to not read a classic in its original language if one is capable of it.  And HP is a classic of sorts for me, whereas Percy Jackson is just Percy Jackson.  :-D  

 

- I'm also holding the Star Trek original series in reserve, and plan on doing those in German- another high interest way to get oral comprehension in.  

 

 

Anyway, just some ideas.  We do about 75% of our writing in French, but often times I will critique in English, then son will make corrections in French.  Because the kids are ALREADY bilingual, this works well for us.  

 

 

[Monica_in_Switzerland]

Sorry for my enthusiastic oversees of "many" and "very."  I drank a Dr. Pepper today.  

[Nan in Mass]

I think this is a good age to be doing this.  I did some literature in French and history/geography at a lower level in French much later, in high school.  Because we had gone lightly on history previously, because the French textbook was heavily primary source based, and because it isn't a high interest area for us, the lower level wasn't a problem.  It wasn't really a much lower level.  My son is brightish, not profoundly gifted.  I would have been much more successful at giving my children a second language if my own French had been better, but I am glad I did as much as I did.  If I could do it again, I would work heavily on my own French when the children were small.  I did, and got to the point where I could conduct ordinary very small child life in French, but I couldn't do things like explain the seatbelt law or the complexities of moral decisions to my older son and he no longer needed me to be able to say the sorts of things I could say, like go brush your teeth.  I gave up with him.  The youngest speaks French.  He isn't fluent.  His grammar and vocabulary are lacking and his writing is miserable, but he can hold a conversation or travel comfortably, which is way more than I could do after my high school French classes.  I second reading as the fastest way to become fluent.  That and actually speaking and listening.  If I had had the resources that are available now on the internet, I would have been much more successful.  As far as worrying about errors - I decided fairly early on that bad French was much better than no French.  If I were you, in your circumstances, I would have the goal of getting my children reading at their own accelerated reading level in Spanish as soon as possible.  I'd tell them that was the goal and that it was going to be miserably boring for a little while until they reached that point, but that it would be well worth doing it.  Then I'd help them suffer through lower level reading until they reached their own level.  I would teach them to use a dictionary and tell them that the way to improve their vocabulary is just to look up every single word they don't know.  No memorization needed.  That happens automatically.  Interestingly, most of the vocabulary for a fictional book tends to appear in the first little bit of the book, so if they can suffer through looking up every word at the beginning of the book, the bulk of the book will go much faster.  Meanwhile, I would work on my own Spanish by reading and using a conversation program like hellotalk or something.  lingu (sp?) might be something you want to check out, also, for yourself.  The people I know personally who have had the most success with foreign language learning have done it by signing their children up for Saturday school.  Just in case any of that helps.

 

Nan

[bakpak]

Of course, I have Spanish-speaking friends from other countries who learned most of their English from watching English movies, so immersion via media can certainly take you quite far. I think learning lots of vocabulary in the mean-time while you await better immersion opportunities should pay off in the end.