Ok...help...please...

[RhondaM.]

Much of this is a vent....but I really do need some help with my oldest. I've mentioned in previous post that he struggles. He is immature, unmotivated and unfocused.

 

When he was little if I did not sit right next to him in every subject he would just get up to go do something and forget about his work, or become distracted by ANYTHING going on, in or out of the house.

 

As he got older, 4th-6th grade, he got a bit better. Not much, but he could sit still longer, seemed to enjoy reading finally, enjoyed science experiments, and could get math done without tears. I still needed to be in the same room, but he was better. School still took all day and we were doing just basics.

 

Ok, so NOW, our 2nd try for 9th grade this 15 year old is a 2nd grader all over again. For example....yesterday it took him 4 hours to get 15 pages of LOTR read. It was the prologue, and he was bored, and distracted and unfocused.

 

He is like this in all subjects...though granted not quite this bad. But he can easily draw something that should only take an hour into two hours. Three if he is having any trouble with the subject.

 

Writing is hard for him. He can sit down and creatively write on a story and it sounds very nice. It flows. Good sentence varity. But if he has to write a history paper he cannot seem to connect the dots. A summary he can do, a book report he can do. But an essay where he needs to prove or argue a point...no way. He cannot stay focused to work through it. We are using IEW and I have the SWI C which is helping him get organized. We are also going to read through the Lively Art of Writing. But again...I think it is more of a focusing problem than anything.

 

But then there are days when he wakes up on a different side of the bed. He can do his work well, in a timely manner, and do more than I even expected him to do. On those days he is very focused and proud of what he is doing. But these days are far and few between.

 

I did take him to our doctor and voiced my concerns...and of course he said ADD and gave me a prescription for that. I even filled it. But never used it.

 

Now I'm wondering if maybe I should not give it a try.

 

He is not a dumb kid, I've seen how well he can do. Nor is he a discipline problem. He sits down to do as I tell him to, but cannot stay focused.

 

And things he has an interest in he learns well. He reads computer books and is constantly working w/ computers and programs. And that is fine...but how do we get school done!?

 

I've signed him up with Hewitt this year. Hoping some outside accountability will help.

 

I've picked subjects that he is interesting in. We are doing Literary Lessons From LOTR. (We were just going to do fantasy, sci-fi and horror, but that changed when we signed up to Hewitt)

 

For history we will do 20th Century WH because that is what he is intersted in.

 

TT for algebra.

 

IEW and R&S 6 for writing/grammar

 

And that is it.

 

English I, History and Algebra I.

Later in the year we will add in PE and Health.

 

Not much is it? But anymore would take him all day long. And I have two other kids to work with as well.

 

I'm also out of state at the moment, in California, my home and all my school books (except the little I brought with me) are in Texas. And I'll be here until December or January.

 

I don't even feel like doing school. I'd rather hide under the covers all day.

 

What can I do?

Advice anyone?

 

RhondaM.

[HollyinNNV]

What is the worst thing that could happen if you tried the medication for a trial month or two? (I don't know what length of time it would take for it to be effective.)

Holly

[RhondaM.]

What is the worst thing that could happen if you tried the medication for a trial month or two? (I don't know what length of time it would take for it to be effective.)

Holly

 

I don't know. I've read such horrible things about the medications...that it scared me off.

 

And I have no idea how long it takes it to start working. I'd love ot hear anyones experience with or without it.

 

RhondaM.

[Nan in Mass]

My son was rather like that at 15. At 16, he was a bit better. Then suddenly, last year, when he was 17, he suddenly could do schoolwork in a much more timely fashion! I couldn't believe it! And in the meantime, he developed into an interesting person, one whose strengths we could appreciate, so by the time he actually could manage a more normal academic load (not a great college prep one, just a normal one), we had almost stopped worrying about him. Except for wondering if he would survive college. He could sit still, but couldn't focus on something he himself wasn't interested in. I don't know if it was gymnastics, which he's done since he was 7, that allowed him to sit still. I'm inclined to think he is just a still person, despite his great need to move. My oldest is fidgitier. I just kept hammering away at the academics, tried to keep the academics from preventing him from getting good at other, less academic things, and tried to structure things so that it was easier for him to concentrate. For example, I decided we'd read the literature aloud together. He didn't exactly develop into a good student, one who does academics easily and who likes them, but he can manage now. I hope. Still rather worried about precalc and intro chem at CC this fall... Anyway, I don't want to stop you from getting help if your son really has ADD. Mine doesn't. I just wanted to let you know that sometimes these boys bloom late, in and my particular case, I'm glad I didn't really do anything about it, just waited.

-Nan

[MommyThrice]

My middle child, but he is still much younger than yours. I am positive that if he were in public school he would be on medication. I would never do that, but I can understand why someone else would want to. What I have finally come to realize (and I have to remind myself of this each and every day) is that not all of our kids are going to be rocket scientists. This is the brain God gave him. I don't mean I'll accept bad behavior, but I do have to accept the he just doesn't "get it" as quickly as his brothers... and he doesn't really want to get it, either.

 

I do know that the individual attention he is getting will give him a much better education than he could get anywhere else. No one will love him like I do. I am NOT always patient with him, but I do keep trying. I look around my church and some the men I have the most respect for are electricians or carpenters, not the attorneys. This child is extremely hard-working physically, so maybe that's how he will provide for his family. He he grows up to love God and his family, I will be happy with that. It will not, however, make me feel like a successful educator - and my own pride makes me want him to do better so it will reflect well on me and homeschooling in general.

 

Can you find his strenghts and encourage those? There's more than one way to make a living in this world.

[Michelle in AL]

Hi Rhonda, I'm a nurse and just completed a CEU on ADD meds, I took the course because I work in a peds clinic ocassionally and wanted to know more about it. Something positive to consider about medications is: they can help your child focus in ways his brain is unable to do on it's own. He may be only to go so far on his own in learning, but meds could allow him to focus and go further. Medications should be closely monitored for side effects. Different kids react to different meds in different ways. Your doctor should find a med that is tolerable for your son and titrate it up to an effective dose. There has been shown a large risk of automobile accidents and untreated ADD. Medication could prevent that.

Having said that, I would only treat my child if I was sure he had ADD and behavior modification didn't work.

If you feel perhaps it's a motivation issue and not an ADD issue, perhaps outside classes would help. I've seen students who wouldn't do much for their parents shine when they took outside classes.

Just a thought.

[RhondaM.]

Nan, he will be 16 in December. I am really not trying to push him to be something he is not. But he has to complete school. I'm going to require what Hewitt requires, which is something like 21 credits, 6 of which are electives. 2 math, 2 science, 4 english and 3 1/2 history, and health. Electivers can be anything from PE to a job to volunteer work to computer classes we design ourself. I cannot make it any easier.

 

Since he is doing 9th grade for the 2nd time...plus was already an older 9th grader LAST year (fall birthday) I am even willing to let him take his GED after 11th if he will go to CC and start on the Game Designer degree he wanta to take.

 

I do not feel like I am pushing him. I am perfectly willing to let him grow up. I have encouraged him to follow his dreams and pursue the things that make him happy. But I can't let him mess with computer programs and play drums all day every day.

 

I left him reading in the livingroom...and I was just informed by his younger brother that he has fallen asleep with his LOTR book. :banghead:

He has been up for an hour, had breakfast, took a shower and dressed. He can't get to sleep at night or get up in the mornings. I don't know what to do with him.

 

Thanks for your help...I hope to wake up one day and fine a mature young man too.

[RhondaM.]

Hi Rhonda, I'm a nurse and just completed a CEU on ADD meds, I took the course because I work in a peds clinic ocassionally and wanted to know more about it. Something positive to consider about medications is: they can help your child focus in ways his brain is unable to do on it's own. He may be only to go so far on his own in learning, but meds could allow him to focus and go further. Medications should be closely monitored for side effects. Different kids react to different meds in different ways. Your doctor should find a med that is tolerable for your son and titrate it up to an effective dose. There has been shown a large risk of automobile accidents and untreated ADD. Medication could prevent that.

Having said that, I would only treat my child if I was sure he had ADD and behavior modification didn't work.

If you feel perhaps it's a motivation issue and not an ADD issue, perhaps outside classes would help. I've seen students who wouldn't do much for their parents shine when they took outside classes.

Just a thought.

 

Belive me when I say I am not pushing for this kid to drive for the very reason you mentioned. We we either do the BOOK portion of Drivers Ed this summer or next year. He will drive with his dad a long, long time before he is released on his own for even short trips. All because of the fact that he is so very unfocused and, yes, impulsive.

 

I want to try the meds so much, but am so afraid to. I am not a medication type person. I avoid it as much as I can.

 

I do have a neice who has ADD...and I saw how much it helped her. She was sooooooooo dreamy before she began her meds that she could have floated right away. You could SEE the difference after she started it.

 

My son is not dreamy. He is just unfocused. Everything gets his attention. So maybe that is more ADHD. An evaluater once said (when he was in 1st grade) that he had MILD ADHD.

 

The doctor that gave us the meds this time did not say which (AD or ADHD). But it was just a GP. NO extensive testing.

 

Maybe when we get home from from California we will try the meds.

[RhondaM.]

My middle child, but he is still much younger than yours. I am positive that if he were in public school he would be on medication. I would never do that, but I can understand why someone else would want to. What I have finally come to realize (and I have to remind myself of this each and every day) is that not all of our kids are going to be rocket scientists. This is the brain God gave him. I don't mean I'll accept bad behavior, but I do have to accept the he just doesn't "get it" as quickly as his brothers... and he doesn't really want to get it, either.

 

I do know that the individual attention he is getting will give him a much better education than he could get anywhere else. No one will love him like I do. I am NOT always patient with him, but I do keep trying. I look around my church and some the men I have the most respect for are electricians or carpenters, not the attorneys. This child is extremely hard-working physically, so maybe that's how he will provide for his family. He he grows up to love God and his family, I will be happy with that. It will not, however, make me feel like a successful educator - and my own pride makes me want him to do better so it will reflect well on me and homeschooling in general.

 

Can you find his strenghts and encourage those? There's more than one way to make a living in this world.

 

When he was young there was no way I would do it either....for one reason...I had this fear that he would not be able to TELL me how the meds made him feel. I figured that when he got older if he still needed it we might give it a try.

 

NOw I'm still afraid to try. But I'm also afraid not to try. Like a poster said below, a ADD/ADHD person driving can be dangerous. And yes, I can honestly say that noone would be safe with this kid on the road.

 

And I truly worry about his future. So I don't know...

[hsmamainva]

May I just say that this thread is very encouraging to me!! I have no advice, as I'm in the same proverbial boat!

 

My 14 year old has high functioning autism. He's technically a 9th grader, but he needs alot of help with his school work. I've had to modify everything to make it more manageable. I wouldn't even call what he's doing 'college-prep' either.

 

Our plan is for him to learn how to do math through Algebra 2 (cross your fingers, everyone!), learn to read high-school-level literature, write a coherent essay, and be able to do his work independently enough that he could go to the community college when he's 18 (he doesn't know what he wants to do, yet, but I want that to be an available option...so we keep plugging away!)

 

He's a good worker, but he's easily frustrated and easily overwhelmed. So I try to schedule his day into small chunks, with frequent breaks.

 

I'm glad to hear that some of this could be just a lack of maturity on his part! (We were told when he was diagnosed with autism at age 6, that he'd never learn to read or do basic math, so we're thrilled with the progress he's made!) And I'm trying not to push him too hard or to plan too far ahead. He IS a late bloomer (he didn't learn to read until he was almost 9), so I'm hoping that he'll continue to progress steadily over the next 4 years!

[Laura in OH]

...

I left him reading in the livingroom...and I was just informed by his younger brother that he has fallen asleep with his LOTR book. :banghead:

He has been up for an hour, had breakfast, took a shower and dressed. He can't get to sleep at night or get up in the mornings. I don't know what to do with him...

 

I find interesting your phrase that sometimes he "gets up on the right side of the bed" and has a day where he can focus. Have you ever tried adjusting his diet? Can you keep a food diary of everything he eats/drinks for a solid month, making a note when/if he has one of those "good" days? Maybe I'm being too simplistic, but could this be the result of a food allergy/intolerance or something just missing from his diet?

 

Just an idea -- YMMV!

[RhondaM.]

I find interesting your phrase that sometimes he "gets up on the right side of the bed" and has a day where he can focus. Have you ever tried adjusting his diet? Can you keep a food diary of everything he eats/drinks for a solid month, making a note when/if he has one of those "good" days? Maybe I'm being too simplistic, but could this be the result of a food allergy/intolerance or something just missing from his diet?

 

Just an idea -- YMMV!

 

Oh man, any time anyone mentions diets I just cringe. Because if we had to adjust it I wouldn't know how to start.

 

I could keep keep track of his diet for a month...but it probably would not do any good as his good days do not come that often. Maybe a 6 month journal would be better. :glare:

[Kathy in MD]

There are many problems that display every single ADHD or ADD symptom. Is your doctor familiar with them and rule them out? A few problems that can look like ADHD are developmental vision problems, food allergies and sensitivities, Sensory Processing Disorder, and, IMHO, auditory processing problems. Of course any or all of these problems can co-exist with ADHD, making the symptoms worse.

 

You could try the medicine and see if your ds responds well. But there are many different drugs because different individuals with ADHD don't always respond well to a certain drug or dosage. You might be better off going to a specialist with more experience in adjusting ADHD medicines and in spotting other possible problems.

 

Added: If you go to a specialist who also knows how diet affects behavior and concentration, he may be able to send you directly to the most common problems for testing. For example, our dev. ped. identified dairy and wheat as the most likely culprets for my ds. The first tested substance was my ds's problems. End of testing and no food diary.

[RhondaM.]

There are many problems that display every single ADHD or ADD symptom. Is your doctor familiar with them and rule them out? A few problems that can look like ADHD are developmental vision problems, food allergies and sensitivities, Sensory Processing Disorder, and, IMHO, auditory processing problems. Of course any or all of these problems can co-exist with ADHD, making the symptoms worse.

 

You could try the medicine and see if your ds responds well. But there are many different drugs because different individuals with ADHD don't always respond well to a certain drug or dosage. You might be better off going to a specialist with more experience in adjusting ADHD medicines and in spotting other possible problems.

 

Added: If you go to a specialist who also knows how diet affects behavior and concentration, he may be able to send you directly to the most common problems for testing. For example, our dev. ped. identified dairy and wheat as the most likely culprets for my ds. The first tested substance was my ds's problems. End of testing and no food diary.

 

Thank you. I will keep this in mind and look into it when we get back to Texas .

[Nan in Mass]

I didn't mean to imply that you were pushing. Or rather, I didn't mean to imply that I didn't push and that pushing is inappropriate. I PPPUUUSSSHHHEEEDDD. I just managed somehow not to issue too many ultimatums, or give up, or say anything I'd regret, or do anything drastic like stop giving him the education I wanted him to have, or give him to someone else to educate because I wasn't succeeding (as far as I could see). That is what I meant by waiting. I didn't get much output back. And I couldn't rely on him to do much input by himself. And then when he turned 17, I got output and he could do quite a lot of the input on his own. I'm not critisizing your plans. They seem like a good idea.

 

Part of my own problem might have been comparisons to what some students so easily seem to manage on this board. Take math, for instance. I was rather worried at first to find I couldn't give my high schooler the math book and have him read the lesson and do the problems, just needing me to explain anything he couldn't understand by reading the book. Then I thought about how I learned math in public school. LOL. I had someone tell me the math and then work lots of problems on the board. Lots. Only then did I try to solve the problems myself. Even in college it worked this way. If I didn't understand, I went to my father. I didn't read the book. In college, yes, I read the book as a last resort, but certainly not in high school. I decided that the sample problems in the book just weren't enough problems for my son to catch onto the pattern, and that it wasn't going to ruin him for life if I sat with him and read him the chapter, actually worked the problems out for him while he watched, worked extra ones out, and then watched while he worked the first few himself. And I decided that it wouldn't kill him if we did the literature aloud together instead of giving him the book to read to himself. We did Conceptual Physics last year. I read the chapter aloud, clarifying anything I found confusing, and we did the review questions and think and explains orally together. Then he did the plug and chugs on his own. And so forth. Yes, it would have been nice if he could have worked on his own. And sometimes he could. And sometimes, it just looked like he could and when he finally looked like he was lost, I was left with lots of misconceptions to untangle and explain. I decided it would be easier just to work closely with him all the time. I'm lucky that my younger one is both more independent so he can do some stuff on his own and better at the academics so he can work with the older one and me for some stuff. I guess what I meant by waiting was that I worked with him and helped him and modified and adapted as best I could until he seemed more able to do things on his own. The story could have turned out awful if it had turned out some other method would have helped him to be more "normal" (whatever that is) academically or if he had medical problems that could have been fixed. We would have wasted all those years. In my case, though, I just had a not very academic, lopsided talents-wise, late bloomer, so my approach worked pretty well. Homeschooling, with its flexibility to allow the child to aquire an education some other way than academics, kept his self-esteem from being damaged and kept him the sweet child he was born. It was scary for me, though. And your situation may be entirely different. I just was grateful for the people (Quiver of 10 comes to mind) who kept telling me every time I worried here that they had a child like that who suddenly got better at academics when they were older.

 

It is a fine line we walk between making them better at something they are naturally wired for and letting them be bad at some things, and not pushing them to learn the essential things that will let them lead a happy adult life. With these children, time is so precious because everything takes so long. Where you spend the time is a big decision, much more so than for ordinary children. I made a list of things I considered essential (be able to write an essay in a reasonable amount of time) and worth spending vast amounts of time on, and those I didn't (like spelling-we could have spent 2 hours a day on spelling and in the end, he would still have been only barely adequate). I concentrated on skills, mostly, and let the content take care of itself, sort of, since his memory is bad. The list helped a bit, but it is still really hard to decide where that line is. Where do you take the time needed to get something down? Where do you let something slide and wait for them to grow into it? It would take a much better teacher than I am to figure that out.

 

Anyway, I didn't mean to sound like I was critisizing. If there is one thing I've learned trying to homeschool this son, it is that everyone is different and what works for one person won't necessarily work for others. And even when you know your son better than anyone but himself, it can still be hard to decide what it right for him. GRIN

 

-Nan

[RhondaM.]

::Anyway, I didn't mean to sound like I was critisizing.::

 

Oh, Nan, I didn't for one second think you were doing that. I've read too many of your post to think that. Ever!

I think you just heard my frustration at the situation, not at you or what you said. I find all your words of wisdom so very helpful...and most of the time they make (most of) my worries poke at me a little less.

 

Yes, the fine line is there. And I don't know how to walk it. His reading is going a bit faster this morning, Maybe lit will only take 3 hours this morning rather than 4.

[Carol in Cal.]

Have you looked at nutritional supplements? I've heard great things about Omega Brites in situations like this.

 

Also, my understanding of the ADD medications is that they are stimulants but they actually calm down people with ADD by stimulating the part of their brain that exercises self-control. It's paradoxical, to a large extent. Anyway, some people who want a middle path try to just use caffeine. They give their children 1/2 cup of coffee at the beginning of the day, and another 1/2 cup at lunchtime, and then some of them observe that their children actually focus better.

 

I have also heard that teenagers need to sleep later in the morning and go to bed later than adults, and so one of the things I would try is letting him wake up later, like at 10AM, and do his homework right away, but then also allow him to stay up later.

[RhondaM.]

Have you looked at nutritional supplements? I've heard great things about Omega Brites in situations like this.

 

Also, my understanding of the ADD medications is that they are stimulants but they actually calm down people with ADD by stimulating the part of their brain that exercises self-control. It's paradoxical, to a large extent. Anyway, some people who want a middle path try to just use caffeine. They give their children 1/2 cup of coffee at the beginning of the day, and another 1/2 cup at lunchtime, and then some of them observe that their children actually focus better.

 

I have also heard that teenagers need to sleep later in the morning and go to bed later than adults, and so one of the things I would try is letting him wake up later, like at 10AM, and do his homework right away, but then also allow him to stay up later.

 

I've read about the Omega stuff and have been meaning to get some...

 

And yes, for a time when he was younger the coffee really seemed to help.

 

And I've tried letting him keep his own hours as far as when he wakes and sleeps. It does not seem to help much. I have a hard time doing this with him because I am a very early riser...so by 3-4 pm I am having a hard time with patience. I just can't keep on keeping on allllllllll day.

[Nan in Mass]

Phew! The last thing I want to do is add to your problems. Or make them sound more trivial or something.

 

My son tripled his reading speed this spring in 5 minutes! I'm not saying this will work in your case because I have no idea if your son reads slowly or just has trouble keeping himself reading. My son had both problems, and now that he is older, the keeping on hearing what you are reading to yourself problem is much less of a problem. The slowness in reading was helped a whole bunch when he took his finger and ran it along underneath the line he was reading. It turned out (grrrr) that he'd known for years that this helped a bunch but that he'd been scolded for it repeatedly in elementary school and told it was babyish and so didn't want to do it. He's finally old enough now that he doesn't care anymore and was willing to try it. It keeps him going straight forward. When he doesn't do it, he skips around a lot. We timed him with and without and it tripled his speed!!!! So easy! Obviously, he doesn't want to bother most of the time, but if it is something he wants to get done with fast, he has this option.

Just in case it helps any...

-Nan

[Nan in Mass]

I found that I am ineffective as a teacher after lunchtime, mostly because I have trouble making myself do it. We start at 7 and they do something independent after lunch. I would find it SO hard to do schoolwork at 3 or 4, especially if I had other children I was dealing with earlier. I'm toasted by then and lucky if I can pull together some supper. I think you are doing super well to even try. Fortunately, my children aren't night owls. I know someone who has a child whom she homeschooled because of extensive allergies and because he just couldn't do schoolwork in the mornings. He was asleep. Very asleep. Hard when you are wired that way. I will say, though, that many, many computer geeks are, so he's headed in the right direction and will be in good company.

-Nan

[JennW in SoCal]

Rhonda,

 

I have a son who struggles mightily with school work, yet who is very capable, even has tested as gifted. He is the kind of kid that makes you smack your head against the wall, that makes you think he is just lazy and unmotivated. But he simply has ADHD/inattentive type, and some other neurological issues as well -- it is how he was born, and how he is wired. We paid to have a educational psychologist do the testing, give a diagnosis and identify his strengths and weaknesses, and with that information the pediatrician then was able to fine tune the prescription he gave us.

 

Behavioral and environmental modifications help to a certain extent. Things like having a checklist, a routine of when to do things, listening to books on tape while reading, working only in the most boring room of the house with me right next to him and the dog and other distractions kept far, far away. Sitting on a large exercise ball instead of in a chair. We've used tutors and outside classes, thinking he'd respond better to someone other than mom. Coffee helps some, though I'm not convinced about dietary changes making any difference.

 

But the ONLY thing that got him through high school algebra and science classes was Ritalin. My son only took it as needed, used the lowest dose possible, and it got him through his math and science work each day, got him through some standardized tests. Without the medication he can do the work, but the effort it requires to stay on task exhausts him, and sometimes he can only focus on fighting to stay on task. It really handicapped him, made him feel stupid. With the medication, he could focus without a second thought, and suddenly the dreaded subjects were a pleasure for him.

 

We homeschooled without medication until 7th grade, and he has used it on and off ever since, with the pediatrician tweaking the prescription each time we decide to go with the meds again. That first day he tried it out I wanted to cry because I could see what a positive difference the medication was making -- I felt horrible for having denied him that help for so long. It made such a positive difference without any side effects. The stigma against the meds is understandable as they are over-prescribed and can have scary side effects, but good grief, would we deny our children insulin if they were diabetic? ADHD meds are not evil, and families who decide to use medication are not choosing the easy way out.

 

Someone mentioned playing to your son's strengths, and I want to whole-heartedly concur with that bit of advice. My son has been very successful in his volunteer jobs, all of which he does without medication. It has been a great boost to his self esteem and it has reinforced his career ambitions.

 

One last random thought....I think the prologue of the Lord of the Rings is truly boring!! A real slog of a read even for those of us without attention issues!!

 

Hope my experience helps you!

[Michelle in AL]

Jennifer reminded me of something. If you have a school that has psychology majors (often a masters program) they will often do testing for learning disabilities, ADD etc at a reduced cost. It would be a great peace of mind to me to have my child objectively tested to be sure of a diagnosis. We did this with one dd when she was 5 and they were great.

[dawn of ns]

I don't know. I've read such horrible things about the medications...that it scared me off.

 

And I have no idea how long it takes it to start working. I'd love ot hear anyones experience with or without it.

 

RhondaM.

 

Don't be scared!

 

I was so much like your son when I was younger. Not hyperactive but slooooow. Concentrating on anything was a battle I generally lost - unless something completely caught my interest and then I was oblivious to the world around me. Working on school work was hard because I couldn't order my thoughts (How do you outline a report if you can't outline a basic thought?). I couldn't read texts. My eyes would slide right over the words - I could read the same page a half-dozen times and never understood what it meant. Lots of other stuff.

 

I was diagnosed with ADD when I was 15 and given a prescription for ritalin. It worked immediately and it felt like taking a breath after being under water for too long. My brain fog cleared, I could order my thoughts and actions and I could focus on work. I could keep a thought in my head long enough to act on it!

 

I've taken it off and on over the years and am back on it now. I find that if I take it for awhile and work on things I have real trouble with I can learn strategies that I can use even off the meds. It makes a real difference to learn how to do certain things, like focus, when you have a tool that actually lets you feel what it's like to be able to do that. People told me hundreds of times before ritalin to focus but I never knew what they meant by that.

 

Side effects for me have been a suppressed appetite. I know some people think that doesn't sound so bad but I won't notice I haven't eaten until I'm already getting a little weak and headachey. I deal with that by eating a large carb and/or protein rich breakfast before I take my pill and then make myself sit down for lunch. The other side effect I sometimes have is when I've taken a pill and also had a couple of cups of coffee, a chocolate bar, etc. Basically just too much stimulant and I get shaky. Again, that's just a matter of watching what I eat and drink. Less the meds fault then mine.

 

It isn't a cure all and it isn't magic. I find it doesn't do much good if I don't get to bed at a reasonable hour, don't eat right and don't exercise. Those are at least as important as the ritalin and frankly, if I haven't done those things, I won't take the ritalin because in my mind it's not a crutch for bad days; it's a tool I have to work with when I'm in the right frame of mind. The work I do with it is set up routines for myself, schedules to help give my days a good foundation perform tasks that require a lot of careful thought and energy (rearranging bookshelves, studying or budgeting and recordkeeping).

 

I think I've mentioned everything I wanted to. If you have any further thoughts or questions, fire away.

 

My advice would be to give it a try if it sounds like it might help. Keep a journal, have your son keep one as well, of any effects, negative and postive. That will give you both a good way to evaluate and review his time on it. Keep in mind that it clears out of the system pretty quickly and it's not a drug that is going to do any permanent damage on a short term trial basis.

[RhondaM.]

Jennifer,

Thank you!

I think the first time he was tested it was with a psychologist...and he was given Adderal...however you spell that drug. He took it a few times, but it was a very low dose and I didn't see any change. This time a regular GP prescribed the meds. Could it hurt for him to take what I already have before having another evaluation, this time one with more of a specialist? Or maybe I should go ahead with this while we are here in Dana Point, CA since we will be here for MONTHS.

 

But I don't even know where to start looking for a doctor. I'm not even sure what sort of doctor to take him to.

 

Can anyone help me with this part?

 

Thanks again..EVERYONE...so much.

[RhondaM.]

Don't be scared!

 

I was so much like your son when I was younger. Not hyperactive but slooooow. Concentrating on anything was a battle I generally lost - unless something completely caught my interest and then I was oblivious to the world around me. Working on school work was hard because I couldn't order my thoughts (How do you outline a report if you can't outline a basic thought?). I couldn't read texts. My eyes would slide right over the words - I could read the same page a half-dozen times and never understood what it meant. Lots of other stuff.

 

I was diagnosed with ADD when I was 15 and given a prescription for ritalin. It worked immediately and it felt like taking a breath after being under water for too long. My brain fog cleared, I could order my thoughts and actions and I could focus on work. I could keep a thought in my head long enough to act on it!

 

I've taken it off and on over the years and am back on it now. I find that if I take it for awhile and work on things I have real trouble with I can learn strategies that I can use even off the meds. It makes a real difference to learn how to do certain things, like focus, when you have a tool that actually lets you feel what it's like to be able to do that. People told me hundreds of times before ritalin to focus but I never knew what they meant by that.

 

Side effects for me have been a suppressed appetite. I know some people think that doesn't sound so bad but I won't notice I haven't eaten until I'm already getting a little weak and headachey. I deal with that by eating a large carb and/or protein rich breakfast before I take my pill and then make myself sit down for lunch. The other side effect I sometimes have is when I've taken a pill and also had a couple of cups of coffee, a chocolate bar, etc. Basically just too much stimulant and I get shaky. Again, that's just a matter of watching what I eat and drink. Less the meds fault then mine.

 

It isn't a cure all and it isn't magic. I find it doesn't do much good if I don't get to bed at a reasonable hour, don't eat right and don't exercise. Those are at least as important as the ritalin and frankly, if I haven't done those things, I won't take the ritalin because in my mind it's not a crutch for bad days; it's a tool I have to work with when I'm in the right frame of mind. The work I do with it is set up routines for myself, schedules to help give my days a good foundation perform tasks that require a lot of careful thought and energy (rearranging bookshelves, studying or budgeting and recordkeeping).

 

I think I've mentioned everything I wanted to. If you have any further thoughts or questions, fire away.

 

My advice would be to give it a try if it sounds like it might help. Keep a journal, have your son keep one as well, of any effects, negative and postive. That will give you both a good way to evaluate and review his time on it. Keep in mind that it clears out of the system pretty quickly and it's not a drug that is going to do any permanent damage on a short term trial basis.

 

Dawn, I somehow missed this post earlier. I miss a lot of things with the way this board is set up. I'm not complaining though, no not me. :glare:

Anyhow...thanks for posting this. I think we are going to have to try it. I was going to do it last year but chickened out. Now I'm sorry.

 

Thanks again.

[RhondaM.]

I found that I am ineffective as a teacher after lunchtime, mostly because I have trouble making myself do it. We start at 7 and they do something independent after lunch. I would find it SO hard to do schoolwork at 3 or 4, especially if I had other children I was dealing with earlier. I'm toasted by then and lucky if I can pull together some supper. I think you are doing super well to even try. Fortunately, my children aren't night owls. I know someone who has a child whom she homeschooled because of extensive allergies and because he just couldn't do schoolwork in the mornings. He was asleep. Very asleep. Hard when you are wired that way. I will say, though, that many, many computer geeks are, so he's headed in the right direction and will be in good company.

-Nan

 

Nan...I have two boys. A 15 yr old and a 12 yr old. My oldest was an early riser. My younger child would sleep alllllll day long if I let him. Then suddenly about a year ago they switched. Now my younger one gets up at 7am every morning...and my teenager can't get up. I'm like, GUYS! PLEASE! Cause i can't go all day, I just can't.

[RhondaM.]

Phew! The last thing I want to do is add to your problems. Or make them sound more trivial or something.

 

My son tripled his reading speed this spring in 5 minutes! I'm not saying this will work in your case because I have no idea if your son reads slowly or just has trouble keeping himself reading. My son had both problems, and now that he is older, the keeping on hearing what you are reading to yourself problem is much less of a problem. The slowness in reading was helped a whole bunch when he took his finger and ran it along underneath the line he was reading. It turned out (grrrr) that he'd known for years that this helped a bunch but that he'd been scolded for it repeatedly in elementary school and told it was babyish and so didn't want to do it. He's finally old enough now that he doesn't care anymore and was willing to try it. It keeps him going straight forward. When he doesn't do it, he skips around a lot. We timed him with and without and it tripled his speed!!!! So easy! Obviously, he doesn't want to bother most of the time, but if it is something he wants to get done with fast, he has this option.

Just in case it helps any...

-Nan

 

Wow! Hey, we'll give it a whirl. Easier than diet changes! :)

He is a slow reader...he can read outloud ok, he mumbles and is hard to listen to, but he can read just fine. So I think he is slow because he is just fighting to think only about the reading. Today did go better than yesterday. He even enjoyed it as well as the Additional notes in the LOTR guide. We even had a nice discussion! And we got math done. All before 4PM. But yikes, we didn't even get to history or writing.

 

Thanks again Nan.:001_smile:

[Kathy in MD]

Jennifer,

Thank you!

I think the first time he was tested it was with a psychologist...and he was given Adderal...however you spell that drug. He took it a few times, but it was a very low dose and I didn't see any change. This time a regular GP prescribed the meds. Could it hurt for him to take what I already have before having another evaluation, this time one with more of a specialist? Or maybe I should go ahead with this while we are here in Dana Point, CA since we will be here for MONTHS.

 

But I don't even know where to start looking for a doctor. I'm not even sure what sort of doctor to take him to.

 

Can anyone help me with this part?

 

Thanks again..EVERYONE...so much.

 

I took my ds to a developmental pediatrician who was a wholistic doctor in that she looked into diet, nutritional deficencies, heavy metals, multiple coexisting problem and a lot more in addition to the normal drugs. She is now a DAN! (defeat Autism Now) doctor.

 

Others have seen neuropsychs and regular psychatrists. Some like to go to major clinics with a large staff of specialists.

[Melinda]

I have not read through all the posts, so sorry if this has been mentioned. If you are wary of trying medication, there are vitamins that can be used to homeopathically improve attentiveness. I have a friend with two autistic sons who swears by these specific vitamins. Let me know if you'd like me to find out what they're called or more info.

[Laurie4b]

ADHD means he is hyperactive/impulsive. ADD means inattentive. It doesn't have to look "dreamy", just not be able to focus, as you've described. Girls with ADD or ADHD often look very different from boys, which is why they are underdiagnosed.

[RhondaM.]

ADHD means he is hyperactive/impulsive. ADD means inattentive. It doesn't have to look "dreamy", just not be able to focus, as you've described. Girls with ADD or ADHD often look very different from boys, which is why they are underdiagnosed.

 

Well, he has never been what I'd call hyper. He was a normal active boy, and I don't just say that because he was mine. He was a handful, into everything all the time. But he wasn't hyper, bouncing off the walls.

 

But he is very impulsive. And of course very unfocused.

 

I've read about ADD/ADHD for years and still am not quite sure which he is...ADD or mildly ADHD.

[ChrisN in NY]

Rhonda,

 

I posted a long-ish reply, but when I clicked submit I got a "server is busy right now" message and lost it all. Grr.

 

The short of it is that my ds was diagnosed with off-the-charts inattentive ADD when he was 17. He was put on Adderall, started at 10 mg and ended up at 30.

 

The difference was amazing. Ds noticed it right away. It was so great for him to be able to focus on one thing instead of his brain trying to follow multiple tracks simultaneously.

 

After high school, he took a herbal product called Neuro-PS from Vitamin World that helped, without all the side effects of the Adderall. Ds found that he needed 5 capsules per day, split up over the day, for the same effect as 30mg of Adderall.

 

He's since finished Bible school with no meds. He wanted to learn to work without them because he's called to missions and will be living who-knows-where. He's become quite successful at using his ADD to work positively for him -- I suppose the best way that I can explain it is that he's learned how to follow one track at a time, while switching back and forth among the among the multiple tracks his brain is on...ignoring at the moment what he doesn't need. (I'm not sure that even makes sense)..

 

HTH.

:grouphug:

[RhondaM.]

Rhonda,

 

I posted a long-ish reply, but when I clicked submit I got a "server is busy right now" message and lost it all. Grr.

 

The short of it is that my ds was diagnosed with off-the-charts inattentive ADD when he was 17. He was put on Adderall, started at 10 mg and ended up at 30.

 

The difference was amazing. Ds noticed it right away. It was so great for him to be able to focus on one thing instead of his brain trying to follow multiple tracks simultaneously.

 

After high school, he took a herbal product called Neuro-PS from Vitamin World that helped, without all the side effects of the Adderall. Ds found that he needed 5 capsules per day, split up over the day, for the same effect as 30mg of Adderall.

 

He's since finished Bible school with no meds. He wanted to learn to work without them because he's called to missions and will be living who-knows-where. He's become quite successful at using his ADD to work positively for him -- I suppose the best way that I can explain it is that he's learned how to follow one track at a time, while switching back and forth among the among the multiple tracks his brain is on...ignoring at the moment what he doesn't need. (I'm not sure that even makes sense)..

 

HTH.

:grouphug:

 

Yes, it makes perfect sense actually.

I'm going to look into the natural methods right away. If, once we get back to Texas I've seen no improvement I'll have him reevaluated by a specialist.

 

I really have been meaning to try the Omega...for all of us, not just him, because it is supposed to be so healthy. I just have not been sure exactly what to get. Could he take both the Neuro-PS and the Omega at the same time I wonder?

 

Thanks very much!

[RhondaM.]

Chris...I went to VW website to check out the Neuro-PS. They have it in 100 and 200 mg. Which did your son take?

 

Boy this stuff isn't cheap is it!?

[GailV]

Our nephew is much the same. When he was in high school he was on the wrestling team, and the coach requested that the kids on the team take fish oil. Nephew discovered that he could focus better when he took the fish oil supplements.

 

This was in addition to his ADHD medication, by the way. The fish oil gave him a boost beyond that, and allowed him to do better on the days he didn't medicate.

 

Just a thought. The omega 3 fatty acids are so crucial to brain function, and some people need more than others. Also, they are often scanty in our diets.

[Cindy in WA]

Our oldest who is now 19 is much like your son, of course, with his own special flare!

 

We never did try the medications. I don't think we really understood that he was ADD until just recently. We had received conflicting advice when he was younger. We were so concerned about the meds that I doubt it would have made a difference.

 

I won't repeat the advice you've already received, but one thing I'd add is physical exercise. Our son seems to need to move even to this day. The physical output seems to help him focus better. He can do and needs to do a level of physical work or exercise that most people can't. When he was home, we would do one subject of school and then send him outside to move, do more school, then have him move. This helped to get through the day.

 

He is now learning more coping strategies as a young adult. He realizes his own limitations, he's working on how to survive in the world. He definately hasn't arrived, but he can now identify how he's feeling and responding on his own. He has considered taking natural supplements, but because he lives on his own, he knows he wouldn't remember to take them. Maybe when he marries?!?!

 

I appreciate your loving heart toward your son. I know how difficult it can be. Our son was also defiant on top of the ADD tendencies. Living with him was hard work. I know you'll figure out the best path for your young man.

 

Oh, just a note, our son drives and actually is a pretty good driver. He loves doing it so much that he focuses on the task at hand. Hope that is encouraging to you.

 

Cindy

[dawn of ns]

ADHD means he is hyperactive/impulsive. ADD means inattentive. It doesn't have to look "dreamy", just not be able to focus, as you've described. Girls with ADD or ADHD often look very different from boys, which is why they are underdiagnosed.

 

I'm definitely ADD myself. Hyperactive is NOT how anyone who knows me would describe me. :D

[ChrisN in NY]

Chris...I went to VW website to check out the Neuro-PS. They have it in 100 and 200 mg. Which did your son take?

 

Boy this stuff isn't cheap is it!?

 

 

Rhonda,

 

My ds took the 100mg. I forgot to add that he was very happy with how well it worked without the side effects that Adderall had. The side effects were mild in his case, but he was happy to be done with them, you know?

 

Neuro-PS isn't cheap, but compared to paying for Adderall every month, not to mention the hassle of going to the docs office to get the paper prescription every month, taking it to the pharmacy, going back later to pick the script up, then packing it to mail to ds in Florida... it wasn't really a bad deal.

 

In your case, imho, it's worth a try. If it makes as much difference for your ds as it did for mine, I'd say it's worth every penny.

 

I know enough about Omega Brites to know that they are a totally different thing than Neuro-PS. I would consider giving them together, but would research each one's ingredients more thoroughly first. If I did give both, also would start one, find a dose that works, then start the other.

 

 

:grouphug: I know how frustrated you are.

[RhondaM.]

Rhonda,

 

My ds took the 100mg. I forgot to add that he was very happy with how well it worked without the side effects that Adderall had. The side effects were mild in his case, but he was happy to be done with them, you know?

 

Neuro-PS isn't cheap, but compared to paying for Adderall every month, not to mention the hassle of going to the docs office to get the paper prescription every month, taking it to the pharmacy, going back later to pick the script up, then packing it to mail to ds in Florida... it wasn't really a bad deal.

 

In your case, imho, it's worth a try. If it makes as much difference for your ds as it did for mine, I'd say it's worth every penny.

 

I know enough about Omega Brites to know that they are a totally different thing than Neuro-PS. I would consider giving them together, but would research each one's ingredients more thoroughly first. If I did give both, also would start one, find a dose that works, then start the other.

 

 

:grouphug: I know how frustrated you are.

 

Thanks again! I am going to get some of this in the next couple of weeks! I did notice that you can get it cheaper...depending on where you buy it. Is there anywhere to get good quality but not spend so much? I'll spend what I have to of course and I totally agree about it being much easier than dealing with doctors. And if it works I'd rather go with a natural method anyway!

 

Thanks for all the information, this has been very helpful!

[RhondaM.]

Our oldest who is now 19 is much like your son, of course, with his own special flare!

 

We never did try the medications. I don't think we really understood that he was ADD until just recently. We had received conflicting advice when he was younger. We were so concerned about the meds that I doubt it would have made a difference.

 

I won't repeat the advice you've already received, but one thing I'd add is physical exercise. Our son seems to need to move even to this day. The physical output seems to help him focus better. He can do and needs to do a level of physical work or exercise that most people can't. When he was home, we would do one subject of school and then send him outside to move, do more school, then have him move. This helped to get through the day.

 

He is now learning more coping strategies as a young adult. He realizes his own limitations, he's working on how to survive in the world. He definately hasn't arrived, but he can now identify how he's feeling and responding on his own. He has considered taking natural supplements, but because he lives on his own, he knows he wouldn't remember to take them. Maybe when he marries?!?!

 

I appreciate your loving heart toward your son. I know how difficult it can be. Our son was also defiant on top of the ADD tendencies. Living with him was hard work. I know you'll figure out the best path for your young man.

 

Oh, just a note, our son drives and actually is a pretty good driver. He loves doing it so much that he focuses on the task at hand. Hope that is encouraging to you.

 

Cindy

 

I do believe that physical activity helps! Just burning off that energy. One thing my ds does to work off some energy several times a day is play his drums...I never would have thought of it as a physical activity, but it is.

That seems to help him much more than the judo he was once involced in...probably because he can do it on and off all day in short spurts.

We have a treadmill too which he likes walking on.

 

We are in California now though until December and the drums and treadmill are at home in Texas. He misses those drums! (shh...don't tell...but...I do NOT miss the drums! It has been a nice, quiet break for all of us! :tongue_smilie:)

[Veronica in VA]

Phew! The last thing I want to do is add to your problems. Or make them sound more trivial or something.

 

My son tripled his reading speed this spring in 5 minutes! I'm not saying this will work in your case because I have no idea if your son reads slowly or just has trouble keeping himself reading. My son had both problems, and now that he is older, the keeping on hearing what you are reading to yourself problem is much less of a problem. The slowness in reading was helped a whole bunch when he took his finger and ran it along underneath the line he was reading. It turned out (grrrr) that he'd known for years that this helped a bunch but that he'd been scolded for it repeatedly in elementary school and told it was babyish and so didn't want to do it. He's finally old enough now that he doesn't care anymore and was willing to try it. It keeps him going straight forward. When he doesn't do it, he skips around a lot. We timed him with and without and it tripled his speed!!!! So easy! Obviously, he doesn't want to bother most of the time, but if it is something he wants to get done with fast, he has this option.

Just in case it helps any...

-Nan

 

 

This actually helps me, too. I use a bookmark usually, but if I don't, and I'm reading something that takes a lot of attention I need to. Or, I hold a pen in my hand - I don't know why this works, but it sort of is a signal to me that this is serious, I have to concentrate.

 

Veronica