Latin after leaving Lone Pine

[mom4peace]

My DS12 has just left Lone Pine Latin 100. He's not managing the more intuitive and immersive approach, largely, I think, because he's a trees-to-forest guy when it comes to languages. He has Aspergers, and he has a great memory. He also has an enormous amount of anxiety. I know some folks adore Lone Pine, but it just isn't for him. 

Anyway, he still wants to learn Latin (classical, not ecclesiastical). He worked through Getting Started with Latin last spring, enjoying it and learning it easily. It was also, mom friendly, a requirement, as I only know the Latin in that GSWL book. I think the goal would be to move into Lukeion Latin next year, probably the first course, so this isn't about trying to make a huge amount of ground in a year. This is about getting comfortable and needing something that makes good use of charts and patterns. That's what he need -- charts and patterns. (Yes, we tried making those for Lone Pine Latin, but he reached an anxiety point where no learning was possible and his mind was closed. Yes, we're working on that, too. 

 

I've looked a good deal online. I don't feel confident diving into Wheelock or Cambridge with him -- I need something a bit more gradual but not slow. He learns quickly. Cute is not going to cut it -- I know chants are popular, but that's really not his learning channel. 

 

Thanks. 

[zaichiki]

My oldest is taking Latin online through http://thevhscollaborative.org/ at his high school.  Previously, he had homeschooled and studied First and Second Form Latin/Memoria Press (Ecclesiastical).  This is his first experience with Classical, but the difference is really no big deal for him.

 

The VHS collaborative is used extensively by school-at-home families in Florida and by magnet schools across the US.  This is a pick-and-choose class type of thing.  Maybe take a look?

 

Good luck!

 

Edited to add: The Virtual High School offers Latin 1 and 2 right now, using Ecce Romani.

[JenneinCA]

No ideas about the curriculum part, I just wanted to tell you that you did a good thing getting out of the lone pine class that didn't work. My daughter loved it for a while and then it stopped being a good thing and it was very hard for both her and me to let it go. The lack of anxiety and happiness that has returned to her is priceless. I wonder how short sighted I could have been to worry about not completing the class when it was painfully obvious that it needed to be gone.

 

My son is taking Latin 100 this year but if it goes bad I will not hesitate this time.

[8filltheheart]

My 6th grader is really enjoying Artes Latinae.   Homeschoolers buyers coop sometimes has it 50% off (otherwise it is expensive.)

 

I know you said no to Wheelock's, but my 9th grader recommends Signum University's coursepack for Wheelock's.   You purchase the video teacher and then you can work at your own pace.   Dd says he is a good teacher.  (but, she has also been taking Latin since 6th grade and is simply doing a quick review of Latin grammar before focusing on translations.)   http://shop.signumuniversity.org/products-page/course-packs/elementary-latin-i-summer-2012/

 

Don't know if those options help at all.  

[mom4peace]

8FillTheHeart,  so was it Artes Latinae that your 9th grader used before Wheelock? I'm hesitant to stress him out, honestly, which is why I'm avoiding Wheelock. He's a bit of a mess right now, but I'm hoping he'll relax somewhat with LP out of the picture. 

 

The VS collaborative is frankly out of my price range. It's good to know it is there should our circumstances allow, but it's just not in the budget. 

 

JennneinAZ, thank you. My older son tried it when he was 12, and I had no idea how many bits and pieces they were and how unprepared he was for that amount of organization and study. He left at the semester. Both boys are quite gifted, but both are 2e. I think most of his mismatch with Lone Pine was due to study skills. My younger was struggling with anxiety before it started, and between that and the mismatch in learning style, it was pretty awful. He really wanted it to work, and I wanted it to work, but he couldn't manage the more immersive approach and lack of clearly organized presentation of declensions and conjugations. He really thrived on Getting Started with Latin, and while we both knew how different the LP approach would be, neither of us guessed he would struggle so much, given his usually excellent study skills. I'm out of kids to send there, so I won't be trying again, but one does have to wonder at my learning curve. 

 

I was looking at Latin Prep  from Galore Press, but I can't find much about it. Any thoughts?

[8filltheheart]

No, my 9th grader and 12th graders used LP and SYRWTLLatin. Honestly, in hindsight I regret it. It was a great fun, light intro but it isn't as comprehensive and does leave gaps. They both agreed that I should switch to something else for the younger kids. Kathy in Richmond recommended AL an when the coop had it on sale, I bought it. My 6th grader used it last yr as well and she loves it and she has been doing extremely well. Kathy has shared that after AL they are in the same place as at the end of Wheelock's. She isn't that far through AL yet, but I do trust Kathy's judgement.....she is the one that lead my ds to AoPS back when few hear had ever heard of it.

[mom4peace]

Thanks, 8FillTheHeart. I've looked at AL, but it's likely out of reach at this point. I'm less concerned with gaps this next several months and more interested in maintaining the Latin he does know and making the language feel assessable down the road, when he can imagine serious study again. He's pretty thrown off and terribly anxious overall. 

[Belacqua]

If you're looking toward Lukeion next year, I wonder if you could noodle around with the charts and tables in the Wheelock appendix? Declensions, endings, demonstrative adjectives, etc.

 

You could make fill-in-the-blank charts on something like Quia, or spread index cards across your floor...whatever would appeal to your son. So much of Latin 1 is memorization, so having a lot of that already in his pocket (even as he'd have yet to learn the reasons and uses of the forms) might reduce anxiety.

[crazyforlatin]

Have you looked at Henle, http://books.google.com/books/about/First_Year_Latin.html?id=FSAeb6bNqesC?

 

It's similar to GSWL but with more words and exercises per lesson. It's easier than Wheelock's, harder than LP. It's just the right level for a middle school student who wants to master grammar without memorizing too many vocabulary words. It's also cheap enough so that you can use it temporarily, if that's what you prefer. Seton has an answer key for $5 (all the answers and not just the essential exercises). It's open-and-go program, and although you need a separate grammar book, I haven't found it cumbersome to go back and forth.

[mom4peace]

Belacqua, that's a doable idea. From last year's use of Getting Started with Latin, he understands a good deal about the uses of the forms, and his memorization skills are strong overall. Working through a good deal of charts and flash cards would likely also appeal. A major struggle was the "forest to trees" approach of Lone Pine -- for a language, at least, and math, really, he is a "trees to forest" guy. Show him the parts. Show him why they are there and any sensical relationships they have to one another, and then move to a bigger picture. We won't talk about how I've previously bought and sold the Wheelock some years back, okay? <sigh>

[mom4peace]

Have you looked at Henle, http://books.google.com/books/about/First_Year_Latin.html?id=FSAeb6bNqesC?

 

It's similar to GSWL but with more words and exercises per lesson. It's easier than Wheelock's, harder than LP. It's just the right level for a middle school student who wants to master grammar without memorizing too many vocabulary words. It's also cheap enough so that you can use it temporarily, if that's what you prefer. Seton has an answer key for $5 (all the answers and not just the essential exercises). It's open-and-go program, and although you need a separate grammar book, I haven't found it cumbersome to go back and forth.

Crazyforlatin, you mention using a separate grammar book. What did you use? 

[crazyforlatin]

Crazyforlatin, you mention using a separate grammar book. What did you use?

It's actually Henle's grammar book, http://www.amazon.com/Latin-Grammar-Henle-Robert-J/dp/0829401121, which can be used at all levels of Henle Latin.

[nansk]

Henle is the most affordable DIY option. There is an active Yahoo group with various helps in the Files section.

 

Another affordable book is Classical Latin by JC McKeown. This also has a supporting web site with various helps. You will not need a separate grammar book for this, but there is an optional workbook if it helps your ds.

[Laura Corin]

 

 

I was looking at Latin Prep  from Galore Press, but I can't find much about it. Any thoughts?

 

I think that Latin Prep is an excellent programme for ages 10-13.  Calvin used the first two books and half of the third.  I did some Latin at school, but it had been twenty-five years since I had thought about it - Latin Prep made the grammar clear to us both.

 

The books have a quirky sense of humour that both my boys appreciated (Hobbes also used LP1 at home then at school) and I think the learning is solid.  When Calvin joined the Latin class at school, his background was very solid in comparison.  He has applied to study Classics and English at university.

 

The books were not designed for the homeschool market - they are used in private schools in the UK.  That means that there is less information on the web about them.  The best way to get a feel is to look at the samples on the Galore Park website, to see if the style suits you.  It's definitely a trees to forest approach.

 

I normally suggest beginning at the start of the series and just moving through more quickly if some of it is review.  You can buy the texts from horriblebooks.com in the US, or (with free shipping) from bookdepository.co.uk

 

L

[morgan]

Have you looked at Henle, http://books.google.com/books/about/First_Year_Latin.html?id=FSAeb6bNqesC?

 

It's similar to GSWL but with more words and exercises per lesson. It's easier than Wheelock's, harder than LP. It's just the right level for a middle school student who wants to master grammar without memorizing too many vocabulary words. It's also cheap enough so that you can use it temporarily, if that's what you prefer. Seton has an answer key for $5 (all the answers and not just the essential exercises). It's open-and-go program, and although you need a separate grammar book, I haven't found it cumbersome to go back and forth.

 

We also used Henle for two years, through Kolbe; they have nice lesson plans and tests. My daughter enjoyed it more than her experience with Lone Pine. The only negative thing I remember about it is there is so much war, soldiers, fighting, etc vocabulary. 

[Tiramisu]

We also had to stop after one year of Lone Pine. Dd learned a lot but was really stressed. I didn't actually realize how hard it was on her until years later when she opened up about it. She also has some processing quirks like the OP's ds might.

 

With my next dd, age 13, we are using the First Form series and it's been great. It's very systematic and everything is broken up into little steps that I think would probably work great for anyone with processing concerns. If you need an online class, Memoria Press offers them and the workload is manageable when compared to our experience with Lone Pine, but it's also written in such a way that I think hsing moms could work right along and pull it off. Quizlet offers a lot of review items for the series, too, that can be helpful. 

 

First Form is the complete opposite of Lingua Latina.

[mom4peace]

 

 

With my next dd, age 13, we are using the First Form series and it's been great. It's very systematic and everything is broken up into little steps that I think would probably work great for anyone with processing concerns. If you need an online class, Memoria Press offers them and the workload is manageable when compared to our experience with Lone Pine, but it's also written in such a way that I think hsing moms could work right along and pull it off. Quizlet offers a lot of review items for the series, too, that can be helpful. 

 

 

 

Thanks, Tiramisu. I've avoided First Form because I've been looking for Classical Latin without the religious component in Memoria Press. However, I think the format may work well for me. A friend has used it, so I'll take a closer look at hers. We'll likely pick up Wheelock so we know where we are headed should he head toward Lukeion. 

[mom4peace]

 

 

The books were not designed for the homeschool market - they are used in private schools in the UK.  That means that there is less information on the web about them.  The best way to get a feel is to look at the samples on the Galore Park website, to see if the style suits you.  It's definitely a trees to forest approach.

 

I normally suggest beginning at the start of the series and just moving through more quickly if some of it is review.  You can buy the texts from horriblebooks.com in the US, or (with free shipping) from bookdepository.co.uk

 

L

Laura Coirn, 

Thanks. He and I are both drawn to the humor and tone of this series. I can only get a look at the first chapter of each book online, so it's a bit hard to tell. While it appears pretty straightforward, it also seems to wander a bit, at least when I look at the workbook. There is enough in the text to support the direction they go in the workbook, correct? Are there also exercises in the text? Thanks!

[Laura Corin]

Laura Coirn, 

Thanks. He and I are both drawn to the humor and tone of this series. I can only get a look at the first chapter of each book online, so it's a bit hard to tell. While it appears pretty straightforward, it also seems to wander a bit, at least when I look at the workbook. There is enough in the text to support the direction they go in the workbook, correct? Are there also exercises in the text? Thanks!

 

The original course was just the text book and the answer book.  If you look at the text book samples, you will see that there are lots of exercises - the pupil writes them separately on paper.

 

The workbooks were added later for extra practice.  

 

I did book one with Calvin first, before there were work books.  It went fine.  I did it again with Hobbes, using the workbooks alongside, and that worked fine too.  With Calvin I had done more straight memorisation - Hobbes learned a bit more as he went along by using the workbooks.

 

L