Math ideas for dd w/DS

[dtsmamtj]

I have a high functioning daughter with DS. With manipulatives she can slowly add up to say 10 and count almost to 20. We used a couple of Paces that someone didn't need 101, 102, & 103. Any thoughts on a slow moving math that might work? I have the dvds for MUS from Beta on up, but not sure that she would be able to understand Mr. Demme, so maybe something more hands on?? Not sure. Any ideas would be appreciated. Thank you.

 

T

[Dobela]

I would be willing to try MUS. Mr. Demme has a son with DS and uses (or used) the program with his son. Do you know anyone with a Primer or Alpha that you could borrow?

[MomatHWTK]

For basics review, I like the math materials online at Starfall.com (the subscription version). Sparklebox has some nice, colorful math printables.

[eoffg]

T, you wrote that; 'With manipulatives she can slowly add up to say 10 and count almost to 20.'

But the question is whether she can concieve of numbers?

Whether she concieves of 3 as a quantity?

Or as the number after 2? In the same way C comes after B in the alphabet.

So that when almost counting to 20, it is recalled in the same way as the alphabet?

 

Where it is important to make a distinction between a difficulty with math, and a difficulty with concieving of numbers?

Where just as we concieve of different sounds, and then learn to associate them different symbols/ letters.

Numbers are symbols that we learn to associate with what we concieve as different sized quantities.

But first, we need to be able to concieve of these different sized quantities?

While we concieve of letters with sound.

Numbers are concieved of with our Spacial sense.

Which is called our 'Sense of Number'.

Where Sense of Number is an immediate recognition of quantities, up to a total of 4.

So that if have a sense of number, then when you look at a group of 2 or 3 or 4 objects?

You will immediately recognize how many their are.

No counting is needed.

But when their are more 4 objects, they will need to be added.

 

Though when people don't have a sense of number?

When they look at 2 or 3 or 4 objects, they don't instantly spacially link them them together and recognize the size of each group.

So that they will have to count: 1,2,3.

But 1,2,3 has no more meaning than: A,B,C ?

I have C objects?

 

So that in regard to math difficulties, what first needs to be identified, is whether their is a basic sense of number, and ability to instantly recognize groups of 2 or 3 or 4 objects?

[dtsmamtj]

eoffg -

 

No, if you were to put three blocks before her she would have to "count" them to know how many blocks there were.

 

Yes, when counting she counts just like you would say the letters of the alphabet.

 

T

[eoffg]

T-

 

I run a forum for Dyscalculia and have been involve in study and research into it for the past 10 years.

Where your reply is a strong indication of Dyscalculia.

Where the underlying issue, is that with Dyscalculia, people can't concieve of numbers?

Though it is rather, that they can't concieve of a different sized groups?

So that numbers have no meaning and aren't sensed.

 

But you wrote about 'maybe something more hands on?'

Where the hands can be used to concieve of numbers, using a specific 'finger counting' technique?

So perhaps you could try this?

 

Form a fist with your left hand, with your palm facing up.

Then from this fist, extend your 'little finger'.

Where we use this little finger to represent 1.

 

Then extend the next finger alongside it.

So that you can see and feel those 2 extended fingers as group of 2.

 

Then, extend the next finger alongside them, to form a group a 3.

 

Followed by the last finger, to form a group of 4.

 

But for 5, we form a fist again, and then extend the thumb.

 

With the thumb extended to represent a group of 5.

We can then use the fingers again?

Which we can extend one by one, to count up to 9.

 

But then we come to 10 ?

Which we carry over to the right hand.

Using the little finger for 10, and consecutive fingers up to 40.

With the thumb as 50.

Leaving the fingers free, to count up to 90 on the right hand.

 

While this can be used physically as counting system.

Over time, it can be used without actually moving the fingers?

So that a number is just 'felt' in the hands.

Which is how people who are born Deaf but learn sign language, do their thinking.

Where as they think, they feel the words as hand signs, without moving their hands.

 

So that while the Deaf can use sign language to concieve of words.

Dyscalculics can use signs to concieve of numbers.

[dtsmamtj]

eoffg -

 

Interesting. I think I saw something "similar" to this method using Rightstart math???? Is the Dyscalculia group open to anyone to learn more about this issue? Thank you for sharing.

[samba]

Hi,

My ds11 (birthday today!) with Down Syndrome struggles with math. We are having slow but steady success with MUS Primer. We started way back with the Rightstart flashcards being able to instantly recognize objects up to 5 (I think) without counting. That, and practicing counting and writing numbers, was all we did for a while. Then we moved to Horizons Math K. We'd work through it and slow down as necessary, along with practicing skip counting by 10's and working on time to the hour and half-hour.

 

When it was time to move into the second Horizons K book, I thought that the text jumped around too much and moved too quickly so I was scrambling for something else to use. I explored Semple and even bought a couple of levels. While I was waiting for all my Semple stuff to arrive, we started MUS Primer. We jumped ahead to where I thought he should be (lesson 9 or 11, I don't remember now). It's been great so far. Nothing miraculous, but nice steady progress, which is very reassuring. At the beginning of this past school year, I was really anxious about math; ds did not seem to understand and I despaired that he ever would (dramatic, I know :tongue_smilie:). Really, just basic concepts like more and less were confusing him. He is now adding +0 and +1 with ease, as well as skip counting 10's, 5's and improving with time and basic coin counting. We're sticking with MUS for as long as it seems to work and I'm hanging on to Semple as a fall-back that I hope I never need.

 

HTH,

Carolyn

[lauranc]

My daughter (13) has intellectual disability and struggles with math.

 

I bought this book: http://www.amazon.com/Teaching-People-Syndrome-Hands-On-Learners/dp/1890627429 and have had great success with a lot of the activities.

[eoffg]

T,

My Dyscalculia Forum is open to everyone, so you would be very welcome.

http://www.dyscalculiaforum.com/news.php

 

Though with Dyscalculia, it is not just a difficulty with maths, but rather that they can't concieve of numbers?

Over 10 years of study and research into Dyscalculia, the most effective approach that I have identified?

Is the model used with the Japanese abacus, which parallels the way that the brain concieves of numbers.

So that it develops a way of concieving and representing quantities.

Where the traditional Japanese approach to teaching math, is to avoid introducing children to the words and symbols used for numbers, until around 9 years of age.

Instead they learn to do math with an abacus, which develops into a mental abacus.

So that they do mental maths in a very different way, to 'Western' mental maths.

As strong indication of the success of the Japanese model, is that while Dyscalculia effects about 8% of people in Western countries, it virtually doesn't exist in Japan.

I'll add a link to a page of different Japanese abacus, which are called Soroban.

Where the one that I would recommend, is in the top left corner, and called a Pacchi and costs about $30 including postage. Which can be used for arithmetic up to 999.

http://www.soroban.com/english/shopping/

[dtsmamtj]

eoffg -

 

Thank you. I did join the group to see what I can learn.

 

samba and lauranc -

 

Thank you for your thoughts and recommendations. I will look into both MUS Primer and the Teaching People w/DS math book.

 

T

 

T

[rafiki]

.

[houseofkids&pets]

A previous poster mentioned being able to "sense a number". The ability to recognize a quantity by looking (and not having to count) is called subitizing. We are really working on this with our ds over the summer. I have learned quite a bit about foundational math skills by reading this blog:

 

http://mathcoachscorner.blogspot.com Just type "subitizing" in the search box and you can read all of her posts and she also has some freebie activities. Two authors that she has recommended quite a bit are John Van de Walle and Kathy Richardson.

 

This blog has more info on subitizing, with photos of some of the activities she does and links to other blogs:

 

http://love2learn2day.blogspot.com/2012/04/subitizing-making-sense-of-numbers.html

[dtsmamtj]

Thank you!!! It has been interesting teaching my children math over the years as I "see" math differently than some of them but I could never explain it. Now I know what it is called. I subscribed to the blogs - they look interesting.

 

T

[jenncslp]

My daughter has DS as well. You may want to look at "Numicon", it is great for helping kiddos to understand the concepts in math.

 

Jenn

[dsmama]

Lurking along...my youngest has DS. Will need to file away these ideas for the future. thank you!