diaperjoys Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 My husband and I decided that we'd spend the rest of this school year seeing how our visual 8yo takes to Singapore. He's just at the end of 2nd grade CLE Math, around lightunit 209, I think. I gave him the placement test for Singapore 2A. And he scored 21%. I was amazed. We've been on a break the last couple weeks, but really, 21%????? I marked his errors and gave him the opportunity to correct, and he pulled the grade up maybe as far as a 30%. So. This kiddo is obviously not grasping some things. At first they were huge silly mistakes, like adding instead of subtracting. When I permitted him to try again he did more things right, but still couldn't come up with the right answer to many of them. Out of 6 problems with three digit addition and subtraction he missed 5. Before our break he was getting these problems right, though it takes him a long time and he dreads math. Now I'm really wondering what is going on. This is a smart boy, but something is clearly not clicking, and he's not retaining the information he has "learned". I just went to the homeschool store and set him up to begin (again) at the beginning. Singapore 1A, with 1B to follow. Sound about right? I'm hoping he'll breeze through and whatever is going awry will be fixed with a new approach. Any other ideas??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jennynd Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 don't get too discouraged. it is typical for kids come from another curriculum to SM has to go back a grade. 1A/B might be too easy for him. you should be able to go through it quickly. or you can get IP/CWP 1 when you do 2A at the same time Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NittanyJen Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 Hang in there. As you do Singapore, be sure to start each concept with hands-on activities before opening the textbook in front of him. If you aren't sure how to do this, go ahead and get Lipng Ma's book and the home instructor guides (yes, I knw I say I don't use them, but I also say I read them and they are well-done, and useful if you need help!). For example, if you are teaching number bonds for 7, get out 7 objects, and let him find all the ways to reorganize them into making 7 (I use colored pencils, because we have about 300, so we can keep on using them through multiplication, division, and fractions!). Anything will work-- pennies, Pokemon, crayons, stuffed animals... If you are teaching subtraction, get your manipulatives back out and make bundles of tens; if you have to redistribute (ie 73 - 58) unbundle a ten and move into the ones pile. For fractions, pie slices are nice, but so is a $10 set of Fraction Stacks. Cuisinaire Rods are brilliant for all of it. A $2 plastic teaching clock with dry erase below is nice, but a windup Baby Ben works perfectly if you have one. Once the hands-on lesson is done, lead through the textbook lesson and examples, then let him try the workbook. I will often start the next chapter or even two, then set him loose on the IP book independently for review and final drilling it in, unless I feel he needs more work on something right away; then we do the IP book right away and follow up with Khan Academy (free online) later. Good luck! NB: I just noticed: Khan Academy teamed up with Google to have Google create "Google Education" accounts! These are for underage kids to have a google account but still be within the rules so they can use Khan Academy. I always got around this before by creating extra accounts "for myself" and permitting my kids access to them for educational purposes (but I held the passwords) but some parents still see even that as cheating (clearly, I do not, but everyone must decide for himself). It is nice to see a simple solution to the issue openly presented. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NittanyJen Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 don't get too discouraged. it is typical for kids come from another curriculum to SM has to go back a grade. 1A/B might be too easy for him. you should be able to go through it quickly. or you can get IP/CWP 1 when you do 2A at the same time :iagree: It will not necessarily take a year to get through this. You will find some units move rather quickly! It takes time to figure out all the clues. Sometimes with my 2E 8YO, poor performance means didn't get it; but sometimes it means he's really bored and not challenged. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pitterpatter Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 Maybe he should have taken the test before the break? We were on vacation for two weeks and it took DD about that long to get back into school. I also think 1A may be too easy, but I guess it wouldn't hurt to start over to be sure nothing is missed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dana Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 Maybe he should have taken the test before the break? We were on vacation for two weeks and it took DD about that long to get back into school. I wouldn't think so... because if they don't remember the material after a short break, I don't think they really knew it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mom0012 Posted March 27, 2012 Share Posted March 27, 2012 Maybe he should have taken the test before the break? We were on vacation for two weeks and it took DD about that long to get back into school. I also think 1A may be too easy, but I guess it wouldn't hurt to start over to be sure nothing is missed. :iagree: When my son was that young, he would not do well the first week after a break. I was always amazed at how much trouble he would have. I know SWB recommends never taking more than a week off of math, so I suspect the problem is not uncommon. I have found as my son has gotten older, it isn't as much of an issue. Now, maybe there is something else going on with your son and he really does not know the material. How was he doing in CLE? Did you have any indications that he was struggling? Were the problems he got wrong on the placement test things you had covered or were they new topics that he had not learned yet? Lisa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blessedmom3 Posted March 28, 2012 Share Posted March 28, 2012 I started to combine CLE & Singapore when my son finished CLE 2 .He comfortably placed in 3a,even if the problems were different than what he was used to in CLE. Even my special needs son who finished CLE 100, placed in Singapore 2a,even after struggling a little bit with the last LU. CLE scope&sequence is not that different of Singapore but they approach words problems differently , which I suspect is where your ds failed most ? I am wondering the same things as Lisa, was he struggling with CLE ? Did you make sure he understood the concepts or was he working independently ? (which I don't think it's a good idea at this age) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redsquirrel Posted March 28, 2012 Share Posted March 28, 2012 I wouldn't worry too much about it. And, I wouldn't take too much time with those 1A and 1B books. I sometimes think that they make those 'placement' tests extra hard so that parents will freak out and worry about their current program. To be clear, I think that about ALL educational supply companies, not Singapore specifically. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paige Posted March 28, 2012 Share Posted March 28, 2012 With my DS, when we switched to MM, which is a similar style to Singapore, it took him a long while to get used to the questions. It's not that he couldn't do the math, but rather that the phrasing of the questions was confusing for him. If I rephrased it, he could do it easily. I wouldn't jump to taking him back a level, but evaluate first whether he missed it because it is math he doesn't know or if he missed it because he didn't understand the questions. If he knows the math and doesn't understand the questions, then you could keep him on his level and just go slow until he starts to recognize the pattern and phrasing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diaperjoys Posted March 28, 2012 Author Share Posted March 28, 2012 :iagree: How was he doing in CLE? Did you have any indications that he was struggling? Were the problems he got wrong on the placement test things you had covered or were they new topics that he had not learned yet? Lisa He did very well through the beginning of the year - the constant review of CLE was good for him. As we've gotten further through the year it has taken longer and longer for him to get through the lessons. He now dreads math in a big way. He hasn't mastered the math facts. He's recently been diagnosed with some sensory issues, and I know he isn't correctly processing the things he hears. I'm finally understanding that he is very visual, which is one reason why we're trying a colorful, 'conceptual' program to see how he does with it. So, lots going on in this kiddo which we haven't nailed down yet - still finding where/how to get appropriate testing done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melmichigan Posted March 28, 2012 Share Posted March 28, 2012 He did very well through the beginning of the year - the constant review of CLE was good for him. As we've gotten further through the year it has taken longer and longer for him to get through the lessons. He now dreads math in a big way. He hasn't mastered the math facts. He's recently been diagnosed with some sensory issues, and I know he isn't correctly processing the things he hears. I'm finally understanding that he is very visual, which is one reason why we're trying a colorful, 'conceptual' program to see how he does with it. So, lots going on in this kiddo which we haven't nailed down yet - still finding where/how to get appropriate testing done. My DD with processing and working memory issues made it through SM 1A, got really bogged down in 1B because of inability to maintain automaticity with math facts. That is when we added in CLE, doing 100-110. We did 2A with CLE 200-205 and then tried 2B without CLE. SM alone was a huge mistake. My kids have always placed appropriately back and forth between SM and CLE so I really think something else is up besides just not getting CLE. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
walkermamaof4 Posted March 28, 2012 Share Posted March 28, 2012 You might also look at Righstart. They learn to see the abacus in their head and can see the answers. My visual son did amazingly well with it! You could start with B. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melmichigan Posted March 28, 2012 Share Posted March 28, 2012 Just coming back because I didn't want my comments to sound harsh, that is not my intent at all. I hope you are able to get testing done soon so you have a better picture of your child's needs. Some kids with processing/working memory issues will struggle with maintaining math facts, especially in the midst of a multi-step problem so many of the mental math strategies in SM can be particularly frustrating to them. Just be on the lookout for this when moving forward with SM in case it applies to your son. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diaperjoys Posted March 28, 2012 Author Share Posted March 28, 2012 My DD with processing and working memory issues made it through SM 1A, got really bogged down in 1B because of inability to maintain automaticity with math facts. That is when we added in CLE, doing 100-110. We did 2A with CLE 200-205 and then tried 2B without CLE. SM alone was a huge mistake. My kids have always placed appropriately back and forth between SM and CLE so I really think something else is up besides just not getting CLE. Thank you so much - yes, I too think that something else is up. It is helpful to know that you have been able to switch back and forth between the two programs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
melmichigan Posted March 28, 2012 Share Posted March 28, 2012 Thank you so much - yes, I too think that something else is up. It is helpful to know that you have been able to switch back and forth between the two programs. This does change in SM3, when bar graphs begin to become prominent. Unless you take the time to go back and teach these methods and child coming from CLE will not have had much exposure, to the mathematical concept, yes, the method, no. Just something to keep in mind. We now stick with CLE as our main program and use other things in the summer. If your child is visual you might check out Singapore Math CD-ROM's. The one for 1A/B and 2A/B is called Rainbow Rock. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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