5wolfcubs Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 My 9yo ds is NOT mathy like 12yo & 15yo. He has been using MUS from the start and struggles with every new concept. He is currently having a very hard time in Delta with long division. DH sat with him about a week ago after I gave up in frustration (ds's and mine!). DH feels he has no idea what long division is and what/why is going on. I agree. Time for a new math program...at least temporarily. I was thinking LOF Apples and on for a complete change of pace, then going back to MUS. In fact I have 4 LOF elementary books in my Rainbow Resource cart...then I started reading about Beast Academy. I found one thread (Dec?) comparing the two but since BA is shipping now, I thought I'd ask again. Could I do both? Alternating? I just need to be doing math with this boy. Something positive for a change. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MomatHWTK Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 I've been having DS watch various online resources that explain division in different ways. And I am also working out problems that he gives me and just letting him watch. I like the way his PLATO learning class (online) explains division in various ways with visuals, but that would require a full subscription to the program. You can get a trial PLATO subscription through HSBC right now at a discount rate but it's still a pretty good sized financial commitment for just a few months of a class. When I did the trial I was ready to make a switch to all new curricula on all our subjects for DS so it was worth spending the money for a trial.;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jennynd Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 Math mammoth has free vedio to explain long division, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BatmansWife Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 My 9yo ds is NOT mathy like 12yo & 15yo. He has been using MUS from the start and struggles with every new concept. He is currently having a very hard time in Delta with long division. DH sat with him about a week ago after I gave up in frustration (ds's and mine!). DH feels he has no idea what long division is and what/why is going on. I agree. Time for a new math program...at least temporarily. I was thinking LOF Apples and on for a complete change of pace, then going back to MUS. In fact I have 4 LOF elementary books in my Rainbow Resource cart...then I started reading about Beast Academy. I found one thread (Dec?) comparing the two but since BA is shipping now, I thought I'd ask again. Could I do both? Alternating? I just need to be doing math with this boy. Something positive for a change. :) I don't really know if LOF is something you want. I mean...it's a quick quirky read. It took us about 10 days to read through Apples (it would have been way quicker if it were up to dd). By the time you are done....you'll know the different ways to add up to 7 and you'll learn what a vigintillion is.....but that's about it. If you are wanting a break to do just some math-type reading...then I guess it would be ok. We are now into Butterflies and I'm still like :001_huh:....but dd still loves it (we just read a chapter or two before bed). But I can.not believe for one minute their claim that there is "more math in Life of Fred than in any other home schooling curriculum that we know of". :blink: Obviously they must only know LOF books. :glare: Since your son is having a hard time with MUS...maybe he needs a more spiral math...maybe mastery isn't for him. If you are thinking of actually switching to a different math curriculum....then I'd say *maybe* try Beast (so hard to say because it's so new). Why don't you have your ds take the placement test at Beast Academy and see how it goes...see what he thinks of the samples. Other than that....maybe he needs something like Teaching Textbooks (kind of fun, engaging, teaches to your child....you could sit with him through the lessons). There are placement tests there too. HTH even a little. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kewb Posted March 14, 2012 Share Posted March 14, 2012 Both of mine hit a 3 week wall with long division with MUS as well. They had no problem with single digit but something about 2-3 digit numbers did them in. I spent that time utilizing online resources to learn new ways to present the material. Eventually they got it. Once they got it the MUS method became a no-brainer. They now wonder why they had such a hard time getting it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5wolfcubs Posted March 16, 2012 Author Share Posted March 16, 2012 Thanks all. I think I just want to use a totally different math format that he can be successful at (because it is somewhat of a review) for a time. I don't really want to leave MUS permanently because a) I've used it successfully for years b) I own Alpha - Geometry c) I don't have to teach it But this non-academic 9yo who doesn't like "school" in any form is in frustrate tears over math daily. After making my oldest cry over phonics daily I said I wouldn't do that to another child, ever. So 9yo ds started really reading about age 7 (previous two were basically self-taught at 4). Why didn't I make myself the same promise over math? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BatmansWife Posted March 16, 2012 Share Posted March 16, 2012 Nothing more to really add (sorry). I just wanted to ask how/where you got your cool family pic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5wolfcubs Posted March 16, 2012 Author Share Posted March 16, 2012 Nothing more to really add (sorry). I just wanted to ask how/where you got your cool family pic. Widdly Tinks Silhouettes Thanks & enjoy, AprilMay! It was amazing how I found a silhouette that was perfect for each kids' age/personality! :001_smile: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spy Car Posted March 16, 2012 Share Posted March 16, 2012 My 9yo ds is NOT mathy like 12yo & 15yo. He has been using MUS from the start and struggles with every new concept. He is currently having a very hard time in Delta with long division. DH sat with him about a week ago after I gave up in frustration (ds's and mine!). DH feels he has no idea what long division is and what/why is going on. I agree. Time for a new math program...at least temporarily. I was thinking LOF Apples and on for a complete change of pace, then going back to MUS. In fact I have 4 LOF elementary books in my Rainbow Resource cart...then I started reading about Beast Academy. I found one thread (Dec?) comparing the two but since BA is shipping now, I thought I'd ask again. Could I do both? Alternating? I just need to be doing math with this boy. Something positive for a change. :) Beast Academy (as of current release) would not directly help you or your son with long division. It is not covered yet. It might, however, help with many of the precursor skills. It would also be a guaranteed challenge in presenting many topics (especially "geometry" topics) in a way that is quite unusual for any program—much less one designed for Third Grade. So it depends what you are looking for. If you are really looking for help with procedural competence with skills like long division BA (as of yet) would be a poor choice. If you are looking to revisit some fundamental concepts and add some new brain-stretching work that is fun and out-of-the box it may be something to consider as a departure. While it is 3rd Grade math, BA is challenging in a way that is difficult to describe. I would try to look at samples and ask your self is this is just the thing your child might respond to, or if it would blow his head out. I think BA will be a somewhat "polarizing" program in that some will love it and some will not. Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
acurtis75 Posted March 16, 2012 Share Posted March 16, 2012 I just posted in this thread about some of the things we did to get through long division http://www.welltrainedmind.com/forums/showthread.php?t=358956&page=3 I considered getting a new program when we were there too. Then I searched the board and found that long division seems to be an issue no matter what program people use. We just reduced the work load, I sometimes wrote the answers while she gave them to me orally and we just pushed through. The good news is if you can just get to the end the introductory fraction lessons are an easy refreshing break. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjins Posted March 16, 2012 Share Posted March 16, 2012 (edited) I have an idea that is a completely different approach. Give a time. Set aside the math books. Play math games (both real and online), talk math, live math (cooking, shopping, family life), make sure that the basic facts (addition, subtraction, multiplication and division- if known) are practiced rather by flash cards, timed quizzes, or games). My DD can do most math problems if presented as a really life problem, but just a division problem sometimes will trip her up. I now ask her EVERY time "if you had ____ friends and _____ cookies, how many would each friend get?" Boom, she knows. Show her the same problem written out and she may struggle. Now, she is going faster, because she sees "if you had ____ friends and _____ cookies, how many would each friend get?" Then come back later and try again. If your child is VERY bothered by math, do not make a big deal and do not set a return date. Maybe just say "we are going to take a break from this, instead you are going to do X. Then when you are ready to restart, just say "tomorrow we are going to do one lesson of MUS. I think we will start again back at lesson, so we can review." Edited March 16, 2012 by jjins finsh after mistakenly posting Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BatmansWife Posted March 16, 2012 Share Posted March 16, 2012 Widdly Tinks Silhouettes Thanks & enjoy, AprilMay!It was amazing how I found a silhouette that was perfect for each kids' age/personality! :001_smile: Thank you for the link. I'll check it out. Maybe I'll make a silhouette too (if you don't mind....and if I can even figure it out). I think it's amazing too....I was looking at your kids ages and if they were a boy or a girl and I could figure out exactly who was who. Cool! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SunnyDays Posted March 16, 2012 Share Posted March 16, 2012 It sounds like you're wanting to work on division from a different perspective, not switch to a whole new program, right? Definitely you could read LOF for fun, and to just keep math "on the brain" for a while, but as AprilMay said, it won't really help you with division. I know Math Mammoth has the Dark Blue series, I imagine there's one on division topics? (Sorry, we don't use MM so not overly familiar.) Maybe that would be helpful with looking at it from a different angle. Or, I imagine there are math games/drills online that he might be willing to tackle?? Just a few thoughts... hugs, it's always frustrating to hit a rough spot!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pen Posted March 17, 2012 Share Posted March 17, 2012 (edited) I'm wondering where exactly you got stuck. I like MUS a lot, but do not use Steve Demme's system of writing the division problems with place value as happens in lesson 18A for example. It is hard to describe in words what I mean. But anyway, I teach it the more "usual" way, where above the division symbol would go the answer as a single number made up of how ever many digits, if I can make this come out on here at all, not a stacked series of numbers in place value notation like: 5 40 200 3000 50000 ) but rather more like: 53245 ) I think looking at the place value method to see what is happening from a math concepts learning point of view is helpful, but I don't think doing it that way as an algorithm is helpful. Edited March 17, 2012 by Pen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
serendipitous journey Posted March 17, 2012 Share Posted March 17, 2012 (edited) Life of Fred won't help, and apparently neither will Beast Academy. You can try the Math Mammoth series on division, or just teach it slowly and incrementally yourself. For these things -- the sticking points in MUS -- I like the books from the series incl. Master Multi-Digit Division. It is just problems, with answers in the back, arranged in sections of progressing challenge. I like to pull 2-4 and work them together over juice or chocolate (or both) each day until we're got it down. You may want to include regular review of other concepts if this takes more than a couple of weeks. That said, I'm thinking of jumping MUS for Singapore b/c I really don't like the way they are introducing multiplying fractions in Epsilon -- it seems okay for solving the problems, but not for really understanding what you are doing and why. But who knows, I may end up coming back to MUS after all! ETA: I've also liked this tutorial on long division by the Math Mammoth author. Edited March 17, 2012 by serendipitous journey more info. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrysalis Academy Posted March 17, 2012 Share Posted March 17, 2012 I agree with pps who said that neither LOF or BA will help you directly with the long division issue. Think about getting Kitchen Table Math (vol. 2) for yourself, though - it teaches you how to teach computations in a step-by-step, incremental way, and to really understand how and why it works. It could help you guys get to a breakthrough. Good luck! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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