Does R&S need a writing supplement?

[smilesonly]

referring to grades 3 or 4 and up.

 

thx!

[HeidiKC]

We started last year with grade 5. TWTM recommends a writing program in addition to R&S. There is very little writing in R&S. So...yes!

[smilesonly]

We started last year with grade 5. TWTM recommends a writing program in addition to R&S. There is very little writing in R&S. So...yes!

 

thanks! i JUST found my WTM book, so will be referring to that-finally!:D

[missmoe]

My understanding is TWTM does not suggest anything in addition to R&S. Perhaps, that has changed in the latest edition.

[MamaBear]

:bigear:

[smilesonly]

i have the 2nd edition of TWTM. SWB recommends dictation 2-3 times a week w/R&S for 4th grade.:)

[Ellie]

We started last year with grade 5. TWTM recommends a writing program in addition to R&S. There is very little writing in R&S. So...yes!

I disagree. There's a boatload of writing in R&S's English series. Even in lessons which are not specifically labeled "writing," there's writing. And the seventh grade text makes a big jump in writing from the sixth.

[smilesonly]

I disagree. There's a boatload of writing in R&S's English series. Even in lessons which are not specifically labeled "writing," there's writing. And the seventh grade text makes a big jump in writing from the sixth.

 

 

OT-sorry! Ellie, i wanted you to know my ds is LOVING the R&S spelling exercises. the words are quite easy for him, but he digs right into the exercises. so glad i listened to you! thx!

 

 

resume...:D:auto:

[Daisy]

It depends.

 

There is plenty of writing INSTRUCTION in R&S English. If a parent takes that instruction and applies it across curriculum and builds on the concepts in R&S English, then no, I don't think you need another writing program.

 

If, however, you are ONLY doing the writing assignments in R&S English, than yes, you'll need to supplement with something else.

[Ellie]

It depends.

 

There is plenty of writing INSTRUCTION in R&S English. If a parent takes that instruction and applies it across curriculum and builds on the concepts in R&S English, then no, I don't think you need another writing program.

 

If, however, you are ONLY doing the writing assignments in R&S English, than yes, you'll need to supplement with something else.

I still disagree. :D

 

But I love you anyway. :D

[Ellie]

OT-sorry! Ellie, i wanted you to know my ds is LOVING the R&S spelling exercises. the words are quite easy for him, but he digs right into the exercises. so glad i listened to you! thx!

 

 

resume...:D:auto:

I'm glad he likes it. :) Yes, it's the exercises that make Spelling by Sound and Structure worthwhile. :)

:auto:

[chepyl]

The version of TWTM I have also says you don't need a separate writing program with it. That is why I chose R&S. I wanted an all inclusive. I have 2-5, the writting really seams to pick up in 4. Prior to that it is more solid grammar and diagraming.

 

I would think that you would use any writing program across your curriculum as your child gets older. I plan to have my son start writing papers in 5th-6th grade. I will expect his grammar to carry over from one subject to the next.

[Ellie]

The version of TWTM I have also says you don't need a separate writing program with it. That is why I chose R&S. I wanted an all inclusive. I have 2-5, the writting really seams to pick up in 4. Prior to that it is more solid grammar and diagraming.

There you go.

 

But don't discount the writing that the children do as part of the grammar instruction, or even the sections regarding using resources. All writing counts as writing, even if it isn't a lesson that specifically says it's writing. :)

 

I would think that you would use any writing program across your curriculum as your child gets older. I plan to have my son start writing papers in 5th-6th grade. I will expect his grammar to carry over from one subject to the next.

There is a big jump at seventh. I cannot imagine adding any extra instruction *or* assignments from then on.

[Daisy]

I still disagree. :D

 

But I love you anyway. :D

 

LOL. We can disagree.

 

I just think the writing lessons need the variety of being used across curriculum. My kids have seemed to need that. I definitely don't think you need to buy anything else. Just make the curriculum work for you. I don't see how doing one research paper in R&S is going to be enough practice. So once we cover it in R&S, I start assigning them regularly in history/science. Same goes with the other forms of writing taught.

[missmoe]

It depends.

 

There is plenty of writing INSTRUCTION in R&S English. If a parent takes that instruction and applies it across curriculum and builds on the concepts in R&S English, then no, I don't think you need another writing program.

 

If, however, you are ONLY doing the writing assignments in R&S English, than yes, you'll need to supplement with something else.

 

 

Yes, what Daisy said! We do apply what is learned in R&S across our curriculum.

[lionfamily1999]

My understanding is TWTM does not suggest anything in addition to R&S. Perhaps, that has changed in the latest edition.

I thought the same thing. That's why we started using it for 5th.

 

We still do outside writing (letters and dictation), but I didn't see that as supplementing so much as... writing letters and practicing dication. :lol:

[Ellie]

LOL. We can disagree.

 

I just think the writing lessons need the variety of being used across curriculum. My kids have seemed to need that. I definitely don't think you need to buy anything else. Just make the curriculum work for you. I don't see how doing one research paper in R&S is going to be enough practice. So once we cover it in R&S, I start assigning them regularly in history/science. Same goes with the other forms of writing taught.

We're not disagreeing here. :)

 

I don't add that disclaimer to my comments about R&S's English, because I assume that's what people are doing. If they aren't, adding something else isn't going to help all that much, KWIM?

[chepyl]

There you go.

 

But don't discount the writing that the children do as part of the grammar instruction, or even the sections regarding using resources. All writing counts as writing, even if it isn't a lesson that specifically says it's writing. :)

 

 

There is a big jump at seventh. I cannot imagine adding any extra instruction *or* assignments from then on.

 

When I was in Jr high and high school, we wrote multiple papers in English class, plus lots of short essays, etc. We were also required to write papers in history, science, amd Spanish. My senior year I wrote 2, 10 page literary analysis papers, one in English, one in history. There was also plenty of other short assignments. I was well prepared for college and writing up to two papers a week at times.

 

I will not purchase another program, but I will assign a history paper, a theatre paper, and possibly something else. I have a while before we get there.

[Daisy]

We're not disagreeing here. :)

 

I don't add that disclaimer to my comments about R&S's English, because I assume that's what people are doing. If they aren't, adding something else isn't going to help all that much, KWIM?

 

LOL. I used to think that was normal, too, but surprisingly some folks just don't think to do it.

[HeidiKC]

I don't have my TWTM handy, and it's the older version that I don't THINK discusses R&S at all. But I read in the most recent version that mentions R&S, that she suggests skipping the writing in R&S and using a different program. Didn't I??! This is for 5th-6th grade. Not sure about younger grades.

 

As far as R&S having a lot of writing, I'm pretty confused! I'm looking at the 6th grade book, and it has very few "writing assignments". Out of the first 46 lessons, there are only 12 writing assignments where writing is taught. So slightly more than one/weekly if you are doing daily R&S. And not all of them are actually writing paragraphs, etc. The exercises include:

 

- 3 of the 12 assignments teach outlining

- 1 of the 12 is about giving an oral book report

 

Which leaves 8 out of 46 lessons where the child is instructed in writing paragraphs. And at least up through lesson 46, the child is only working on one paragraph assignments. For me, 8 lessons on writing one paragraph in about the first 9 weeks of school is not enough for 6th grade.

 

Some of the subsequent writing lessons include taking notes for a report, organizing notes, writing a friendly letter, writing a business letter, courtesy and clarity on the phone, making an introduction, etc. All helpful and important and I'm glad we're covering them...but again, I'd like my dc to have a bit more writing instruction than that.

 

Now this does not take into account whether or not you do a lot of other writing or summarizing in other subjects, of course. But I'm just responding to whether or not R&S provides enough writing instruction (without assuming parent is doing her own additional writing instruction). So far this year I feel like we've hardly done any writing at all through R&S.

[Ellie]

I don't have my TWTM handy, and it's the older version that I don't THINK discusses R&S at all. But I read in the most recent version that mentions R&S, that she suggests skipping the writing in R&S and using a different program. Didn't I??! This is for 5th-6th grade. Not sure about younger grades.

 

As far as R&S having a lot of writing, I'm pretty confused! I'm looking at the 6th grade book, and it has very few "writing assignments". Out of the first 46 lessons, there are only 12 writing assignments where writing is taught. So slightly more than one/weekly if you are doing daily R&S. And not all of them are actually writing paragraphs, etc.

So, is there something magic about writing paragraphs, etc.? There are many facets to writing.

 

The exercises include:

 

- 3 of the 12 assignments teach outlining

- 1 of the 12 is about giving an oral book report

I don't understand why this is a problem. :confused:

 

Which leaves 8 out of 46 lessons where the child is instructed in writing paragraphs. And at least up through lesson 46, the child is only working on one paragraph assignments. For me, 8 lessons on writing one paragraph in about the first 9 weeks of school is not enough for 6th grade.

You're fixated on writing paragraphs. :D Most writing has nothing to do with paragraphs.

 

 

Some of the subsequent writing lessons include taking notes for a report, organizing notes, writing a friendly letter, writing a business letter, courtesy and clarity on the phone, making an introduction, etc. All helpful and important and I'm glad we're covering them...but again, I'd like my dc to have a bit more writing instruction than that.

 

The grammar instruction which is interspersed with the writing (and other topics) helps improve your dc's writing, don't you think?

 

Now this does not take into account whether or not you do a lot of other writing or summarizing in other subjects, of course. But I'm just responding to whether or not R&S provides enough writing instruction (without assuming parent is doing her own additional writing instruction). So far this year I feel like we've hardly done any writing at all through R&S.

 

All of it is instruction in using the English language well, whether the lesson specifically addresses writing or not. And the first six years are foundational to the seventh through tenth. Have you seen the scope and sequence for those texts?

[HeidiKC]

So, is there something magic about writing paragraphs, etc.? There are many facets to writing.

 

 

I don't understand why this is a problem. :confused:

 

 

You're fixated on writing paragraphs. :D Most writing has nothing to do with paragraphs.

 

 

 

 

The grammar instruction which is interspersed with the writing (and other topics) helps improve your dc's writing, don't you think?

 

 

 

All of it is instruction in using the English language well, whether the lesson specifically addresses writing or not. And the first six years are foundational to the seventh through tenth. Have you seen the scope and sequence for those texts?

 

Wow. I'm just trying to be helpful to the OP and wasn't trying to debate you or anyone else or say you were wrong, etc. I said I was confused about some of the statements that there was lots of writing in R&S, and so to help the OP I counted out the specific writing assignments and to ME it doesn't seem like enough (like I said, unless the parent is also doing other writing with the child).

 

And my goodness...I didn't say there was anything magic about paragraphs or that grammar instruction wasn't extremely helpful for writing. Of course it is. But to me R&S is great for grammar and has tons of it, but not a lot of lessons specifically about writing. Which is what I THOUGHT the OP was referring to. Maybe not, so I'm sorry if I misunderstood. I'm sure she would know that any grammar program would contain writing, but I thought she wanted to know how much additional specific writing instruction was in the book.

 

Maybe it's because I'm not feeling well right now, but your post seems rather unfriendly. I just thought it would be helpful to the OP to let her know what writing lessons were there, and whether or not it was outlining, oral presentations or "paragraphs". Personally I think a 6th grader should know how to write a paragraph and should have practice doing so. If you don't agree, I have no bone to pick with you and I have nothing against you and certainly don't wish to make you feel bad just because you might have a different idea about writing. Again, maybe it's because I'm not feeling well, but I'm not clear from your response what you do think is helpful about R&S for writing...but rather that you seem to think my views on it are ridiculous.

[Mrs Twain]

But to me R&S is great for grammar and has tons of it, but not a lot of lessons specifically about writing. Which is what I THOUGHT the OP was referring to.

 

[...]

 

Personally I think a 6th grader should know how to write a paragraph and should have practice doing so.

 

:iagree:

I have only used up to R&S grade 3, but I agree with the above. I think R&S English is wonderful for grammar. I also think the writing instruction has been good so far. However, I use other programs as our main writing programs. I specifically added WWW this year as a supplement because I wanted my third grader to get more practice in learning how to structure and write an original paragraph.

[smilesonly]

Wow. I'm just trying to be helpful to the OP and wasn't trying to debate you or anyone else or say you were wrong, etc. I said I was confused about some of the statements that there was lots of writing in R&S, and so to help the OP I counted out the specific writing assignments and to ME it doesn't seem like enough (like I said, unless the parent is also doing other writing with the child).

 

And my goodness...I didn't say there was anything magic about paragraphs or that grammar instruction wasn't extremely helpful for writing. Of course it is. But to me R&S is great for grammar and has tons of it, but not a lot of lessons specifically about writing. Which is what I THOUGHT the OP was referring to. Maybe not, so I'm sorry if I misunderstood. I'm sure she would know that any grammar program would contain writing, but I thought she wanted to know how much additional specific writing instruction was in the book.

 

Maybe it's because I'm not feeling well right now, but your post seems rather unfriendly. I just thought it would be helpful to the OP to let her know what writing lessons were there, and whether or not it was outlining, oral presentations or "paragraphs". Personally I think a 6th grader should know how to write a paragraph and should have practice doing so. If you don't agree, I have no bone to pick with you and I have nothing against you and certainly don't wish to make you feel bad just because you might have a different idea about writing. Again, maybe it's because I'm not feeling well, but I'm not clear from your response what you do think is helpful about R&S for writing...but rather that you seem to think my views on it are ridiculous.

 

Heidi,

 

i do appreciate your sharing here and found it very helpful. thank you!:grouphug:

 

thanks for everyone's input-good to hear different views!

[joyfulhomeschooler]

LOL. I used to think that was normal, too, but surprisingly some folks just don't think to do it.

I am ashamed to admit it but I have not been doing this. I assumed the writing in R&S3 was enough. I really appreciate you commenting on this because it is really a great idea and should be done. I will start immediately (well tomorrow anyways).