Sahamamama Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 We won't begin 2nd grade until July 2012, so there is some time to adjust, if necessary. Here's the rough draft: Bible & Christian Discipleship Bible Reading & Prayer Bible chapter (daily group RA) Bible Read Alouds & Storytelling Egermeier's Bible (daily group RA) Bible storytelling with felts or costumes (weekly; they love doing this) Scripture Memory Work A Psalm in My Heart (memory cards for Psalms 1, 8, 23, 24, 100, 46, 121, 91) Christian Doctrine Christian Life Hymnal (3x/weekly) Leading Little Ones to God (3x/weekly) Bible Survey (OT) & Study Skills What the Bible Is All About: Young Explorers (Chapters on OT, reads with me) Bible study skills (1x/weekly, e.g., "Let's find the map of Abraham's journey in this atlas" or "Let's use the children's concordance to find that verse.") Literature & Poetry Chapter Books (3x/weekly group RA) Heidi The Wonderful Wizard of Oz Misty of Chincoteague The Borrowers The Moffats James Herriot's Treasury for Children Audio Chapter Books (2-3x/weekly, we have these, might as well listen) The Chronicles of Narnia (7 books) Charlie & the Chocolate Factory Black Beauty Alice's Adventures in Wonderland Charlotte's Web Peter Pan Mr. Popper's Penguins The Five Little Peppers & How They Grew The Wind in the Willows Mary Poppins Just So Stories The Merry Adventures of Robin Hood Read Alouds (daily group RA, choosing from these resources): Aesop for Children Book of Greek Myths [21 weeks] Book of Norse Myths [15 weeks] My Book House, Volumes 3 & 4 Fifty Famous Stories Retold Beautiful Stories from Shakespeare Poetry Anthologies English for 2nd Grade Literature & Poetry Study MP 2nd Grade Literature Guides (3 out of 4)--The Courage of Sarah Noble; Mr. Popper's Penguins; Tales by Beatrix Potter Evan-Moor Poetry Guides (6 weeks) Guided Reading McGuffey's 3rd Reader (reads aloud with me) K-12 Readers, Volumes 2, 3A & 3B (reads aloud with me) Book Basket 2nd Grade Book Basket (daily, about 30 minutes) Copywork & Handwriting MP New American Cursive II handwriting course MP New American Cursive copybook(s) Spelling & Vocabulary All About Spelling, whatever level she needs (3? 4?) English from the Roots Up, Volume 1 (cards only) Grammar Rod & Staff English 2 (daily) Growing with Grammar (3x/weekly, up to Chapter 3) Linguistic Development Beautiful Memories (homemade memory work packet for 2nd grade) Oral Language Exercises (some weeks) Narration (2-3x/weekly, from subjects) Written Composition Winning with Writing 2 (3x/weekly, 1/2 the course) Writing with Ease 2 (4x/weekly, entire course) Mathematics Core Math Course Singapore Primary Math (daily, need to test into a level at the end of 1st grade)--I've never taught Singapore before :001_unsure: Math Supplements Math Mammoth Blue series Kumon math workbooks Math fact drills Math Lab (options) Miquon series Hands-On Standards (with manipulatives) Games, puzzles, mazes Mental math (free packet from online) Musical Instrument Instrument lessons (1x/weekly, at home, either recorder or keyboard, her choice) Instrument practice (3x/weekly) Latin Prima Latina DVD, flashcards & workbook (maybe up to Lesson 12? 15?) Lingua Angelica (listening only) Greek Learn to say, write, and pronounce the alphabet, upper & lower case (3x/weekly, for about 10 minutes) Geography State pages (1x/weekly, we'll carry this across 2 years into 3rd grade) History U.S. History to 1850s (group RAs from a homemade list, about 2-3x/weekly) Science Earth & Space Science (group RAs from a homemade list, about 2-3x/weekly) AND/OR Elemental Science: Earth Science (I'm thinking about this, they would love the hands-on projects) The Happy Scientist (any projects/videos that we are interested in doing) BFSU, Level K-2 (any lessons that apply to earth/space science, or others) Nature Time As much time outdoors as possible Family membership to Longwood Gardens or similar Her own square foot garden (box garden) in spring, summer & fall Nature walks & collections! :001_huh: French Little Explorers French [from Enchanted Learning website] (Continue learning vocabulary & phrases, listening to French dialogue & songs; 2-3x/week for 10 minutes) German Little Explorers German [from Enchanted Learning website] (Continue learning vocabulary & phrases, listening to the German Bible & songs; 2-3x/week for 10 minutes Music Appreciation Listen to classical music, The Story of Classical Music (CDs), Great Composers & More Great Composers (CDs), Sing the Word (CDs), and American colonial music (CDs), at random moments whenever we feel like it Art & Crafting Picture/artist study prints from Classical Writing website (free), painting, drawing, sculpting, Notgrass How to Draw book, I Can Draw ____ books, still life drawing, very basic crocheting, basic sewing & various crafts that this girl loves to do Be gentle. :bigear: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs Twain Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Wow--you are awesome. I don't have much advice, but I enjoyed reading through your post! I am happy using many of the same choices you have listed. I think your plan looks great. Winning With Writing for 2nd grade--you may be able to complete the whole year just doing it 3 times per week. I started it with one of my kids this year, and we are often doing 2 lessons or more per day because some of the lessons are pretty simple and quick. We also use Oral Language Exercises. That is one of the best 60-second per day programs that I have. :D The German resources on Enchanted Learning look very good. I hadn't seen those. I love the garden idea! What does MP stand for by the way? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sahamamama Posted January 4, 2012 Author Share Posted January 4, 2012 What does MP stand for by the way? Memoria Press. Thanks for the encouragement. :001_smile: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aurelia Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 It looks really thorough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
................... Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Looks like too much to me. I see that many things are not done every day and many are also short, and all seem developmentally appropriate...but the sheer number of things you have planned would overwhelm me and my 2nd grade. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twoxcell Posted January 4, 2012 Share Posted January 4, 2012 Looks like a great line up but I could never keep up with 4 different languages? Can he/she really learn that many at once? Also I would stick with one grammar, and math(maybe do the extras occasionally or as needed). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Farrar Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 Looks like too much to me. I see that many things are not done every day and many are also short, and all seem developmentally appropriate...but the sheer number of things you have planned would overwhelm me and my 2nd grade. :iagree: Part of what makes it look like so much is that long book list at the start, which I actually think is totally doable - we've done that many books in the last year easily. But I think that curricula would be overkill for most 2nd graders. Only you know your kids, there's a point at which I know mine would just tune it out and not be really getting anything out of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sahamamama Posted January 5, 2012 Author Share Posted January 5, 2012 Looks like a great line up but I could never keep up with 4 different languages? Can she really learn that many at once? Also I would stick with one grammar, and math (maybe do the extras occasionally or as needed). French and German only involves learning basic vocabulary such as colors, numbers, shapes, body parts, family members, days, months, animals, foods, and so on. We do things like get out the color cubes and I tell them to pick up "trois rouge" or "sept jaune." :D Easy-peasy, nothing to prepare. I agree, though, the need for Latin and Greek is questionable at this age. I don't know... but is HALF of Prima Latina impossible for an advanced, eager-beaver, word-loving 2nd grader? And she herself wants to "just learn the Greek alphabet." We studied Greece this year, and she saw my (koine) Greek Bible and became intrigued. Yes, I know what you mean about the two grammars. Why? Oh, why? I don't know, but I think that so many people say they do much of Rod & Staff 2 orally, which is how we've done most of FLL 1 & 2. With this child, oral lessons go so quickly -- she just gets it, and remembers it all six months later. :001_huh: Like, down to the page numbers, actually. So that was the motivation for getting GWG, because it's more visual/written, and I think there's some value to that for her. I have appreciated the oral aspect of FLL for K & 1st -- and we'll pick up FLL 3 in 3rd grade (too much for 2nd, IMO) -- but I wanted something that approaches grammar from a different angle than either R & S or FLL. So, enter GWG (only part of it). So that's really 1 and 3/5ths grammar programs, LOL. As for math, the only "required" component is the Singapore. All the rest is there to use, if needed. I haven't taught "Asian math" before, so I need something in the wings for MY confidence and a bit of hand-holding. But, no, we are not doing all that math! Just the Singapore, I don't know what level(s) yet. To me, it's more important to understand it than to get through it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sahamamama Posted January 5, 2012 Author Share Posted January 5, 2012 But I think that curricula would be overkill for most 2nd graders. Only you know your kids, there's a point at which I know mine would just tune it out and not be really getting anything out of it. Farrar, what do you think is the "overkill" part? What would you take out? Edit for me, please, that's why I'm asking for feedback. Not a complaint, but... I ask my husband what he thinks, and it's all, "You're so great, Honey, you're the mom, Honey, you know best, Honey. Zzzzzzzzzzzzz." :blink: "Thanks for the thoughtful feedback, Darling." :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chepyl Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 I would cut 3 languages. I think it would be better to do one at a time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lewelma Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 I would cut 3 languages. I think it would be better to do one at a time. :iagree: You seem to have 2 of everything. I would suggest that you do 1 thing well, rather than two only so so. I have a 2nd grader now, and my list is in my siggy. I think you have way. too. much. So here it goes.... I would cut all of this: 3 languages either lit or poetry 1 of the handwritings vocabulary 1 of the grammars beautiful memories 1 of the compositions supplemental math lab math 3 science texts, only keep BFSU Music appreciation Hope this helps. I don't know how gentle I was.... Ruth in NZ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kristinannie Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 I love the German activities on Enchanted Learning! THANKS!!!! It does seem like a lot, but it really depends on how much time you spend per subject. I lean heavily towards CM so we do A LOT of subjects in a day, but spend only 5-15 minutes per subject so it isn't too much. I think the languages are OK if you are really learning Latin (Prima Latina is what I plan to use for second grade) and just getting exposure to the others. I would probably just choose one of the modern languages though, but that is totally up to you! Let me know how it all works for you! Oh, and by the way, I get the same response from my husband. He just says that he trusts me. I know he trusts me, but sometimes I just need a sounding board! Thank God for this forum! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heidi Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 I think it looks like WAAAAAAAAY too much. You don't need a foreign language at all, so you certainly don't need to do 4. What's the point? One grammar, one math, one composition (wwe contains narration and copywork already, and the lit guides require a lot of writng, plus include vocab) I just see a lot of overlap. My 2nd grader would much rather get school done quickly and go play outside than sit and do workbooks all day, but that's her. You could try to do it all and adjust later. I dropped half of what I planned for this year, but that is mostly because I have my hands full. Less is more! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadianmumof5 Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 I have to agree that it really is an ambitious plan. Rather than trying to do all of it at once - why not choose one curricula for each of the subjects, finish it up, and if it is done quickly and well, then move onto the next for that particular subject. For example, start with R&S for grammar and once it is done, then move along to GWG. You may find your DC move very quickly and can jump to the 3rd grade level for grammar?? Trust me, I love all of the choices out there as well and I have more than enough of the various curricula as a result of my own addiction :glare:; but at some point, you just have to be realistic in what can be accomplished and put a stake in the ground KWIM? I don't want to discourage your choices, just perhaps try to do it in more of a linear fashion rather than all at once. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs Twain Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 Sahamama, I'm seeing your curriculum from a different viewpoint. I currently have a first grade daughter who is very bright and learns extrememly quickly. I started out this year with a standard first grade curriculum, but I have had to add many programs to it, some of them up to third grade level because she understands concepts easily, can remember everything, is eager to learn, and is bored to tears with regular first grade materials. If I wrote out what I do for her, everyone here would tell me that I am crazy and need to cut half of it out, too. I say that if your child is like mine and needs the challenge, then go ahead with your choices. I think we ought to be as rigorous as we can, as long as we and the children are happy and doing well. If the children are getting overworked and burned out, then it would be time to cut some things and simplify. However, if your child thrives on learning and is a little sponge like so many are at this age, I would say your plan seems fine to me. By the way, there are subjects in which I use multiple programs. For math, I am using materials from three different programs, and for writing I am using materials from four different programs. It can be good to use elements from multiple programs in order to present the material in a variety of ways and for the student to do a variety of assignments. Just my two cents! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sahamamama Posted January 5, 2012 Author Share Posted January 5, 2012 I would cut all of this:3 languages either lit or poetry 1 of the handwritings vocabulary 1 of the grammars beautiful memories 1 of the compositions supplemental math lab math 3 science texts, only keep BFSU Music appreciation Hope this helps. I don't know how gentle I was.... Ruth in NZ Perhaps I did not explain myself too well... sorry about that. Perhaps the list doesn't clearly explain that each component is not necessarily carried through the entire year, or is only a 5 minute/twice a week kind of thing, or that it's a rough draft/listing options stage of the curriculum. Not everything is meant to be done each day, nor even completed in a year. For example, the poetry study is just a 6-week unit (very simple materials, actually). Then we move into the Memoria Press guides, and we're only doing 3 out of 4 of those. When I list the science resources, they are exactly that, just something to pull from, not courses to complete. IOW, these are the things we could use to build our understanding of earth & space science for a year. No pressure to "finish" anything for science, not even the topic. In fact, I think we will stretch Earth & Space out for two years, there is no rush. ;) The same with math, there is only one core course (Singapore) and everything else is there to help out if we don't understand how Singapore teaches a concept, we want more practice, or we want to approach a concept from a different (more traditional) angle. There are not two handwriting courses. There is one (thin) workbook for handwriting (learning the letter formation) for an entire year, and this will be mostly review and some transition to a new style of cursive. She's becoming proficient in cursive this year in 1st grade. Along with the handwriting instruction booklet, there are copybooks available, to use at our own pace. Again, no pressure to complete them. As for the memory work in Scripture and poetry, we are not giving that up, that is fundamental to what we're doing in our homeschool. What we're calling "music appreciation" is simply listening to CDs (that is all), which is easy to do and a normal part of our day. Don't you all listen to music? :confused: I don't think I explained this well in my initial post, so the plan must come across as rather draconian. In real life, it doesn't really work that way here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twoxcell Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 Perhaps I did not explain myself too well... sorry about that. Perhaps the list doesn't clearly explain that each component is not necessarily carried through the entire year, or is only a 5 minute/twice a week kind of thing, or that it's a rough draft/listing options stage of the curriculum. Not everything is meant to be done each day, nor even completed in a year. For example, the poetry study is just a 6-week unit (very simple materials, actually). Then we move into the Memoria Press guides, and we're only doing 3 out of 4 of those. When I list the science resources, they are exactly that, just something to pull from, not courses to complete. IOW, these are the things we could use to build our understanding of earth & space science for a year. No pressure to "finish" anything for science, not even the topic. In fact, I think we will stretch Earth & Space out for two years, there is no rush. ;) The same with math, there is only one core course (Singapore) and everything else is there to help out if we don't understand how Singapore teaches a concept, we want more practice, or we want to approach a concept from a different (more traditional) angle. There are not two handwriting courses. There is one (thin) workbook for handwriting (learning the letter formation) for an entire year, and this will be mostly review and some transition to a new style of cursive. She's becoming proficient in cursive this year in 1st grade. Along with the handwriting instruction booklet, there are copybooks available, to use at our own pace. Again, no pressure to complete them. As for the memory work in Scripture and poetry, we are not giving that up, that is fundamental to what we're doing in our homeschool. What we're calling "music appreciation" is simply listening to CDs (that is all), which is easy to do and a normal part of our day. Don't you all listen to music? :confused: I don't think I explained this well in my initial post, so the plan must come across as rather draconian. In real life, it doesn't really work that way here. I get it! If I listed all our material some peoples heads would spin.:lol: I was just mostly surprised by the 4 languages thing, and two grammars for a 2nd grader. I'm not one for early grammar though and I didn't start my ds until 3rd grade. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sahamamama Posted January 5, 2012 Author Share Posted January 5, 2012 Sahamama, I'm seeing your curriculum from a different viewpoint. I currently have a first grade daughter who is very bright and learns extremely quickly. I started out this year with a standard first grade curriculum, but I have had to add many programs to it, some of them up to third grade level because she understands concepts easily, can remember everything, is eager to learn, and is bored to tears with regular first grade materials. If I wrote out what I do for her, everyone here would tell me that I am crazy and need to cut half of it out, too. I say that if your child is like mine and needs the challenge, then go ahead with your choices. I think we ought to be as rigorous as we can, as long as we and the children are happy and doing well. If the children are getting overworked and burned out, then it would be time to cut some things and simplify. However, if your child thrives on learning and is a little sponge like so many are at this age, I would say your plan seems fine to me. By the way, there are subjects in which I use multiple programs. For math, I am using materials from three different programs, and for writing I am using materials from four different programs. It can be good to use elements from multiple programs in order to present the material in a variety of ways and for the student to do a variety of assignments. Just my two cents! Thank you for all of this, but especially the bold. We must have same child, LOL. Yes, my first grade girl is bright, eager to learn, happy, cooperative, confident, playful, funny, and sweet. Like a lump of sugar, coated in honey, dropped in a vat of syrup. She does play for half the day, but she truly wants to do school (more than I want to, in all honesty). She likes the rigor, but I have to push myself and hold her back. It's always been that way with her. I came home from the hospital with the twins when she was not quite two years old, and she asked me to teach her to read. That very day. :001_huh: Apparently, there was something she wanted to read, she didn't know how, so she asked to be taught. "Um, not today, Sweetie." I am not kidding, she asked again the next day. I've never known exactly what to do with this child's strong desire to learn, but my heart tells me that in 2nd grade, it will be okay to give into it, to feed it and run with it as far as the child can go. I actually have held back up to now. I suppose the initial post must not have clearly explained that ALL the listing is not MUST DO material, but rather a buffet from which to choose. I think that good teachers should have various resources from which to pull just the right materials and lessons for that child, for that season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lewelma Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 it's a rough draft/listing options stage of the curriculum. Not everything is meant to be done each day, nor even completed in a year. Thanks for clarifying. Yes, my first grade girl is bright, eager to learn, happy, cooperative, confident, playful, funny, and sweet. She likes the rigor, but I have to push myself and hold her back. I do think that we have different philosophies. My ds is keen and likes a challenge, but instead of giving him additional 2nd grade material, I have him finish up 2nd grade material faster and then I bump him up to 3rd grade curriculum. He would consider more curriculum at the same level to be busywork even if it taught slightly different material. Homeschooling is all about adapting to your child and your family. enjoy the ride. Ruth in NZ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boscopup Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 One thing I noticed is that you're planning to do R&S2 after FLL2? You might want to rethink that. FLL2 has more grammar topics and goes quicker. So it's like you're going backwards to go to R&S2. And seriously, she will be B-O-R-E-D because it's too easy. I tried it in first grade, and it was too easy then. The first 6 weeks was spent on sentences vs phrases. Why not do FLL3? It's really quite nice. Only takes about 15 minutes 3 times a week. It's fun, too. She sneaks some occasional activities in there involving movement. ;) I'm using it with my 2nd grader, and it's one if the easiest parts of the day. While it includes some neat grammar topics that the kids can't pronounce (predicate nominative), it's done in such a gentle way. You don't drill, drill, drill. The writing has been just the right amount for my pencil phobic son. Also, don't hold her back. There is plenty to learn! You won't run out of material. I give my son material at the level that challenges him, but keep the length of time spent age appropriate. I also adjust output expectations (while he can read a middle school text, he won't be able to write an essay about it). No need to tread water doing 3 separate 2nd grade level grammar programs when you could just move on to the fun diagramming in 3rd grade programs. ;) If she hasn't struggled with FLL2, let her move on, even if it's GWG3. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Embassy Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 I have a child who would love that line-up. It does look extensive, but some kids need variety. You know your child and your teaching style. Is this list something vastly different from this school year? I am doing multiple languages and using several resources for one subject. People tell me that I do too much, but it works for us. My kids would get bored if we had a simple line-up. Variety keeps their attention. Is the "extra" busywork or is it approaching the same topic from different angles? If it is busywork I would trim, but it doesn't look like that to me. My kids do well with a deep and wide approach. It sounds like you have a child that is thirsty for learning and it looks like you have a well thought out plan to quench her thirst. I have a child that needs plenty of school work in his life to feel satisfied. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sahamamama Posted January 5, 2012 Author Share Posted January 5, 2012 I get it! If I listed all our material some peoples heads would spin.:lol: I was just mostly surprised by the 4 languages thing. My husband and I have a theory on this. ;) He is multilingual, and finds that there are times when he can only think a thought in a particular language. He tells a joke in his other language, then says, "Sorry, it doesn't translate." :glare: He sees his 2.5 languages as tools, which he is free to use to be a better thinker, better communicator, better person. We have this vague idea that ANY language exposure at a young age is better than nothing, if for no other reason than that it decreases the child's resistance to a "foreign" language. We even did some "experiments" on our poor guinea pig children. The first experiment involved introducing non-English vocabulary on the unsuspecting child, with no preparation period. Let me tell you, they HATED this approach (which we predicted). For example, we would point to the apple and say "la pomme." The girls' reaction was immediately hostile to the offending intruder. "APPLE!" :mad: All our research bears this out, that children who do not first HEAR the language will react with hostility toward it. So... the second phase of this experiment involved softly playing language CDs in the background while playing, eating, and especially sleeping. We worked up to listening to audiobooks in the target languages, and they became comfortable with "those funny sounds." This was when they were toddlers. After a period of doing this, the girls' resistance was melted away. They took to French enthusiastically, with amazingly French-sounding pronunciation. :001_smile: Any time the pronunciation starts to veer off a bit, we know it's time to do more listening, less talking. We don't read or write anything at this point, except the occasional Babar or Bonsoir, Lune book, usually with a CD (native speaker). This year, for Pre-K & 1st, we've continued on with French, very gently, simply adding to our understanding and ability to think and communicate in the language. We've also started listening to the German audio Bible, with no explicit instruction. That is "German" for this year. Next year, for K & 2nd, we would only add in some of the vocabulary from the Little Explorers site, just like we did for French this year. It's easy to do this with little kids, they don't forget how to say "The apple is red" in another language. :lol: It's a game to my three, just a funny-sounding game. At first, they laughed when they heard German, they mocked it and made fun of it -- "Achtblocked meinschteinsveignnuusen munschenhausen weinersnitzel pretzel sauerkraut, ha ha ha ha ..." You get the idea. But now they LIKE it. They respect it and tune into it. It's all listening, just listening. NOW, they ask for it, there is something in their little brains that WANTS it. There is something that goes "click" in the brain when we feed it languages early on. For us, the first stage is listening (for about two years). In the next experiment that we tried on them, ;) we taught the girls some vocabulary (French) for colors, numbers, shapes, and more. We only used those words for a few weeks, then dropped it out. So, for weeks, it was, "Quelle couleur preferez-vous?" "Rouge?" But then we stopped using the French words. There was a blank space, where no one was saying "bleu," then the girls started to bring the words back into the conversation. They owned the words for themselves. I also see them making connections because of the little bit of French they do know. For example, the oldest realized that "blanc" (white) is related to "blank," that "porc" (pig) is related to "pork," and that "baleine" (whale) is related to baleen whales. Not bad for a six year old. We realize that this is a far cry from being bi- or tri-lingual. We wish we could pull that off, honestly, but for now we will be happy to hear our children say, "Bonjour, maman." So sweet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AngelBee Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 I think your languages are fine, as long as the goal is not mastery at this point. Exposure is great! :) We are doing Latin, Spanish, and American Sign Language. Children have requested to add French and perhaps Mandarin. We will see.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sahamamama Posted January 5, 2012 Author Share Posted January 5, 2012 One thing I noticed is that you're planning to do R&S2 after FLL2? You might want to rethink that. FLL2 has more grammar topics and goes quicker. So it's like you're going backwards to go to R&S2. And seriously, she will be B-O-R-E-D because it's too easy. I tried it in first grade, and it was too easy then. The first 6 weeks was spent on sentences vs phrases. Why not do FLL3? It's really quite nice. Only takes about 15 minutes 3 times a week. It's fun, too. She sneaks some occasional activities in there involving movement. ;) I'm using it with my 2nd grader, and it's one if the easiest parts of the day. While it includes some neat grammar topics that the kids can't pronounce (predicate nominative), it's done in such a gentle way. You don't drill, drill, drill. The writing has been just the right amount for my pencil phobic son. Also, don't hold her back. There is plenty to learn! You won't run out of material. I give my son material at the level that challenges him, but keep the length of time spent age appropriate. I also adjust output expectations (while he can read a middle school text, he won't be able to write an essay about it). No need to tread water doing 3 separate 2nd grade level grammar programs when you could just move on to the fun diagramming in 3rd grade programs. ;) If she hasn't struggled with FLL2, let her move on, even if it's GWG3. Thanks for that advice, boscopup. I do have FLL 3 waiting in the wings. I looked it over for a long time, alongside GWG and RS2. I don't remember how I decided. :lol: Did I toss a coin? :lol: There was something about FLL 3 that felt like it would be a little more analytical than she is ready to be, KWIM? I pictured going through it and having her give me the deer-in-headlights look. She's much more of a concrete-operational still, just-the-facts-ma'am, let me memorize a definition kind of gal. Plus, I wasn't certain what to do after FLL 3. I know, I know, FLL 4, duh. But that felt like it would be too fast. I do know that she gushes and gushes over "loving grammar." Go figure. She just adores FLL, so much that she sent some scented soaps to Jessie. Hilarious. She wanted to thank the lady who taught her to read (Hey, I thought that was your mother) and put in all those lovely poems and defined a noun so thoroughly. Do you really think she'll be bored with RS2? Oh, stinking dog. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Embassy Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 My husband and I have a theory on this. ;) He is multilingual, and finds that there are times when he can only think a thought in a particular language. He tells a joke in his other language, then says, "Sorry, it doesn't translate." :glare: He sees his 2.5 languages as tools, which he is free to use to be a better thinker, better communicator, better person. We have this vague idea that ANY language exposure at a young age is better than nothing, if for no other reason than that it decreases the child's resistance to a "foreign" language. We even did some "experiments" on our poor guinea pig children. The first experiment involved introducing non-English vocabulary on the unsuspecting child, with no preparation period. Let me tell you, they HATED this approach (which we predicted). For example, we would point to the apple and say "la pomme." The girls' reaction was immediately hostile to the offending intruder. "APPLE!" :mad: All our research bears this out, that children who do not first HEAR the language will react with hostility toward it. So... the second phase of this experiment involved softly playing language CDs in the background while playing, eating, and especially sleeping. We worked up to listening to audiobooks in the target languages, and they became comfortable with "those funny sounds." This was when they were toddlers. After a period of doing this, the girls' resistance was melted away. They took to French enthusiastically, with amazingly French-sounding pronunciation. :001_smile: Any time the pronunciation starts to veer off a bit, we know it's time to do more listening, less talking. We don't read or write anything at this point, except the occasional Babar or Bonsoir, Lune book, usually with a CD (native speaker). This year, for Pre-K & 1st, we've continued on with French, very gently, simply adding to our understanding and ability to think and communicate in the language. We've also started listening to the German audio Bible, with no explicit instruction. That is "German" for this year. Next year, for K & 2nd, we would only add in some of the vocabulary from the Little Explorers site, just like we did for French this year. It's easy to do this with little kids, they don't forget how to say "The apple is red" in another language. :lol: It's a game to my three, just a funny-sounding game. At first, they laughed when they heard German, they mocked it and made fun of it -- "Achtblocked meinschteinsveignnuusen munschenhausen weinersnitzel pretzel sauerkraut, ha ha ha ha ..." You get the idea. But now they LIKE it. They respect it and tune into it. It's all listening, just listening. NOW, they ask for it, there is something in their little brains that WANTS it. There is something that goes "click" in the brain when we feed it languages early on. For us, the first stage is listening (for about two years). In the next experiment that we tried on them, ;) we taught the girls some vocabulary (French) for colors, numbers, shapes, and more. We only used those words for a few weeks, then dropped it out. So, for weeks, it was, "Quelle couleur preferez-vous?" "Rouge?" But then we stopped using the French words. There was a blank space, where no one was saying "bleu," then the girls started to bring the words back into the conversation. They owned the words for themselves. I also see them making connections because of the little bit of French they do know. For example, the oldest realized that "blanc" (white) is related to "blank," that "porc" (pig) is related to "pork," and that "baleine" (whale) is related to baleen whales. Not bad for a six year old. We realize that this is a far cry from being bi- or tri-lingual. We wish we could pull that off, honestly, but for now we will be happy to hear our children say, "Bonjour, maman." So sweet. This is great! I think early introduction of multiple languages is beneficial. To me language learning isn't just about learning a language. It is great brain exercise that translates into skills in other areas of life. My youngest has had the earliest exposure because she was around her older siblings when they were learning multiple languages. It was so interesting to watch her tune in to the languages with a preference for one in particular. She then started jargoning in that language using the appropriate sounds and intonation patterns. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chepyl Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 One thing I noticed is that you're planning to do R&S2 after FLL2? You might want to rethink that. FLL2 has more grammar topics and goes quicker. So it's like you're going backwards to go to R&S2. And seriously, she will be B-O-R-E-D because it's too easy. I tried it in first grade, and it was too easy then. The first 6 weeks was spent on sentences vs phrases. Why not do FLL3? It's really quite nice. Only takes about 15 minutes 3 times a week. It's fun, too. She sneaks some occasional activities in there involving movement. ;) I'm using it with my 2nd grader, and it's one if the easiest parts of the day. While it includes some neat grammar topics that the kids can't pronounce (predicate nominative), it's done in such a gentle way. You don't drill, drill, drill. The writing has been just the right amount for my pencil phobic son. Also, don't hold her back. There is plenty to learn! You won't run out of material. I give my son material at the level that challenges him, but keep the length of time spent age appropriate. I also adjust output expectations (while he can read a middle school text, he won't be able to write an essay about it). No need to tread water doing 3 separate 2nd grade level grammar programs when you could just move on to the fun diagramming in 3rd grade programs. ;) If she hasn't struggled with FLL2, let her move on, even if it's GWG3. I am using R&S 2 with my 6 year old this year. We have moved very fast (many days of two lessons a day) and we only spend 15 minutes. He is remembering and applying the lessons as well. If I had waited until he was in 2nd grade, he would have been bored. If you want R&S, I would start with 3. I have flipped through the book and it still looks pretty simple, but not quite as repetitive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ester Maria Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 It does look a bit daunting at a first glance, but once I actually read through it and thought about how all of that would be fleshed out over an entire year in appropriate, digestible chunks, it seems reasonable. There are certain things I would do differently, if the choice was up to me, but nonetheless, I think that it is a very reasonable and thorough plan for a bright and interested child. :) (P.S. You are allocating too much time for Greek if learning the alphabet is your only goal. You can effectively teach her to recognize all the Greek uppercase and lowercase letters and say the alphabet in a week or a few, depending on how you approach it, it definitely does not take the whole year. Only if you are actually using some kind of a program which also introduces some elementary vocabulary, accents on words, etc. would you need to allocate a regular time in your yearly schedule for Greek.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twoxcell Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 I think early exposure to language is great. I just know I wouldn't be able to keep up with that many. I decided to go all in with Spanish this year. We do it all together as a group every morning. It is mostly listening, watching and interactive conversation for now, but it is amazing how involved even my two preschoolers get. My 2 year old will probably know more Spanish than all of us soon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boscopup Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 There was something about FLL 3 that felt like it would be a little more analytical than she is ready to be, KWIM? I pictured going through it and having her give me the deer-in-headlights look. She's much more of a concrete-operational still, just-the-facts-ma'am, let me memorize a definition kind of gal. FLL3 is fairly concrete-operational, just-the-facts-ma'am, I think. They still have you memorizing definitions. They EASE you into diagramming. Here's an example... If you were learning about adverbs and had already learned adjectives, it might take you through this sequence of diagrams: The dog ran. <diagram already drawn out... kid fills in 3 words easily> The brown dog ran. <diagram from above is already filled out... kid only needs to add "brown" on the line coming down from dog - you can't get it wrong> The brown dog ran fast. <diagram from above is once again already filled out... kid only needs to add "fast" on the line coming down from ran - again, can't get it wrong> That's for introducing how to diagram that particular part of speech. Later on, there would be a blank diagram where a similar sentence has to be placed on the diagram, but it's done in such a way that it's easy to figure out. It's also explained so well... I really don't think it'd be a problem for your DD. If she were struggling with FLL2, then I'd not recommend FLL3 yet, but since she seemed to find it easy, I'd go ahead with 3 - in whatever program you decide on. Plus, I wasn't certain what to do after FLL 3. I know, I know, FLL 4, duh. But that felt like it would be too fast. Jump off that bridge when you get to it. ;) I'm doing MCT Island next year. I won't even be doing FLL4 at all. I was originally going to go over to ALL at some point, but since that likely isn't happening, I'll figure something else out. Perhaps the upper levels of R&S might be better. I just think the lower levels are VERY slow and easy for a child that understands grammar easily. I'm not sure at what point it picks up. I know everyone says R&S is so rigorous, but the grade 2 and 3 books most certainly are NOT. FLL 2 and 3 have more meat to them, without all the repetition within a lesson! I just figured that my son picks up grammar easily, so I don't need to fret about the grammar or worry about doing the same program every single year. We may end up doing MCT Island and Town, and then jump into R&S 5, or maybe do KISS grammar (a post in the logic stage forum explained it in a way that suddenly, I understand! :D). Or we might continue with MCT if we like it. I think it's going to be a good fit for DS, because it has grammar up front, then application the rest of the year. That's what DS needs. He doesn't need to drill and kill with grammar. Do you really think she'll be bored with RS2? Oh, stinking dog.Put it this way... We did the first unit of R&S2 (sentences vs. phrases), started the next unit (nouns), and I said I just couldn't do that anymore. So I got FLL1 and 2. I went ahead and started FLL1 (afterall, he was in first grade). It was too easy also, but it was better than R&S2!!! It moved a little faster, believe it or not. And the lessons were more varied in FLL, even with the 45 lessons of common vs. proper nouns. :tongue_smilie: We spent 3 or 4 weeks in FLL1, then did half of FLL2. We then tried out R&S 3, again doing it for about 6 weeks (one full unit). It was much, much, much better than R&S 2. It at least changed topics more regularly! It introduced diagramming in lesson 6, which was nice, but then it stayed on the same type of diagram forever! I also didn't like that it had us doing skeleton diagrams instead of full diagrams. For example, if the sentence was "The brown dog ran fast.", they'd only have you diagram "dog" and "ran". Eventually, they'll add the other parts. My son would ask about the other words in the sentence, and we hadn't learned to diagram those yet. He wanted to diagram the whole sentence, and really, he was ready to learn to diagram those parts. So in that sense, FLL takes you a bit further in the diagramming, and just doesn't introduce longer sentences until you're ready to diagram the whole sentence. Another issue I had was that some topics were split into multiple lessons, when my son could easily learn the entire topic in one lesson. So even though I was using R&S3 with a just turned 7 year old (June birthday, we started R&S3 in July), I was having to combine lessons on some topics. So anyway... You've already done a 2nd grade grammar program (FLL2). I think any 2nd grade program you use is going to be going backwards - you've already done that level. I would go with a 3rd grade program in whatever you choose. You could take it a bit slower than intended if you want... don't do grammar every day or anything. That was actually my original intention with R&S3. I was doing it only 3 days a week instead of the 4 required to finish the book in a year, but since we were having to combine some redundant lessons, it just didn't slow us down enough. :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sahamamama Posted January 5, 2012 Author Share Posted January 5, 2012 (edited) I am using R&S 2 with my 6 year old this year. We have moved very fast (many days of two lessons a day) and we only spend 15 minutes. He is remembering and applying the lessons as well. If I had waited until he was in 2nd grade, he would have been bored. If you want R&S, I would start with 3. I have flipped through the book and it still looks pretty simple, but not quite as repetitive. FLL3 is fairly concrete-operational, just-the-facts-ma'am, I think. They still have you memorizing definitions. They EASE you into diagramming. Here's an example... If you were learning about adverbs and had already learned adjectives, it might take you through this sequence of diagrams: The dog ran. <diagram already drawn out... kid fills in 3 words easily> The brown dog ran. <diagram from above is already filled out... kid only needs to add "brown" on the line coming down from dog - you can't get it wrong> The brown dog ran fast. <diagram from above is once again already filled out... kid only needs to add "fast" on the line coming down from ran - again, can't get it wrong> That's for introducing how to diagram that particular part of speech. Later on, there would be a blank diagram where a similar sentence has to be placed on the diagram, but it's done in such a way that it's easy to figure out. It's also explained so well... I really don't think it'd be a problem for your DD. If she were struggling with FLL2, then I'd not recommend FLL3 yet, but since she seemed to find it easy, I'd go ahead with 3 - in whatever program you decide on. Jump off that bridge when you get to it. ;) I'm doing MCT Island next year. I won't even be doing FLL4 at all. I was originally going to go over to ALL at some point, but since that likely isn't happening, I'll figure something else out. Perhaps the upper levels of R&S might be better. I just think the lower levels are VERY slow and easy for a child that understands grammar easily. I'm not sure at what point it picks up. I know everyone says R&S is so rigorous, but the grade 2 and 3 books most certainly are NOT. FLL 2 and 3 have more meat to them, without all the repetition within a lesson! .... So anyway... You've already done a 2nd grade grammar program (FLL2). I think any 2nd grade program you use is going to be going backwards - you've already done that level. I would go with a 3rd grade program in whatever you choose. You could take it a bit slower than intended if you want... don't do grammar every day or anything. That was actually my original intention with R&S3. I was doing it only 3 days a week instead of the 4 required to finish the book in a year, but since we were having to combine some redundant lessons, it just didn't slow us down enough. :lol: Hmmm.... that is true. She has done a 2nd grade grammar course, and there is no point in going backwards with this child. Sigh. And I had it all so nicely mapped out. LOL. I could hold onto RS2 for the twins and pick up RS3, which shouldn't be too hard to plug into the plan, since it has the same overall format. I sincerely appreciate this feedback, especially the heads-up about RS2 being a bit too redundant for a child who has completed FLL2. For $38.74 I could have RS3 and move it along for her in grammar. I'll take a closer look at RS3 and try to remember why I initially decided against it, in favor of RS 2. But I think I agree with your advice to move up to RS3. Thanks for it! Ester Maria, if you check back in, could you please tell me what you would do differently? Please? :001_smile: BTW, your avatar is hilarious. And redundant -- Perfect AND Italian? Should it not rather say, "Not only am I perfect, but I'm perfect because I'm Italian?" Italian-perfection = Cause-effect. :D Edited January 5, 2012 by Sahamamama Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs Twain Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 Thank you for all of this, but especially the bold. We must have same child, LOL. Yes, my first grade girl is bright, eager to learn, happy, cooperative, confident, playful, funny, and sweet. Like a lump of sugar, coated in honey, dropped in a vat of syrup. She does play for half the day, but she truly wants to do school (more than I want to, in all honesty). She likes the rigor, but I have to push myself and hold her back. It's always been that way with her. I came home from the hospital with the twins when she was not quite two years old, and she asked me to teach her to read. That very day. :001_huh: Apparently, there was something she wanted to read, she didn't know how, so she asked to be taught. "Um, not today, Sweetie." I am not kidding, she asked again the next day. I've never known exactly what to do with this child's strong desire to learn, but my heart tells me that in 2nd grade, it will be okay to give into it, to feed it and run with it as far as the child can go. I actually have held back up to now. I suppose the initial post must not have clearly explained that ALL the listing is not MUST DO material, but rather a buffet from which to choose. I think that good teachers should have various resources from which to pull just the right materials and lessons for that child, for that season. Ha! Yes, we do have the same child. I used to hold her back, but one day she was very upset after I handed her something I thought would be good for first grade. She accused me of giving her "baby work." After that, I just decided to ignore grade levels for her and find things that would give her sufficient challenge. I have finally gotten her curriculum to the point where she hasn't complained about "baby work" lately. LOL. BTW I also use R&S English. I am planning on doing R&S 2 next year for my rising second grade daughter, but then we haven't done FLL. The concepts are pretty simple, and as others said may be too dull for your daughter. I have my kids do at least half of the writing exercises on paper, and that is part of R&S English that I think adds some challenge. Even if the concepts may be simple to grasp, writing out a lot of sentences properly is still a good and valuable exercise IMO. Sometimes I think my son has understood a concept, but then I realize that he didn't understand it when I see him doing the written exercises incorrectly. My third grader is currently doing R&S 3 English. R&S 3 is defintely ramped up compared to 2 concerning concepts. We spend about 15 minutes on the oral review from the TM and with teaching the new aspects of the lesson. Then it takes him about 15-30 minutes to write out the written exercises on his paper (we do at least half of them). If I had my 2nd grader do this next year, it would probably take her longer just because she is not as fast at writing. Third graders can pump out the writing faster because they are older, more physically mature, and have had more practice IME. So you may consider what you want to get out of R&S English to decide the level. If the concepts in 2 are too boring, you could probably do 3 fine, though it may take some significant time out of your day. On the other hand, you could do R&S 3 over two years (by doing the oral review/teaching one day, and then doing the written work the next day). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
In the Rain Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 I think it is awesome you and your dd can do so much! At the same time, I feel like a total slacker. :tongue_smilie: My 2nd grader just wouldn't be able to juggle so many things. Neither would I. :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
................... Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 Here's a quote...I try to remember it when planning my goals: "I think this was wise; the greatest service we can to education today is to teach few subjects. No one has time to do more than a very few things well before he is twenty, and when we force a boy to be a mediocrity in a dozen subjects we destroy his standards, perhaps for life." CS Lewis So I would say that, at this age, one language, one grammar, one math, and read-alouds is more than enough. It's hard to choose from them, early on. But you know what works for you and your dc. One of my dc needs a ton of repetition and review...next year he'll be doing Saxon Math AND Saxon Grammar. My other dd doesn't need as much repetition. She will do fine with PLL. But if I knew that she needed more repetition, then I would just do the one program that covers it better, even if it meant leaving out my beloved PLL for 3rd grade. Doing multiple curricula in trying to cover what you think one lacks, is very tempting in homeschooling. But it'll only serve to burn out your dd. Your Book list looks just fine. I would also take out some of the Bible. Leading LIttle Ones to God, and Scripture memory singing, is enough. Rushing through to get to everything else on the list will only serve to make your teachable moments feel stressed. My kids had lots of discussion with LLLTG and it's good to leave lots of room for that. Hope this helps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
................... Posted January 5, 2012 Share Posted January 5, 2012 Here's your list, with edits: English for 2nd Grade Literature & Poetry Study MP 2nd Grade Literature Guides (3 out of 4)--The Courage of Sarah Noble; Mr. Popper's Penguins; Tales by Beatrix Potter Evan-Moor Poetry Guides (6 weeks) Guided Reading McGuffey's 3rd Reader (reads aloud with me) K-12 Readers, Volumes 2, 3A & 3B (reads aloud with me) Book Basket 2nd Grade Book Basket (daily, about 30 minutes) Copywork & Handwriting MP New American Cursive II handwriting course Spelling & Vocabulary All About Spelling, whatever level she needs (3? 4?) Grammar Rod & Staff English 2 (daily) Linguistic Development Beautiful Memories (homemade memory work packet for 2nd grade) Narration (2-3x/weekly, from subjects) Written Composition This is included in Rod and Staff English Mathematics Singapore Primary Math (daily, need to test into a level at the end of 1st grade)--I've never taught Singapore before Math fact drills Musical Instrument Instrument lessons (1x/weekly, at home, either recorder or keyboard, her choice) Instrument practice (3x/weekly) Latin Prima Latina DVD, flashcards & workbook (maybe up to Lesson 12? 15?) Geography Just use puzzles or games when desired. History U.S. History to 1850s (group RAs from a homemade list, about 2-3x/weekly) Science Earth & Space Science (group RAs from a homemade list, about 2-3x/weekly) Nature Time As much time outdoors as possible Family membership to Longwood Gardens or similar Her own square foot garden (box garden) in spring, summer & fall Nature walks & collections! French Little Explorers French [from Enchanted Learning website] (Continue learning vocabulary & phrases, listening to French dialogue & songs; 2-3x/week for 10 minutes) Music Appreciation Listen to classical music, The Story of Classical Music (CDs), Great Composers & More Great Composers (CDs), Sing the Word (CDs), and American colonial music (CDs), at random moments whenever we feel like it Art & Crafting Picture/artist study prints from Classical Writing website (free), painting, drawing, sculpting, Notgrass How to Draw book, I Can Draw ____ books, still life drawing, very basic crocheting, basic sewing & various crafts that this girl loves to do ____ I do not think that the goal is to do as much as possibly, be as rigorous as possible as long as everyone is happy. I think the goal, as a Christian, is to do what God has called us to do and to do it well, and to pray and observe carefully for God's leading on each child we have, all the while obviously using our brains and common sense that He gave to us. One of my children might be capable of, and interested in different things, or even do less school work than another. Allowing each child free time in which to create, draw, play, explore, and set their own goals outside of school is a healthy part of any education, including a rigorous Classical one. You may still end up doing "more" formal schooling than I do, and that's OK. :001_smile: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kristinannie Posted January 6, 2012 Share Posted January 6, 2012 (edited) I loved your reasoning on early language learning. I understand what people are saying about keeping things simple and, honestly, that works for some people. The great thing about homeschooling is that we can do what is right for our family. I am doing German this year (my oldest is in K). I am definitely adding Latin in 2nd grade. I would love to add another modern language at some point (probably Spanish although I do know some Russian and Croatian). I plan to teach Greek at some point, but I don't want to do Koine Greek. I want Classical Greek. The best program I have found for that is from MP and it doesn't start until around 9th grade. I would love to hear if anyone has any suggestions for Greek! I am sure that if I posted my complete curricula on here, I would get some bad reviews as wellm but here goes: Circle time (devotions, prayer, memorization, read alouds at different levels, singing, calendar)...takes about 20-30 minutes depending German (mix of KIKUS materials, picture books and DVD's of Dora, Disney movies, etc as soon as we get our new international DVD player set up) Phonics (mix of Struggling Reader games which I highly recommend, ETC, AAS and learning while reading) Math (Singapore 1a, McRuffy Color Math K since there are still a few things I want him to get from that, RS games and Miquon Orange/Red) Handwriting (ZB and MP 1st Start Reading) Religion (Image of God Series, Catholic Treasure Box, Bible stories and lots and lots of picture books) Picture Study (we do one painting a week that I laminate from old calendars I got for cheap) Art (free painting, crafts, Artistic Pursuits) Music (Making Music Praying Twice) Reading (Little Stories for Little Folks, MCP Readers) Science (NOEO Bio 1 and RS4K Bio Pre-Level 1 as well as random unit studies such as The Solar System and Dinosaurs) History and Geography (We are doing a trip around the world and are currently doing South America) Tons and tons of read alouds (selections from SL P3/4, P4/5, Mater Amabilis, and recommendations) Poetry Nature Study Honestly, I would say that most people would be appalled at our list. It really works for us though. Most lessons are short and sweet. We don't do everything every day or even every week. For example, in handwriting, he gets frustrated doing the same book every day and I don't mind him doing two programs. I let him choose which one he wants to do since they use the same letter type. I think that if your schedule works for you then DO IT! :D Edited January 6, 2012 by kristinannie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sdreeves Posted January 6, 2012 Share Posted January 6, 2012 You are a motivated woman!!!! WOW!!! If it were me (and it isn't!) I would feel scattered jumping around with so many different things. I am wondering what affect all of this, no matter how good, will have on your 2nd grader's progress in the areas of focus and concentration? As a music teacher, I advocate practicing on the days that you eat, for 20-30 minutes. Hope that was gentle! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Embassy Posted January 6, 2012 Share Posted January 6, 2012 You are a motivated woman!!!! WOW!!! If it were me (and it isn't!) I would feel scattered jumping around with so many different things. I am wondering what affect all of this, no matter how good, will have on your 2nd grader's progress in the areas of focus and concentration? As a music teacher, I advocate practicing on the days that you eat, for 20-30 minutes. Hope that was gentle! I can't speak for the OP, but as someone who uses a variety and expanse of different subjects/materials/curriculum I don't find any negative impact on focus and attention. Conversely, I feel it increases my child's focus and attention because it isn't the same thing everyday. They can spend 5-6 hours on school without difficulty. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sahamamama Posted January 6, 2012 Author Share Posted January 6, 2012 I can't speak for the OP, but as someone who uses a variety and expanse of different subjects/materials/curriculum I don't find any negative impact on focus and attention. Conversely, I feel it increases my child's focus and attention because it isn't the same thing everyday. They can spend 5-6 hours on school without difficulty. [i like your blog. :) Your children are adorable. My husband is fluent in Arabic, and he got a kick out of seeing your daughter sing the Arabic alphabet.] Yes, and I can already see that in seven months, when Sugar Lump is a 2nd grader, she will be ready for much more "meat on the bone." She's willing and eager to do 3-4 hours of work, 4-5 days a week as a 1st grader. Of course, this includes many relaxing and/or fun activities, such as snuggly read alouds, art, music, games, puzzles, songs for memory work, and more. I don't feel as though the girls are under pressure to finish, finish, finish. They are not. Instead, they are engaged in learning, and they still have hours upon hours in which to play. I will say, I'm surprised at how many responded with "that's too much." I am surprised to hear it said so much, in many threads, especially on this board. :confused: Over the course of a full year (we go nearly year-round), these curricular plans are only targets at which we'll aim, but I'm not going to burn out my children just so I can check off all my boxes. :tongue_smilie: Still, I don't believe that cutting it down to two hours a day is honestly enough a 2nd grader. We're not trying to keep up with the public school's six hours X 180 days, but I think people are fooling themselves if they think that "two hours of homeschool equals six hours of public school." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ester Maria Posted January 6, 2012 Share Posted January 6, 2012 Ester Maria, if you check back in, could you please tell me what you would do differently? Please? :001_smile: I would make one modern foreign language a particular priority at this age. (Not that you cannot study multiple ones, but I would choose one which I would tie into other subjects and study more thoroughly.) So, for example, you wish to memorize Psalms: I would have your DD memorize both the English and the French versions of some of them (you could probably find nice recordings online too), even if she does not fully understand all of what she is memorizing (although I suggest roughly comparing with English). It will not only train her memory and air to some phonetic details, but will help her to get used to the language, have a vocabulary foundation, etc. Ditto for audiobooks - it would so "happen" that I would insert some kids' French audio books while she is bored in a car (you can probably find freebies online too, it does not take particular investment), have her watch some French cartoons on a fairly regular basis, etc., simply to allow for more touch with the language. Again, it may not work instantly, but little by little, these things help tremendously. I would REALLY invest into her French and use this time when she is fairly small, enthusiastic and eager to learn to get her to a good level in French to later incorporate it into regular studies. The ability to learn in two languages, even if not both equally proficient, is a big advantage and it is one of the things I recommend to parents with advanced / bright kids - to use some of that early time to additionally emphasize a foreign language. I would actually turn it into a daily thing and aim for solid 3-5 hours weekly of French. When the greater emphasis on content hits, about middle school, you will probably not have the luxury again to focus so intensely on a foreign language, yet so "effortlessly" - the better the basis you acquire in elementary, the better for you on the long run. In fact, if possible, I would actually invest into this area even in terms of a more formal curriculum / a teacher, if you can + all the enrichment (audio, video) you can squeeze in. I would make it a top priority to become reasonably comfortable with one modern foreign language BY high school, and then use it extensively for academic work in high school. I would also have her practice her instrument 5-6x/weekly. Lots of good connections are being formed via music training - it is my biggest HS regret that I did not have my older two start an instrument young (we offered, but did not insist). You bet that with the next kid I will not wait the t(w)een years. Also, drawing lessons (as in, not "creative art", but actual lessons, actual teaching of technique) did wonders for my girls in terms of precision, focus of the eyes, attention to detail, etc. Not saying you should take the same route, but consider it; I think we generally overemphasize creativity and underemphasize technical artistic training. It can be joyous, yet much more useful. These are the things I thought of, now of course it also depends on your circumstances and priorities. BTW, your avatar is hilarious. And redundant -- Perfect AND Italian? Should it not rather say, "Not only am I perfect, but I'm perfect because I'm Italian?" Italian-perfection = Cause-effect. :D :001_wub: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chepyl Posted January 6, 2012 Share Posted January 6, 2012 [i like your blog. :) Your children are adorable. My husband is fluent in Arabic, and he got a kick out of seeing your daughter sing the Arabic alphabet.] Yes, and I can already see that in seven months, when Sugar Lump is a 2nd grader, she will be ready for much more "meat on the bone." She's willing and eager to do 3-4 hours of work, 4-5 days a week as a 1st grader. Of course, this includes many relaxing and/or fun activities, such as snuggly read alouds, art, music, games, puzzles, songs for memory work, and more. I don't feel as though the girls are under pressure to finish, finish, finish. They are not. Instead, they are engaged in learning, and they still have hours upon hours in which to play. I will say, I'm surprised at how many responded with "that's too much." I am surprised to hear it said so much, in many threads, especially on this board. :confused: Over the course of a full year (we go nearly year-round), these curricular plans are only targets at which we'll aim, but I'm not going to burn out my children just so I can check off all my boxes. :tongue_smilie: Still, I don't believe that cutting it down to two hours a day is honestly enough a 2nd grader. We're not trying to keep up with the public school's six hours X 180 days, but I think people are fooling themselves if they think that "two hours of homeschool equals six hours of public school." I accomplish more in 1.5 hours with my first grader than public schools do in 6. I have had many people say that a general rule of thumb is 1 hour for each grade level until Jr high, making out at 5-6 hours in high school. The difference is in one on one teaching. I explain a math concept, he understands, we practice - 20 minutes most days. In school, the explanation would be 20 minutes, some kids don't get it, teacher explains again, they do problems together, they work alone....1 hour plus homework. It takes us 1/3 of the time. We do a lot, but we do it much faster. 2 hours can be equal to 6. In school teachers spend a lot of time on classroom management. Sit down, pledge, announcements, line up walk to PE or music, line up, walk back to class, sit down be quiet, line up for recess, line up after recess, sit down, be quiet, line up for lunch, lunch, line up, come back to class, sit down, be quiet, gather belongings, line up go home. How much school time is really in there? We do PE, music, and art away from home. We spend 1.5 hours on concentrated academics. Reading, silent and read-alouds, are not done in that time. It's not quantity, it's quality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs Twain Posted January 6, 2012 Share Posted January 6, 2012 I also don't understand the abundance of comments of the schedule being "too much." I don't understand why it is not good to set the bar high, especially for kids who have the ability and the desire to learn. Why should we hold them back? Why shouldn't we teach them all that we can? I do sort of agree with one comment about focusing on a couple of important subjects and doing them well. It made me think of Mike Farris' recent article in HSLDA about what he has learned as a homeschooling father. One piece of his advice was to make sure that the core subjects (math and LA) get first priority and get done well. There will be plenty of time for the other subjects later (high school and beyond). We try to follow that in our house, doing math, grammar, spelling, writing, and reading for the first several time blocks of the day when the kids are fresh. We do high quality programs and aim for high quality work in those subjects. After that, though, I find that there is plenty of time to add in other second-tier subjects (history, science, geography, music, art, civics, government, logic, foreign language). If my kids were not doing well in the LA and math, I would cut some or many of the second-tier subjects and focus on the most important things. However, if the kids are doing well, why not add in other good subjects that may be useful for their lives and help them to become better citizens? I don't know what God is going to call my kids to do when they grow up. Since that is the case, it is my intention to try to educate them as thoroughly as I can. I want my kids to have as many options open to them as possible. If I purposely limit their education, then I feel like I may be limiting the choices they can make for their lives. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Embassy Posted January 6, 2012 Share Posted January 6, 2012 [i like your blog. :) Your children are adorable. My husband is fluent in Arabic, and he got a kick out of seeing your daughter sing the Arabic alphabet.] Ha-ha! She tries. Thanks for your comments :) It's not quantity, it's quality. Yes, quality is very important. You can have both though. I know if my kids had school for 2-3 hours a day they wouldn't be happy because we would be leaving out the things they like the most. It sounds like your daughter has quantity time with the activities you have provided for her. Not everything of quality requires a desk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lewelma Posted January 6, 2012 Share Posted January 6, 2012 (edited) I will say, I'm surprised at how many responded with "that's too much." I am surprised to hear it said so much, in many threads, especially on this board. :confused: For me there are trade offs. If I spend more time using formal curriculum, then there is less time for my ds to follow his interests/passions, less time to play outside, less time to read, less time to do chores, less time for games, less time for informal (often deep) conversation, and less down time in general. I homeschool because of the freedom it gives my children, in addition to the academically superior education they receive. Now you can look at my siggy and realize that we follow the WTM pretty strictly with the exception of Latin (although we have done a year). We will finish these curriculum in a year. So I don't think it is fair to imply that I and others like me are slackers --"I don't believe that cutting it down to two hours a day is honestly enough in 2nd grade". But as I said before I do think that you and I have a very different philosophy. I ramp up the difficulty level until my ds really has to think (and even struggle), and when he is done with 2.5 hours of formal learning, he is exhausted. He is doing 4th grade work in 2nd grade, so I am not sure how much more time I want to spend on formal work. Now, I have seen the "how much time do you spend homeschooling" threads every month or so for a couple of years. And I know that everyone counts their hours differently, so perhaps we have a different definition of time. My son does 2.5 hours of pencil in hand, at a desk time each day. I do not include in the 2.5 hours any read alouds (science, history, lit), independent reading, music practice, or his PE. All this probably adds up to 6 hours or such, but who really cares? My ds is academically advanced, but still a happy little boy who has the freedom to choose how he wants to spend most of his day. My concern was not that you were doing "too much", but that you had 2 curriculum for every subject. Some newbies can't decide, so that just don't decide and try to do it all. It sounds like this description does not fit you, but it does fit many, and those of us who have BTDT try to help the newbies not to sink into a deep dark hole of doing too much as a way of heading off their critics, or to protect themselves from worry. If you think that the list of curriculum is working for you, that is great. I encourage you to follow your instincts. But please don't read into my comments more than was intended - some helpful advice from someone who knows and loves the WTM and has BTDT. Good Luck, Ruth in NZ Edited January 6, 2012 by lewelma Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boscopup Posted January 6, 2012 Share Posted January 6, 2012 I will say, I'm surprised at how many responded with "that's too much." I am surprised to hear it said so much, in many threads, especially on this board. :confused: <snip> Still, I don't believe that cutting it down to two hours a day is honestly enough a 2nd grader. I follow WTM guidelines pretty closely (except I do different grade levels). The second grade lineup in the book only takes about 2 hours or so. I do think that's enough. We spend about 2.5 hours 3 days a week and 1.5 hours 2 days a week (so average just a tad over 2 hours a day), including history and science. Honestly, if I tried to do any more than that, my son would be burnt out. During that 2 hours, he's using his brain a LOT more than he did in a whole day at school. He needs time to play and explore and enjoy the company of his brothers. He's working in 4th grade math, 3rd grade grammar, 3rd grade spelling, 2nd grade writing, reading books at 4th-7th grade levels for literature, doing SOTW and library books (recommended in the AG), doing 3rd grade science and library books, notebooking in history and science... The thing that takes longest is usually math, because we probably spend 45 minutes on that (though this week it's been easier stuff, so we've been spending about 30 minutes and getting two lessons done). I think that's plenty for 2nd grade. WTM is really not that rigorous in the young elementary years. WTM focuses on skills in those years. In the logic and rhetoric stages is where it gets more rigorous, and the times take much longer (a high schooler might need a full school day, considering the b&m schooled child would be listening to lectures 45 minutes x 6 subjects or so, plus doing 2-3 hours of homework after school). Now the thing people might have with the multiple curricula is that often people can't just choose one, so they try to do it all, and then they burn out on that subject. Or your child, who appears to be quite bright might get bored doing the same thing over again in a different curricula at the same level. I know I couldn't do FLL2 and then go over to GWG2 AND also do R&S2 with my son. It only takes one curriculum to teach him the material. Using 2 or 3 would be overkill, unless they came at it from a completely different angle, but I don't think that's really the case with the grammar programs. It looks to me like you're trying to slow her down by using multiple programs. That may or may not work, and slowing down may not be what she needs. One of the benefits of homeschooling is that we can work at our child's pace. So rather than pummel my son with 3 different 2nd grade math programs that ALL have content he already fully understands, I give him one 4th grade program that has some new content and gives him enough challenging word problems to really make him think. The former would have him hating math before too long. The latter keeps him happy and interested. Same goes with grammar... I don't give him multiple 2nd grade programs that are all too easy for him. I bumped him up to a 3rd grade program that appropriately met his needs (ok, it's easy too, but he enjoys it and isn't bored, and there are new topics and fun diagramming). Now if you're doing parts of different programs, but not repeating the same information from the different programs, that might be enjoyable to your DD. But going over the same information over and over again when she already understands it? That might not be so fun. Of course, some kids like that type of thing, so if your DD does, that's fine. But if she doesn't need to use multiple grammar programs at the same level, I'd not waste my time doing so. Pick one, and let her go play and explore life with the all that free time. :) We school year round also, but at the end of a book, we move on to the next level. I don't try to make "2nd grade grammar" last one full school year. I just don't have any reason to do that. I go into each year knowing that my son will need more than one level for some of his subjects (math in particular). Or if it's a subject where I don't think acceleration is useful, I just reduce the amount of time spent on that subject. Anyway, I don't think your lineup is horrible, and I don't think your languages thing would take up that much time, since you're not learning 4 full languages. I do think you don't need 2 grammar programs at a level that you've already done, and we've already discussed that. I think if you just did R&S3, you'd be fine. Do it 2-3 times a week if you want. :) As long as your DD is *happy* and YOU aren't burning out either, it's all good! :D I personally couldn't keep up with all that you are doing (plus twins! :001_huh:), but I'm not you. ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Embassy Posted January 6, 2012 Share Posted January 6, 2012 For me there are trade offs. If I spend more time using formal curriculum, then there is less time for my ds to follow his interests/passions, less time to play outside, less time to read, less time to do chores, less time for games, less time for informal (often deep) conversation, and less down time in general. I homeschool because of the freedom it gives my children, in addition to the academically superior education they receive. We spend a good chunk of our day on school, but much less time than public school peers especially when you factor in homework. However, I value those things as well and incorporate many of those things into our school day. I don't know the OP, but it doesn't look like her list is all formal curriculum. Formal curriculum does not equal school around here. I don't view it as a trade off. By having a longer school day I can incorporate my child's interests and passions, daily exercise (not always outside in this weather), games, chores, reading and read alouds and movies related to them, and informal conversation. Down time? Probably not as much as your kid, but way more than a child in public school. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mommee & Baba Posted January 6, 2012 Share Posted January 6, 2012 Looks like too much to me. I see that many things are not done every day and many are also short, and all seem developmentally appropriate...but the sheer number of things you have planned would overwhelm me and my 2nd grader. :iagree: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wabi Sabi Posted January 6, 2012 Share Posted January 6, 2012 You sound like a very busy woman! My concern would be whether you have enough downtime and leeway built into your plan to follow little rabbit trails as they arise. Different stroke for different folks and all that, but I still can't manage to wrap my head around a year that is meticulously planned out so far in advance. What if your child starts asking questions about something that is not in your plans/curricula for the year? With such a busy schedule will you be able to set aside time for exploring such things? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ester Maria Posted January 7, 2012 Share Posted January 7, 2012 I also don't understand the abundance of comments of the schedule being "too much." I don't understand why it is not good to set the bar high, especially for kids who have the ability and the desire to learn. Why should we hold them back? Why shouldn't we teach them all that we can? [...] However, if the kids are doing well, why not add in other good subjects that may be useful for their lives and help them to become better citizens? I don't know what God is going to call my kids to do when they grow up. Since that is the case, it is my intention to try to educate them as thoroughly as I can. I want my kids to have as many options open to them as possible. If I purposely limit their education, then I feel like I may be limiting the choices they can make for their lives. :iagree: I actually do not find the OP to be unreasonable - although I would be sure to eliminate "busywork" (if there is repetition between multiple curricula, etc.). I write with the assumption she will eliminate it too and merge things in a way that suits her DD. For an eager and interested child, this can be a perfect age to build the foundational skills and knowledge with some breadth. All of that breadth will ultimately translate to depth, as it typically happens in a good education - we make them study various fields, but then they end up combining them, stealing ideas from different disciplines, being exceptionally good at history also because they gained cultural knowledge by learning a few languages, etc. It is all connected, though it may seem "wild". The key is to find a right balance for each child - I also tend to say err on the side of keeping it simple with the littles, as a general rule, but if the OP has a child that demands a particular intellectual attention and variety ot be a happy a child, why not? My only concern would be that OP might be a bit "overscheduled" in a sense of "planning" too much things which should, at this age, maybe come a bit more spontaneously (with a less rigid schedule - but then again, I take the descriptions as approximations anyway). But other than that, why not provide more if you can, while making sure the child is reasonably burdened (children this age differ greatly as to what is reasonable)? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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