Do Christians and Muslims worship the same God?

[BeckyFL]

No. That's all I feel like saying tonight. Just no.

[solascriptura]

No, Muslims and Christians do not worship the same God. Muslims do not believe Jesus to be God nor do they believe in the Trinity. It might have been addressed here, but would it be accurate to say that Muslims and Jews worship the same god?

[Shannon in TN]

I have only made it through page 6 but I wanted to add something. I've seen several give similar response, so it may not be exactly new, but here goes.

 

I had a pastor a while back who led a class with a reading from what we all thought was the OT with the story of Abraham and Isaac. Turns out it was from the Quran. It sounded so much like the Bible, we all were surprised. The whole evening was spent discussing the origins of the Muslim faith. Too much info to get into here (plus it's been a couple of years). Anyway, I asked him at the end of class this very question - is our God the same as theirs? His answer was no, because of the Trinity. They (Muslims) believe in one God, whereas Christians believe in the Trinity - one is three and the three are one. It's just not possible to be both.

 

I had another lady leading a Bible class for me put it this way, too. That our God is not the same because our God has come down to commune with us (Adam and Eve) - that God wants to be with us and part of us and that's why he sent Jesus, so that he can be with us through the blood of Christ. The Muslim God doesn't have a desire to be with the people.

 

I'm not trying to offend anyone, and I hope that I haven't, but I just thought I'd share these other two perspectives. Now, off to read the next 20 pages (and hope that I haven't completely stuck my foot in my mouth with this :tongue_smilie:)

[Sputterduck]

I have only made it through page 6 but I wanted to add something. I've seen several give similar response, so it may not be exactly new, but here goes.

 

I had a pastor a while back who led a class with a reading from what we all thought was the OT with the story of Abraham and Isaac. Turns out it was from the Quran. It sounded so much like the Bible, we all were surprised. The whole evening was spent discussing the origins of the Muslim faith. Too much info to get into here (plus it's been a couple of years). Anyway, I asked him at the end of class this very question - is our God the same as theirs? His answer was no, because of the Trinity. They (Muslims) believe in one God, whereas Christians believe in the Trinity - one is three and the three are one. It's just not possible to be both.

 

I had another lady leading a Bible class for me put it this way, too. That our God is not the same because our God has come down to commune with us (Adam and Eve) - that God wants to be with us and part of us and that's why he sent Jesus, so that he can be with us through the blood of Christ. The Muslim God doesn't have a desire to be with the people.

 

I'm not trying to offend anyone, and I hope that I haven't, but I just thought I'd share these other two perspectives. Now, off to read the next 20 pages (and hope that I haven't completely stuck my foot in my mouth with this :tongue_smilie:)

 

So then, do Jews and Christians worship different Gods in your opinion?

[WishboneDawn]

No, Muslims and Christians do not worship the same God. Muslims do not believe Jesus to be God nor do they believe in the Trinity. It might have been addressed here, but would it be accurate to say that Muslims and Jews worship the same god?

 

I'd say we do worship the same God but have different understandings of God.

[Shannon in TN]

So then, do Jews and Christians worship different Gods in your opinion?

 

I don't think so because even Jesus was Jewish. Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't the Torah and the OT the same? Jesus changed things up a bit (in layman's terms) being the Messiah and all, and so the Christ-followers left Judaism to become Christians and thus Christianity was born and the NT was written.

 

(and now to read page 8 - there's no way I'm going to get through this tonight!!)

 

ETA: Of course, after reading several other posts - up to page 12 now - I can see how saying the Muslim God not being the same as the Christian God but that the Christian God and the Jewish God are the same might be flawed logic and I don't have an answer for that. I do remember learning that Muslims back in the day respected all the "People of the Book" - Jewish, Christian and Muslim alike and I think that might stem from the God of Abraham. It wasn't until - and I know my memory is failing me here - there was a leadership change early in the time of Islam that the mutual respect wasn't there any more. Or something like that. Something else to keep me up tonight - trying to remember....

Edited September 10, 2011 by Shannon in TN

[leeannpal]

The Torah is the first 5 books of the Old Testament.

[Shannon in TN]

The Torah is the first 5 books of the Old Testament.

 

Thank you! Isn't that also called the Pentatauch (sp?)

[Osmosis Mom]

Basically, depending on your viewpoint and who you want peace with, then Muslims are the outsiders. This is the obvious answer and makes sense especially in light of ****ed terrorist acts. It puts things in perspective and makes the world go 'round (from your viewpoint).

 

This is directed at posters who want to argue that Muslims believe in a different Creator than their own. It's actually such a funny statement, but it has brought out so much hatred (imo). My God is different from yours and because I sympathize more with Jewish people, then (in my faulty logic) I'll accept that the Jewish God theoretically could be mine as well (but of course the Jews are wrongly-guided, but I'll ignore that for now). But most definitely then the Muslim Allah (which in Arabic means God and is used by Arab Christians to determine their god, but I don't know this since I don't have Arab friends) is totally different; we all know how weird and different Muslims are.

 

This thread should be merged with a few other threads and would thus explain why we never understand each other and never really enter into dialogue; we being educated, peace-seeking individuals who probably have a lot more in common than not.

[umsami]

Wading in gently as a Muslim who was a seminary-educated Christian not too long ago.

 

It's not a simple answer.

 

On one hand, Muslims and Christians do not worship the same God as Muslims are strict Monotheists who do not believe in a Godhead or Trinity. Christians consider God to include God the Father, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit. For Muslims, God is simply God. God has no children. God is neither male nor female--so there is no God the Father concept.

 

However, if you ask Jews and Muslims if they worship the same God, most will agree. They both worship the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. Just as a Muslim finds the concept of the trinity troublesome, so do most observant Jews (of course, Messianic Jews tend to be the exception.)

 

For those who try to get in a tizzy regarding the word Allah--it is the commonly used word for God among Arabic-speaking Christians and Jews (yes, there are both), Allah is the word used for God. Also in Indonesia and Malaysia, Christians there use Allah--and there was a lawsuit regarding whether or not the Catholic church could use Allah for God not too long ago. If you go to the Wycliff Bible Translators site and pull up the Arabic Bible, you can read Allah used for God in 3:16 and in Genesis and throughout. From an etymology-standpoint, Allah existed as a word long before the English word God did. Arabic, being Semetic, is quite similar to Hebrew El, Eloah, and Elhim. Many dictionaries link God to the Sanskrit word "hu".

 

I've read a lot of weird and simply untrue statements in only browsing through these, so all I can say, is that I recommend that for those who want to learn about Islam to actually read a copy of the Qur'an. Mohammed Asad and the Oxford version (Haleeb I think is the translator) are two good, well-respected versions used by native English-speakers today. You'll find many familiar stories from the Bible--including an entire book called Maryam (Mary)--note in Aramaic her name would be Maryam as well.

 

Shannon.... Muslims still respect all the People of the Book (which means any group of people that God gave scriptures to--Jews and Christians are the most common). Well, at least they're supposed to. Yes, you'll find Muslim-Jewish and Muslim-Christian issues these days, but those are relatively new phenomena and have to do with politics, land, and wars rather than religion regardless of what people may say. It's people using religion for political manipulation--which happens with all religions. Remember, in the Dark Ages Jews were being killed by Christians so fled to Muslim Spain where both groups flourished in science, medicine, art, etc. When the Muslims were kicked out by Isabel and Ferdinand, the Jews and Muslims were given the choice convert or die.

 

I also highly recommend Yahiya Emerick's "Complete Idiot's Guide to Understanding Islam." It's a quick read and accurate.

 

Reza Aslan's "No god but God" is excellent. If you're wondering why the Egyptians are attacking the Israeli embassy right now, it's not just about Palestine. You should really read up on the Suez Canal Crisis. If you're studying the Crusades, read "The Crusades through Arab Eyes." Etc.

 

Muslim society flourished when Muslims remembered the commandment to respect the People of the Book. When Muslims worked with Jews and Christians, treated all with respect, etc. Isolationism or demonizing other faiths has not helped Muslims--and I don't think Islamophobia helps the US or others as well. There are so many common themes in both religions, heck all religions. The Golden Rule exists in all. Variations of the 10 commandments exist in all. The mercy, grace, and compassion of God is gigantic in Islam. It's why Muslims say "Bismillah-ar-Rahman-ar-Rahim" probably 100+ times per day--to remember that mercy and kindness. (It means "In the name of God, the Most Merciful, the Most Compassionate.")

 

I recommend googling "Hadith Qudsi" to read a bit about God's mercy and forgiveness in Islam.

 

On a side note, one of the reasons Muslim societies tend to be less economically robust than Christian ones is the prohibition on riba (interest). The Bible also prohibits usury, but I'm not sure how/when the Christian feeling on interest changed. To be honest, I know way too many people in debt who would have probably done better to avoid interest payments and the like.

Edited September 10, 2011 by umsami

[staceyobu]

Basically, depending on your viewpoint and who you want peace with, then Muslims are the outsiders. This is the obvious answer and makes sense especially in light of ****ed terrorist acts. It puts things in perspective and makes the world go 'round (from your viewpoint).

 

This is directed at posters who want to argue that Muslims believe in a different Creator than their own. It's actually such a funny statement, but it has brought out so much hatred (imo). My God is different from yours and because I sympathize more with Jewish people, then (in my faulty logic) I'll accept that the Jewish God theoretically could be mine as well (but of course the Jews are wrongly-guided, but I'll ignore that for now). But most definitely then the Muslim Allah (which in Arabic means God and is used by Arab Christians to determine their god, but I don't know this since I don't have Arab friends) is totally different; we all know how weird and different Muslims are.

 

This thread should be merged with a few other threads and would thus explain why we never understand each other and never really enter into dialogue; we being educated, peace-seeking individuals who probably have a lot more in common than not.

 

I think there is opportunity for dialogue and understanding either way. Can I not have dialogue and understanding with a Hindu because they are not part of an Abrahamic religion? I would disagree with you and say that I see Christians as the outsiders. Jews and Muslims both believe in a singular God where Christians believe him to be triune.

 

In a way, this conversation is meaningless. Is it the same God and we have correct and incorrect perceptions about him? Or is it a *different* God? I would argue that perhaps a better question would be: "What are the differences in the nature of God as viewed in Christianity and Islam?" Because, obviously, there are huge differences. To try and act like there aren't differences undermines both faiths that have their own separate ideas about theology.

 

Edited to add... I would personally put Jews in the same category as Muslims in saying that their God is different from my own. The Christian God is one and the same with Jesus. If you reject Jesus as being the one true God, then you are not worshiping what I worship. It doesn't matter to me if you claim the God of Abraham. What matters to me is what you do with Jesus.

Edited September 10, 2011 by staceyobu

[Osmosis Mom]

I think there is opportunity for dialogue and understanding either way. Can I not have dialogue and understanding with a Hindu because they are not part of an Abrahamic religion? I would disagree with you and say that I see Christians as the outsiders. Jews and Muslims both believe in a singular God where Christians believe him to be triune.

 

In a way, this conversation is meaningless. Is it the same God and we have correct and incorrect perceptions about him? Or is it a *different* God? I would argue that perhaps a better question would be: "What are the differences in the nature of God as viewed in Christianity and Islam?" Because, obviously, there are huge differences. To try and act like there aren't differences undermines both faiths that have their own separate ideas about theology.

 

Stacey, you are right. I had added something about Natives and Hindus actually, but removed it. I was being cynical.

 

Even before I converted to Islam, I believed that God had spoken to Humanity through different vessels. It makes sense.

[staceyobu]

Stacey, you are right. I had added something about Natives and Hindus actually, but removed it. I was being cynical.

 

Even before I converted to Islam, I believed that God had spoken to Humanity through different vessels. It makes sense.

 

Is it rude for me to ask you if you are American or immigrated here?

[Osmosis Mom]

Haven't we all immigrated here?? Been here for 14 years.

[staceyobu]

Haven't we all immigrated here?? Been here for 14 years.

 

Yes... I was just curious when you mentioned converting. I will now go back to minding my own business. :tongue_smilie:

[Lovedtodeath]

 

This thread should be merged with a few other threads and would thus explain why we never understand each other and never really enter into dialogue; we being educated, peace-seeking individuals who probably have a lot more in common than not.

:( I know a lot of people who don't worship my god. It doesn't mean that I don't understand them, enter into dialogue with them, have things in common with them, have them as friends and family, etc.

[Shannon in TN]

Wading in gently as a Muslim who was a seminary-educated Christian not too long ago.

 

It's not a simple answer.

 

...Thank you for wading into the conversation! I loved your entire response and it does make one think

 

Shannon.... Muslims still respect all the People of the Book (which means any group of people that God gave scriptures to--Jews and Christians are the most common). Well, at least they're supposed to. Yes, you'll find Muslim-Jewish and Muslim-Christian issues these days, but those are relatively new phenomena and have to do with politics, land, and wars rather than religion regardless of what people may say. It's people using religion for political manipulation--which happens with all religions. Remember, in the Dark Ages Jews were being killed by Christians so fled to Muslim Spain where both groups flourished in science, medicine, art, etc. When the Muslims were kicked out by Isabel and Ferdinand, the Jews and Muslims were given the choice convert or die.

 

I was referring to something I had learned in a one-hour class (which was not long enough!) and I'm trying to remember the details back to around the time of the first leader after Muhammad. The Islamic people, Jews and Christians all lived peacefully together and when traveling, I think, gave shelter to each other, because they all recognized that they were from the God of Abraham. However, something happened, that leader died, there wasn't a clear next leader (hence the Sunni and Shi'a split) and then there was discord. I'm sorry, I shouldn't have said disrespected - it wasn't the right word choice. Maybe discord would be the better choice. I completely agree with you that religion is being used for political manipulation. I see it all the time and it makes me so sad.

 

 

I also highly recommend Yahiya Emerick's "Complete Idiot's Guide to Understanding Islam." It's a quick read and accurate.

 

Reza Aslan's "No god but God" is excellent. If you're wondering why the Egyptians are attacking the Israeli embassy right now, it's not just about Palestine. You should really read up on the Suez Canal Crisis. If you're studying the Crusades, read "The Crusades through Arab Eyes." Etc.

 

Muslim society flourished when Muslims remembered the commandment to respect the People of the Book. When Muslims worked with Jews and Christians, treated all with respect, etc. (This is what I was thinking of. Wasn't there a term for that or something? I seem to remember there being something....) Isolationism or demonizing other faiths has not helped Muslims--and I don't think Islamophobia helps the US or others as well. There are so many common themes in both religions, heck all religions. The Golden Rule exists in all. Variations of the 10 commandments exist in all. The mercy, grace, and compassion of God is gigantic in Islam. It's why Muslims say "Bismillah-ar-Rahman-ar-Rahim" probably 100+ times per day--to remember that mercy and kindness. (It means "In the name of God, the Most Merciful, the Most Compassionate.")

 

I recommend googling "Hadith Qudsi" to read a bit about God's mercy and forgiveness in Islam.

 

 

 

 

Again, thank you for taking to time to wade into the conversation and for the book references. I'll be making a list and hope to read a bit when life settles down.

Edited September 10, 2011 by Shannon in TN

[Mrs Mungo]

Basically, depending on your viewpoint and who you want peace with, then Muslims are the outsiders. This is the obvious answer and makes sense especially in light of ****ed terrorist acts. It puts things in perspective and makes the world go 'round (from your viewpoint).

 

This is directed at posters who want to argue that Muslims believe in a different Creator than their own. It's actually such a funny statement, but it has brought out so much hatred (imo).

 

:confused: Christians think Muslims are wrong about God, Muslims think Christians are wrong about God. Why are you demonizing one group for it? It is okay for you to think that our Bible is corrupted, the laws of the Jews are corrupted, only Islam has the correct version of God's word as revealed through Mohammed. But, you are saying Christians are only motivated by racism or wanting to ostracize Muslims? I am seeking to understand here.

[Mrs Mungo]

Haven't we all immigrated here??

 

Only if you are counting immigrations that happened ten thousand years ago.

[twoforjoy]

:confused: Christians think Muslims are wrong about God, Muslims think Christians are wrong about God. Why are you demonizing one group for it? It is okay for you to think that our Bible is corrupted, the laws of the Jews are corrupted, only Islam has the correct version of God's word as revealed through Mohammed. But, you are saying Christians are only motivated by racism or wanting to ostracize Muslims? I am seeking to understand here.

 

I think there's a distinction between being wrong about God and worshiping a different God. AFAIK, most Muslims don't believe that Christians are worshiping a different/false God; they think Christians have some wrong ideas about God, but the God they worship is the same one that Muslims worship. Most Christians feels the same way about Muslims.

 

That's a different matter than saying that, when Muslims talk about God, they are talking about an entirely different (and therefore imaginary, non-existent, and/or demonic) entity than Christians are referring to when they talk about God (or vice versa).

[Jyniffrec]

Muslim society flourished when Muslims remembered the commandment to respect the People of the Book. When Muslims worked with Jews and Christians, treated all with respect, etc. Isolationism or demonizing other faiths has not helped Muslims--and I don't think Islamophobia helps the US or others as well. There are so many common themes in both religions, heck all religions. The Golden Rule exists in all. Variations of the 10 commandments exist in all. The mercy, grace, and compassion of God is gigantic in Islam. It's why Muslims say "Bismillah-ar-Rahman-ar-Rahim" probably 100+ times per day--to remember that mercy and kindness. (It means "In the name of God, the Most Merciful, the Most Compassionate.")

 

 

This model is how we try to live as a family. I am not closed to friendships with anyone of another faith, in fact I find it easier to be friends with people who are not Christians. There is no assumption that we all agree and there is no effort to convert one another. I have a very high respect for my Muslim friends especially, because they live their faith. My very best friend is an ex-pagan turned something like a scientologist. She says that my faith is a small circle and that hers is large (and I would agree). It doesn't matter to me because I am not the Judger of souls. Respecting each other and leaving off the opinions about each other's faith and to show, as you said, mercy and kindness (and love) is what it is about, isn't it?

 

FWIW, Father of Pearl and I went to Egypt and Palestine in 1997 for a few months. We were abused by settlers for being with Arab Palestinians in Hebron. I wasn't surprised when 9/11 happened (as awful as it was).

 

Thanks for your post.

[Mrs Mungo]

I think there's a distinction between being wrong about God and worshiping a different God. AFAIK, most Muslims don't believe that Christians are worshiping a different/false God; they think Christians have some wrong ideas about God, but the God they worship is the same one that Muslims worship. Most Christians feels the same way about Muslims.

 

Except, they do. They don't believe Christ was divine, therefore they believe we are worshipping a false god.

 

That's a different matter than saying that, when Muslims talk about God, they are talking about an entirely different (and therefore imaginary, non-existent, and/or demonic) entity than Christians are referring to when they talk about God (or vice versa).

 

Eta: I have lots of friends outside of my faith, including atheists who think I am sort of crazy for being a Christian. ;)

 

It is impossible for most religions to believe that their religion is right without believing everyone else is wrong.

Edited September 10, 2011 by Mrs Mungo

[Wayfaring Stranger]

There is a guy in my town that writes about me in his blog. He thinks, because I work for the local government, that I am a left wing liberal who wants to take his farm and herd everyone into the city and make them live in highrise apartments. In reality, I am an agrarian conservative. I buy milk from a local farmer and I want the government to leave the farmers alone.

 

Is this guy really writing about me and he is just mistaken? Is he writing about a me that does not exist or maybe he is writing about someone somewhere and is just saying it is me? I do not know the answer. But I do know that what this man believes about me effects how this person acts. What he believes matters.

 

In the same way what we believe about God changes the way we behave. Whether we think Islam, Judaism and Christianity have the same God or not. We understand our God differently and that changes what we do. I think it would be worse to give the impression that we all are the same because that does not reflect reality.

 

When I was in Egypt there was a Christian group that bought a mosque and started holding services. They kept the Muslim format to the service - they all faced east, did the same prostrations that the Muslims did and did the same prayers except they would insert Jesus and the Bible in and took the Koran and any reference to Mohammed out. This group was quickly kicked out of the country because there is nothing so offensive or sneaky as trying to get someone to convert or change loyalties by saying we are the same. It is better to acknowledge that people have differences and state up front what they are.

[Beauty From Ashes]

From my personal time studying Allah, no.

 

From speaking to a very few Muslims, no. (their stance, not mine)

 

Their god is very different from the God of Christians. I do have my own thoughts on where their faith stems from, and that thought comes from the Bible. And it would explain the god they have created and his beliefs and commands of them. But that's just a personal belief that I won't get into on here as I have done no formal study to see if it could be plausible.

[Orthodox6]

Can you elaborate? (Your post is interesting.) If you are writing about a Coptic parish, then of course they would pray toward the east, and make prostrations. Those two ancient elements of worship are among those adopted from Christianity by Islam. It is remote, but possible that a mosque could have been purchased, and adapted for Christian worship.

 

 

 

When I was in Egypt there was a Christian group that bought a mosque and started holding services. They kept the Muslim format to the service - they all faced east, did the same prostrations that the Muslims did and did the same prayers except they would insert Jesus and the Bible in and took the Koran and any reference to Mohammed out. This group was quickly kicked out of the country because there is nothing so offensive or sneaky as trying to get someone to convert or change loyalties by saying we are the same. It is better to acknowledge that people have differences and state up front what they are.

[mommaduck]

Can you elaborate? (Your post is interesting.) If you are writing about a Coptic parish, then of course they would pray toward the east, and make prostrations. Those two ancient elements of worship are among those adopted from Christianity by Islam. It is remote, but possible that a mosque could have been purchased, and adapted for Christian worship.

 

He's probably referring more to the same type of Protestant groups that go into Orthodox countries (Russia, as a prime example) and dress up like Orthodox priests, carry around icons, etc, but are actually baptists and preach against Mary, Real Presence in the Eucharist, and paedo-baptism. It's a "see we're just like you, come check us out, then we'll tell you how everything else you believe is wrong." There is one person, that communicated with me awhile back, who has relatives involved in this stuff and I was told that Orthodoxy was a "cult" (first time I'd ever heard a Protestant use that term for Orthodoxy, and I was raised Baptist!).

Edited September 10, 2011 by mommaduck

[mommaduck]

ex: http://islamworld.net/docs/tanseer.htm

[Orthodox6]

Mommaduck, thanks for both of your posts. That definitely is NOT how either EO or OO Christians would share their faith.

 

ex: http://islamworld.net/docs/tanseer.htm

[mommaduck]

Mommaduck, thanks for both of your posts. That definitely is NOT how either EO or OO Christians would share their faith.

 

Not a problem. I figure, if they are doing it to other Christians, then it doesn't really surprise me that they would do it to those that aren't Christian. The Southern Baptists put out a paper on/against the EO, particularly in Russia. Here is a video series with an EO priest responding to the paper bit by bit. A couple of the videos you will have to skip as there is only static for audio.

[Lovedtodeath]

:( That seems a far cry from 1 Cor. 2:2. "For I determined not to know anything among you except Jesus Christ and Him crucified."