Define: "afterschooling" for me?

[Bang!Zoom!]

Hi, I'm not sure I'm in the right place, what do you define or use to describe "afterschooling" here?

[Roadrunner]

Parents supplementing public education at home. We do pretty much everything at home (English, math, logic, etc) even though my kids go to PS.

[Bang!Zoom!]

It sounds like the right fit so far; is self-created curriculum & lessons okay?

[specialmama]

if you're the mom you decide. It's all up to you. :D

[Bang!Zoom!]

Okay, here is the issue. My 8 yr. old daughter heard her teacher say to her: "It's not a good idea to want to be an artist, there is no money in that career."

 

I am working on overcoming that statement and the damage it did. I'd like to weave together ideas on how to do that. Would anyone like to help?

[Rosie_0801]

You'll get more answers to that question by asking on the general board. We have artists on here, and they'll be able to give realistic accounts.

 

Rosie

[Guest Dulcimeramy]

Okay, here is the issue. My 8 yr. old daughter heard her teacher say to her: "It's not a good idea to want to be an artist, there is no money in that career."

 

I am working on overcoming that statement and the damage it did. I'd like to weave together ideas on how to do that. Would anyone like to help?

 

How infuriating!!! And how cruel and wrong. :( Nice value system, there, Teacher. UGH.

 

Time to go find artists who have been repaid for their vision in ways that fulfilled them, whether the payment came in money, or recognition, or value added to a community, or just the heart-filling satisfaction of having captured the beauty in one's mind in a medium that could be shared with others.

 

The Worth of Art. The Worth of the Artist. That's what you have to show your daughter.

 

One quick and tangible way would be to arrange art lessons for your daughter, A.S.A.P. The fact that Mama is willing to shell out cash and carve out time for her development as an artist will counter-act her teacher's statement like nothing else.

 

Oh, I'd want to give that teacher a piece of my mind.

[Guest Dulcimeramy]

You'll get more answers to that question by asking on the general board. We have artists on here, and they'll be able to give realistic accounts.

 

Rosie

 

:iagree: That question deserves its own space.

 

TBH, my husband was a graphic artist and left the field because he didn't feel he could raise a family on it. He didn't want to become embittered toward art if it didn't pay, so he got out while he could still love his art.

 

But some do make a living at art. Artists exist. They are not imaginary. And the study of art (music, dance, etc.) has worth of its own. We are part of a world full of beauty and emotion and time and space. There is value in learning to throw a pot or play a tune, even if it never brings a dime.

 

I would call that teacher's remark part of the mess that I have labeled, "What is Wrong With the World Today."

[Rosie_0801]

And "art" covers such a range of activities. There may not be a huge market for Dadaist paintings (my brother studied art, that's how I learned that word. I think I got it right :tongue_smilie:) but take a look at displays in the window of cake decorating shops and tell me the creators aren't artists.

 

Rosie

[Bang!Zoom!]

Okay, thanks for the guidance. I will post for help in the general section. I'm not quite sure how to ask my questions to the people that might be interested in helping. I hope I do this right.

[LittleIzumi]

:grouphug::grouphug::grouphug: I have already decided that if anyone tries telling dd she shouldn't pursue science or math because she's a girl, I'm pulling her out (I know that's not an option for some). That is her passion & gift and if school teachers try to mess with that, :smash:.

 

:grouphug: I hope you can fix this with your dd. Have you talked to the teacher about her comment?

[Bang!Zoom!]

She is attending a different school next year. In the most gentle terms I can manage, the reason is simply that I've had it. Excuse me, I should say, "we've all had it."

 

You honestly don't want to hear what this teacher said about staying home, having babies while the husband goes to work. I didn't want to either; I was driving, going down the road at 45 miles an hour in rush time traffic when this conversation first happened. I was not prepared to have a teachable moment just then.. lol...

 

I'm familiar with Blooms taxonomy as a method of education, and I've gathered up many ideas to work on. It is the finer details of putting them into practice I need help with.

 

Have you ever bought one of those Sauder assemble-it-yourself dressers? Get it out of the box, look at the pieces scattered all over the floor; glance at the instructional pictures and say to yourself "oh boy, this might be harder than I thought.."

 

That's sort of where I am at right now.

 

I have the pieces, parts, ideas, and objectives...but how do I put it together the right way?

 

This is where I'm stuck.

[Rosie_0801]

If you have the pieces, parts, ideas, and objectives, you probably can't put them together a wrong way :) Or if you do, she'll tell you. :rolleyes:

 

Suppose you describe the pieces to us? You are sure to get commentary. ;)

 

It's perfectly ok to take a 'throw it at the wall and see what sticks' approach. :)

 

Rosie

Edited July 7, 2011 by Rosie_0801

[Bang!Zoom!]

Well, I've been sketching and writing things for a week or so. Saving little things from here and there as I've read.

 

I put a little area to *try* to organize the thoughts here: http://art4kid.blogspot.com/ (nothing to really see yet).

 

I know that this child is a visual learner, followed by auditory, then tactile, next verbal and last kinetic. She's impatient (classic 8 yr old). Of course I know these things, I'm her mother..lol..

 

What I've done is to gather up about 25 or so art video/documentaries. I'm trying to put them together by *her* sorting them out top down. She was very convinced she wanted the first artist to be Alex Gray (link here for trailer: http://art4kid.blogspot.com/p/art-ed-video.html ). Well, I began to play it and she said, "This makes me sleepy.."

 

Huh? Um, sorry kid..mom already has worked out your vocabulary sheets, the projects after the movie..all of this stuff..and now..you say..."this makes me sleepy.." What a kick in the pants that was for me. My rational mind kicked in and said, "Look, it's bad timing, that's all..that's all.." and we did nothing that day.

 

I'd already gone and fetched the evil eye beads (this is a related element of Alex Gray's work), had the kit ready for after viewing...(the creation or top level of blooms..)

 

I thought I was all smarty pants ready, crossed my t's and dotted my eyes and was stood up!

 

Huge lesson plan failure. Or just the execution of it anyway.

 

I'm not throwing the baby out with the bathwater by any means, but..that's how things have started out.

 

I need to stay motivated too, my mama-bear anger is only going to take me so far of course. I want to see the growth and excitement.

 

I've lined up three community visits. One to the local university to meet a REAL professor of art history, then another to the local art gallery where an artist has agreed to meet with her, and last...an all day adventure at this art show with about two hundred artists in the show, outdoors..a fairly big deal.

 

They'll have "junior" artists there doing exhibits (and selling art) which are people under the age of 17.

 

I was talking about this with a group of other mothers, bouncing around ideas, and one of them said to me, "You are just one of those mothers who do too much period."

 

I was insulted.

 

Deeply.

[Rosie_0801]

I was talking about this with a group of other mothers, bouncing around ideas, and one of them said to me, "You are just one of those mothers who do too much period."

 

I was insulted.

 

Deeply.

 

Wear it as a badge of pride, Dear. And feel happy you've found where to belong. Here on the WTM boards where thousands of other people "over-think" things, "do too much," "are do-too-much wannabes" and the like. ;) Luckily, there are a bunch more people here to tell us to chill when we ought. :)

 

What I've done is to gather up about 25 or so art video/documentaries. She was very convinced she wanted the first artist to be Alex Gray (link here for trailer: http://art4kid.blogspot.com/p/art-ed-video.html ). Well, I began to play it and she said, "This makes me sleepy.."

 

Huh? Um, sorry kid..mom already has worked out your vocabulary sheets, the projects after the movie..all of this stuff..and now..you say..."this makes me sleepy.." What a kick in the pants that was for me. My rational mind kicked in and said, "Look, it's bad timing, that's all..that's all.." and we did nothing that day.

 

You've discovered Murphy's Law of Homeschooling. Or that's what I call it, anyway. That's the Law that states that your children will always hate your best ideas. I had one of those today. :rolleyes:

 

I'd already gone and fetched the evil eye beads (this is a related element of Alex Gray's work), had the kit ready for after viewing...(the creation or top level of blooms..)

 

Is it possibly you're being a bit too schoolish about it all? Let's pretend Family A sat at the kitchen table today and read "Very Important and Life Changing Text," Family B sat on the couch and read "Very Important and Life Changing Text," Family C piled into Mum's double bed and read "Very Important and Life Changing Text" and Family D sprawled on the lawn, throwing dandelion heads at each other and read "Very Important and Life Changing Text." At the end of the day, they can ALL report that they read a very important and life changing text. Who was most comfortable while they did it? (I'd vote those in bed, but I like reading in bed.) Can the vocabulary be done orally or on a white board, rather than in worksheet form? It still counts.

 

I've lined up three community visits. One to the local university to meet a REAL professor of art history, then another to the local art gallery where an artist has agreed to meet with her, and last...an all day adventure at this art show with about two hundred artists in the show, outdoors..a fairly big deal.

 

They'll have "junior" artists there doing exhibits (and selling art) which are people under the age of 17.

 

That sounds like great fun! I'm sure if you give her some cogitation time, you'll have some fabulous follow up conversations :)

 

Sometimes teaching is more like fishing than pouring water into a bucket, if you need a visual. Set bait (introduce the topic,) hook the ideas she expresses, and very gently wiggle and tug them to help her express them more clearly. When all the fish are out and in the bucket and you've both seen all you care to see of them, it's time to re-bait your lines. You might be fishing for specific varieties of fish, and that's fine. Some fish are better eating than others! But all the other fish she might toss up add to the diversity :)

 

(Apologies if this sounds patronising. I know my kid is only 4, but I was a brownie leader for years and spent a lot of time with girls this age. I'm not trying to be a know it all twat.)

 

Rosie

Edited July 7, 2011 by Rosie_0801

[Bang!Zoom!]

Oh sure, I recognized the insult, I felt it, but my thought that followed was this..

 

"And this is exactly why your kid wants to spend 10 hours a day at my house and not yours..."

 

Is that very mean of me?

 

ps: I'm a much better cook also. :)

[Bang!Zoom!]

Rosie, I owe you one. How insightful. The fish thing, diversity....

 

I'm brainwashed by the Blooms pyramid.

 

Step 1. Step 2. Step 3. Lesson Plan. In order. Cover all bases.

 

I'm being too "Federal Guidelines" about it. B I N G O

 

Where do I send my check? :) Thanks so much!

 

I haven't had what feels like an original thought for days. You nailed it.

[MBM]

Okay, here is the issue. My 8 yr. old daughter heard her teacher say to her: "It's not a good idea to want to be an artist, there is no money in that career."

 

I am working on overcoming that statement and the damage it did. I'd like to weave together ideas on how to do that. Would anyone like to help?

 

I worked as a graphic designer for a number of years after getting my BFA in art. Jobs are out there, but they tend to be in cities, are competitive, don't pay a lot initially or ever, and hours can be long and stressful. However, I have a friend who's been creative director at one of the largest ad agencies for years, and he makes well over $500K plus all the extras. He is phenomenally good, though.

 

If your daughter chooses to go that route, then early on, I'd suggest becoming familiar with what's going on in the graphic design world (graphic design magazines would be a start), know some of the history, know what skills an employee needs (don't rely on a school to do this), try to meet people in the field, and then network while creating a strong portfolio. She should get used to someone critiquing her work, too.

 

I would also suggest considering a dual degree, so that she can switch if necessary. Business and art go well together, IMO. I later studied accounting b/c I didn't like selling my ideas to people with no taste. :D Accounting jobs just fell into my lap. It was a night-and-day difference. I'd say that making a living in the field of art is harder but doable.

 

The world of fine artists is another story altogether.

[AngelaNYC]

Okay, here is the issue. My 8 yr. old daughter heard her teacher say to her: "It's not a good idea to want to be an artist, there is no money in that career."

 

I am working on overcoming that statement and the damage it did. I'd like to weave together ideas on how to do that. Would anyone like to help?

 

Well I can tell you that there surely is money in being an artist! My dd goes to a high school where fine arts is one of the majors. The school has a pretty good track record for success, too. Check out some of the artists HERE.

 

Don't forget, children who love drawing and coloring as a child grow up to be photographers, architects, fashion designers, book illustrators, interior designers, not to mention tons of things related to computers.

 

Show this to that teacher and tell him where he can shove it. :)

[Momof2:E&T]

My dd also has strong interest in art. I would also add looking at careers that incorporate art such as architecture. I think that would also show her that the statement her teacher made is wrong. There are plenty of people who make a living as artist or by using art.

[Bang!Zoom!]

For myself, I took art classes all the way through high school, then into my college years.

 

When I think of "the arts" - I think of all disciplines; musical, visual, written, dance...but for the little one right now, I think "art" for her means generalized studies such as painting, drawing and other "crafty" media.

 

When I asked her, "What is art?" she replied, "Creativity, making things to share with others in a new way to get ideas across, to see things a different way."

 

So I think by that, she understands it's a method of communicating and expression.

 

I think the iron is hot in the fire for her. There is something about this age where a window is open, some sort of drive that begins. I'm not exactly sure what to call that...maybe just some sort of developmental opportunity.

 

So I would like to do some exposure to different disciplines, environments, tools..things like this.

 

I don't know if any of you out there use netflix service, but I do. There is a website called instantwatcher.com that will search the netflix database (in what I think is a better way) and help locate obscure or hard to find documentaries. That website holds an amazing amount of information.

 

I'm hoping that one of the DVD's I've ordered for her will arrive in the next day or so, it is called "My Kid Could Paint That". It is the story of a young 4 year old child who was given art materials (painting) by her parents and she splashed quite happily on canvas. Her parents took the canvas to a friends coffee shop, hung them up, and some of the NY City patrons of the store wanted to buy them.

 

One thing led to another, and the next thing you know, the childs paintings are in museums, her parents were invited on Oprah, the kid was labeled a prodigy and went into a media frenzy. Ahem.

 

Anyway, it's the story of this family, the child and of her art journey.

 

On the other hand, I'd like to show as a contrast the collector side of abstract art by watching "Herb & Dorothy". That is the story of two elderly folks who amassed a fortune in art on very modest salaries. They then, at the end of their collecting lives, donated the collection (which is genuinely a hoard) to various museums all over the world.

 

I've seen this documentary before and highly recommend it.

 

So, my second attempt will be a contrast/compare hopefully. How one would cover all the disciplines and sub-categories involved under the umbrella of just painting is amazing in its own right.

 

Modern, Ancient, Classical, Romantic, Modern, Contemporary, Cubist..yow!

 

I need seven lifetimes just for that.

 

We are moving in a few weeks, and in our new apartment, I hope to create a small gallery inside to create an "exhibit" of her drawings and such..there is pottery, photography, paintings, drawings...I think it's important to create those spaces in our home to support her.

 

Fortunately/unfortunately, there will be a Michaels craftstore about three blocks away.

 

Pray for me. :) :) lol

[Bang!Zoom!]

Katie, there is a internet discussion board that deals specifically in the realms of afterschooling.

 

It might be helpful to add the illustrations & experiences of parents there in adding to the wider applications of the word. I liked a lot of what I read there and connected to it.

 

You can find it at: http://afterschoolers.yuku.com/

 

I don't know that the literal term: "afterschooling" has much press and/or literature devoted specifically to the practice or ways people view and use it. I feel it's a fairly new term in educational conversations and hasn't been set a path in stone anywhere.

 

Hope this helps.

[presley]

Thanks for the link, onemom, I can't wait to peruse it!

[Bang!Zoom!]

It's not as active as this one, but there are some really interesting views there, it should help in getting a feel on what some have done in the past.

 

I've read about everything there, and the one thing I've really taken away from it is that depending on where you actually live...let's say..rural vs. city, makes a huge difference in how to handle your personal approach.

 

There is also a Berkeley parents board to goof off on and read, and that one is interesting because it's generally a collected posting by academic parents..professors and such.

 

There's some pretty far out stuff there to read.

 

You can find it at: http://parents.berkeley.edu/

[jenbrdsly]

Okay, I just spent this morning working on an "Afterschooling" page for my blog. It was really helpful for my own thinking to put my thoughts about Afterschooling into words. I wish there were more blogs out there with a specific Afterschooling bent. I like reading Homeschooling blogs too, and often learn from them, but it would be nice to have more company in the Afterschooling blogosphere!