ToG users: dialectic level for 5th grade?

[Ali in OR]

I am researching ToG to see if I want to use it for our second cycle through history (using Biblioplan for first time through). As I look through the book lists, I get the impression that my dd could do the dialectic level books. I'm sure she would love the UG books--she basically reads anything and loves history. It just seems that some of the books are placed into a higher category than I would have thought. Wanderings of Odysseus is dialectic--we did it as a read-aloud in 1st grade. I would have placed it as UG. The Zeman Gilgamesh books are UG--we did them in first. Jan Brett's Noah's Ark is UG--I would place it in LG.

 

Do you do UG or D choices for 5th grade? Dd's reading and comprehension are very strong. Writing is more average. Not sure how ToG works, so not sure if there is a lot more (and more sophisticated) written work required for D level. I know I could probably mix and match levels, but since I would buy many of the books, I would like to focus on one level. What has worked for you for 5th grade?

[Alenee]

As a TOG user I would say that a strong reader could definitely handle a good portion of the dialectic *reading*. What I would be concerned about is the discussion. A 5th grader isn't into the logic stage, typically, which is what the dialectic level requires for good hearty discussion. What I would do is check the book lists and see what your library has in stock and choose a few from that list. Then I would give some of the dialectic books a try with the discussion. If you find it's working, keep her there. But I would not hold to any idea that we would have to stay there. I have found that some of the books in each level could potentially have been for another level. I think what happens is that the best material just may not be available for one specific level so they compromise.

 

You may have done some of those books in 1st grade (we did too using Sonlight) but those were read alouds with less discussion about real issues. kwim? If I were you, I would give a few dialectic books a try but plan to stay in the UG level for one more year to give her logic a chance to catch up. Utilize this time to enjoy the last bit of grammar stage before it's gone. :001_smile:

[choirfarm]

The first year we did TOG year 1 the boys were 5th and 7th. We switched from Sonlight. I used dialectic for both. My 5th grader read everything on the list and more. BUT, the questions were too hard for him. So I just gave him a few questions at first and worked up to more and more of them as the year progressed. The other thing he didn't like was the fact that I tried to have him plan his week. He HATED it at first and was pitiful and found he had tons of stuff left on Thursday afternoon to try and finish. I had to help him plan that year. Last year, he did the questions pretty well and planned better. This year he is doing well. So, yes, have him do the dialectic reading and use your judgement about the written work you require.

 

Christine

[johnandtinagilbert]

I agree with the other posts. The reading level of UG is meant to be easy enough for them to work independently, while the questions in D are meant for in depth discussion.

 

We start D in the middle and work on one question at a time until they get a feel. Then we add on. Since you have a strong reader, D books may be great. You'll also notice that although you've read some of these things earlier, 1st and 5th grade retentions will be so far apart you'll appreciate the good materials.

 

HTH,

[Karenciavo]

When my ds16 was in 5th grade he was dialectic level in reading and thinking. Echoing what the others have said, it's not just the reading, but some 5th graders can handle the discussions.

[Heather in WI]

I had some of these same questions. I'm so glad that you posted. :-)

[Cinder]

Another echo to the posts above. When we did Yr1 ds was in 5th. He could handle most of the D readings but the discussion questions were over his head. For that I mainly reviewed the teacher's notes with him, covered some comprehension questions, and tried to help him see connections.

 

 

Cinder

[Ali in OR]

Thank you all. I really appreciate your input. I will take a look at the sample discussion questions and try to get a feel for whether or not dd is ready for that.

[ChemMommy]

Yes, your child may have heard "The Wanderings of Odysseus" in 1st grade, but reading it independently in 5th might be pushing it. Also, you should consider whether you want to place your child such that all of the material will be a stretch for him/her or whether if might be night to do UG and add a D book in on a topic you know interests him/her. Or, you might decide to up the amount of writing he does or the time he spends on science and stay at the UG level.

 

I'll have a 5th grader next year and she will be in UG. She needs to focus on writing and grammar issues. She's a good reader, but the number of pages in D, more than the difficulty of D, would though her for a loop.

 

Hope it helps to hear my opinions! Otherwise, forget I typed!:001_smile:

[mamato3 all-boy boys]

 

I'll chime in about what I'm doing w/ my 5th grader this year. We're using year 1 for 5th grade, and I've been switching between UG and D level books depending on the book itself. One of the books (Hittite Warrior - a dialect level resource) I decided my 1st grader would enjoy listening to as a read-aloud, so I'm using the book for that purpose.

 

What I've noticed is that some of the lit. student activity pages have been fine for his level, and others we've just scaled back so that I could introduce some of the literary analysis concepts to him (something we've never covered up to this point).

 

The nice thing about TOG is that it is *all* there, and you can tailor it to your daughter's needs, her abilities/interests, and whatever else is going on in your life at the time!

 

HTH

[mamato3 all-boy boys]

Another echo to the posts above. When we did Yr1 ds was in 5th. He could handle most of the D readings but the discussion questions were over his head. For that I mainly reviewed the teacher's notes with him, covered some comprehension questions, and tried to help him see connections.

 

Cinder, that is so reassuring to hear! I do the exact same thing with my son.