Math frustrations -Kinder/first grade

[bbsweetpea]

My oldest is currently doing Kinder/first grade work. She will be 7 in April and reads at about a 2nd grade level.

 

For Math I have been using Right Start A and Singapore EB math (we are in B). She just does not grasp addition at all. She can count up to 200 but cannot figure out that three items plus three more is six (or whatever the problem is). We play games daily. I am constantly talking about adding in our everyday life.

 

Her 4 year old brother has gotten to where he answers for her because he now knows how to do it from listening to me work with her. I am not sure what to do at this point.

 

I bought Horizons K to see if maybe a new approach would work. If we were to start on it I would need to start her at lesson 24 out of 160 lessons. I had her talk me through the book and that was the part she started struggling (this is where addition starts).

 

Currently she does a Math lesson 4-5 days a week. I upped it to twice a day. One time doing a lesson and the second time playing games.

 

Is this something that will eventually just click with her or should I switch to Horizons from Singapore (still will probably do RS A 2 times a week).

 

I am just at a loss. Since she is my oldest, teaching is still new for me.

[ondreeuh]

Does she seem to be a visual learner? Maybe a Mathtacular DVD would work, or LeapFrog Number Factory DVD would work

 

Is she a hands-on learner? Acting out stories with manipulatives using words like "3 more came" and "2 left" would connect addition and subtraction to something she already understands. Saxon K does this with teddy bears and stories (look at samples at http://www.exodusbooks.com/details.aspx?id=1675) and Funtastic Frogs uses little plastic frogs and worksheets (avail at Rainbow, Amazon, etc.)

 

What all have you tried? Which games?

[bbsweetpea]

She seems to see something and then write it to understand concepts.

 

We use Right start because it has all the manipulatives and then I try to reinforce it with Singapore or handmade math sheets.

 

We play Right start card games. For Go to the Dump she has to have a cheat sheet in front of her telling her all the numbers that make 10 when added together. I have tried to get her to play it with the Abacus but she just does not get it at all. We play Corners and again she needs some sort of cheat sheet for 5,10, 15 and 20. I have tried giving her tally sticks and counters to get her to figure it out herself but she just can't (or won't) figure it out. The answers she comes up with on her own are always so off that I can't figure out how she got it.

 

We have played story games to try to add together objects or take them away. If I am walking her through it she can count and answer. If I ask her to figure one out she just looks at me. At first I thought she was just doing it because she did not like it and did not want to answer but she is not that way with any other subject.

 

With every lesson I make sure one of us is writing problems on the board and working it out with objects. Instead of numbers I have even had her draw problems out.

 

We have read lots of living Math books to try to reinforce concepts as well.

 

What is strange to me is that she can count by 2's up to 40, 5's up to 50 and 10's up to 100. She also can tell me even and odd numbers up to 200. This may just be a memorization thing though.

[ondreeuh]

It sounds like you're doing lots of fun things with her and working hard to make it accessible. Maybe she is unable to do the math because she is stressing about it - does that sound possible? Like it's a mental block: "I can't do it!" that's tripping her up?

 

Have you tried taking a break and working on time, money calendar, etc. that use math in a "sneaky" way? Maybe a change of focus will give her a breather and you can come back to sums later?

[Mommy22alyns]

My oldest is about the same age (7 in March), so take what I say with grains of salt... but just keep plugging away. Maybe, and someone correct me if I'm wrong, back away a little bit? We just started Corners and we use a "cheat sheet" too. They're still at that fairly young age where things might not have clicked 100%, where it's still developmental, etc. I have also made the mistake of thinking, "Oh, Becca's reading at this level so her math should be up there too!" Er, no. Totally asynchronous. We do math 5 days a week, but do RS only 3 days. She needs time for the ideas to "marinate" and take hold, so we do an MEP sheet and play games every other day. Math is definitely our (her) most challenging subject.

 

Hopefully someone will come rescue me from this limb I'm on... :001_huh: I didn't want to read and not post since our girls are so close in age though.

[bbsweetpea]

Thank you both for your responses. We may take a sum break and move to money and time.

 

I know with her reading I took a month break when she started struggling and she came back even stronger.

 

I guess I just needed to know I was not missing anything myself that could help her. On the plus side, we have had lots of fun reading living books about math.

[blessedmom3]

Some children don't grasp abstract concepts like in RS and Singapore math . Try Horizons where there is more memorization and less concept . Seems like she has a great memory. Play with Cheerios like :" I will give you 2 cheerios and daddy gives you 3 --how many do you have" Ilustrate the concept with real cheerios .

[pageta]

We're doing time right now because I got tired of ds not getting addition. We've been going through all the facts with flashcards and learning them. But I'll show him 4+5 and he'll say 9 and then I immediately show him 5+4 and he has to sit there and count on his fingers even though he knew the first one without hardly thinking. So yeah, we're learning time. It isn't any easier though. I'll have the clock set to 2:15 and he'll say it's a quarter til 7. It's like he doesn't get concepts at this point or something. He's the same age as your dd, and I fear that my just-turned-3-year-old might start answering for him too (hasn't happened yet).

 

I've gotten to where we do three things every day. Such as 1) flashcard addition facts, 2) counting by 2's and other intervals we've been learning, and 3) practicing telling time. Five minutes on each is all I can handle.

 

Oddly enough, when anyone asks ds what subject he likes best, it's always math. Really.

[LadyAberlin]

I think I would try MUS before I would try Horizons because Horizons moves a lot faster and the addition gets hard much faster than MUS. I really like the way MUS presents addition.

[Karen in CO]

She seems to see something and then write it to understand concepts.

 

 

 

Maybe add something simple and iterative and written. I am a recent and happy convert to supplemental Kumon workbooks. They do one simple topic and do it well in each book. They stress simple mastery. And it is very different from what you are doing.

 

It sounds like you are doing a great job of teaching math concepts, but maybe supplement with something more iterative and incremental for her Stop by the local Barnes & Noble and browse through their math books and pick up the addition book that is where she is or maybe a touch below. Then do one assignment everyday for a week and see how she is progressing. If it is going to work, you will see it working quickly. I just picked up the third grade multiplication for my third grader and although I was skeptical, she is loving them and learning her multiplication which she understood, just didn't know.

[nova147]

Does she have a clear understanding that numerals represent quantities? In other words, does she know that "5" stands for five bears or five trees or five of anything? If her problems with addition come in only when trying to do math on paper, this may be part of the problem.

 

If she's not getting addition with objects, I wonder if she has developed an understanding of conservation of number. If you give her a small group of objects, let her count them, and then rearrange them, does she re-count them or is she confident that there is still the same number? If she re-counts them, she is just not ready to add. Keep playing games with numbers and give her time.

 

I highly recommend "Math at Their Own Pace" by Greg Nelson. It has a number of math activities and games, as well as extensive explanation of how children learn math. Some of them are likely repeats of Rightstart, but there are some unique ideas in the book.

[lovinmykids]

The math curr. you are using are tough ones, and Horizons is as well. If she has a tougher time with Math, she may plumeth with Horizons.

I know, we had that trouble in K with Horizons. We switched to Abeka for K-1 and it was great for mine. She just took longer to "get" math. She is now in 3rd grade and things are just clicking with her. So, it could just be a maturity thing for yours as well.

My oldest is 16 and she was always a math brain but not all kids are.

Try using manipulatives as well. Show her 3 blocks + 3 blocks are 6 blocks. That has always worked well for mine.

I showed her a couple times how to group things for Multiplication and BAM, she got it and now does it like crazy on her own!

HTH

[FO4UR]

Have you tried Cuisenairre Rods?

 

Maybe take a break from formal adding and let her play with the rods for a week or more. Let her build trains/houses/stick people/etc...then start asking her to find two rods that are the same length as orange...as blue....etc...(if you can do this in the context of playing with her, all the better..."I am out of orange rods. What can I use to make equal sides to my house?")

 

AFTER she gets the concept that two yellow=one orange...translate that into numerals 5+5=10. I use 1cm graph paper and have my dc color the rod equations before asking them to perform the adding/subtracting with numerals. My dc like coloring in the little boxes...and it's a visual way to see that 5 boxes and 5 boxes always equal 10 boxes.

 

Whatever you decide - I would try something that is based on the child's individual development and NOT on a pre-set schedule. I have never tried Math on the Level, but the idea of ditching the pre-determined scope and sequence in favor of teaching the next thing in line, according to YOUR specific child's needs is the kind of thing I try to do. The $ keeps me from buying MOTL;) Miquon is MUCH cheaper and the philosophy and practical helps found in the teachers' materials (Annotations and First Grade Diary) are priceless.

 

At the same time, if she likes to memorize - memorize the facts up through 10. It may take doing both memorizing AND concept teaching for things to click.

[TracyR]

I agree with taking a break from it and moving on to something else right now. That has always worked with my older daughters.

I'm having the same issue right now with my 6yr old with math.

It could be the fact too that the subject of addition isn't quite her cup of tea because its a challenge to her at the moment too. My daughters usually play " duh" when something is a little bit of a challenge too. I think giving that break and letting them do something they can do for a while makes them forget. Maturity helps a bit too. Just keep plugging away and work with blocks, manipulatives or even cheerios. Heck, even candy helps. Today my daughter was working on three digit addition and she magically appeared to be able to add while using candy. Hmmmm. LOL.

[bbsweetpea]

Thanks again for everyone's posts. I have some stuff to think about. I may look at a different type of math program for her. Right start Math and Singapore is not my favorite. I think the issue is going to be that my son and daughter learn different ways. He responds well to RS and Singapore lessons. My daughter does not. I am going to look at MUS and some of the other suggestions.

 

We do have cuisenairre rods. My son (4) LOVES them. My daughter though does not understand them. I honestly don't get them either. I would rather just memorize facts than associate a color with a number. I am keeping them though to use with my son.

 

 

If she's not getting addition with objects, I wonder if she has developed an understanding of conservation of number. If you give her a small group of objects, let her count them, and then rearrange them, does she re-count them or is she confident that there is still the same number? If she re-counts them, she is just not ready to add. Keep playing games with numbers and give her time.

 

I am going to do this with her tomorrow. I knows how many there are the first time around but am curious to see if she recounts them if I move items around. Thank you for this suggestion!

[Crimson Wife]

What about Touch Math? I looked into this at one point because I had heard it was good for kinesthetic learners. They have some free sample worksheets here.

[FO4UR]

We do have cuisenairre rods. My son (4) LOVES them. My daughter though does not understand them. I honestly don't get them either. I would rather just memorize facts than associate a color with a number. I am keeping them though to use with my son.

 

 

 

 

 

I encourage you to find a way to hook her on playing with the rods. No need to push her to associate the color w/number...that part should come naturally through play. C Rods are just one way to explain these things and it's not the end of the world if she never "gets" them, but since you already have them...

[Guest Barb B]

Try one fact family at a time. For instance start with 2 family - get 2 things (something she likes - for my ds it is cars, or plastic animals). Work with the facts that add to 2 first. When she gets that (1+1, 0+2, 2+0); then go on to the 3's and work just on the three's (while review the 2 family). I think some kids can get overloaded working on all the fact up to 10 at once. I have used some ideas from a book called "Math their way". Not sure if it is still around, but it has some good ideas. When working with the fact families (one at a time) she doesn't have to write them down every time: sometimes my son says them (the whole number sentence not just the answer), some times writes them on paper, sometimes on a wipe off board and sometimes with number tiles (make your own from small pieces of carboard or index cards).

 

Barb

[matrips]

my little kids always learned a ton of math at mealtime! from counting their blueberries, having to divide 12 pieces of fruit three ways, to wanting 10 of something when I only put 5 on the plage (how many more?), to I have 6 carrots, I ate one, now I have five.

 

it wasn't a lesson per se; it was usually directed by them. though encouraged by me! it was fun because they got to eat their manipulatives :) and a lot more veggies were eaten just so they could do more math!

 

maybe your kids might have some fun with it too.