I've learned a lot from John Holt, from unschoolers in general and, quite frankly, from every educational theory book I've ever read. When I talk with new homeschoolers I always recommend that they read wide and deep. It's easy to limit oneself to the book or group of books that are closest to one's comfort level, but significant growth, insight, and inspiration can also come from ideas that are way outside our comfort zone. There have been many times where I've picked up a book, read the back, and thought, "wow, that's *way* out there." I could have put the book back, but instead I read it and there is always something I can take from it. My homeschool has been enriched by the ideas of unschoolers, by the Charlotte Mason philosophy, by the Montessori approach - by Gordon Neufeld, John Holt and Alfie Kohn. I'm most inspired when I read things like The Well Trained Mind and Climbing Parnassus, but I also make a point of reading Educating the Whole-Hearted Child once a year. My scope and sequence is mostly classical. But, the flow of our day, the way our learning areas are set up, the methods I bring in - they often come from elsewhere. I spent a couple of years lurking and occasionally posting on an unschooling board. I was inspired again and again by the creativity of these parents and the kinds of things the kids were doing. I learned a lot from them and I continue to learn and grow from the wisdom of other homeschoolers and educators. Sarah

I still see a big difference. With Suzuki I have a very good idea of what I'm going to get in a teacher. A Suzuki certified teacher has been trained in that technique. They have been taught the things I value. I pretty much know that one-point teaching will be something that is emphasized. I pretty much know that group learning will be valued. I know that the teacher is also interested in learning from the parent. I know that there will be an emphasis on reaching the child at the child's level and making the practice fun. I know that we won't hurry, but we won't stop, either. I know that the review pieces will be used again and again to master technique and improve musical expression. I know that each song has a purpose and that any song learned is one that will always be played. My daughter has been in piano for a number of years. Traditional lessons. She's had three very good teachers. One was very straightforward and helped her to move along quite quickly and was also very particular. Dd did quite well in piano that year but the teaching was definitely not age appropriate. Then we had a fantastic teacher who was very enthusiastic, supportive and fun - but dd felt that she didn't learn very much at all that year. She took a year off piano and now we've found another teacher who seems to be a good balance between the two. But, pieces are not reviewed, once a piece is performed it isn't really played again. I have no clue what is going on in lessons or how to help dd at home. There are no group classes - no musical community of peers. There are no parent groups - we've been with the same teacher for two years and I've never spoken to another parent there. We've had a number of different Suzuki teachers between trying a visiting teacher in town and attending the Suzuki Institute two years in a row. While they all offer something different and notice something different in my boys' playing, they all have shown the trademark Suzuki values. I know what I'm getting with a Suzuki trained teacher because they have been trained to interact with children in a similar way. With young children I definitely want to know what I'm getting into. If we went traditional, I may or may not get a teacher who has gleaned some Suzuki techniques over the years - I just wouldn't know what kind of actual training the teacher had besides getting up to a certain level in the Royal Conservatory. And I agree about the musical community as well. My boys have been playing in group classes since the beginning. They have made friends there. They have also attended Suzuki Institute for the last two summers. I don't know of any other musical opportunities like that for little kids. One of my boys was 4 at his first institute, the other was 6. There is nothing I have ever heard of anywhere near me tht offers that kind of an opportunity for such young strings players. Our teacher encouraged me to start a parent group for Suzuki parents. We met a number of times last year and talked about practice techniques, how we created a musical environment at home, etc. It was very valuable and our teacher was always pleased to hear our feedback as well. She provided us with books we could borrow and articles I could print off to share with the group. The boys are both looking forward to "violin camp" (Suzuki Institute) this summer. It's become an annual camping trip for our family. At least two other kids in the boys' group class are also coming. The opportunities outside of private lessons (group class, parent group, Suzuki institute) have made a huge impact on music in our home. Sarah

I'll agree with what Robin said. Our teacher has been teaching the Suzuki method for something like 30 years. She also studied in Japan with Dr. Suzuki - in fact she's been giving the boys stickers that Dr. Suzuki gave to her while she was there; she's finally decided to use them up : ) Dr. Suzuki himself made a point of saying that he was always learning. I think that's one of the things I've found most refreshing with Suzuki teachers - I haven't met one yet who wasn't excited about learning how to become an even better teacher. There was no end-all-be-all with the Suzuki method. The values and the principles remain the same, but the techniques were adapted and improved upon even by Suzuki himself. I loved watching the Suzuki teachers who had been teaching for years sit in on other teacher's lessons at the institute so that they could pick up something new. Our teacher uses box violins for the young pre-twinkle class (probably 6 and under? maybe 5 and under?). Both of my boys began with a box and learned how to hold the violin, the parts of the violin and how to hold it in play and rest position before beginning with a real violin. We probably spent about a month or so on a box violin. We also have private and group lessons. Our teacher encourages us to come early to our private lessons so that we can watch the lesson before us and stay late so we can watch the lesson after us. I know she'd love to have more people around during private lessons, but most people are too busy to spend that amount of time hanging out at the music school. Our group classes are a source of great joy and motivation to the kids. We also focus a lot on how we can create an inspiring home environment. Sarah

I couldn't imagine how hard it would be for a young child to learn violin traditionally. I find there are so many things - very small, picky things - that make a *huge* difference in the success of practice and the ease of playing. The majority of these are things I wouldn't even be aware of if we weren't doing Suzuki. One of the main values in Suzuki is in the teacher - child - home teacher (parent) triangle. I find that very compatible with homeschooling. The teacher recognizes that it's the parent who works with the child on a daily basis at home so there is a lot of respect for the role of the parent. Our teacher has really equipped me to help my boys at home. Whereas with my daughter, if she has a problem or gets stuck with piano I have to tell her to wait until Thursday to ask her teacher. With the boys I can make little changes to their hand position, or the angle of a finger because I know what they're supposed to be doing, how they're supposed to be doing it, and how it's supposed to sound. I also love the fact that the boys can pick up their violins at any time and play any song they've ever learned. My daughter can play a small handful of piano songs, but that's about it. I think the way the Suzuki program is structured is brilliant as well. Each Suzuki piece teachers a technique that will be used later in more complicated songs. So when a student gets to the complicated song they are already familiar with the hardest part of it. We continue polishing the review pieces and getting better and better at the techniques presented in each of them. Our teacher introduces note reading fairly early on. She does a lot of hands-on work at our group class where the kids arrange letters, place notes on a staff, and clap out rhythms. Last year my ds started note reading with a book and each week she goes through the next lesson with him. My little guy (age 5) just recently started with the same book. I have no issues with them learning how to read music - they both really enjoy it. I'd encourage you to read a few books about the Suzuki method. There's so much more to it than I can express here and it's been an incredibly positive experience for us. It has helped my boys to develop a passion for violin and it has helped me to be a better parent.

Outside of our informal French, my sixth grade daughter does both Latin and French with texts. She does Latin first thing in the morning and French after she's finished a few other subjects. I had her scheduled to do Latin and then French but she doesn't like to do that much language back to back. Her Italian teacher told me that she often uses her knowledge of French and Latin to figure out what's happening in Italian. There haven't been any major mix-ups here - she is usually able to keep her languages separate, but sometimes she slips. They were counting in her French class at co-op and she slipped into Italian, but once it was pointed out to her she realized what she was doing a switched back to French.

For a second there I thought you were talking about planning your family according to history rotations :lol: I have been blessed with three children who completely conform to our family's history rotation. My other child is currently listening in to the Middle Ages while in kindergarten. He enjoys listening to SOTW and we also have the CDs so he's very familiar with all of the stories from volume 1 as well. Starting a child mid-rotation hasn't been an issue for us. He just does what he's capable of doing at his level. The benefit is that I can do read alouds as a family, or at least with the two boys (they're two years apart). This morning we sat down together and read about vikings. We looked at a map of where they attacked and that prompted a discussion about Alexander the Great and how much land he conquered. The boys excitedly planned their history project - they're making a viking longhouse for their Playmobil vikings to live in. Then we read our lit selection and discussed alliteration. I really enjoy having the kids learning together and they enjoy bringing what they've learned into their playtime.

Very cool, Cleo. And hey, I guess you're grateful that you survived your ice slip - apparently that runs in the family. I haven't heard the names of two of his children before - did those get passed on through the family line at all? Are there more modern variations of them? They probably sound beautiful with a French accent. I wanted to resurrect an old family name for our last baby, but dh would only consent to have it as a middle name. Cassimier.

I don't find it important at all. It's so far back that no one remembers. I'm Canadian and that has a lot more meaning to me than my ethnic background.

I have German and English ethnic roots, but they're so far back that I wouldn't consider them cultural heritage by any means. I had a wake up call when I lived in England - it didn't take long to realize that I could not, in good faith, describe myself as "English". My family has been in Canada too long to have retained any significant heritage from Germany or England - I'm just a Canadian now : )

Ok, Cleo you've got to tell us who your famous ancestor was. Was it Champlain?

I agree with the others about the lack of brilliant high school discussions. I had a great English teacher in high school, but she would ask a question and we would all sit there hoping someone else would answer. There were definitely no lively discussions. I'm finding that in the co-op class I teach I have the same problem. Last year was better as I had a good mix of girls and boys. This year I only have three boys and then my dd. Sometimes it's like pulling teeth. Dd, being a girl and being the only one who was inolved in last year's co-op is usually chomping at the bit to talk but I have to hold her back so that I can get the other guys to talk. We had some good discussions while doing The Samurai's Tale, but getting them to talk about poetry is like pulling teeth. I'd suggest starting your own book club or finding an online group. Enrolling in high school will not guarantee quality lit discussions. Sarah

My 2nd grader and my new-to-reading K'er are really enjoying TOG this year. I don't get them to do any independent reading - we do it all as read alouds and it really doesn't take that long. I enjoy the couch time with them, they enjoy the stories and we all like the hands-on activities. I think TOG is a great choice for younger kids. Sarah

Oooh, Barbie! What a wonderful thought. I had never entertained the idea of having dd tutor the boys in Latin! I have a similar age spread to your kids - 12 year old dd, nearly 8 year old ds, nearly 6 year old ds (and then a two year old). Dd moved ahead of me during LC II so I put her into an online course this year. I have dreams of working through Henle on my own before the boys get that far. Sarah

My sixth grader does both each day. She spends about 45 minutes a day on Latin and about 30 minutes a day on French. She also has a 90 minute online Latin chat each weel and a 45 minute French class at co-op each week. She is in her fifth year of Italian classes as well. She goes on Saturdays for two hours from October until mid-April. This doesn't require much in the way of daily practice even though I've scheduled 10 minutes a day to review her materials. Sarah

Since you already have Prima and the DVDs, why don't you start that now? The lessons are short and, with even the smallest amount of teacher directed creativity (of which you have an abundance) can be very engaging. I'm teaching Prima at co-op this year to a group of K to 4th graders. We're having a fabulous time : ) My daughter started Latin with LC1 in third grade. She's now working on her second semester of an online high school Latin course with Memoria Press - using Henle. She's 6th grade this year. I would agree with others who caution against placing an older child in MP materials. There's no need to because an older child can easily begin in Henle. I think that if you're starting now you may as well go with the MP materials. They are well put together and I've found them incredibly helpful as a teacher with no Latin experience. However, if you're planning on putting it off until 6th or 7th grade you should go right into Henle or look at other programs that are aimed at older students. Sarah

I'm glad you guys had a good time! This was my daughter's second year at the Regionals. She came third, for the second year in a row. Three other spellers were out on the same round which left the last two. The last two went at least four more rounds but kept getting all of the words wrong! Eventually one of them spelled a word right and then also got the championship word. The winner at our bee gets to go to the Nationals in Ottawa and in Washington as well - what fun! Sarah

I've had a Dyson, thanks to these boards, for a couple of years now. I also have a cat and one very large black dog. The Dyson is amazing. We moved a couple of months ago and our new home has a built in vac. I tried it twice and then went back to my Dyson. I don't have a problem with the attachments; I've actually found them pretty easy to use. Our new home has carpeted stairs - a first for us - and I love the rotating attachment for the stairs. It's fantastic. I actually find it pretty easy to cart around as well. The handle on top makes it easy to pick up and move. I grew up with a big electrolux, so I find the Dyson light : ) The Dyson is definitely near the top of my favourite WTM purchases list. Sarah

I spend $1000 per child on books and curriculum. That does not cover music lessons, taekwon-do, or any other activities. Our regular activities cost about $500 per month (for all three kids) and then we do the odd session of swimming lessons or tennis as well. The $1000 per child is funded in my province and we pay for the rest.

My first child was able to read Bob books at three but wasn't reading things like the Magic Treehouse series until she was four. By five she was reading The Secret Garden and Black Beauty. My second child had trouble learning to read. It felt like I was banging my head against the wall for 18 months. Finally, it just clicked. He was six and went from struggling to remember letter sounds to reading Nate the Great and the Magic Treehouse series in just a couple of months. My third was reading well by age 5.

It will be a sad summer season for my crew. We moved in January so had a very extended Christmas break. We usually school through about half of summer, but this year it will have to be even more than that. We'll take one week off for Suzuki camp and one week off for the kids to go to Grandma and Grandpa's. Other than that their little noses will be to the grindstone.

Ds is still constantly having tics. However, last night something weird happened. He has night terrors but last night was much different than "regular" night terrors. He came out of bed and was upset about his hands hurting - basically right inside his palms. He was crying, rubbing his hands, even hitting them together at one point to stop the pain. This went on for about 10 minutes and then it stopped. I'm wondering if this is related to the tics? Was this some kind of extreme tic? Or was this just a night terror? What caused the pain in his hands? Sarah

I was just happy to be homeschooling. After I put the two year old down for his nap I had a couple of hours to homeschool quietly with my older three. Between the move, the renovations, and the flu it's been hard to get back into a routine. It felt so nice to just be working around the table with everyone today.

Me being out of my leauge really hit home when dd wrote a story in Latin. And I could figure out some of it but not very much.

I fully agree that downloading or ripping albums that one has not purchased is wrong. I would not do that. My thoughts on this were that since I already had purchased this set of CDs, copying it would not be wrong. I really just got thinking about it because of that thread that dealt with copying CDs from the library. That's not something I would do, but I wanted to see what other people thought of this situation - where I had already paid for that particular audio but couldn't find the hard copy of it. My copy is *somewhere*. What if I copied my friend's CD so that I had the set on my computer but then I found my set - then it would be Ok? I haven't given up hope for my CDs yet. I am still trying to find them. And yes, the set isn't that expensive - I probably would end up purchasing them a second time if I wanted to replace them. The discussion was very interesting.