Magnet school or not?

[Earthmerlin]

Hi. I'm considering a local G/T magnet school for my 7 year old next year (3rd grade). She'd need to be accepted, etc. but if so this would mean a new school, peers & schedule. She needs more intellectual challenge but does NOT do well with change. It's more the latter that makes me seriously pause. What to do?

 

Our district only offers G/T grades 3-5 & she'd return to her local mIddle school afterwards. I fear that while she may get more intellectual stimulation during that time, she'd fall behind in bonding socially with neighborhood peers. She's already the youngest in her grade & keenly feels this difference. I don't want to make things more socially awkward with a long leave of absence, if you will. How do you know in which favor to tip the balance--socially or intellectually?

[Tanaqui]

Where will the other students at the GT elementary attend middle school?

[Earthmerlin]

Where will the other students at the GT elementary attend middle school?

At their neighborhood schools--just like my daughter--& those would vary--they all get bussed in. The other potential issue I have is that the hosting school is a Title I school in a shady neighborhood. Perhaps that's superficial to others but it's a significant concern for me.

[Tanaqui]

The other potential issue I have is that the hosting school is a Title I school in a shady neighborhood. Perhaps that's superficial to others but it's a significant concern for me.

 

Have you visited the school in question?

 

[Earthmerlin]

Have you visited the school in question?

Yes, I've been there. My concern is mainly with her adjustment--she does not deal with change very well. I'm trying to figure out if I should maintain the status quo & continue to enrich at home & with extra-curricular activities. Or if a more demanding school would be the better option. Hmmm.....

[epi]

At their neighborhood schools--just like my daughter--& those would vary--they all get bussed in. The other potential issue I have is that the hosting school is a Title I school in a shady neighborhood. Perhaps that's superficial to others but it's a significant concern for me.

 

How "shady" are you talking about. There are gifted programs in our district, but they are only available in the schools in "shady neighborhoods". For the school our children would attend if we accepted a place in the gifted program, there was yet another murder within a mile of the school in the last 24 hours.

 

[Earthmerlin]

How "shady" are you talking about. There are gifted programs in our district, but they are only available in the schools in "shady neighborhoods". For the school our children would attend if we accepted a place in the gifted program, there was yet another murder within a mile of the school in the last 24 hours.

Yes, that level of shadiness. Bars on windows, hobos hanging about & several bondsmen businesses nearby.

 

How will you decide?

[Arcadia]

Yes, that level of shadiness. Bars on windows, hobos hanging about & several bondsmen businesses nearby.

That would be a no go for us. Bars on windows and doors is enough to make us not be anywhere near the neighborhood.

 

We don't have a gifted program but we do have a stem program in a shady school area. Kids in the program are segregated so it is like a school within a school. Socioeconomic gap is also big between those in the stem program and the children in the school boundaries. The district put the program there to help boost the school's state testing scores even though they don't state that explicitly. So it is socially isolating for the kids.

[Tanaqui]

*sigh*

 

I don't think integration is going to be that big a deal. Kids change a lot between now and middle school, and likely there will be students from multiple schools attending her middle school. She won't be the only kid there who didn't attend her zoned school.

 

The neighborhood might be an issue. I live in a poor neighborhood and have limited patience for "oh, bad neighborhood", but that actually does sound like it might be a problem. It's three things, not just one. (Though - are there kids playing outside after school and on weekends? If there are, it might be a bit shady but not actively dangerous for people. If there aren't, then that's a neighborhood to avoid.)

 

The trouble with afterschooling, though, is it takes up a LOT of time. If you're concerned about socialization, well, all your extracurriculars and extra work at home really cuts into that.

 

So I don't know which is better for you. I would base this decision primarily with how much you like the school, and the actual crime rate of that precinct - which you should be able to check online or by calling the precinct personally.

[TerriM]

Yes, that level of shadiness. Bars on windows, hobos hanging about & several bondsmen businesses nearby.

 

How will you decide?

 

Is she happy where she is?  Has she toured the GT school?  What does she think of it?

 

 

I don't mind shady neighborhoods, but the school needs to feel good to her.  Bars on windows are like a prison--the inside would have to be super bright, airy, and cheerful to make up for the outside and surroundings.

[maize]

How long would the bus ride be? I found bus rides tiring as a child. When school was out I just wanted to be home, not sitting on a bus.

[Earthmerlin]

Yes, there is an upcoming parent intro. meeting that I'll attend. I'd like to also know what the district does for non-magnet G/T kids. There are lots of questions floating in my head right now. Hopefully by asking them & getting solid answers I can make a well-informed & sound decision for my specific situation. I guess my original post was trying to hint at whether staying put is do-able with an enriching home life. I feel her social & intellectual needs require equal weight but I'm not sure if after-schooling will be both 'enough' & feasible.

[Earthmerlin]

That would be a no go for us. Bars on windows and doors is enough to make us not be anywhere near the neighborhood.

 

We don't have a gifted program but we do have a stem program in a shady school area. Kids in the program are segregated so it is like a school within a school. Socioeconomic gap is also big between those in the stem program and the children in the school boundaries. The district put the program there to help boost the school's state testing scores even though they don't state that explicitly. So it is socially isolating for the kids.

I suspect the same is true in my case as well. She'd be mixing with the local population a few times per day (lunch, specials, etc.) & that creates concern. I'm not sure I'd want to expose her to behaviors & values that vary greatly from our family's. We shall see....

[Tanaqui]

I suspect the same is true in my case as well. She'd be mixing with the local population a few times per day (lunch, specials, etc.) & that creates concern. I'm not sure I'd want to expose her to behaviors & values that vary greatly from our family's. We shall see....

 

And this is why I have very little patience for the "oh, bad neighborhood" argument most of the time. It's one thing to be concerned about physical safety if the neighborhood is actually unsafe - but exactly what do you think the under-11 set is getting up to, even in this neighborhood? That they'll be doing inside their school?

 

It's really classist (and potentially racist). That's a behavior and value that I wouldn't want my kids to be swimming in, but I'm sure they could still interact with your kids and come out stronger for it, even though they'd be exposed to something I strongly disagree with.

[Earthmerlin]

And this is why I have very little patience for the "oh, bad neighborhood" argument most of the time. It's one thing to be concerned about physical safety if the neighborhood is actually unsafe - but exactly what do you think the under-11 set is getting up to, even in this neighborhood? That they'll be doing inside their school?

 

It's really classist (and potentially racist). That's a behavior and value that I wouldn't want my kids to be swimming in, but I'm sure they could still interact with your kids and come out stronger for it, even though they'd be exposed to something I strongly disagree with.

Yes, the physical safety is an issue but also her intellectual, social & emotional well-being too. I myself teach at a very diverse school (a neighboring one to the magnet) & I know 1st hand the goings-on. Expletives, improper dress, disregard for authority, & too mature behaviors are some things I've not only seen but also want to protect her from. In this environment, staying grounded is an active task--& I'm an adult. I'm not sure my child would fare equally well.

 

It's funny you should mention race. We chose to buy our house largely because of its neighborhood schools. However, we've since learned it's pretty homogeneous (racially speaking) but quasi-mixed socio-economically. We are a bi-racial & trilingual family so I have some concerns about my daughter being 'different', if you will. Luckily, the area is growing & attracting more diversity. Her Saturday French heritage school is quite diverse as well--not only racially but also in their educational methodolgy.

 

I think the overall culture of the magnet school matters as well as its surroundings. After the upcoming parent meetings I'm sure I'll have a better feel for things. My objective in posting was to get feedback from others who've grappled with a similar situation--uproot or stay put?

Edited December 25, 2016 by Earthmerlin

[SparklyUnicorn]

I didn't read all the responses.

 

Magnate schools are kinda "sneaky" for lack of a better way of putting it.  They are just public schools with a theme.  Maybe a gifted magnate school is somewhat interesting (although this would depend on how exactly they define gifted or on what basis they admit students).  Around here we have magnates and their ratings are as lousy as the other public schools.  So...nothing special.  I guess if you have reservations it's probably not worth it.

 

 

[Have kids -- will travel]

And this is why I have very little patience for the "oh, bad neighborhood" argument most of the time. It's one thing to be concerned about physical safety if the neighborhood is actually unsafe - but exactly what do you think the under-11 set is getting up to, even in this neighborhood? That they'll be doing inside their school?

 

It's really classist (and potentially racist). That's a behavior and value that I wouldn't want my kids to be swimming in, but I'm sure they could still interact with your kids and come out stronger for it, even though they'd be exposed to something I strongly disagree with.

 

Personally, I think the "physical safety" aspect of parent worry about bad neighborhoods is overestimated, while the influence of peers is underestimated. Sadly, kids growing up in poverty are exposed to more violence, experience more stress at home, and are more likely to have behavioral problems. It's an important consideration to make when choosing a school for your children, and calling it "classist" trivializes the importance of weighing all factors. For the record, I strongly disagree with the US policy of creating a magnet school in a poor school to bring up the quality of that school; the poor school should get much more money and strict oversight to improve -- that way all the kids benefit, not just the bussed-in gifted kids.

 

OP, I wouldn't stress about changes for your daughter, if the move to the gifted magnet would fall with the beginning of the school year, and I wouldn't worry about fitting in when middle school starts. As others have pointed out, kids come together from different schools at the beginning of middle school, so it's a very natural point to arrive from a different place, as friend groups are just forming.

 

The length of time on the bus would be a big factor in the decision for me, as would educational opportunities staying on at the current school and peers who stay or choose the magnet school. If there are one or two quality kids from your current school planning on going, that would make it more attractive to me. Can you apply and choose to back out later (in which case, apply and decide later)?

 

Also, can you talk to parents who have children in the gifted magnet? They'll probably be able to better answer your questions.

 

Afterschooling/enriching is hard work, and not all kids are equally eager to spend a mind-numbing day at school followed by hard work at home. 

[Earthmerlin]

Personally, I think the "physical safety" aspect of parent worry about bad neighborhoods is overestimated, while the influence of peers is underestimated. Sadly, kids growing up in poverty are exposed to more violence, experience more stress at home, and are more likely to have behavioral problems. It's an important consideration to make when choosing a school for your children, and calling it "classist" trivializes the importance of weighing all factors. For the record, I strongly disagree with the US policy of creating a magnet school in a poor school to bring up the quality of that school; the poor school should get much more money and strict oversight to improve -- that way all the kids benefit, not just the bussed-in gifted kids.

 

OP, I wouldn't stress about changes for your daughter, if the move to the gifted magnet would fall with the beginning of the school year, and I wouldn't worry about fitting in when middle school starts. As others have pointed out, kids come together from different schools at the beginning of middle school, so it's a very natural point to arrive from a different place, as friend groups are just forming.

 

The length of time on the bus would be a big factor in the decision for me, as would educational opportunities staying on at the current school and peers who stay or choose the magnet school. If there are one or two quality kids from your current school planning on going, that would make it more attractive to me. Can you apply and choose to back out later (in which case, apply and decide later)?

 

Also, can you talk to parents who have children in the gifted magnet? They'll probably be able to better answer your questions.

 

Afterschooling/enriching is hard work, and not all kids are equally eager to spend a mind-numbing day at school followed by hard work at home.

Thanks for your input. I had thought to inquire about magnet school parents' opinions, etc. at the upcoming parent meeting. I hope to find out many other details as well.

 

I already after-school & know what you mean about it being hard work. I have lots in my mind planned but fall short in reality when unforeseen 'real life' events crop up. I've scaled back my expectations & now after-school in more manageable chunks. The question is whether it's enough of an intellectual thirst-quencher for her.

 

There's quite a bit to consider & the decisions would have a 3 year impact. That is why, in this initial stage, I posed my questions on this forum. All answers have given me plenty of food for thought & I appreciate them all.

[TerriM]

Afterschooling/enriching is hard work, and not all kids are equally eager to spend a mind-numbing day at school followed by hard work at home. 

 

Yeah.  At some point you might as well homeschool instead.....

[katilac]

And this is why I have very little patience for the "oh, bad neighborhood" argument most of the time. It's one thing to be concerned about physical safety if the neighborhood is actually unsafe - but exactly what do you think the under-11 set is getting up to, even in this neighborhood? That they'll be doing inside their school?

 

 

In her defense, the under-11 set in parts of our district are getting up to quite a bit.

 

The language alone can be concerning; not the curse words, but sexual comments directed to classmates, violent words and threats, lots of drug references. Some behaviors include stealing, fighting, and acting out sexually.

 

It's heartbreaking that they are exposed to these things enough to mimic the behavior, but it's also valid to be concerned about your own child's exposure to it. 

 

I am in no way saying that this is typical across the board for schools in bad neighborhoods, but I am saying that to be concerned about it doesn't make one a terrible person. I used to visit our local schools often for my job, and I have seen gifted, dedicated teachers and smart, hardworking students at every one. At some, there is an overall positive culture to the school, with individual incidents but not an overall negative culture. At others, this isn't true, and a school with small children does not feel safe, nurturing, or positive. 

[LTBernard]

In my previous life (read before children) I taught in a public school that was not horrible. I was teaching 7th graders and since I am on the short side if I was walking in the halls between classes the kids would often not notice me there and I would hear it all. I know OP's child is not in 7th grade yet, but I can imagine in the last 10 years since I was teaching and also with the fact that I was in what seems a somewhat better area where kids haven't been exposed to such hardships the age for similar behaviors has gone down. Oh and I was recently in a training for work where I was taught that 8 is great - meaning 8 is a great age to talk to your child about sex in order to beat them learning about it from someone else. So yeah, I have a feeling 11 year olds are up to plenty.

 

I apologize in advance if any of that doesn't make sense, my eyes keep crossing due to exhaustion and I should really just go get in bed.

[Earthmerlin]

Well I went to the parent meeting & I'm still on the fence. What mostly holds me back is her strong resistance to change, sensitivy & shyness/quietness. So I will still mull it over & talk to her directly about it (just to gauge her openess to the idea). However, it was stressed several times that although children may qualify intellectually it's still not the right choice for all--due to transportation & hour changes but also (& perhaps more importantly) because of differing affects & resiliency. So we shall see....