He doesn't remember it??

[venusmom]

I am homeschooling another child, with mine, and I am struggling with retention.  He is a good kid for the most part, but there are struggles.  I constantly have to work on building him up, and he is a "tough guy" on the outside, but the slightest thing said gets taken wrong, and he's mad.  Then I realize I have inadvertently hurt his feelings.  For instance, if I tell him to stop playing and he'll finish quicker, he tells his parent I've implied he is stupid.  I've learned to work with his emotions - but what it really concerning me is his retention.

 

It almost seems as if I sit next to him all day and explain everything he is willing to work.  However with multiple children, I expect them to read instructions and complete lessons independently whenever possible.  If I am to help when they get snagged on a math problem, or work with a child learning a new concept, I can't sit with one all day and explain each step.  He also seems to miss quite a bit on his papers - and then when I ask him and help jog his memory - he remembers how to do it.  His writing skills are very weak and I am struggling to even get him to write a single correct sentence.  He tends to either write fragments, or he writes entire paragraphs that are one sentence.  He will begin the paragraph with a capital letter, use "and" anywhere that a comma or period would have been better, and finally close his paragraph with a period - the first to appear in the whole paper!  His math is improving, but he seems to forget some of the basic things he really needs to understand in order to build on.  For instance, he truly struggles with fractions - just remembering that 1/2 cut in half, is 1/4, is very difficult.  He even struggles with this concept when I pull out cookies, slices of bread, or fraction circles and demonstrate the concept for him.  Sometimes I think he could have a bit of a learning delay of some type; while other times I feel like he's being stubborn because he "doesn't want to do it, and doesn't care", (as he so eloquently puts it when a subject gets tough).  Does anybody have any suggestions?  I am committed to teach him this year, but he has to be ready to re-enter school next year as I committed to teaching him for two years.  After that his parents want to put him back into school.

 

Editing to add:  He's 13, 8th grader, using Saxon 87, App of Grammar by CLP, Writing Strands 4 plus working on some copywork, dictation, narration for basic sentence structure, (tried Razzle Dazzle, and several other writing courses last year, but ended up just working on back to basics with him), Apologia Physical Science, Spelling Power & Apples Daily Spelling Drills for spelling, MFW for bible / history.  Thanks  :huh:

[Farrar]

How old is he? Depending on his age, the things you're describing that he's struggling with seem like they're things that lots of kids struggle with - fractions, writing sentences, constructing a paragraph, etc. It sounds like maybe the work level is too high and you'd do well to back him up a little.

 

It also sounds like he's suffering from some level of anxiety, but that you're figuring out how to deal with that...

[EKS]

If he can't write a coherent sentence, work with him on simply *saying* a coherent sentence.  You write it down and he copies it.  Then move to paragraphs.  You can prompt him.

 

If he needs more review in math, you could use something like Saxon.

 

Has he been evaluated?  Does he have a learning disability?  How did you come to be teaching him?  If he has an LD or other special needs, he likely does need someone to sit with him full time.  I sat with my son who has dyslexia full time until he was in 8th grade and even after that I sat with him at least half the time. 

[venusmom]

Oops - yes a few questions I didn't answer, though I was quite wordy!!

 

He is 13.

 

He was having some discipline problems in school; and the parents had been pleased with the way my children's education was progressing.  They felt I could help him establish better study habits, and the smaller environment might help him focus on his academics instead of many distractions of school.  He is easily distracted.

 

I have been working on the sentence approach, as Kai described.  I am also using Saxon 87.  We tried it last year, though his placement test showed he might have been better with Saxon 76.  I spoke with some math contacts at my curriculum and they suggested try it and slow down when needed.  We did - and we ended up pulling off altogether several times to stop and work on Life of Fred Fractions for a while.  We spent much of the year doing this and I printed online worksheets on things he needed more work on.  We also kept doing the facts practices from Saxon 87 to reinforce things he needed.  We began Saxon 87 again this year and I am being extremely rigid about his dawdling.  When he doesn't want to do his work, he just starts rattling on and on about whatever he'd prefer to talk about.  As a result, I am getting my own children up several hours earlier to do the subjects they need help with.  Then when he arrives - they take turns taking my granddaughter to their rooms to keep her from distracting him, and they work on their subjects they need less help with.  We do group work during the little one's naptime.  I don't have any idea how to know if he has any LD's.  I know when he wants to, and when he tries, he does much better.  But when he sees my children have finished, or when the little one interrupts, or when a bird lands on the porch rail, he's trailing off his work and discussing whatever comes to mind - from the bird, to the latest video game!

[venusmom]

Math usually takes 60-90 minutes - but I let him break it up when he seems to lose focus.  Other subjects take less time.  Science occasionally takes an hour, but usually all subjects take about 1/2 hour.

 

Money is another method I have used for demonstrating fractions and it has been helpful too.

[venusmom]

Yes, it has been a struggle.  I originally had an hour mapped out for math.  Now I have him do the facts practice, mental math, watch the DIVE & do the lesson for 30 minutes.  Then he does another subject.  After lunch, or if he finishes before he does another 30 minutes for mixed practice.  If it takes longer, he either takes it home to complete later or finishes at the end of the day if he finishes everything else in time.

[OneStepAtATime]

If he has any underlying undiagnosed learning issues then he may be very sensitive to the fact that things seem easier for others and hard for him.  He may have internalized that he is stupid and is defensive, hoping no one will realize that he is (which he actually isn't but it is a common issue with many kids that are bright but have learning challenges).  He could have stealth dyslexia, or low working memory or word retrieval issues or all of those or any number of other  things that are subtly tripping him up and causing him anxiety.  

 

Or he may just have a lot of gaps that are causing the processes not to be automatic yet, gaps that may require stepping back a bit and breaking things into smaller pieces with a lot of review.  

 

This is tricky for you, especially since he is already in 8th grade.  Would the parents consider having him evaluated by a neuropsychologist or a CALT specialist or an educational psychologist?  That might give you and them (and him) a better idea of any weaknesses he may have but also strengths, perhaps that are not currently being tapped but could possibly help tremendously with his learning.  For instance, DD has phenomenal ability in 3D spatial relations.  We had no idea how important that was for her learning until we had the eval.  The evaluator showed us that giving DD a piece of paper with some words on it was like giving a blind person that piece of paper.  Give her a 3D construct or let her build it in clay or paint it or whatever, and comprehension increased enormously.  

 

Hugs and best wishes.  I admire you for trying so hard to help him.

[Storygirl]

In your original post, I thought you might be talking about a child aged 8 to 10, but when you said that he is 13, it honestly sounds like there are some learning challenges or disabilities at play. What exactly was the trouble that he was having when he was enrolled in school?

 

You say that you committed to working with him for two years, and I think it is admirable that you want to stick to that. However, if he has undiagnosed learning differences, and they remain unaddressed, he is unlikely to make the progress that you or his parents would like to see in that time. You and his parents need to know what is going on with him, so that he can be helped best.

 

In your position, I would tell them that he has needs that you do not know how to address unless he is evaluated. I would not want to take responsibility for the education of someone else's child in these circumstances. You are not doing them a favor by sticking with the two-year commitment. I would be very uncomfortable with this if it were me. To be blunt, he is not your child, and it sounds like he needs more help than you can give. His parents need to get him some specialized help. You say that they like the results that you had with homeschooling your own children, but you are not going to get those same results by working with him. If he is still struggling in these ways after working with you for a year, the situation is not working, and it should change. Keeping your word is much less important than getting this boy the help that he needs.

 

I'm usually not this blunt, but I think that the boy's needs must come before any plans that the adults made a year ago. If the parents do not want him to be evaluated, I would tell them that I could not keep homeschooling him. They need to bear the responsibility, not you.

[kiwik]

It does sound a bit like they left it far to long and then handed you a problem you probably can't fix in the time given.

 

I agree with sitting down with the parents and telling them that the time has come (well it came years ago but never mind) to get him properly assessed. Say you are willing to stick to your agreement but you can't do it without the information from a proper assessment.

[venusmom]

Thanks so much for all the advice - I was really thinking it was gaps because our school system is quite deficient (when my kids were in it - I spent several hours an evening helping them learn what they should have in school, and finally decided why bog them down with more school when what they needed was to do it right the first time).  However - in working with him and seeing his frustration - and yes - as one of you mentioned - he does seem to have internalized that he is stupid - I guess it may be time to suggest to the parents that they might need to get him tested for some learning delay of some sort.  I can't tell you what it means to have a place to mull this over with moms who may have experienced these things - I really needed some ideas!

[kbutton]

Thanks so much for all the advice - I was really thinking it was gaps because our school system is quite deficient (when my kids were in it - I spent several hours an evening helping them learn what they should have in school, and finally decided why bog them down with more school when what they needed was to do it right the first time).  However - in working with him and seeing his frustration - and yes - as one of you mentioned - he does seem to have internalized that he is stupid - I guess it may be time to suggest to the parents that they might need to get him tested for some learning delay of some sort.  I can't tell you what it means to have a place to mull this over with moms who may have experienced these things - I really needed some ideas!

 

You might need to say things pretty gently and concretely with the parents--no one likes to hear that their kids need an evaluation, and if he's been squeaking by with issues that seem behavioral from the outside rather than learning challenges, they might not be on your page yet. 

 

I would say whatever I needed to say to motivate them, but I would be really gentle and specific. You may have to do some legwork to help them see what you are seeing, not just seeing global problems (particularly if they feel it's behavior or that the school was the problem). It can take several passes and some objective information (articles, etc.) partly because it takes some time to get past denial and partly because people have a lot of preconceived ideas about learning problems (not all negative ones), such as...Dyslexia is only about reading, my kid couldn't be on the spectrum because he makes eye contact and has empathy, my kid doesn't have ADHD because he's not hyperactive, my child's vision is fine because he passed the typical optometrist's exam.

 

You are awfully nice to work so hard for this child. Hopefully this will be a turning point for him.  :grouphug:

[OneStepAtATime]

Agree with kbutton.

 

You might read The Mislabeled Child by Brock and Fernette Eide and recommend that they read it, too.  I highly recommend it to any parent of a child that seems to be struggling with learning in some form or fashion.  Some of the info in there is not quite as current as I would like, but it can be an enormously helpful book.

 

Best wishes.