Orton-Gillingham training

[PeterPan]

Heather suggested pursuing this.  Is this what I'm looking for?  http://www.orton-gillingham.com/frmCourseList.aspx?city=Columbus&state=OH

 

And this is affordable, right?  :D

 

(I know, nothing ever is.)

 

But first, is this what you meant?  Is OG training useful if you're going to do Barton?  Sandy, didn't you say you did OG training?

[PeterPan]

Dude folks, it's $1K!!!!!! Ok, $975.  Why is everything we want so expensive???

 

Ok, so why would I want this?  What would I learn? And it looks like they have a basic course and then the advanced/continuing course.  How far does that basic course take you?  Like is it so basic that we'd be done with the skills even before the workshop starts in December?  Of course, that's a laugh as our progress is so slow.  Nevertheless, I'll ask.  :D

 

Couldn't you have had a $450 option?   :lol:  I'll google for online training.  I thought that popped up.

[OneStepAtATime]

Man, I really wish there were something like that in EITHER location I have easy access to.  I am sure this training would be useful, even if you are doing Barton.  Not necessary since it is so scripted out and there is so much tutor support but yes, I would think it would be helpful to add to your repertoire of skills and background knowledge and might help you if you ran into snags with Barton to be able to modify Barton to make it more effective.

 

edited to add I had not seen the price....ugh!

[PeterPan]

Nuts with this local junk.  Heather, you wanna go to Miami or Phoenix?  I'm pretty sure we deserve a vacation.  :D  

 

A girl can dream...

[PeterPan]

Man, I really wish there were something like that in EITHER location I have easy access to.  I am sure this training would be useful, even if you are doing Barton.  Not necessary since it is so scripted out and there is so much tutor support but yes, I would think it would be helpful to add to your repertoire of skills and background knowledge and might help you if you ran into snags with Barton to be able to modify Barton to make it more effective.

 

edited to add I had not seen the price....ugh!

OneStep, if you ever got serious and wanted to travel for it, you could come stay with me and go to one.  Of course if we were both flying (and dreaming) then we'd all go to Miami or Phoenix and have a block of rooms and girl it out, sigh...  Clearly I need a vacation from my summer vacation.  :D

[OneStepAtATime]

OneStep, if you ever got serious and wanted to travel for it, you could come stay with me and go to one.  Of course if we were both flying (and dreaming) then we'd all go to Miami or Phoenix and have a block of rooms and girl it out, sigh...  Clearly I need a vacation from my summer vacation.   :D

Goodness that sounds so inviting.   I would love a girly productive break!!!  :)  Heavy sigh....maybe when the dust settles from this crazy half move we are attempting....

[Storygirl]

Hey, can I come along??  Of course, there is a session about 30 minutes from my house, but taking it with friends in a vacationy locale would be much more fun!! :party:

 

Too bad about the price :thumbdown: .

[Plink]

OG training is not necessary with Barton because it has training videos that are included with each level.  That said, additional training wouldn't hurt, however there are significant differences between OG programs, and your lessons will not exactly match what is said in the training videos.  If you have already decided to use Barton, I would pick a weekend and a partner and work intentionally to make it through the videos, taking notes and DOING THE PRACTICE LESSONS (for some reason most people skip this part) as you go.  

 

I don't know anything about pricing or locations, but you might also want to look into Wilson OG training.  It can't hurt to have options.  

[OneStepAtATime]

OG training is not necessary with Barton because it has training videos that are included with each level.  That said, additional training wouldn't hurt, however there are significant differences between OG programs, and your lessons will not exactly match what is said in the training videos.  If you have already decided to use Barton, I would pick a weekend and a partner and work intentionally to make it through the videos, taking notes and DOING THE PRACTICE LESSONS (for some reason most people skip this part) as you go.  

 

I don't know anything about pricing or locations, but you might also want to look into Wilson OG training.  It can't hurt to have options.  

Agree that if you are going to do Barton, get a partner and do the practice lessons.  Boy, did that help!!!

[merry gardens]

Dude folks, it's $1K!!!!!! Ok, $975. Why is everything we want so expensive???

 

Ok, so why would I want this? ....[/size]

You want this because you have an extra $975 just sitting around, waiting for you to spend it. Alternatively, you can send your extra money to me. :D

[merry gardens]

Oh, and if y ' all decide to take that trip together, let me know where you're going. I may have an extra $975 coming my way in the near future. ;)

[Heathermomster]

I wondered whether you should consider O-G training because you can learn from professionals and discover what is to be expected during the remediation process. A friend of mine took the week long course to work with her globally disabled children. You would need to ask first, but I was under the impression you could pick up any phonics based reading program after the training.

 

I hate to see you panic when I believe your DS is doing so well. In a months time, he has learned to distinguish vowels. With your DD, the reading came quicker? My 5.5 yo read as well as my 8yo DS with 4 months of Wilson reading. The learning speed difference between my average reader and my dyslexic reader is like night and day. And I get frustrated with DD at times over phonics. I would be sideways teaching DS if I did not know reasonable expectations. There are books about reading that you could explore. My MIL always recommended Jane Fell Greene and Louisa Cook Moats. Anyways, the training was just a thought.

Edited July 28, 2017 by Heathermomster

[PeterPan]

Ok, I looked at what your dyslexia school is doing, Heather, and they're using OG training from a *different place* than the one I found when I googled.  I should have realized there'd be more versions, but I guess I figured it was sort of a proprietary label and owned by somebody, oops!

 

So when I searched it further,   is the org your place is getting their OG through, and they happen to be the place our local dyslexia school got their OG certification through too.  It also had not occurred to me to contact them about training.  I just figured they were a school, kwim?  Turns out they run OG training every summer.  I've probably missed it for this summer, but again I'm realizing I was not connecting with these resources, wow.

 

So does anybody know anything on the debate between these variants of OG and how to know a good OG training program when you see it?  

 

I got Barton level 1.  He's clearly not ready for it yet.  It's not very *alive* if that makes sense.  I've already described in other posts that he's a peculiar child to teach.  I like Heather's observation about having realistic expectations, but I also think I'm going to have to bring MORE TO THE TABLE than you would with the average dyslexic dc.  He's not this easy, compliant, boring vanilla dc to teach.  I've met dyslexics who are diagnosed who you could just tell what to do and they would do it.  Whatever he is and whatever his label, that's NOT who he is.  Simply going through volumes of non-sense syllables because Barton thought it was a good idea isn't going to fly.  He's way too out there for that.

 

And if that doesn't make sense, don't bother calling me a bad parent.  I think people who've taught that know exactly what I'm talking about.  The more I bring to the table with skill and the ability to be flexible and do things other ways, the more I'm likely to get him to comply.

[PeterPan]

Oh, and if y ' all decide to take that trip together, let me know where you're going. I may have an extra $975 coming my way in the near future. ;)

You're too fun!  Well first let's figure out what the right one is to be doing, lol.  I have no clue yet.  But yes, if it were near me, I'd host everybody.  It would be fun.  :)

[OneStepAtATime]

Ok, I looked at what your dyslexia school is doing, Heather, and they're using OG training from a *different place* than the one I found when I googled.  I should have realized there'd be more versions, but I guess I figured it was sort of a proprietary label and owned by somebody, oops!

 

So when I searched it further,   is the org your place is getting their OG through, and they happen to be the place our local dyslexia school got their OG certification through too.  It also had not occurred to me to contact them about training.  I just figured they were a school, kwim?  Turns out they run OG training every summer.  I've probably missed it for this summer, but again I'm realizing I was not connecting with these resources, wow.

 

So does anybody know anything on the debate between these variants of OG and how to know a good OG training program when you see it?  

 

I got Barton level 1.  He's clearly not ready for it yet.  It's not very *alive* if that makes sense.  I've already described in other posts that he's a peculiar child to teach.  I like Heather's observation about having realistic expectations, but I also think I'm going to have to bring MORE TO THE TABLE than you would with the average dyslexic dc.  He's not this easy, compliant, boring vanilla dc to teach.  I've met dyslexics who are diagnosed who you could just tell what to do and they would do it.  Whatever he is and whatever his label, that's NOT who he is.  Simply going through volumes of non-sense syllables because Barton thought it was a good idea isn't going to fly.  He's way too out there for that.

 

And if that doesn't make sense, don't bother calling me a bad parent.  I think people who've taught that know exactly what I'm talking about.  The more I bring to the table with skill and the ability to be flexible and do things other ways, the more I'm likely to get him to comply.

You are the person in the trenches.  If you don't think he is ready, then he probably isn't.  

 

And I have no clue what makes a better program than something else without trying it.  I guess you could try looking for reviews?

[Storygirl]

 

  The more I bring to the table with skill and the ability to be flexible and do things other ways, the more I'm likely to get him to comply.

 

I so admire this! I have a very hard time being flexible myself and adapting to my children's needs when they don't match my own preferred teaching style. It's a real struggle for me and something I need to work on, because my natural desire is to bring them to a place that is comfortable for ME. My teaching style doesn't totally match their learning style.

 

For what it's worth, you seem to be doing well figuring things out, even if it is just one small piece at a time.

[OneStepAtATime]

I so admire this! I have a very hard time being flexible myself and adapting to my children's needs when they don't match my own preferred teaching style. It's a real struggle for me and something I need to work on, because my natural desire is to bring them to a place that is comfortable for ME. My teaching style doesn't totally match their learning style.

 

For what it's worth, you seem to be doing well figuring things out, even if it is just one small piece at a time.

:iagree:

[Momofeat]

I am an OG tutor. It's worth every last dime. If you decide to tutor privately, you can make back the money you spend in just a few months.

 

OG is an approach, not a program. This is a significant difference because learning the approach gives you the tools you need to individualize for the student. While Barton, Wilson, AAS, etc. are all wonderful OG-based programs, there will always be students who don't quite fit the mold, and they will hit a roadblock that the program authors didn't foresee. If you're trained in the OG approach, you'll have many more ways to help the student around that roadblock.

 

At this point, you would only need to be trained at the basic level. The advanced training is for those who are working with older students. 

 

To receive truly worthwhile OG training, make sure that the trainer is a Fellow of the Academy of Orton-Gillingham Practioners and Educators. Anyone who has made it to that level in the Academy should have the experience and expertise to successfully teach a training course. The Academy has tough standards for its instructors to meet. 

 

[OneStepAtATime]

I am an OG tutor. It's worth every last dime. If you decide to tutor privately, you can make back the money you spend in just a few months.

 

OG is an approach, not a program. This is a significant difference because learning the approach gives you the tools you need to individualize for the student. While Barton, Wilson, AAS, etc. are all wonderful OG-based programs, there will always be students who don't quite fit the mold, and they will hit a roadblock that the program authors didn't foresee. If you're trained in the OG approach, you'll have many more ways to help the student around that roadblock.

 

At this point, you would only need to be trained at the basic level. The advanced training is for those who are working with older students. 

 

To receive truly worthwhile OG training, make sure that the trainer is a Fellow of the Academy of Orton-Gillingham Practioners and Educators. Anyone who has made it to that level in the Academy should have the experience and expertise to successfully teach a training course. The Academy has tough standards for its instructors to meet. 

I'm not the OP but I must say thank you so much for posting.  This is great info!

[imagine.more]

I just did the training this summer because a dear friend paid for it, otherwise we never could have afforded it. If like you said you need to go outside the box and really add more fun and color to your O-G lessons then the training will be invaluable to you. I think what I got most out of the training was really understanding the 'why' of Orton Gillingham. What I had dismissed as silly attempts to be fun and cool and entertaining with hands-on materials in O-G actually totally make sense because you are tapping into the child's right brain, which is often unchanged or even stronger than normal because of the deficiencies in the left brain. Also, I now know about 10 different ways to teach syllable types....and 10 different ways to practice phoneme sounds or sight words or whatever. Before I could follow Barton but I didn't 'get' it. Now I get it. I still like Barton best, I like it even better than the program of the woman who trained us (though she is brilliant and her program is certainly great for some kids/tutors), but now I feel better equipped. In fact, because my husband just got laid off and I have no homeschool budget anymore I am basically combining my training and my Wilson Readers with the scope and sequence of Barton so I can continue tutoring my daughter this year without spending much of anything. That's a benefit I hadn't anticipated needing when I took the course. 

 

So anyway, if you are truly strapped for cash like us just know that you can tutor your child without the training and you will both be FINE. But if as you said your child is the type who would clearly benefit from teaching each concept and practicing it in multiple ways and you have the reasonable ability to do the training, it's absolutely a valuable thing to do. 

 

I did mine in Columbia, MD if anyone is interested, with Fran Bowman's Educational Services. We had about 12 other people taking the course, 3 of us were there just as parents, another 5 as tutors, and the rest were private school teachers whose schools paid for them to be there. We all got a lot out of it but definitely in different ways. 

 

ITA with Kassi that a big part of the value is in being able to stray from your curriculum and trouble-shoot when you hit a snag. Though not everyone can tutor with it, it just depends on your area. There is zero market for O-G tutors here in central Pennsylvania, nobody here even understands what dyslexia is and almost everyone assumes the schools are doing just fine and there's no need for extra stuff. So while I'd love to tutor there's really nobody who has expressed interest here. So not everyone can make the money for the course back through tutoring on the side. 

[aaplank]

As an O-G tutor I agree with Momofeat. You want somebody who is a Fellow doing the training. Also the training should have a practicum component, not just class time. The invaluable training I received was really in the ongoing feedback of the practicum. I had to log in 100 hours of tutoring before I could really be on my own. My lesson plans were scrutinized before I could tutor. I was videotaped and observed and given feedback on my strengths and weaknesses. I was given test scores and asked to diagnose and pinpoint the problems and come up with solutions. Lots of blood, sweat and tears, but totally worth it! 15 years later and I still rely on the solid training I received. My success as a tutor has all come from those early years.

[aaplank]

Sorry, double post.

[PeterPan]

So this is wild.  It looks like all of you did your training with AOGPE.  What's up with the Institute for Multi-Sensory Education and their OG training?  Do you know anything about it compares?

[PeterPan]

Here's a little oddity I found.  There's a free OG phonogram card deck app.  http://www.cincinnatidyslexia.org/index.php/education (scroll to the bottom) Or you can go to iTunes and search Mayerson Academy.

[SandyKC]

Heather suggested pursuing this.  Is this what I'm looking for?  http://www.orton-gillingham.com/frmCourseList.aspx?city=Columbus&state=OH

 

And this is affordable, right?   :D

 

(I know, nothing ever is.)

 

But first, is this what you meant?  Is OG training useful if you're going to do Barton?  Sandy, didn't you say you did OG training?

 

YES, I completed an OG training class offered by Rotter and Becker Educational Consultants in Roswell, GA, taught by Claire Pearson, an OG Fellow.  They generally only offer this in the summertime, and OG methods are learned more effectively with hands-on, face-to-face practice.

 

The class was EXCELLENT and it allowed me to understand how to work with my son, not just in his reading instruction, but with all of his learning.  When you understand the whys and hows, it really does help you work with your child in creative ways that support his learning.  

 

OG Training IS expensive, especially if you end up traveling to a location for the training.  The course I took was two full weeks long, and cost several hundred bucks.  I've THOUGHT about developing an inexpensive online class--not sure it would do the OG method "justice" and I'm not sure of the usage/licensure issues that might be involved in teaching OG methods. Still, I DO feel there is a need for an inexpensive, overview kind of course that will give parents insight to the method so they can effectively teach their kids!

 

I think OG training is useful no matter what program you use.  Having training enabled me to use a very inexpensive program (The Language Tool Kit) while adding on my own multisensory activities and not needing scripting (which Barton provides).  If you're going to do Barton, you may not "need" OG training, but I'm virtually certain having training would enable you to more effectively use the program and to carry over the OG methods to math and other subjects too, as needed.

 

Obtaining training for yourself is one of the best, long-term investments I think a parent can make in their child's education.  It's cheaper to get trained than to hire a tutor, to pay for expensive programs, etc. and it enabled me to help my DS rather inexpensively at home.  

 

Those are my thoughts based upon my experience, FWIW.  Hope that helps! :-D

[SandyKC]

Ok, I looked at what your dyslexia school is doing, Heather, and they're using OG training from a *different place* than the one I found when I googled.  I should have realized there'd be more versions, but I guess I figured it was sort of a proprietary label and owned by somebody, oops!

 

So when I searched it further,   is the org your place is getting their OG through, and they happen to be the place our local dyslexia school got their OG certification through too.  It also had not occurred to me to contact them about training.  I just figured they were a school, kwim?  Turns out they run OG training every summer.  I've probably missed it for this summer, but again I'm realizing I was not connecting with these resources, wow.

 

So does anybody know anything on the debate between these variants of OG and how to know a good OG training program when you see it?  

 

I got Barton level 1.  He's clearly not ready for it yet.  It's not very *alive* if that makes sense.  I've already described in other posts that he's a peculiar child to teach.  I like Heather's observation about having realistic expectations, but I also think I'm going to have to bring MORE TO THE TABLE than you would with the average dyslexic dc.  He's not this easy, compliant, boring vanilla dc to teach.  I've met dyslexics who are diagnosed who you could just tell what to do and they would do it.  Whatever he is and whatever his label, that's NOT who he is.  Simply going through volumes of non-sense syllables because Barton thought it was a good idea isn't going to fly.  He's way too out there for that.

 

And if that doesn't make sense, don't bother calling me a bad parent.  I think people who've taught that know exactly what I'm talking about.  The more I bring to the table with skill and the ability to be flexible and do things other ways, the more I'm likely to get him to comply.

The Orton-Gillingham method was developed by Samuel Orton and Anna Gillingham back in the 1930's.. NINETEEN THIRTIES!! Can you imagine? And people still act as though we don't know how to teach kids with dyslexia to read!! 

 

The Academy of Orton-Gillingham Practitioners and Educators is a "certifying" organization, so to speak.  They are the most well-known and have stringent requirements for certifying candidates as Orton-Gillingham practitioners.  Any training offered by an Orton-Gillingham Fellow certified by this organization is likely to be a "good OG training program."  

 

That is not to say there aren't plenty of other people who are qualified or even highly qualified to teach the OG Method, but if you're going to drop some big bucks on training, going with an OG Fellow will give you some level of assurance that the person doing the training is well-trained in the methodology.  For training not offered by a certified OG Fellow, I'd suggest doing your research to find reviews and information about the trainer to make sure she has some practical, hands-on experience and is effective in using the method. 

 

A LOT of the schools for kids with dyslexia offer OG training in the summer time.  I know the Schenk School here in Atlanta offers training.  If you want to get familiarized with the method, don't have the money for a hands-on course, and don't mind reading a textbook.. look at:  The Gillingham Manual: Remedial Training for Students With Specific Disability in Reading, Spelling, and Penmanship.

 

The book was co-authored by Anna Gillingham and it will give you a good grasp on the whys and hows.  It's not quite the same thing as gaining hands-on instruction in the method, but it works well if you can't / aren't able to get training otherwise.  A lot of libraries have the book on hand too, so you might want to check it out there before buying it, then buy it if the book works for you. ;-)

 

 

[PeterPan]

Ok, this is cool.  I'm getting connected with more of the resources locally.  Turns out there's a great OG course going on RIGHT NOW and I didn't even know about it!  That's ok, sigh, since there's nothing I can do about it, lol.  I'm getting on some email lists and getting more connected, so that should help.  

 

I'll go look for that book Sandy.  Thanks.

[Mom28GreatKids]

OhE, did you ever do this? If so, can you give me some details? I am interested in pursuing this eventually. Thanks.

[PeterPan]

OhE, did you ever do this? If so, can you give me some details? I am interested in pursuing this eventually. Thanks.

 

The local place I was looking at runs it in the summer.  Turns out there's another major place that I just found out about.  The first place is like a full month of intensive and then another month of tutoring kids to apply lesson plans.  I just really don't know if I have time for that.  My ds' situation turns out to be *much* more complex, and to get away like that may nigh be impossible.  And really his *comprehension* issues are turning out to be even more significant than the decoding.  I see you have a bunch of things going on with your 3 yo.  Is the dyslexia with your olders or are you thinking ahead?  

 

With the 3 yo, when he hits 4, I suggest you begin doing a blend of PROMPT (which is what I hope you're getting, as it's the MOST EFFECT THERAPY YOU CAN GET for apraxia) and LIPS.  Just do it gently, not aggressively, as part of a letter of the week preschool kind of thing.  Like don't even think oh regular will work.  Just skip the less effective stuff and do it.  Of course, that makes it harder to diagnose, since dyslexia will be diagnosed by failure at that age, sigh.  But whatever, it's what you could do if you want.

 

When we finally got my ds eval'd at newly 6 (late, in reality) the low language scores on the CELF 5 turned up.  Took me quite a while to figure them out and figure out what to DO about them.  Those low language scores are behind ds' comprehension issues.  Well that and the ASD.  It's the two together.  Anyways, that's another thing you don't have to intervene on.  If your SLP is doing articulation and motor planning of speech, they are probably *not* doing as much as *could* be done on language processing.  Expressive language is a totally separate gig.  Like you could get another 1-2 hours a week just for the expressive language issues and not have it be overkill.  I don't have funding for that right now, so I'm doing stuff myself.  I'm just saying don't underestimate that.  In my ds' case he has a gifted IQ, 99th percentile vocabulary, and single sentence comprehension at the 28th percentile.  So as we progressed in Barton he began decoding sentences like "The frog sat on the log" but he couldn't actually UNDERSTAND it!!!  So now we're going back through pronouns, plurals, all sorts of things, using a program.  And that's stuff you can do with a little one, no need to wait, kwim?

 

Adding: I'm really happy with Barton.  I can make it work for me, and I don't really feel a need to write lessons from scratch when Barton is good enough.  If it *weren't* working or if I needed more tools, that would be different.  There are some things I have to tweak because of the mix of his problems, yes.  But for us, Barton is working.  I'm finding the complicating things are MUCH more important than whether his word list is custom.  An OG workshop would let me customize, but it's really the least of my worries right now.  My problems are basics like bolting (leaving our space when we're working), comprehension, etc.  The actual decoding is pretty straightforward now that we have thorough materials and a way of implementing them that works for him (with the Quizlet app, with token boards to motivate, etc.).

Edited November 24, 2015 by OhElizabeth

[Storygirl]

I haven't had OG training, but I did just go to a seminar on reading problems at the local dyslexia school. A few things that they mentioned that might be helpful. These are, of course, specific to this program and may not apply elsewhere, but it might give you an idea of what questions to ask as you are doing research.

 

* Their summer training program is hard to get into, and people have to apply early to get a spot.

 

* They highly recommend that participants have some kind of background in education. They said they have had a few people take it who have done well who have not had that previous experience, but that many without an educational background have trouble in the classes.

 

* They said that participants regularly tell them the class is the hardest work they have ever done.

 

* The class alone is only a first step in OG training. To get certified by an OG accrediting organization is a huge deal (most of the teachers in the school are not actually certified, although they are highly trained).

 

* The benefit of having OG training, compared to following a scripted curriculum, is that the teacher can identify the child's specific weaknesses and plan a more targeted approach to remediation.

 

I hope that is helpful in some way. I have not used Barton or other OG programs myself (DD10 is dyslexic, but is being tutored), and I have not gone through this kind of training, but I thought I'd pass on what they said in the seminar.

 

 

[Mom28GreatKids]

Definitely thinking ahead OhE. I am positive that DS 3 is going to have trouble, considering he is almost 3.5 and is still only has a working vocabulary of about 15 words. This number has tripled since starting therapy, so he is making progress. Huge breakthrough cooperqting with slp the last 2 weeks, and he started OT this week, so I am hopeful. He also passed his hearing eval, so I think we are getting close to a place to get a dx. He sees a dev ped in Jan. Our insurance is awesome. We have 24 visits of ST in 60 days, renewable with progress. Haven't seen the OT auth yet, so not sure there. He is going 1 hr of OT per week right now. Have only been doing 30 min of speech but will push for more now that he is actually cooperating.

 

Right now we are at suspected CAS with potential SPD. Dude is a sensory seeker in every sense of the word. I am familiar with OG and thought the training could really help considering what I believe lies ahead.

 

I do plan to use LiPS. I want to get my hands on a manual. Thanks for the advice on when to start. He will be 4 next summer.

 

Storygirl, thanks for the feedback on the training. I have lots of Education in my background with a MA degree in Composition Pedagogy. I think it might be worth it. The time and money are huge, though.

 

Thanks ladies.