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#1 razorbackmama

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 01:32 AM

This sort of jives with a post from the General Board from a while back: http://forums.welltr...-really-behind/

Due to a mixture of things (poor curriculum choices, some laziness on his part, remediation of language issues, etc.), my 10th grader is behind, particularly in math. He did Lial's BCM in 9th grade, and I thought it would prepare him enough to start Saxon Algebra I this year. I was wrong. He was only able to start in Algebra 1/2, and he's about 3/4 of the way through. He has been doing 2 lessons a day, but it's finally starting to get to the difficult point to do that, so he wants to cut back to just 1 a day.

How can I catch him up by the time he graduates? While I wouldn't consider him "gifted" in math, it is not a struggle for him. He is behind simply due to poor curriculum choices and choosing to not do his work some days in years' past. (That is not a problem now - he is very diligent with his work.) If he does just one lesson a day, I don't know that he'll be able to get through Advanced Math by the time he graduates. If he struggled in math I'd be totally fine with this. But since he doesn't...I'm not.

Is it possible to catch him up without burning him out?

#2 Ohdanigirl

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 01:40 AM

Maybe if you look through the book, you can find times when he can do two sections. Also you can try doing 1 and 1/2, before whittling it down to 1. Other options maybe adding in work on Saturday, and even working through the summer.

Have you considered a tutor? I am not sure if that is an option for you, but it may help. If your ds doesn't need as much repetition, he maybe able to skip some of the problems. I know Saxon tend to have a lot of problems to help solidfy the lesson. Not all dc need that. KWIM

I feel you, though. I have a dc that has fallen behind in math more than once. He simply would prefer to read.

#3 razorbackmama

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 02:05 AM

Maybe if you look through the book, you can find times when he can do two sections. Also you can try doing 1 and 1/2, before whittling it down to 1. Other options maybe adding in work on Saturday, and even working through the summer.

Summer was already a given, the poor guy. I like the 1.5 lesson idea though. I don't know if he'd be willing to do it on Saturdays. I have enough trouble getting him to do it on Fridays after he's been at his charter school all day. :glare:

Have you considered a tutor? I am not sure if that is an option for you, but it may help.

We can't really afford one, but I don't really know how much it would help since he understands it...he just can't cram it all in at once.

If your ds doesn't need as much repetition, he maybe able to skip some of the problems. I know Saxon tend to have a lot of problems to help solidfy the lesson. Not all dc need that. KWIM

That's a good idea. That's actually how this discussion came up - he asked if he could just do the odds like he did with Lial's. I told him no because then he'll miss some of the review that's so essential. But maybe I can look through and nix certain problems I know he doesn't need.

Poor guy is just pooped. He spent 3 hours on math yesterday, and not becuase he wasn't understanding.

#4 JanetC

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 12:31 PM

Three hours of math a day is really pretty brutal. I would look for ways to reduce the workload to the essentials. If he's not going into a science/engineering type major, 3 hours of math a day is also crowding out curriculum or experiences that may be more relevant to him.

--Janet

#5 razorbackmama

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 01:06 PM

Three hours of math a day is really pretty brutal.

He doesn't spend that much time on it EVERY day, but the day before yesterday, yes. I think he usually spends about 2-2.5 hours a day doing math though, simply because it takes him about an hour per lesson.

I would look for ways to reduce the workload to the essentials.

That's why I started this thread and am asking. :D He and I don't want him spending 3 hours a day on math either. But we also can't figure out how to get him to where he needs to be either.

If he's not going into a science/engineering type major, 3 hours of math a day is also crowding out curriculum or experiences that may be more relevant to him.

He's not (he plans to be a Marine), but math is his best subject. (By "best" I don't mean that he's a math whiz...he's just stronger in math than in any other subject.) The ONLY reason he's been doing this much math is to get caught up to where he needs to be.

#6 regentrude

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 03:31 PM

My solution would be to use a math curriculum with less busywork. I found Saxon Math extremely time consuming for the material that is taught.
I would use a mastery based curriculum that is streamlined, gets to the point, cut out the mental math/fact practice sheets/endless spiral reviews.

#7 razorbackmama

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 04:02 PM

My solution would be to use a math curriculum with less busywork. I found Saxon Math extremely time consuming for the material that is taught.
I would use a mastery based curriculum that is streamlined, gets to the point, cut out the mental math/fact practice sheets/endless spiral reviews.

Saxon 1/2 doesn't have all the fact practice sheets and stuff like the younger levels do. It's just the lesson and then the review problems, which he needs. We actually came from mastery curriculums, and it took a ton of time just helping him remember how to do xyz because so much time would go by between uses of whatever the topic was. Spiral works so much better for us, and I'm kicking myself for not using it years ago. We wouldn't be in the mess we're in today if I had. :glare:

I think my best bet might be to go through and only have him do the review problems that he actually NEEDS more work on. Concepts that he gets easily, I'll just have him skip. I also plan to sit down and figure out just how many lesson days are needed between now and the end of Advanced Math. That might give me a bit more of a road map over the next couple summers and such. AND I'll be able to speak in more specifics when he balks at doing his math on Fridays after being at the charter school all day.

#8 regentrude

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 04:33 PM

Another thought: Have you thought about taking an extra year?
Your son is two years behind in math which you say is his strongest subject... so I am not sure why you want to push the time table and end up with little math on his transcript. I'd look into taking a year longer and finishing stronger.

#9 razorbackmama

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 05:43 PM

Another thought: Have you thought about taking an extra year?
Your son is two years behind in math which you say is his strongest subject... so I am not sure why you want to push the time table and end up with little math on his transcript. I'd look into taking a year longer and finishing stronger.

Oh you're preaching to the choir there. In 8th grade I offered him an extra year prior to starting high school to get caught up so he wouldn't have to bust his hump so much in high school. Both he and my husband nixed that idea. I've offered him an extra year after 12th grade, but he hates that idea even worse. In fact, he WANTS to graduate in 3 years rather than 4, so he can start his college/military career sooner. I told him that was absolutely IMPOSSIBLE. :glare:

Keep in mind, he isn't behind in math because he struggles. He is behind because of curriculum choices we've made in the past. Those curriculums didn't teach things that they should have, and we didn't realize it until after we had switched. We also have had to spend a lot of time remediating language issues (he has CAPD). Also he went through a period of time when he didn't think anything of it to just not do his schoolwork. (I'm thinking it's a 12-13yo thing...he went through it at that age, my 14yo went through it, and my previously diligent 12yo is in the thick of it now. :bored: ) So all of those things have set him back, not an inability to perform at grade level.

How would completing Algebra I, II, Advanced Math end up as "little on his transcript"? That would be the same amount of math he would have normally done. I'm confused.

Also, I posted here for suggestions on how to get him through the math he needs by the time he graduates. The graduation date won't be changing - that's why I asked for suggestions.

#10 regentrude

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 06:12 PM

How would completing Algebra I, II, Advanced Math end up as "little on his transcript"? That would be the same amount of math he would have normally done. I'm confused.
Also, I posted here for suggestions on how to get him through the math he needs by the time he graduates. The graduation date won't be changing - that's why I asked for suggestions.


I am sorry; I did not mean to offend when I suggested taking the extra year.
My concern re transcript was that he will have only two high school math credits (alg 1+2) on his 11th grade transcript- the one he would use to apply for college. This is "little" because most students will have three (and many four) credits at that point. And this is already assuming he can complete two full credits in 1.5 years.

#11 razorbackmama

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 06:32 PM

I am sorry; I did not mean to offend when I suggested taking the extra year.

No, no offense taken. I'm sorry if I came back snarky. I am so. stinkin. frustrated about all of this, and I am just kicking myself and want to kick our previous curriculum about all of this. He really COULD use an extra year, simply because while he has made TREMENDOUS strides with his language ability (his Iowa scores went up 25 percentile points this last year, which is HUGE for him), he is still doing some heavy work on vocabulary and reading comprehension. He's behind in all subject areas (though not as badly as math) due to his language troubles and all the time we've spent working on remediating those. But when it comes to the realities of the situation, what do I know? I'm just the teacher. :glare: :glare: :glare:

My concern re transcript was that he will have only two high school math credits (alg 1+2) on his 11th grade transcript- the one he would use to apply for college. This is "little" because most students will have three (and many four) credits at that point. And this is already assuming he can complete two full credits in 1.5 years.

Oh OK, I see what you are saying. I forgot about that aspect. Sigh. Now I REALLY have no idea what to do. :( :( :(

#12 SkateLeft

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 07:24 PM

Is there any chance that he could take math via dual enrollment at some point? That would probably be my first choice, if I were in your position. College math classes generally cover a year of high school math in a semester. For example, our local community college offers "Intermediate Algebra" which is the semester long equivalent of Algebra 2, then a semester long Precalculus class, which would enable a dual enrolled high school student to complete two years of math in a single year.

Another option would be to use K12's Summer School courses, which are teacher guided, full-length high school courses designed to be completed in a summer. They're quite expensive, and I think the student probably has to be pretty motivated, but I thought I'd throw it out there. My 9th grader is planning on accelerating her math sequence by taking a math class through K12 this summer.

#13 AngieW in Texas

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 07:36 PM

First of all, I recommend doing math year-round. That all by itself will help some with catching up.

Saxon is not a math program that I would recommend at all, but I know it works for some people. I'd recommend using something else. Saxon is a program that is abandoned by many people in high school. Even the kids it originally worked for tend to start having problems with it then.

If he did fine with Lial's BCM, then I would drop Saxon Algebra 1/2 right now and move on. Use Jacobs Algebra or Lial's Introductory Algebra and just go through it one day at a time. Kinetic Books Algebra I and Algebra II are great if you have a kid who likes doing math on the computer. My youngest won't have anything to do with a math program that's computer-based. Kinetic Books also goes deeper than the other programs I've mentioned here, so it might not be the best to use with your ds. I know that my youngest would have a lot of difficulty working through KB because math is not a strong point for her.

If you do math year-round and switch today to a different program, he should be able to get through 3 years of math in the next 2.5 years. Working through the summers will give you about 50 extra days this summer and next summer. That means about half of a schoolyear. If he is able to work through the programs at the intended pace (finishing each book in about 180 schooldays), then he should be able to get through three of them. He could do Jacobs Algebra, Jacobs Geometry, and Lial's Intermediate Algebra or Lial's Introductory Algebra, Jacobs Geometry, and Lial's Intermediate Geometry.

If you want something that is MUCH easier, you can go with MUS, which is what I ended up doing for my youngest. I would love to use a more rigorous program for, her, but MUS works for her and other programs that I try just end up with her in tears. Dyslexia really gets in the way of her math progress.

#14 Tullia

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 08:03 PM

We had similar challenges. My suggestion would be to define exactly what you mean and expect to achieve by "catching up". One thing I learned from all my son's difficulties with math (he was out of sync for most of his high school years) is that there is no substitute for mastery of pre-algebra skills and then mastery of algebra skills. If that means your son only has time to become well grounded in algebra and geometry during high school, he might find himself better prepared for college than by trying to rush things to fit in another level of math.

IME, colleges are well aware that impressive transcripts don't always mean a student is prepared to do college work. However, that depends on the school; requirements and expectations vary--definitely check to see what likely college choices expect to see on transcripts, how they validate transcripts, and how they deal with students who aren't as ready for college work as first expected or who enroll fully understanding they need some leveling work.

I agree that dual enrollment can be a good option. It helped my son get back on track. We were able to address some pre-algebra issues ourselves, but he really took off once he started taking college level math classes. Since then, my son has gathered up enough college math credits that he's thinking a second major in math is doable. It does take work, but if you son is motivated he can do it.

ETA: I do NOT recommend our path; it certainly wasn't ideal. Life dealt us some challenges and I made a bad curriculum choice that made things worse. Even so, the damage wasn't permanent so my advice is don't panic, and don't worry that his college chances are irretrievably damaged.

#15 razorbackmama

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Posted 21 November 2012 - 10:55 PM

Is there any chance that he could take math via dual enrollment at some point? That would probably be my first choice, if I were in your position. College math classes generally cover a year of high school math in a semester. For example, our local community college offers "Intermediate Algebra" which is the semester long equivalent of Algebra 2, then a semester long Precalculus class, which would enable a dual enrolled high school student to complete two years of math in a single year.

Hmmmm there actually is! As part of his charter school he has access to our local community college for free, I believe. He may have to wait until his junior year, but I will ask the coordinator more about it. That is an option I had not thought of at all - thanks!

First of all, I recommend doing math year-round. That all by itself will help some with catching up.

Yes, we both have come to that realization and had been planning to do that.

Saxon is not a math program that I would recommend at all, but I know it works for some people. I'd recommend using something else. Saxon is a program that is abandoned by many people in high school. Even the kids it originally worked for tend to start having problems with it then.

If he did fine with Lial's BCM, then I would drop Saxon Algebra 1/2 right now and move on. Use Jacobs Algebra or Lial's Introductory Algebra and just go through it one day at a time. Kinetic Books Algebra I and Algebra II are great if you have a kid who likes doing math on the computer. My youngest won't have anything to do with a math program that's computer-based. Kinetic Books also goes deeper than the other programs I've mentioned here, so it might not be the best to use with your ds. I know that my youngest would have a lot of difficulty working through KB because math is not a strong point for her.

If you do math year-round and switch today to a different program, he should be able to get through 3 years of math in the next 2.5 years. Working through the summers will give you about 50 extra days this summer and next summer. That means about half of a schoolyear. If he is able to work through the programs at the intended pace (finishing each book in about 180 schooldays), then he should be able to get through three of them. He could do Jacobs Algebra, Jacobs Geometry, and Lial's Intermediate Algebra or Lial's Introductory Algebra, Jacobs Geometry, and Lial's Intermediate Geometry.

If you want something that is MUCH easier, you can go with MUS, which is what I ended up doing for my youngest. I would love to use a more rigorous program for, her, but MUS works for her and other programs that I try just end up with her in tears. Dyslexia really gets in the way of her math progress.

MUS is a four-letter word to him. It is the program that put him so far behind. No way, no how will I use that. The only way I even recommend it is if absolutely nothing else works for a student.

Lial's BCM sort of worked. He did OK with it, but it didn't have enough review for him to stay up on things - he kept forgetting concepts in between the review sections. Saxon is working, and apart from the amount of time we have left issue, we've both been very pleased with it. He is really learning a lot with it. I'm EXTREMELY hesitant to switch away now that we have found something that works well. The stuff he's learning, he is REALLY learning - Saxon is the first program we've used that I've been able to say that with. I actually can't say that about Lial BCM. It did the job but honestly I wish we hadn't used it - I feel like it was a wasted year, to be honest. I wish I would have used Saxon 8/7 with him so that he could have just gone straight into Saxon Algebra I. BCM didn't prepare him to do that, which is why he's having to do a 2nd year of pre-algebra and use 1/2. Sigh.

BUT for the sake of being open to everything, what is so different about Lial/Jacob's Algebra and geometry (other than the mastery vs. spiral)? He actually has requested using Lial's again, but there again, I saw how much he was forgetting in between. He just seems to really, REALLY grasp the math concepts better with Saxon

We had similar challenges. My suggestion would be to define exactly what you mean and expect to achieve by "catching up". One thing I learned from all my son's difficulties with math (he was out of sync for most of his high school years) is that there is no substitute for mastery of pre-algebra skills and then mastery of algebra skills. If that means your son only has time to become well grounded in algebra and geometry during high school, he might find himself better prepared for college than by trying to rush things to fit in another level of math.

At the very minimum he needs to get through Alg. I, II, and geometry. Now, with Saxon I know that is tricky beacause their geometry is interwoven throughout the books (which I LOVE), and their actual geometry "course" is part of Advanced Math. I'd love it if he could get through Advanced Math because I know he is CAPABLE of it, but time is what is truly getting in our way.

Also I want him to be able to take the science courses he needs/wants to without the math pre-requisites getting in the way. In addition to being interested in the Marine Corps, he's interested in medical stuff (not sure which field at all though), so he needs a good foundation in science too.

definitely check to see what likely college choices expect to see on transcripts, how they validate transcripts, and how they deal with students who aren't as ready for college work as first expected or who enroll fully understanding they need some leveling work.

Good idea. He knows which college he wants to attend because they are the only ones with an NROTC program around here.

Maybe we can do sort of a combination...cut out some of the unnecessary review on stuff he knows backward and forward and also utilize our community college options....

#16 3andme

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Posted 22 November 2012 - 07:19 PM

If you want to stick with Saxon, you might try contacting Art Reed. He is a very experienced Saxon math teacher and offers free advice on how best to utilize the Saxon curriculum as well as DVD supplements. I've read several posts where users have said his advice has been very helpful.

#17 razorbackmama

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Posted 22 November 2012 - 07:44 PM

If you want to stick with Saxon, you might try contacting Art Reed. He is a very experienced Saxon math teacher and offers free advice on how best to utilize the Saxon curriculum as well as DVD supplements. I've read several posts where users have said his advice has been very helpful.

Oooooooh! We use his DVDs! I just might do that! Thanks for the idea!

#18 PollyOR

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Posted 23 November 2012 - 01:21 PM

Ideas... ALEKS or Teaching Company DVD's (all on sale today with free shipping).

Best of luck!

Edited to add that we really like the math courses by James Sellers.

#19 TeachingMine

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Posted 23 November 2012 - 04:24 PM

If you want him to get as far in the Saxon math as he can, I'd suggest one lesson a day, every day minus major holidays. It may not be palatable to him, but it could work. I'd also second the suggestion of dual enrollment. Personally I wouldn't start it at his present level, but he might want to consider doing that for math in his senior year. IMO he'd have to be very solid in his math skills to consider that as the cc classes move very quickly. Regarding the Saxon, I'd have him just do algebra 1, 2 and then Advanced Math and not take time out for a separate geometry as it's not necessary.

#20 Tiramisu

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Posted 23 November 2012 - 05:39 PM

Just a thought that I don't think has come up yet...If you are planning college, I would consider making sure that he has what he needs in terms of knowledge of algebra and geometry by the fall of his senior year. If he is strong on math and you do SAT prep so he does well on the math portion of the SAT's, that will make up for fewer math credits on his transcript.

He may still need three credits of high school math. That could be done by doing MUS Geometry at the same time as Algebra I, since MUS Geometry doesn't need algebra--from what I've heard. I know MUS isn't on his good list right now, but it will do the job without creating too much stress. I think that if a college saw that he doubled up in math, they might think that he got off to a slow start in math but applied himself to make up for it. :)

#21 In The Great White North

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Posted 23 November 2012 - 05:48 PM

Good idea. He knows which college he wants to attend because they are the only ones with an NROTC program around here.


It's great that he knows what he wants and where he wants to go. You haven't mentioned which college, but if he's looking at NROTC, it will be similar to USMA. Here's an explanation of what they expect, and several test versions:

http://www.dean.usma...andidateWeb.htm

HTH

#22 razorbackmama

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Posted 23 November 2012 - 07:18 PM

Ideas... ALEKS or Teaching Company DVD's (all on sale today with free shipping).

I'm not super familiar with how either of those work as standalone courses. Or ARE they standalone courses? Would he be able to use them for full credit?

If you want him to get as far in the Saxon math as he can, I'd suggest one lesson a day, every day minus major holidays. It may not be palatable to him, but it could work. I'd also second the suggestion of dual enrollment. Personally I wouldn't start it at his present level, but he might want to consider doing that for math in his senior year. IMO he'd have to be very solid in his math skills to consider that as the cc classes move very quickly. Regarding the Saxon, I'd have him just do algebra 1, 2 and then Advanced Math and not take time out for a separate geometry as it's not necessary.

Yes, we weren't going to use the standalone Saxon geometry since the material is interwoven in the other courses (which I love). I believe I may have all of the courses, so I may sit down (tonight?) and see how many lessons/test days are required to complete them all.

Just a thought that I don't think has come up yet...If you are planning college, I would consider making sure that he has what he needs in terms of knowledge of algebra and geometry by the fall of his senior year. If he is strong on math and you do SAT prep so he does well on the math portion of the SAT's, that will make up for fewer math credits on his transcript.

He may still need three credits of high school math. That could be done by doing MUS Geometry at the same time as Algebra I, since MUS Geometry doesn't need algebra--from what I've heard. I know MUS isn't on his good list right now, but it will do the job without creating too much stress. I think that if a college saw that he doubled up in math, they might think that he got off to a slow start in math but applied himself to make up for it. :)

The school he wants to go to requires 4 math credits, Alg. I and up. They also have this indexing thing where they plot them on this chart based on their SAT/ACT score and their GPA.

It's great that he knows what he wants and where he wants to go. You haven't mentioned which college, but if he's looking at NROTC, it will be similar to USMA. Here's an explanation of what they expect, and several test versions:

http://www.dean.usma...andidateWeb.htm

HTH

It does, thank you! It looked like that information was geared toward math/engineering students? He doesn't have any interest in anything like that (I'm thinking he wants to do something medical...maybe nursing but he's not sure yet). Would the requirements be the same?

Thanks so much for y'all's help. This situation is exactly why I answered the way I did on that thread I mentioned in my OP. Ugh ugh, and double ugh.

#23 Sebastian (a lady)

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Posted 23 November 2012 - 08:36 PM

It does, thank you! It looked like that information was geared toward math/engineering students? He doesn't have any interest in anything like that (I'm thinking he wants to do something medical...maybe nursing but he's not sure yet). Would the requirements be the same?

Thanks so much for y'all's help. This situation is exactly why I answered the way I did on that thread I mentioned in my OP. Ugh ugh, and double ugh.


I had a briefing from an NROTC rep over the summer. For the Navy scholarships, they are very much looking for students interested in technical majors (and who can thrive in them). I think the number he gave was that 90% of the NROTC scholarships were for engineering, math or science majors. (He was primarily representing NROTC - Navy option. I don't know how much this might be different for USMC option.)

Medical services for USMC is all done by Navy corpsman, nurses, doctors, etc. So if he's interested in medical, but working with Marines, he would actually want to join the Navy.

#24 razorbackmama

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Posted 23 November 2012 - 09:08 PM

I had a briefing from an NROTC rep over the summer. For the Navy scholarships, they are very much looking for students interested in technical majors (and who can thrive in them). I think the number he gave was that 90% of the NROTC scholarships were for engineering, math or science majors. (He was primarily representing NROTC - Navy option. I don't know how much this might be different for USMC option.)

He is not going to try for a scholarship.

Medical services for USMC is all done by Navy corpsman, nurses, doctors, etc. So if he's interested in medical, but working with Marines, he would actually want to join the Navy.

Yes, he's aware of this. I was just talking about when it comes to a college major. If he did something medical in the Marines he'd want to be a field medic. He also is interested in being a police officer.

We talked more about it tonight, and I'd forgotten that he's leaning toward the PLC option. That will actually work out better for us financially because then he'd be able to attend our local community college the first 2 years. Since an NROTC scholarship won't be happening, he and we will be footing the bill for school. Our community college is a whole heck of a lot cheaper than the university that offers NROTC (or the cross-town affiliate).

I looked at the Saxon Math. He should be able to do one lesson/test per day (and I stressed to him that he MUST do it even after a day at the charter school) and be able to do it in summers too and finish out Advanced Math by the time he's done in 12th grade. That will give him 4 credits. He also said that he'd be willing to do 2 lessons/day when it's something that doesn't take as long. So WHEW. I think we have a plan!

#25 In The Great White North

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Posted 23 November 2012 - 09:26 PM

double post

#26 Sebastian (a lady)

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Posted 23 November 2012 - 10:03 PM

As far as I know even field medics are Navy corpsmen serving with USMC and trained at the USMC field medic school.
http://www.usmilitar...cation-options/

Plc could be a good option but he needs to make himself competitive. Economic downturns paired with military budget cuts usually means the military can be picky.

Sounds like you have a plan for math. If he's at all like my sons the more that the goals and the plan are his the more they are likely to be done.

#27 butterflymommy

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Posted 23 November 2012 - 10:20 PM

Do you have the teacher cd for saxon? It's a little pricey but much cheaper than a tutor. My son is in a similar spot. 9th grade and still trying to get through algebra 1.

The main problem is his lack of effort... and there's not much I can do about that. There are so many resources out there for him and he just doesn't care.

#28 razorbackmama

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Posted 23 November 2012 - 10:43 PM

As far as I know even field medics are Navy corpsmen serving with USMC and trained at the USMC field medic school.
http://www.usmilitar...cation-options/

Ah, good to know. He was under the impression they were Marines. I actually think he's leaning toward the police officer thing, although he sure would be good in the medical field. ;)

Plc could be a good option but he needs to make himself competitive. Economic downturns paired with military budget cuts usually means the military can be picky.

Oh yeah, he's working on it. And truth be told, I'm glad he wants to go the PLC route because if, for whatever reason, they end up saying it's a no go, he'll have something else to fall back on. If he were to just enlist and have no other plans...ugh, I don't even want to think about it.

Sounds like you have a plan for math. If he's at all like my sons the more that the goals and the plan are his the more they are likely to be done.

:thumbup1:

Do you have the teacher cd for saxon? It's a little pricey but much cheaper than a tutor. My son is in a similar spot. 9th grade and still trying to get through algebra 1.

We use the Art Reed DVDs. We like them pretty well, although my son sometimes says that Mr. Reed makes things harder than they need to be. Who knows LOL.

The main problem is his lack of effort... and there's not much I can do about that. There are so many resources out there for him and he just doesn't care.

Oh yeah that's not an issue here (though it was in the past, which is why we're here today). He busts his hump and understands well...it's just that you can only do so much in a time period. It took him till he joined his Young Marines unit, but now he is highly motivated and works really hard.


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