Novel Studies?

[ElaineSmiles]

Any thoughts on novel studies for 4th/5th grade?  How many would you do?  What would your expectations be?  

[caffeineandbooks]

I would just have them read books.  6th or even 7th grade is not too late to begin formal literature studies, and I recall from your other recent posts that this is already a big year for you guys.  You could have some simple oral discussions and introduce ideas like character, setting, plot, conflict, protagonist, climax, but I wouldn't have them writing essays or completing comprehension and vocabulary workbooks.

When you decide you have enough scope in your week to add a bit more (and it's fine if that is not this year), I highly recommend Center for Lit's Teaching the Classics.  It's a program to give you as the parent the skills you need to discuss any story, without needing a lit guide to hold your hand.  You start with picture books, and you start your kids with picture books as well, even if they're high schoolers.  I have levelled up my own reading with this method and it's working for my kids too.

[El...]

We used a good booklist and talked through the questions from TWTM. It was simple and fun, and didn't destroy the experience of reading. For my kids, I was concerned that too much picking books apart would be detrimental. 

[Lori D.]

Agree. No formal novel/literature studies below middle school.

That's a great way of killing love of reading and literature for many reasons -- not least that it runs the risk of turning reading, which is (hopefully) enjoyable and magical for the child, into "schoolwork." 

Grade 4-6 is a wonderful stage for reading. So many fantastic, well-written books to enjoy at this reading level.

In grades K-3, "formal reading goals" were more about getting solid in decoding, fluency, comprehension, and holding what came before alongside what is happening now to begin to predict what might happen later in the story.

In grades 4-6, children now have that solid foundation, so "formal reading goals" are more about exploring a wide variety of genres (mysteries, humor, historical fiction, real-life adventure, fantasy, sci-fi, etc.), and about slowly increasing difficulty in vocabulary, sentence structure, and content/ideas. But at all of those grades, keeping the reading pleasurable is critical.


Not as a formal novel (literature) study, but at that age I CAN see adding in some fun extension hands-on activities that are similar to things done or seen by characters in the book. Or make a food that is described in the book. Or possibly do a go-along short geography or history unit on that area of the world in which the book is set... etc. If you have a child who loves to do creative writing at that age, then maybe they might enjoy writing some "further adventures of" for the characters or the world of the book. BUT... my expectation, if doing something along these lines, would be to keep it as FUN supplement, and NOT kill the enjoyment of the book.

Wishing you all the BEST in finding what works best for you and your students for enjoying the journey of reading those many wonderful children's books that make reading magical at this age! Warmest regards, Lori D.

[ElaineSmiles]

1 hour ago, caffeineandbooks said:

When you decide you have enough scope in your week to add a bit more (and it's fine if that is not this year), I highly recommend Center for Lit's Teaching the Classics.  It's a program to give you as the parent the skills you need to discuss any story, without needing a lit guide to hold your hand. 

This sounds really, really handy!  Thanks!

 

22 minutes ago, Lori D. said:

In grades 4-6, children now have that solid foundation, so "formal reading goals" are more about exploring a wide variety of genres (mysteries, humor, historical fiction, real-life adventure, fantasy, sci-fi, etc.), and about slowly increasing difficulty in vocabulary, sentence structure, and content/ideas. But at all of those grades, keeping the reading pleasurable is critical.

Okay--this is good to hear.  Right now we've been incorporating some reading on science and social studies topics along with a choice of various fiction books.  I will just keep plugging along like that for awhile!  

 

[ScoutTN]

Just read books and enjoy them. Save lit analysis for later.

[PeterPan]

17 hours ago, ElaineSmiles said:

Any thoughts on novel studies for 4th/5th grade?  How many would you do?  What would your expectations be?  

We did the Hobbit around this age using a guide I found online and it was good. There are extra things they have them do, like figuring out the writing. 🙂

I was just mentioning in another thread this is a good age to throw that discussion energy into things that *benefit* from discussion and aren't as easily understood, like Shakespeare. Oxford Press has a comic series for Shakespeare that my dd ADORED and you can read those then watch videos and discuss using guides. You can do something similar with opera, though I'd wait a couple years for that to junior high. Shakespeare you can start with the tragedies and they're fine, easy, something you can do once a week. 

Does your dc write narrations/book summaries easily? Would they enjoy the Mrs. Renz book projects? We did them around that age and they were fun.

Edited August 25, 2023 by PeterPan

[Green Bean]

Memoria Press has a great selection. I disagree with the "just read the books" camp. Talk about the books. Maybe don't use the guides as write in, but use the teacher ones for talking points. Lay the foundation.

4-5 a year is plenty.

Edited August 26, 2023 by Green Bean

[ScoutTN]

2 hours ago, Green Bean said:

Memoria Press has a great selection. I disagree with the "just read the books" camp. Talk about the books. Maybe don't use the guides as write in, but use the teacher ones for talking points. Lay the foundation.

4-5 a year is plenty.

I am in the just read books camp and just assumed discussion is automatic. It’s how we did homeschool, all the way through.
 

We didn’t talk about every book my kids read at that age, but we always discussed the ones that were officially for school. I find lit guides for elementary ages to be tedious at best, mostly fact questions or vocabulary.  I did sometimes use some of the questions of Center for Lit’s list. Mostly our conversations were organic and were just making connections and sharing enjoyment. 
 

How many books for LA depends on how fast your kiddo reads. I had one who read super fast and she easily finished 10 for school a year, not counting free reads, history or RAs. 

[Lori D.]

31 minutes ago, ScoutTN said:

I am in the just read books camp and just assumed discussion is automatic. It’s how we did homeschool, all the way through.

Yes, also just clarifying... The bolded was us as well. In the elementary grades, discussion was always very informal and came up naturally. It was not guided analysis.

We started learning about literary devices along about 6th/7th grade, and we did use excerpts of some lit. guides starting in late middle school/high school for some books. Not every book. In high school, DSs wrote about some books. Again, not every piece of literature we read in high school.

Edited August 27, 2023 by Lori D.

[El...]

The kind of informal, low-pressure discussions we're talking about here, in my experience, require that the parent also reads the book. It's not just giving the kid a book and then a quiz. It's more work on my end. I haven't found a way around that. 

I love doing it, but it's a time commitment. Audio books help, because I can listen while I'm doing all the rest of the things I need to do! 

[ScoutTN]

10 hours ago, El... said:

The kind of informal, low-pressure discussions we're talking about here, in my experience, require that the parent also reads the book. It's not just giving the kid a book and then a quiz. It's more work on my end. I haven't found a way around that. 

I love doing it, but it's a time commitment. Audio books help, because I can listen while I'm doing all the rest of the things I need to do! 

This is true. And I found I needed to reread even familiar and oft-read books to keep all the details fresh. 

[historically accurate]

4th and 5th grade here were the years I gathered all of the little freebies I had collected over the years, and we did unit studies so I could use the elementary age ones up before moving on to middle school. I alternated a history topic, a science topic, and a novel study, so it ended up being about 3 each per year. IIRC, some of those we did were Anne of Green Gables, The Hobbit, some Harry Potter novels (kids did Hogwarts classes with these -  Potions=Periodic Table, etc), Treasure Island and My Side of the Mountain. Novel studies at that age were more like Five in a Row books were when they were younger - we did writing/narrations using Build Your Library narration card activities, maps (The Hobbit and Treasure Island), fencing/pirates (Treasure Island), nature walks & science (My Side of the Mountain), and poetry and word play (Anne of Green Gables and The Hobbit), etc. Occasionally, they did a lapbook. Depended on what I had in my computer drive, my local library, and the time I had available.

Sometime between 6th and 9th grade, my kids went through Figuratively Speaking and How to Read Lit like a Professor for lit analysis, but in 4th and 5th grade, we played with novel studies.

If I hadn't had time to design these and had spent $ on other curriculum, I probably would just do read alouds and just ask some questions/discuss.

Edited August 27, 2023 by historically accurate

[Shoes+Ships+SealingWax]

During elementary we’ve primarily done comparisons to film adaptations & extension projects, rather than more formal analysis. When we read Alice in Wonderland / Through the Looking Glass we had a tea party with cherry tarts; played croquet, hearts, & spades; & compared all of the satirical poetry to the originals. Throughout the Anne of Green Gables series, we looked up all of the poems she referenced & read them. DS designed & built a house boat while reading The Gate in the Wall. Things like that usually only happened with a book or two per year - the rest we simply enjoyed. 

Last year (4th grade) we completed “matchbook summaries” for three novels. These involved writing a short summary of each chapter on a notecard, illustrating the front, & creating a lift-the-flap poster. DS really enjoyed it! Definitely not something I’d do for *every* book, but for a few it was a fun way to dig a bit deeper. 

I’m not sure what we’ll do in that vein this year. Later this week we’re playing Mariposas after he’s written a report on monarch butterflies for composition. We have a Baba Yaga-themed game to go along with our reading of The House with Chicken Legs, as well. We’ll see where the year takes us! 
 

ETA: I do have one study that I’ve been wanting to do for over a year now, but I’m not sure where to fit it in… I’d love to read Chasing Vermeer & work through Didax Pentominoes in parallel. 

Edited August 30, 2023 by Shoes+Ships+SealingWax