I wish SWB would put out an update

[inashoe]

on the recommendations that have changed since she published WTM. I have had frustration with some recommendations, only to find on this forum that others have the same difficulties.

 

For example, she *apparently* no longer recommends Kingfisher history Encyclopedia. I also get conflicting versions of her recommendations for grammar - R&S or Abeka.

 

Couldn't she just put out an update for us online somewhere.

[Emmy]

There is a revised version of TWTM being released in a couple months I'm pretty sure -I think that will be the best place to get updates, I can't wait for it to come out. :)

[Jami]

Updates from the 1st edition?

 

If you start a thread asking "What does SWB recommend for grammar in the 2nd edition of WTM" or "I don't like R&S Grammar as recommended, what do others use for 3rd grade grammar?" I'm sure many here would jump in with all sorts of answers for you. :001_smile:

 

But some of the recs from the 2nd edition will no doubt be changed in the 3rd edition which is due out in 2009.

 

If one of SWBs recommendations doesn't work for you, I'm sure you can find someone here who can suggest another option.

[Rhondabee]

Well, I think part of the reason her recommendations change is *because* we are able to share here on her forum. And, sometimes people recommend things here, even though they're not the "recommended" WTM items - and that's a good thing because not everything that works for SWB will work for everybody.

 

The new WTM version is coming out soon (February), and that should have *all* the new, updated recs. That's what happend with R&S and Abeka. The first edition recommended ABeka, then (because of the forums!) SWB tried R&S and really liked it - so that was the top recommendation in the second edition.

 

I will *really* love to see the new Logic Stage History routine. Yes, at a seminar I attended this summer, she recommended using the KHE as a spine to take notes from, and to fill up the timeline with, but not to outline. Unfortunately, the old Kingfisher really fits in better with the current plan (there are summaries in the text that match all the tabs recommended in the notebook, for instance). But, from what I've read, it went Out of Print (OOP) just after the first edition was released. What to do but try to make the new KHE work, you know?

 

Some of the updates *are* on her blog - if you scroll down, in the bottom left hand corner, you can click on "The Well Trained Mind", where there will be a link to "Susan's blog".

 

hth,

Rhonda

[Harriet Vane]

on the recommendations that have changed since she published WTM. I have had frustration with some recommendations, only to find on this forum that others have the same difficulties.

 

For example, she *apparently* no longer recommends Kingfisher history Encyclopedia. I also get conflicting versions of her recommendations for grammar - R&S or Abeka.

 

Couldn't she just put out an update for us online somewhere.

 

Where did you get your info about these specific recommendations?

 

I just bought a Kingfisher from her booth last summer. It's fabulous. Are you sure she is no longer recommending it? I'd be pretty surprised if that were the case, and curious to know the reasoning.

 

Also, as far as I am aware, SWB recommends both R&S and Abeka (either or, not both together) and that has not changed. Did she say otherwise? As a former English major, and former editor/proofreader, I think both programs are really strong. Again I am curious to know why she would no longer recommend them--are you sure she herself has retracted that opinion?

[Colleen in NS]

Where did you get your info about these specific recommendations?

 

I think she got the KF info. from me, when I posted about it in answer to another of her threads. I got it from Rhondabee several months ago, who explained it fully in her post above.

 

OP, I can't wait to see the new WTM for all the changes. Try not to get discouraged when you hear these conflicting answers - just keep asking until you piece it together. I'd imagine SWB doesn't have time to post all the ever-changing updates. She has said in the past, too, that books go out of print all the time, which is frustrating to her, too, after she has made a recommendation. Keep asking here! :)

Edited December 1, 2008 by Colleen in NS

[Carol in Cal.]

The third edition is due out in February. You can pre-order on Amazon now.

 

I already own the first two, and I'm sure that the third will be worthwhile as well. Also, I will order it from Peace Hill Press, even if Amazon has it cheaper, as a thank you for maintaining these boards.

[Guest]

By newer KF, I am going to assume the poster was referring to pre-1999? The 1999 and 2004 seem to be the same content and format. I am looking forward to the updated Logic History. It is a bit confusing and (dare I say it?) boring now. Jackdaws are expensive, as well.

 

I wish I had my original copy of WTM. I have the 2nd edition but it is neat to see the progression as each edition seems to refine JW/SWB's philosophy of neo-classical education. I am planning on ordering from Peace Hill directly, as well.

[inashoe]

Relieved to hear that it is not just me who is having difficulties with the Logic Stage History. We just don't have it figured out. To ask my fifth grader to make an outline from anything - KF or library books - is just not working. He loved SOTW, is an avid reader, but is no longer enjoying history.

[hischool]

Couldn't she just put out an update for us online somewhere.

 

If she does that, who will buy the book? ;)

 

I have only glanced through the WTM on google books. (limited preview) Personally, I find the recommendations and reviews on this forum by other homeschool moms far more useful during my research on curriculum.

[Carol in Cal.]

By newer KF, I am going to assume the poster was referring to pre-1999? The 1999 and 2004 seem to be the same content and format. I am looking forward to the updated Logic History. It is a bit confusing and (dare I say it?) boring now. Jackdaws are expensive, as well.

 

I wish I had my original copy of WTM. I have the 2nd edition but it is neat to see the progression as each edition seems to refine JW/SWB's philosophy of neo-classical education. I am planning on ordering from Peace Hill directly, as well.

 

 

I have it, it's much easier to use for outlining than the newer one, which I also have.

[Carol in Cal.]

Relieved to hear that it is not just me who is having difficulties with the Logic Stage History. We just don't have it figured out. To ask my fifth grader to make an outline from anything - KF or library books - is just not working. He loved SOTW, is an avid reader, but is no longer enjoying history.

 

If not, I'm absolutely 100% positive that SWB would be the first one to say, "Then change what you're doing." TWTM is not prescriptive; it's just a very well thought out, thorough, complete way to get a well-rounded, classically oriented homeschooled education.

 

Personally, I would not let ANYTHING ruin my daughter's love of history. In fact, when she was doing history summaries, I didn't have her proofread and perfect them and neatly file them as TWTM suggests. She did OTHER proofreading and OTHER perfecting, and as a result, she learned how to summarize and write very, very well, and she also still loves history. This was a conscious decision that I made for the good of my child. I got wistful from time to time about that binder with the neat compositions and maps and coloring that we did not have, but it was worth it. I am very grateful to TWTM for dignifying summarization work as well as showing how to progress through teaching writing in all its glory--composition, grammar, mechanics, proofreading, etc.--so that it was easy to make that mid-course correction and still be on track. The correction was separating the hated part of writing from the loved part of learning history, but still making sure that both occurred. Without a doubt that was the best thing for my DD. YMMV.

[Crimson Wife]

What I would love is for Peace Hill to sell mini-volumes of just the recommendations for the individual stages to supplement the full WTM book. I'm not going to keep shelling out $40 for a new edition every few years but I would spend $15 to have the most recent information for the stage we're in on hand rather than having to keep requesting it through my library.

[Guest]

We all have our wish list. I would love the SOTW AG parent sections split out from the included student pages and bound as a hardback/paperback.

[runningirl71]

What I would love is for Peace Hill to sell mini-volumes of just the recommendations for the individual stages to supplement the full WTM book. I'm not going to keep shelling out $40 for a new edition every few years but I would spend $15 to have the most recent information for the stage we're in on hand rather than having to keep requesting it through my library.

 

:iagree: I think this is a great idea! :)

[Damselfly]

:iagree: That is a FANTASTIC idea!! I also find it hard to part with the money, when all I'm looking for is an update on the recommendations. Especially in this economy, and being a frugal homeschooling mama.

[Renee in NC]

:iagree: That is a FANTASTIC idea!! I also find it hard to part with the money, when all I'm looking for is an update on the recommendations. Especially in this economy, and being a frugal homeschooling mama.

 

SWB doesn't control that, though - her publisher does. You would have to convince W.W. Norton about that!:D

[Colleen in NS]

The correction was separating the hated part of writing from the loved part of learning history, but still making sure that both occurred.

 

This is what I've finally concluded, too. I have stacks and stacks of lib. books on hand to supplement ds' SOTW and KF reading. But I have a separate time for teaching writing (one level outlining, and continuing to work on one paragraph narrations - one each per week, taken from history reading). So, we don't have a full "history time" each week anymore - I don't focus on filling up the history notebook. I teach writing skills in the morning with whatever reading is on hand for the week, and hand over the reading to them in the afternoons. I also read SOTW to them at night.

[Carol in Cal.]

...between the first and second editions.

 

I'm not positive, though.

 

I thought that the second edition was a little 'softened' in terms of encouraging parents to find their own path within the framework of their own goals and their children's own capabilities.

 

I might be wrong, but that was my impression.