Vivofit Jr for alarms/reminders

[PeterPan]

I'm trying this with ds https://buy.garmin.com/en-US/US/p/600380  It's a Vivofit Jr 2 from Garmin. It takes a fresh battery once a year, no recharging, no wifi, and it just syncs to an app on your phone/ipad via bluetooth. You can add chores, alarms, etc. and the parent certifies them as completed. I'm sending the Goally back. Parts of it were very charming, and it might really be the right device for the right dc. On the Goally he would just tap through everything and fake it out. With the Vivofit, I tick it off in the app if I see it done.

So if I have to *remind* him to do it (meaning he ignores the alarms), then no points. And him doing it on his own is what we were trying to work on. But it also eliminates the problem of our variable schedule by putting it on him. The alarm went off at 12:00 today for his lunch vits, but we were in the car. It was his job to remember and take them when we got home a bit later. To me that's a good level of responsibility and EF. 

I'm looking forward to seeing how he does and then expanding it to include other things, like starting his school day, etc. Obviously that will take bigger rewards. You can assign points within the system, and he can see how he's doing on that.

So anyways, nice little no-hassle device that might be the EF support you need. Comes in a stretchy version for younger kids and adjustable wrist for bigger. The biggest setting on the adjustable fits me, and I have pretty big bones. They have a Vivofit 4 for adults that I suggested my dd look at, sort of a poor woman's apple watch, haha.

 

[Lecka]

That sounds very independent 🙂

[Kanin]

I can't wait to hear how it goes after a few weeks. Sounds awesome!

[Storygirl]

That looks very cool!! It's too bad, though, that they don't have a plain band for the jr version. The character versions are too young for high schoolers, even though the chore tracking feature on the jr version would be great for DS15. Some high schoolers could still benefit from parents being able to connect to their device and oversee the chores, but you can't connect that feature to the adult version of the vivofit.

[Guest]

It can apparently use regular vivofit bands https://smile.amazon.com/s?k=vivofit+jr+bands&crid=2RT5C94U4S5W8&sprefix=Vivo%2Caps%2C165&ref=nb_sb_ss_i_1_4

[PeterPan]

3 hours ago, Storygirl said:

The character versions are too young for high schoolers, even though the chore tracking feature on the jr version would be great for DS15.

Just get him the regular adult version. The adult version has alarms too. Or, like dmmetler is saying, change out the band if you want him on the kid app. But really, the kid app is a game and the alarms. The game is nothingness and ds doesn't care about it. So at that point, adult or jr doesn't matter. You can find the diameters of the bands online or just get it at Best Buy so you can change sizes. 

So if you buy the adult version of the vivofit 4, you might let us know how it does for alarms. You want him to have rewards? Oh duh, I'll bet we can download the app for the adult version and see for ourselves what it does, lol. If you don't need rewards points, then go adult. If he needs the wards, the jr will probably fit him. How big is his wrist? You can find the measurements online. I am a pretty big boned woman, and I can wear the Jr. Seriously.

[PeterPan]

I'm gonna download the app. Now I'm curious, lol.

[PeterPan]

https://buy.garmin.com/en-US/US/p/pn/S00-00515-29  Here's the teen/tween $10 band changeout. 

So I tried the Garmin Connect app that you use with the Vivofit regular, and it's just a really cluttered app filled with all kinds of stuff you may not need. The app for the jr version is what you're wanting probably for now. The modified band is probably your ticket. And something like this is way styling, not an expensive solution. If it gets him a year, then you might be like ok now let's try this other $$$ tech. But really, it might be epiphanal to help him see structure and the flow. I think there's a lot of routine to life that my ds has completely MISSED. Like it just doesn't register to him that things happen the same way every day...

[Storygirl]

Thanks, guys! Getting the jr version and switching the band might work for him.

We really need to work on transitioning away from needing to remind DS15 about everything verbally, but we haven't worked out a good plan yet. He does like to wear rubber bracelets, and he is a runner, so a fitness tracker might be a good option for him. I don't want to buy him something that he will refuse to use, so I'm going to ponder it a bit.

Last night I went to oversee the bedtime routine -- he still needs supervision, or he will purposefully skip brushing teeth and will accidentally forget to do other things (his EF is particularly bad at nighttime) -- and discovered him wiping down the bathroom counter without being reminded!!! WOOHOO!!!! We had a mini celebration. He and his brother take turns with this chore, and neither of them has ever done it without a reminder before.

So working through a regular routine consistently CAN result in him accomplishing more things on his own. Honestly, after years of working on a bedtime routine, without seeing much progress, I was starting to doubt.

I think switching things up to having alarms and digital reminders would be a good choice for him.

[PeterPan]

I think it's frustrating to the kid to be in trouble for EF issues but not be given the level of support it would take to get there. We have this in our house with the compost bin, where both dc over the years have gotten in trouble for not remembering to just DO it. The dc himself has no clue what it would take. To me the question is only *which* wearable product he wants for alarms and independence. If he wants something more $$$ than the vivofit jr, then you can go up the levels. But to me that would be an earned thing, like start with the lower one, see how he does, move up. Or is he responsible (not destructive) with products already? Then he could move to the apple watch or something. 

The app for the jr version is bringing in rewards/tokens, which are appropriate for young children and people on the spectrum. If they're motivating to him, then it's the product to start with. Then, after maybe a year of rewards he might be ready to switch to a swankier product and do it without rewards. And if he doesn't need rewards, then any level of the wearable teach with reminders would do. Like my 20 yo doesn't need rewards, lol. She just needs something that is easily set up to give her reminders. Since the Garmin Connect (adult version) app is such a nightmare, seems to me she's looking at either the jr version or all the way to an apple watch. But I haven't looked really hard. I don't like devices that have the sensors in the back shooting your wrist all the time. There are no long-term studies to know the safety of that, seems to me. 

So even for my 20 yo in college, the little $70 jr version is an option. Amazon has a Star Wars model that is only $60 right now. Then change out the band for $10 and boom. 

I would think with a 15 yo the cleaner app (which YOU will be using) and the rewards (which you could set to zero but probably won't want to, haha) are a better fit. It's very low key tech. You can see it in person at Best Buy.

My ds is pretty cantankerous and self-determinate. I told him that if I have to remind him, he doesn't get the point. So it was funny this morning to watch him go out, open the vitamin lid for the day, and NOT take them. LOL It was almost like he's fighting himself, like it's going to take some time for him to chill out and figure out how to accept this. 

Edited June 21, 2019 by PeterPan

[PeterPan]

Just a brief update, but it seems to be a good learning tool for him. The stories with Goally were sorta magical, like oh the kid liked the music so much he just DID everything! Hahaha. Well there aren't all the extra perks like that, so he very quickly got down to basics like DO I WANT TO DO THIS, NO I DO NOT. And that was really good, because it got to the heart of the issue. That compliance, just I am told the plan, I know it's the plan, I agree to work the plan, is always really hard for him. And this is sort of intractable and neutral. It's predictable and always there.

So he's had days where he has taken it off, then I give him 30 minutes to cool down and he puts it back on. But it's a compliance issue and having the watch the the Robot ABA (which is basically what it is) is actually perking him up. He's more connected, seeing more that there's a planning, seeing that there was a routine, that there were literally things happening THE SAME TIME EVERY DAY and that he had had no clue. 

So someone said that's independent. It's really not, not yet. It's a teaching tool right now. I'm doing faded prompts where, if he's slow, I'm going to work through faded prompts. But what part is EF (I have to remember my alarm and do it when I get back to the house in an hour) and what part is transitioning (the alarm went off, hit pause and go do it) and what part is compliance? That's what is interesting to watch. So as a teaching tool to work through those issues it's FABULOUS. But it's not like I've just handed it to him and he is magically doing it. It's not that entertaining. He overthinks and outthinks entertainment approaches anyway. It sucks to be told what to do and sucks to do something to alarms. But he's calmer, more connected, more peaceful for it. 

I like what it's doing to his BRAIN, even if it's going to take us a while to get this to where it's completely independent and accepted. That's going to take a bit.So faded prompts? Like his alarm goes off for lunch vits, so after about 10 minutes I'll go over and take my lunch vits. If that flops I might ask if he's Thursday. And every few minutes just up the prompt till he figures it out. But I think he needs mantras in his head like: when the alarm goes off I pause and go do it. That's why it becomes compliance,because he's obeying the watch over and over.

[Lecka]

A strategy is to have alarms be for things that are highly preferred for him, so the alarm goes off and if he is paying attention etc he gets to do something highly preferred or get a reinforcer.  Then maybe he gets in the habit of paying attention/responding to the schedule, and take compliance out of the picture to some extent.  

[Lecka]

You could also just put things on it that you are confident he will comply with, things that are just very routine and he complies with routinely, or things you think he will enjoy, and start that way. It can be another way to take compliance out of it to some extent.  

 

[Lecka]

A common problem is for kids to go “I don’t like any of the stuff this schedule so telling me to do, I don’t want anything to do with it.”  So then the strategy is to try to avoid that, to have plenty of preferred things.  You don’t have to to anything extra, just include it on the schedule.  Where — for schedules or lists a lot of times, it is natural to make them just have chores or tasks that are not as preferred.  

[Lecka]

This is just something I think is cute — but I have seen things like having on the schedule “go look in the cabinet” and you have put a treat in the cabinet.  

It’s corny but I think it is cute, too.  

[PeterPan]

55 minutes ago, Lecka said:

A strategy is to have alarms be for things that are highly preferred for him, so the alarm goes off and if he is paying attention etc he gets to do something highly preferred or get a reinforcer.

Oh now that's an idea, lol. I'll have to think about that, as I haven't a clue what it would be. If I set up ANY good, preferred thing on a schedule, it becomes compliance for him and will be a battle, a hill to climb, something to resist. I made break schedules (and who doesn't want a break???) and put on it nintendo, air hockey, play with balls. Like literally those with the choices. And he fought that simply because it was being required!

37 minutes ago, Lecka said:

This is just something I think is cute — but I have seen things like having on the schedule “go look in the cabinet” and you have put a treat in the cabinet.  

It’s corny but I think it is cute, too.  

Now THAT could actually work! And the setup is simple enough, I can do it whimsically too, like just tomorrow it pops up in his schedule. The app has it that way, so you can set something to recur, not recur, be on certain days, etc. Or at least I think it does. And we're building the habit of syncing every night before bed to get points. So he wouldn't know the surprise was coming and it would just be there. That would be HILARIOUS.

52 minutes ago, Lecka said:

It can be another way to take compliance out of it to some extent.  

If compliance weren't an issue, we wouldn't be doing this. If he was just like oh yeah, fine, then it would be a small thing, a quick reminder. But no, he's more like Story's boy, where life is kinda constant uphill. 

And that's why I'm saying the attitude shift here is so interesting. He's HAPPIER, calmer. It's like he's figuring out that life is dependable, consistent, going to be the same, that he's not going to get nagged. He's literally happier and our whole family situation is a little lighter. I was able to put in timers for bedtime to smooth that over. He can fall asleep and we actually have a really good routine, with a weighted blanket, etc. But to get it with the alarms and just make it happen has been SO nice. 

I don't know. i can't guarantee it will last, but it's surprising me, that's for sure. I didn't realize how much happier and calmer he would be. I think it let him see the big picture and feel like his world is orderly, predictable, low stress. The alarms go off at the same time, life is consistent.

[Lecka]

It sounds like it’s working great!

Schedules are considered something that can reduce anxiety — that might be part of it.  

They can also be a great prompt for narrating the events of a day.  

[Lecka]

It depends what you are going for, but for the preferred items, I have limited access to make it more likely to have the reinforcer overcome the lack of compliance.  

If a preferred item put on a schedule is something there is free access to, it doesn’t make as much sense on a schedule, because he could choose to play with it anytime in his choice time.  Then I have seen “choice time” or “free play time” as an item on a schedule.  

It can change from “I have to play with legos right now?” to “oh, I get to play with legos!!!!!”

Edit:  not that it always works, but sometimes it works.  

Edited June 24, 2019 by Lecka

[kbutton]

On 6/21/2019 at 12:23 AM, PeterPan said:

https://buy.garmin.com/en-US/US/p/pn/S00-00515-29  Here's the teen/tween $10 band changeout. 

Does anyone know how small this particular band goes? I have a kid with tiny wrists, but I don't think he'd want a character band. He's impossible to find a watch for unless we get a Lego watch that you can take out parts of the band. 

[Lecka]

https://www.amazon.com/iBREK-Silicone-Replacement-Vivofit-Tracker/dp/B071L2GS78/ref=mp_s_a_1_1_sspa?keywords=garmin+vivofit+jr+band&qid=1561747720&s=gateway&sr=8-1-spons&psc=1

This is 3rd party but it is solid colors.

I am wearing a 3rd party Fitbit band right now and it is fine with me.  It isn’t quite as soft as a real Fitbit band, but it’s fine with me and my original band broke!

Edit:  there are a lot of options with “related products.”  I got just a 3-pack of Fitbit bands and am still on my 1st replacement band from the pack.

But it is my 3rd Fitbit band — I got another replacement band as a single when they were still sold at local stores.  Now my model is too old and I have to order online.  

Edit:  my mom has very small wrists and weighs less than 100 pounds, and she can wear a one-size-fits-all Fitbit band fine.  They have a lot of adjustment holes, much more than regular watch bands.  

I think she weighs 95 pounds and is about 5 feet.  

It does say wrist sizes on the description on Amazon.  

Edited June 28, 2019 by Lecka

[PeterPan]

They have the measurements on the manufacturer website and you can see the fitter strip at Best Buy. My ds is using the 4th hole, so not quite tightest but 4 holes out. I think if your ds' wrist is dramatically smaller I would consider the non-adjustable strap. It also comes in a Star Wars theme I think. It's the next size down and meant for ages 2+. That's where I would start. 

https://buy.garmin.com/en-US/US/p/607993/pn/010-01909-21#

Here, they call it Stretchy. It's one size down and it should fit. If you buy from Best Buy, then you could return if it doesn't fit right.

[PeterPan]

22 minutes ago, Lecka said:

I think she weighs 95 pounds and is about 5 feet.  

I've met her ds and he really has the skinniest structure you've ever seen. I would start with the stretchy, younger size strap. 

[PeterPan]

Remember too, the coding when you sync the watch will decide what theme/games the app on the phone shows. The game is actually kinda fun for my ds. Not like stellar full time or something but cute. So I would get the watch to the theme he likes (Star Wars, Marvel, whatever) and then trade out the band as necessary. I agree a 3rd party band could work, but I would try the stretchy to get the smaller sizing. 

[Guest]

Does anyone know if this syncs to Apple Health? My DD likes the idea of being able to set reminders, etc,  and wants something that would give her benefits for her Pokémon Go account (steps taken in Apple Health count to hatch eggs). And she’s not adverse to having Star Wars or Avengers-although she would prefer Pokémon or Doctor Who....

[PeterPan]

42 minutes ago, dmmetler said:

Does anyone know if this syncs to Apple Health? My DD likes the idea of being able to set reminders, etc,  and wants something that would give her benefits for her Pokémon Go account (steps taken in Apple Health count to hatch eggs). And she’s not adverse to having Star Wars or Avengers-although she would prefer Pokémon or Doctor Who....

The Vivofit Jr is the lowest wearable they offer and does not have heart rate, etc. It uses an accelerameter to measure movement for an overall "activity" level. If you go up through the products, they add those health measurement features, which means they might be able to sync. I guess look through them and tell us what you find out! 

[Guest]

It really just needs to track steps and sync them. We’ve tried a MisFit and my Fitbit, and both tend to convert her efforts in practice to “workouts” (the MisFit thought she was swimming when she was tumbling 🙂 ), which gives her no credit for steps. She was hoping the more limited kids’ devices might actually work better for her purposes. The higher level Vivofit does sync to Apple Health, but syncs a lot more information than she wants sent. 

[PeterPan]

1 hour ago, dmmetler said:

It really just needs to track steps and sync them. We’ve tried a MisFit and my Fitbit, and both tend to convert her efforts in practice to “workouts” (the MisFit thought she was swimming when she was tumbling 🙂 ), which gives her no credit for steps. She was hoping the more limited kids’ devices might actually work better for her purposes. The higher level Vivofit does sync to Apple Health, but syncs a lot more information than she wants sent. 

I found this link https://support.garmin.com/en-US/?faq=lK5FPB9iPF5PXFkIpFlFPA saying the data from the Garmin CONNECT app can go into Apple Health. Thing is, the vivofit jr uses a different app, not that one I *think*. 

Ok, I found another page explaining how you connect them. https://help.carrotwellness.com/article/82-how-can-i-share-my-garmin-connect-data-with-apple-health-on-my-iphone  Once we finish the show we're watching, I'll play with it and see. No clue.

[PeterPan]

3 hours ago, dmmetler said:

The higher level Vivofit does sync to Apple Health, but syncs a lot more information than she wants sent. 

I have both the Vivofit Jr app and the regular Garmin Connect app on my phone, and like you say the Connect app shows in apple health to sync and the Vivofit Jr app does not show as a source. 

Is it possible she would be happy with the Vivofit Jr app for activity rewards and not even need the apple health app? It sounds like the Jr app would do what she's wanting. You'll see in the app, but everything just gets tallied as "activity" with no further breakdowns. So anything where she's in motion will count toward activity goals.

[Guest]

We went with the FitBit. The Ace/Inspire (same device, but one uses the kids’ app and one the regular one, and they come with different bands-but it also means you can get the kids’ app but use the device with a more adult looking and sized band) does what she wants, and there is an extra app that syncs to Apple Health.