OCD - what do you think of this advice? UPDATED

[Selkie]

36 minutes ago, chocolate-chip chooky said:

She's getting better with being open about it and telling me she's got an inner struggle going on. Just yesterday there was a struggle to resist washing her mouth out. She told me she felt like she really really really really needed to. We used distraction to get past that moment (maths!!). 

In the past, I've used relaxation - deep breathing, sitting her in front of a fan, brushing her hair, rubbing her shoulders etc. We tried visualisation, but she generally resisted that. It helped sometimes at bedtime, though.

What I've found is that most often though, her mind needs to be redirected with a good mental challenge. Differentiation from first principles worked wonders yesterday 😁 We got past that urge to wash out her mouth. Success!! In years past, I'd have a quiz book on hand and we'd use that. I call it breaking the loop. I try to send her brain on a different track with an engaging and challenging task.

What you are describing here has been absolutely crucial for me. My mind needs something interesting to puzzle on. Relaxation, meditation, calming imagery? Nope, nope, nope! My brain needs to be kept busy. 🙂

[chocolate-chip chooky]

2 minutes ago, Selkie said:

What you are describing here has been absolutely crucial for me. My mind needs something interesting to puzzle on. Relaxation, meditation, calming imagery? Nope, nope, nope! My brain needs to be kept busy. 🙂

Thank you for sharing this. I appreciate it.

[Pen]

On 3/24/2019 at 4:39 PM, Mergath said:

I have OCD, and I agree that advice is just bad.

Be careful if you try NAC. I tried it and while it worked well for my OCD, it also landed me in the ER with heart issues. It isn't a common side effect, but it can happen and it's something to be aware of.

 

How much NAC were you taking prior to heart issues?  

[Pen]

I wonder if this Yale University (?) study has been carried out, and if so what results:

https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT01172275

[Mergath]

10 hours ago, Pen said:

 

How much NAC were you taking prior to heart issues?  

 

I can't remember the specific dosage, but it was what was recommended on the bottle, so whatever the standard dosage is. I wasn't taking a large amount or anything. The issues went away as soon as I quit taking it, so thankfully it didn't cause any permanent damage. 

[Ausmumof3]

On 3/26/2019 at 8:04 AM, chocolate-chip chooky said:

She's getting better with being open about it and telling me she's got an inner struggle going on. Just yesterday there was a struggle to resist washing her mouth out. She told me she felt like she really really really really needed to. We used distraction to get past that moment (maths!!). 

In the past, I've used relaxation - deep breathing, sitting her in front of a fan, brushing her hair, rubbing her shoulders etc. We tried visualisation, but she generally resisted that. It helped sometimes at bedtime, though.

What I've found is that most often though, her mind needs to be redirected with a good mental challenge. Differentiation from first principles worked wonders yesterday 😁 We got past that urge to wash out her mouth. Success!! In years past, I'd have a quiz book on hand and we'd use that. I call it breaking the loop. I try to send her brain on a different track with an engaging and challenging task.

This makes perfect sense to me.  With birds when they are caged without enough stimulation they often develop obsessive grooming routines like picking all the feather out.  I think with people finding some kind of mental stimulation to break the cycle can be so important as well.

[chocolate-chip chooky]

Today is Updates from Chooky Day.

Yesterday, both the inositol and the book Brain Lock arrived.

Watch out, OCD, here we come!

 

Huge thank yous to everyone here for their support and advice 🌻

[kiwik]

I think the counsellor needs to concentrate on the cause not the symptoms.  If she was so guilty she stopped using it all together she would still have OCD.  If she washes her hand constantly with water it isn't less OCD.  If she substitutes another behaviour for handwashing it isn't really going to help us it?

[Pen]

13 hours ago, chocolate-chip chooky said:

Today is Updates from Chooky Day.

Yesterday, both the inositol and the book Brain Lock arrived.

Watch out, OCD, here we come!

 

Huge thank yous to everyone here for their support and advice 🌻

 

I hope they give at least enough help to make a noticeable positive difference.  I would like to know what the result is if you choose to share about it.  And perhaps what strategies in the book end up helping.

[chocolate-chip chooky]

8 hours ago, Pen said:

 

I hope they give at least enough help to make a noticeable positive difference.  I would like to know what the result is if you choose to share about it.  And perhaps what strategies in the book end up helping.

Thanks, Pen. Your support is much appreciated.

I'll keep you all updated. 

So far, we're two days in, starting with just 2g/day.

I'm reading Brain Lock myself first, and then I'll hand it to my daughter to read.

I feel like we're already reasonably good at the relabel step, but I'm going to hammer that home. It isn't about cleanliness, this is about OCD.

[chocolate-chip chooky]

I was telling my daughter about some of what I've read in Brain Lock so far.

We discussed relabelling and reattributing. I also told her about the 'impartial observer', where you try to mentally take a step away and look impartially at what's really happening.

With a twinkle in her eye and a whole lot of dramatic flare, she said, 'You need me to have an out-of-body experience?? So that's why you're giving me that suspicious white powder!'

😄

Edited April 6, 2019 by chocolate-chip chooky

[chocolate-chip chooky]

A little update.

We're about 10 days in with the inositol and we're up to about 5g/day.

I hadn't noticed any obvious difference, but then yesterday something happened that gives me hope.

We were about to go out and usually getting out the door takes a really really really long time, because of all of the routines (ie Os and Cs) related to getting ready. Well, yesterday, there she was, all ready to go. My surprise must have been evident because she told me she 'didn't loop'. I said something along the lines of 'that must have taken a lot of energy and effort' and she said 'I decided to be stubborn and just not loop'.

So, progress!! 

As well as using the inositol, she's reading Brain Lock, so the combo may be the key.

I'm not exactly doing cartwheels up and down the hall squealing 'she's cured, she's cured', but I am feeling more optimistic. 🙂

[chocolate-chip chooky]

Update:

My daughter (13) started inositol in early April, so it's been about 3 months now. We started slowly and have built up to a heaped teaspoon per day.

I don't ever want to be without inositol!!

It's like the volume has been turned down on her OCD. It's there, but it's manageable, and it's not this huge monster controlling her life anymore. 

I won't bore you all with all the details, but wow, she's come a long way in 3 months.

Wow.

i can't thank you all enough for this recommendation 🌻

[Pen]

1 hour ago, chocolate-chip chooky said:

Update:

My daughter (13) started inositol in early April, so it's been about 3 months now. We started slowly and have built up to a heaped teaspoon per day.

I don't ever want to be without inositol!!

It's like the volume has been turned down on her OCD. It's there, but it's manageable, and it's not this huge monster controlling her life anymore. 

I won't bore you all with all the details, but wow, she's come a long way in 3 months.

Wow.

i can't thank you all enough for this recommendation 🌻

 

Excellent!  I’m so glad that went well.

 

Now, with the edge off I want to highly recommend a book—you may need to read it and explain it, or maybe she can read it or listen to you as a read aloud.   (The Audible audio was read by author and alas while I think it’s overall a wonderful book, he’s not a good reader IMO, but if that’s best option, I’d go for it).

Apply “use what works and leave the rest””.” For example, he has places where becoming okay with nuclear radiation and pesticides are goals for a couple of OCD cases he describes. Personally, I think he’s wrong about pesticides and nuclear radiation being safe.  But the concepts are still important and the system will work for many people.  For me though if I ask myself whether pesticides are actually dangerous or is it my anxiety, my answer is they really are dangerous.  

Brain Lock, Twentieth Anniversary Edition: Free Yourself from Obsessive-Compulsive Behavior https://www.amazon.com/dp/006256143X/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_YdMiDbHKTS8Q3

dont skip intro and preface! They bring it up to date to some degree from the original over 20 years ago book

 

not only does this “work (or help) if you work it,” some brain scan studies seemed to show improvement from just listening multiple times—though, nowhere near as helpful as actually practicing the system it recommends 

 

[Pen]

Adding— the book above is sort of like CBT, but it’s easier system to do.  

And I can summarize the steps, but the many examples and repetitions imo help to understand 

[Pen]

The basic steps of BrainLock— good practice for me to summarize and explain the basics maybe!— are:

RELABEL

REATTRIBUTE

REFOCUS

REVALUE

 

Step one: so to start with hand washing example one has to question the urge or action— is it something a person without OCD or anxiety should do? Like after using toilet or before preparing food it’s a correct thing to do so long as not going overboard in duration or harshness...

or is this something being driven as a compulsion that’s the OCD brain lock?

if it’s being driven by unhealthy anxiety RELABEL  for example,  ETA I now realize this is already into step two — if it’s not normal and healthy then REATTRIBUTE:  “that’s not me, that’s my anxiety”

[Step two - fourI will  have to think about in hand wash context (probably there is a hand washing example in book, but not in my family so I didn’t pay a lot of attention to that ).]

step 3 REFOCUS could be

instead of washing my hands I’m going to ... work in the garden, practice the guitar, make my bed... 

 

or could be: I *am* going to wash my hands now because I’ve decided that prior to food preparation it is the right thing to do— for a reasonable time and amount — and then I’m going to make dinner

 

REVALUE then has to do with reassessing oneself as a person who is able to control these urges and able to live in a world of grey areas and make good decisions that further ones goals for oneself 

iirc

 

eta since she’s read much of it, could you ask her if she agrees with my summary of the 4 steps, and if not share back her different understanding?

Edited July 7, 2019 by Pen

[Pen]

Here’s btw a you tube with the author:

 

there are others too if you search

[chocolate-chip chooky]

@Pen  Thank you so much for all of your support and advice 🌻

Yes, we already have Brain Lock. I bought it at the same time that we started the Inositol. My daughter hasn't read it cover to cover, but she has read a lot of it. She particularly liked reading the case studies. Seeing the brain scan images was really helpful too. It helps to know that there's a portion of the brain that is hypermetabolic and 'overheats' and gets stuck.

Thank you so much. Your input has been so helpful.

[Pen]

18 minutes ago, chocolate-chip chooky said:

@Pen  Thank you so much for all of your support and advice 🌻

Yes, we already have Brain Lock. I bought it at the same time that we started the Inositol. My daughter hasn't read it cover to cover, but she has read a lot of it. She particularly liked reading the case studies. Seeing the brain scan images was really helpful too. It helps to know that there's a portion of the brain that is hypermetabolic and 'overheats' and gets stuck.

Thank you so much. Your input has been so helpful.

 

Good!

Inositol works well alone, and then bit by bit getting the book in mind should help as she continues through life!

Could you look back at my revised 4 step Brain Lock summary and see if your dd has a similar understanding or if not help refresh my understanding of it?

[chocolate-chip chooky]

20 hours ago, Pen said:

 

Good!

Inositol works well alone, and then bit by bit getting the book in mind should help as she continues through life!

Could you look back at my revised 4 step Brain Lock summary and see if your dd has a similar understanding or if not help refresh my understanding of it?

This is our understanding:

Step 1: Relabel - recognise the OCD and label it as such. This puts some space between you and the thought.

Step 2: Reattribute - say to yourself: this is not me, it's the OCD. This is not about clean hands. It's about OCD. My overheating brain is misfiring.

Step 3: Refocus - move away physically and mentally. Get your mind and body busy with something else immediately.

Step 4: Revalue - OCD starts to get less power and less value in your life