Music lessons in college

[Roadrunner]

Are there any colleges that would allow a non music major to take private music lessons?

[kokotg]

There are tons. I've checked most of the schools my DS has applied to, and every one I've checked offers it as an option....some of the very selective schools with great endowments even offer free lessons for everyone.

[lewelma]

My son takes private music lessons from MIT and he is not a music major. 

[Roadrunner]

4 minutes ago, kokotg said:

There are tons. I've checked most of the schools my DS has applied to, and every one I've checked offers it as an option....some of the very selective schools with great endowments even offer free lessons for everyone.

Do you have a list of those who offer free? Do you know if Williams is one of them?

[kokotg]

I don't have a list, but I thought Williams was one and I just googled to confirm. I know a few different schools we toured in the NE mentioned it, but they all ran together after awhile, so I can't remember specifics! 

[Guest]

Pretty much any school with a music department will. Typically, non-credit lessons will be arranged through the community or prep program, and will be a per-hour fee. Lessons for credit will be charged as a regular class (usually with an additional fee-at the U I taught at, it was the same as for a science lab), and will usually be with faculty.  

 

If if you want to take lessons or do ensembles, the student will need to audition. It depends on the school as to how that is managed, espeically for non-majors. 

[Roadrunner]

54 minutes ago, dmmetler said:

Pretty much any school with a music department will. Typically, non-credit lessons will be arranged through the community or prep program, and will be a per-hour fee. Lessons for credit will be charged as a regular class (usually with an additional fee-at the U I taught at, it was the same as for a science lab), and will usually be with faculty.  

 

If if you want to take lessons or do ensembles, the student will need to audition. It depends on the school as to how that is managed, espeically for non-majors. 

 

So could a non major take a private lesson for credit without paying extra fee? 

 

[catz]

MANY will.  However, some will require an audition especially to work with faculty (instead of a grad student).  So ask at each individual school you are interested in.  Ask about ensemble opportunities for non-majors as well.  My kid is applying to music programs this year and many schools he's looked at have lesson fees for non-majors but included with those accepted to the music major.  

[Guest]

It would be the same cost for a major at many state U’s. It simply costs more for the department to offer private lessons, and every hour a professor spends teaching 1-1, she cannot teach a class. Some schools will let you take lessons on your major instrument for regular tuition if you are a major, but add fees for secondary instruments.

 

Having said that, one of my suggestions for advanced high school students is that it is often cheaper to take college private lessons for credit, even paying full tuition and extra fees, than to take private lessons independently with an instructor of similar caliber. 

Edited March 20, 2019 by dmmetler

[catz]

Oh well, my kid got accepted to at least 2 programs that include a 1 hour weekly lesson with music faculty as long as you are a full time music major student and you just pay the base full time tuition.  One is an LAC but one is a public flagship.  Honestly, I haven't looked at the other programs he is considering that closely for those type of details. 

[Roadrunner]

1 hour ago, FuzzyCatz said:

Oh well, my kid got accepted to at least 2 programs that include a 1 hour weekly lesson with music faculty as long as you are a full time music major student and you just pay the base full time tuition.  One is an LAC but one is a public flagship.  Honestly, I haven't looked at the other programs he is considering that closely for those type of details. 

 

Thats how it was when I was a student. I am just afraid they are going to tack on $150 a week for lessons. That would be a no no. And double major with music is super tough given all the requirements that are 1 credit units and take outrageous amount of time. 

[Guest]

It usually would be more like $150 semester on top of tuition-even at the private college here, it’s $490/semester on top of $1,990 tuition (for a one credit hour lesson)-and the additional fee is waived if you have a music scholarship. 

[City Mouse]

My DD was allowed to enroll in private lesson as a non-major. As a non music major, she would normally have been limited to the lessons given by grad students, but because of her instrument she was allowed to take the majors only lessons directly with the professor as there were no grad students for her instrument. I do remember taking her for some sort of audition process when she was still in high school, but I don't remember any details of what or why. 

[whitestavern]

Any University of Rochester student can take free music lessons at the Eastman School.

[catz]

4 hours ago, whitestavern said:

Any University of Rochester student can take free music lessons at the Eastman School.

Interesting!.  With a grad student or with faculty?  Or maybe by audition?  Do you have a student there? My kid was accepted to URochester, but not invited to audition at Eastman.   This process is completely unpredictable for VP, he did get invited to audition at a couple other programs that are probably similar in terms of acceptance rate anyway.  He is an out of the box VP applicant as well and applied double degree.  Not all music faculty is excited about students interested in dual degree or multi-interested musicians we've discovered either.

Rochester is not a super realistic financial option for my kid.  It's WAY more expensive than his other 3 options right now which were offers by auditions  (+ 1  music waitlist).  Waiting on one more.  

Edited March 21, 2019 by FuzzyCatz

[Roadrunner]

3 hours ago, FuzzyCatz said:

Interesting!.  With a grad student or with faculty?  Or maybe by audition?  Do you have a student there? My kid was accepted to URochester, but not invited to audition at Eastman.   This process is completely unpredictable for VP, he did get invited to audition at a couple other programs that are probably similar in terms of acceptance rate anyway.  He is an out of the box VP applicant as well and applied double degree.  Not all music faculty is excited about students interested in dual degree or multi-interested musicians we've discovered either.

Rochester is not a super realistic financial option for my kid.  It's WAY more expensive than his other 3 options right now which were offers by auditions  (+ 1  music waitlist).  Waiting on one more.  

 

I thought Eastman Conservatory would have a somewhat autonomous admissions process. I didn’t realize you have to be invited to audition! 

[mathnerd]

In the local universities that have strong music departments, they allow any student to take music lessons with professors after an audition. The advanced level lessons have requirements for repertoire and musicianship skills, but the introductory classes have no audition requirement, obviously.

The cost of lessons is much lesser than what it costs for lessons for my son with a highly qualified music teacher in my community! They charge per quarter and there is a nominal fee for practice room access which becomes very important depending on the instrument.

Though their policy states that any student can take lessons with faculty, what I hear from parents with kids in those universities is that the top faculty always choose students who have very high caliber, have won various prestigious competitions, perform at a semi-professional level and are referred to them by their previous teachers. Most others end up taking lessons with grad students. There are endowments and scholarship funds that the students taking private lessons can apply for through auditions.

[Roadrunner]

1 hour ago, mathnerd said:

In the local universities that have strong music departments, they allow any student to take music lessons with professors after an audition. The advanced level lessons have requirements for repertoire and musicianship skills, but the introductory classes have no audition requirement, obviously.

The cost of lessons is much lesser than what it costs for lessons for my son with a highly qualified music teacher in my community! They charge per quarter and there is a nominal fee for practice room access which becomes very important depending on the instrument.

Though their policy states that any student can take lessons with faculty, what I hear from parents with kids in those universities is that the top faculty always choose students who have very high caliber, have won various prestigious competitions, perform at a semi-professional level and are referred to them by their previous teachers. Most others end up taking lessons with grad students. There are endowments and scholarship funds that the students taking private lessons can apply for through auditions.

 

Which universities are those? I want to scratch them of my list. 

[catz]

4 hours ago, Roadrunner said:

 

I thought Eastman Conservatory would have a somewhat autonomous admissions process. I didn’t realize you have to be invited to audition! 

Yes, they have a pre-screen process and a holistic admissions process before you get invited to even come to audition on campus.  I do think it serves kids well to try and visit campus BEFORE auditions and try to have a sample lesson and get in and talk to faculty.  My kid did uniformly do better at schools he pre-visited prior to auditions.  Unfortunately we couldn't get to Eastman.  Which is fine.  This is a process where having unlimited funds both for admissions and for tuition would be nice but that's not us.

Now that we're getting more to the tail end of this yucky process, as a high stat academic kid wanting to double degree he has definitely done better with schools of music set in universities.  Those teachers seem to like that he has lots of musical interests and has some academic chops and that maybe he isn't on a traditional performing path.  He also really could show his stuff much better in a live audition.  Prescreen videos are a very poor substitute.  

[mathnerd]

1 hour ago, Roadrunner said:

 

Which universities are those? I want to scratch them of my list. 

UCs, Stanford, SCU etc. But, what I said applies to non-music majors who are enthusiastic about learning an instrument. If say, a Computer Science major or Math major excels in an instrument at national and international competitions, then it is a different scenario and it seems that the professors would teach them and mentor them.

[Roadrunner]

34 minutes ago, mathnerd said:

UCs, Stanford, SCU etc. But, what I said applies to non-music majors who are enthusiastic about learning an instrument. If say, a Computer Science major or Math major excels in an instrument at national and international competitions, then it is a different scenario and it seems that the professors would teach them and mentor them.

 

More reason to scratch UCs off the list. Mine will be at a conservatory level, but the last time we went to the competition, two parents sat up front and shuffled the papers loud. They were foreigners (spoke either Chinese or Korean). My kid wants nothing to do with competitions because some parents are so toxic. And we found the same at sports events in the Bay Area. He also doesn’t want to major in music. 

I think this is even more reason for us to focus on LACs.

 

Edited March 22, 2019 by Roadrunner

[Roadrunner]

46 minutes ago, FuzzyCatz said:

Yes, they have a pre-screen process and a holistic admissions process before you get invited to even come to audition on campus.  I do think it serves kids well to try and visit campus BEFORE auditions and try to have a sample lesson and get in and talk to faculty.  My kid did uniformly do better at schools he pre-visited prior to auditions.  Unfortunately we couldn't get to Eastman.  Which is fine.  This is a process where having unlimited funds both for admissions and for tuition would be nice but that's not us.

Now that we're getting more to the tail end of this yucky process, as a high stat academic kid wanting to double degree he has definitely done better with schools of music set in universities.  Those teachers seem to like that he has lots of musical interests and has some academic chops and that maybe he isn't on a traditional performing path.  He also really could show his stuff much better in a live audition.  Prescreen videos are a very poor substitute.  

 

It’s really hard to double major in music because of all the ensemble participation requirements and all the concerts and practice time that gives you nothing in terms of credit. 

 

I hope you get other great choices!  

 

[mathnerd]

11 minutes ago, Roadrunner said:

 

More reason to scratch UCs off the list. Mine will be at a conservatory level, but the last time we went to the competition, two parents sat up front and shuffled the papers loud. They were foreigners (spoke either Chinese or Korean). My kid wants nothing to do with competitions because some parents are so toxic. And we found the same at sports events in the Bay Area. He also doesn’t want to major in music. 

I think this is even more reason for us to focus on LACs.

 

This may be off topic, but if competitions are a turn off because of the aggressive parents and competitors, you may want to explore the competitions that are audition-based where you send in a video of the performance and the judging is based on the video entry and you never have to see another toxic parent who loads up a mini generator onto a pickup truck so that their genius can warm up just before the piano competition on a keyboard specially designated for this purpose (in the parking lot in front of a lot of people) and nail the first prize! (true story from the bay area!) There are many competitions that have gone online-only because of these complaints. Your music teacher might be able to point you in the right direction.

[Roadrunner]

9 minutes ago, mathnerd said:

This may be off topic, but if competitions are a turn off because of the aggressive parents and competitors, you may want to explore the competitions that are audition-based where you send in a video of the performance and the judging is based on the video entry and you never have to see another toxic parent who loads up a mini generator onto a pickup truck so that their genius can warm up just before the piano competition on a keyboard specially designated for this purpose (in the parking lot in front of a lot of people) and nail the first prize! (true story from the bay area!) There are many competitions that have gone online-only because of these complaints. Your music teacher might be able to point you in the right direction.

 

We have seen a teenager getting slapped in front of a crowd by a mother. The level of crazy is something else.

[catz]

12 hours ago, Roadrunner said:

 

It’s really hard to double major in music because of all the ensemble participation requirements and all the concerts and practice time that gives you nothing in terms of credit. 

 

I hope you get other great choices!  

 

Yes, the double major dilemma!  He may not end up completing a dual degree (BM/BA)  or possible double major (BA/BA) but he REALLY wants to try!   He does come in with 32 DE credits and is a strong piano player (that is actually his first instrument) so I think he should be able to test out of any piano requirements.  So that end will potentially help a bit.

And thank you - I think he will end up in a good place for him and he is thinking toward grad school too so I'm glad we took time to look at a big range of options even if many don't seem right for an undergrad experience for him.  It's been hard to balance his desire for good academics and music and faculty who are happy to have a quirky academic kid double degree.  He has had a couple very enthusiastic music faculty reach out to him.  

Music competitions are not my kid's cuppa either.  He did them when he was younger and he was a very good little pianist.  People would throw the word prodigy around.  I hate that work BTW.   The tiger mothers would come swirling with questions about his background and preparation and snide remarks.  Not our scene at all.  He is much more interested in collaborative programs and opportunities.