What helped you when your child was in public school?

[Kanin]

In just a few weeks, I’m starting a new job as a special education teacher in PUBLIC SCHOOL! It’s a pretty cool K-8 school, and I’ll be one of two special ed teachers. My caseload will be grades K-4. I’m not sure exactly how many kids that will be, but I don’t think it’s too many. Everything about the school sounds great so far - but I won’t even be local for another week. When I get there, I can finally get my hands on the files of “my” kids. ?

My previous experience is all at independent schools, and most recently at a school that is exclusively for students with learning disabilities. I have zero experience with public schools. I’m pretty nervous about handling all of the paperwork that goes along with public school special ed, but I have some trainings coming up, and hopefully I won’t mess things up too badly. As far as interventions, the materials at the PS will be much more limited than at my previous school, which is fine. The principal is very willing to purchase materials, which is great (shopping!) ? 

My main concern is doing a good job communicating with parents, and facilitating IEP meetings and such in a way that makes them feel confident. In my previous job, I only had 7 students, and you’d think it would be easy to keep up with communicating with their parents, but somehow I always fell behind. The parents there were also pretty well versed in the special ed lingo, since they had been fighting for a placement for sometimes years. 

For those of you who had/have kids in the PS, could you share experiences of what teachers did that was really helpful, or NOT helpful? I really want to start this school year off on a great foot.

[PeterPan]

Our state has paperwork for every stage of IEP stuff. I hope you like it. I hear ps SLPs spend 50% of their time on paperwork. Keep us posted!

[Pen]

I had so really good SPED experience and some not so good. I’ll try to think through what made the good experiences good in a way I can articulate. 

[Kanin]

16 minutes ago, PeterPan said:

Our state has paperwork for every stage of IEP stuff. I hope you like it. I hear ps SLPs spend 50% of their time on paperwork. Keep us posted!

I will for sure keep you updated! I’m excited/nervous. My new principal said that when the special ed teachers get overwhelmed with paperwork, sometimes he has them work from home while he hires a substitute to teach for them for a day. That sounds a bit ominous...

I really want to be the teacher that parents remember as one of their good experiences.

[Lecka]

Like my kid.  It comes across.  It’s the main thing.

 

[Pen]

GOOD SITUATION

Available

Kind

Encouraging

Calm

Positive

FeLT like we worked together as team to discover how to help dc

 

Knew names and faces of all her kids and spoke to them often—even now that Ds is many years out of his IEP, when his 3rd 4th grade SPED teacher sees him at middle or high school she has asked him how he is doing etc 

 

Knows at least faces, though not sure about names, of parent(s) of her kids and what parent gave goes with what kid. Also even now years after IEP takes a moment when she sees me to ask me how things are going 

 

Made effort to make rules work to get good help for dc rather than interpreting them to avoid help.  This included writing the IEP so that ds could get help at the school while homeschooling  and including reading help at a point that I had remediated reading to where it did not itself qualify for services  But his writing did still qualify and reading time got thrown in  

 

Knew some places to call to try to try to find additional help beyond what school could do  (felt supportive and helpful rather than at point of something being outside what school could do having no ideas or knowledge)   Including a suggestion of someone in area who could do more detailed LD evaluations  

 

She was also just plain out a good teacher.

 

Not so good situation. Person seems to get frustrated with dc too easily instead of trying to figure out how to help. Not so good, dismissing issues or narrowly construing rules that can be used. Wanting dc to fit into an existing box instead of trying to figure out how to fit the dc with resources available or obtainable.  Calling home with “your dc is _____” and expecting parent to fix the problem going on at school  

A less good SPED teacher has LD problems which is good in terms of relating to the kids but has problems of one often disorganized person trying to help a  5 classes a day of disorganized kids get organized  

 

[Kanin]

Thanks guys! Keep ‘em coming!

[displace]

Having initial paperwork for parents to review before a meeting would have been helpful.  Being presented with services (or lack thereof) at the meeting and blindsiding parents is par for the course here.  It’s very frustrating for the parents I’ve spoken with to learn of lack of services or discontinuing services at a meeting and need to fight for them on the spot.  I bet around here it’s a tactical, intentional decision.  But if you can do it differently, I would.  

[Kanin]

On 7/26/2018 at 7:09 PM, displace said:

Having initial paperwork for parents to review before a meeting would have been helpful.  Being presented with services (or lack thereof) at the meeting and blindsiding parents is par for the course here.  It’s very frustrating for the parents I’ve spoken with to learn of lack of services or discontinuing services at a meeting and need to fight for them on the spot.  I bet around here it’s a tactical, intentional decision.  But if you can do it differently, I would.  

This is a great idea - I will definitely attempt to do that!

[Lecka]

I sometimes request draft paperwork.

What happens sometimes is that you, personally, aren’t the one doing all the testing or writing all the goals or deciding on everything by yourself.

There may be speech therapists, OTs, a vice-principal, a special education department representative, a classroom teacher, etc.  

So for me part of the thing with getting the draft info is that — depending on how they have things set up — if the speech therapist just updated testing in the month before, you as the special ed teacher might not have had a lot of chance to see that updated testing, either.  If it was significant then probably something was mentioned or emailed.  But it also might not have been shown to you, or maybe the speech therapist got her stuff ready for the IEP meeting, or..... it’s hard to explain, but if there is a big team you might be in meetings hearing things that are new to you, also.  I think that happens even when there is good colloboration.  

Also there may be a LEA representative.  Where I used to live this was the vice-principal, where I live now it’s a representative of the district special education department.  You as the teacher may not know what this person is going to think at the meeting.  This person may be really out-of-touch with what happens in your classroom.  Maybe, maybe not.  

The school psychologist may give a report, you may or may not have had prior access to it.  The school psychologist may have little idea what you do in your classroom.  The school psychologist may have a different take on things than you do.  

I think ideally maybe they upload stuff onto the computer ahead of time and you see it ahead of time, but I think it is possible that for what you personally can do, you can only provide ahead of time the stuff that you personally are doing.  And then that could adjust based on what other people say at the meeting.  

What I think can be possible sometimes is — if you find out the policy for requesting drafts ahead of time is, then you can share that with parents.  

I have also had a form come home asking me about my thoughts and concerns. 

You could potentially put something on there reminding parents that they can have someone attend with them or request a draft if they want.

I think also, it is great if you mention way ahead of time things about possible changes in placement or reduction in services.  Give a lot of warning it might be coming.  On the other hand, if parents are hoping for a reduction in services but you think the kid may stay in the same level, it is really helpful to give a lot of warning about the kinds of things looked at, and mention the supports you are providing in some way.

I think it depends on what age you are working with, but for younger kids, I have seen so much that kids thrive with supports, and then the parents think they will have a change in placement, but the school wants to keep the child where they are because they don’t think it will go well without the supports.  Then talking early about how to try fading supports and seeing how it goes can be good.  

It is really ironic but depending on what is going on with your students, a lot of times parents either want more, or else they want less.

Sometimes parents want less because they want their kids to be given more of a chance, and they think they can make it in a higher placement if they just get the chance.  

Sometimes parents really want more services than are being offered.  

It will depend on your students but you may have more one way or the other.  

 

[Lecka]

What is hard too is parents don’t all want the same things.  I had trouble (like miscommunication) once with a teacher who was doing things like a parent of a child one year older had liked them.  We are similar parents in many ways so I can see why.  But it turned out we had different priorities than the other parents and wanted different decisions.  

I think asking questions goes a long way.  

[PeterPan]

On July 26, 2018 at 7:09 PM, displace said:

Having initial paperwork for parents to review before a meeting would have been helpful.  Being presented with services (or lack thereof) at the meeting and blindsiding parents is par for the course here.  It’s very frustrating for the parents I’ve spoken with to learn of lack of services or discontinuing services at a meeting and need to fight for them on the spot.  I bet around here it’s a tactical, intentional decision.  But if you can do it differently, I would.  

 

1 hour ago, Mainer said:

This is a great idea - I will definitely attempt to do that!

Just to lessen Mainer's guilt a bit, could I say that there's a difference between the law and what would be nice and that Mainer should not feel compelled to go beyond the law. Like everybody knows I fought my ps 4 rounds, 3 calendar years, to get just my ds' disabling condition correct. I'd never even let my ds in the room with my ds' ps assigned IS (intervention specialist) because she's not qualified or knowledgeable enough to work with him. So it's not like I'm some huge lover of the system. However reality is the woman is a NICE woman, skillful in some things, NOT the enemy (being unknowledgeable does not make you the enemy), and she's worked HARD. For the times when she has run our IEP meetings (not often, because they've been litigious), reality is she was not kicking out stuff ahead because she was BOOKED, pushed hard. 

So me, I'm cool, I can control my emotions and my anxiety, I can be grown-up and say thanks and let me think about that before I sign, and I can walk. I take people with me to help me sort things out so I don't feel so rushed or stressed. If the law SAYS you have to present it ahead of time when they ask, fine. But if the law doesn't say that, then it's ok to follow the law and help them chill and help them feel supported.

I personally think the problem is that the school both has the emotional role of making the parent feel that their dc is being supported optimally and provided services optimally, that everything will be fine, AND the role of saving money, not overworking themselves, not over-committing the school. It's a really nasty line to walk, seems to me. 

At our school the actual writing of the IEP is collaborative. I take my workers and we go in with our list. They have their draft, and we just read through it. It's really not that big a deal. And actually, since we homeschool, they sit with me as the teacher and go through everything ahead and write down what I'm saying and what I as the teacher think ought to be in there. So that's where I whip out my common core and look at the goals and say this grade, these goals, etc. Common Core is actually really easy in some ways to fit into our WTM expectations. When you understand what you're wanting, it's there, which is really cool. It has made it easy to work with them. Their goals tended to be floaty till I started printing out CC and saying hey, why don't we have this goal and this goal. They couldn't buck that, since it's sorta the law of the land, lol. So now I have goals that actually make sense.

1 hour ago, Lecka said:

What is hard too is parents don’t all want the same things.

I really think this is true. And personally, if I never hear again from an IS or an SLP or an OT "Oh, but my dc does that too!" I'd be much happier. I can't tell you how many times people do that as a way to gloss disabilities, and I get SO tired of it. How about actually going back to the LAW and DATA??? Nope, they just tell me their kids do that so it's not an issue. And then what am I supposed to do, point out that their kid's IQ is 30 points lower and that it PROBABLY isn't a sensible comparison??? Nope, obviously I don't say that. That's why I was finally like CC is the law, so use CC and actual test data and don't blow me off by referring to your kids. 

The other thing, which I KNOW Mainer would never do, is tell a Mom to go on a medication because she's on it and it's GREAT and would solve her problems.  For real, someone in an IEP meeting ACTUALLY SAID THIS to me. It was unbelievable. So then I got paid lawyers and more people on my team and it stopped. That person, toast, no longer on the team. LOL But see Mainer is so sensible, she would never do that. We don't even have to say that, lol.

The general tenor of IEP meetings has surprised me. These people are friends and they socialize. Like I know about my IEP team IS's DOG for pity's sake. I know about her kids and all sorts of stuff. I think they do it to diffuse the tension. I really have to work at that, because that's not how I roll, lol. 

The good thing about the IS for my ds' IEP team is that she really listens. Like she might not be the most whatever, but she actually LISTENS and collaborates. That goes a long, long way with me. Now I say that, and I had one come through who didn't listen but was screaming competent. I could actually work with that too. But I guess they're sort of inverse presentations. I think you find your groove on who you are. I'll just say I like feeling like I was listened to, like my observations mattered. It goes a long way in smoothing things over I think. 

If you set up unrealistic expectations for yourself, you'll burn out. I haven't seen stats, but I think it's a high burnout field. You don't want to be stoic or dispassionate, but you'll have to find a place to put your emotions and a way to balance all this out, kind of a long-term view that gives you peace.

[Lecka]

For me with my kids actually in public school..... the teacher has a close relationship with my child, likes my child, and works with my child.  

I get more frustrated with the people at the meetings who have either met my kid for a limited amount of time, never met him, make broad generalizations that I know the teachers don’t agree with, etc.  

But the teacher is just one little part of an IEP meeting.  

And then — that meeting is a small part of the year *when things are going well and there’s  not any changes.*  

That is how it has been for me lately, with no particular behavior issues and no particular work avoidance on my son’s part.  Then if I think the teacher likes my son, everything is going well.   So I like where he is and I am happy with his progress!  

When parents aren’t happy with progress, services, or their child’s well-being ———— that is when I see problems.  

[PeterPan]

Guess I'm missing whether Mainer is going to be in a classroom as a teacher. Around here the IS are pullouts and they run the IEP meetings. That's what I was referring to. But you're right, if she's in a classroom it's different from what I was describing. The IS coordinates a lot with the IEP around here, so things like providing a draft to parents and having that conversation would be with that person, not the classroom teacher. But really, I don't think they call anyone special ed anymore in our area. That's why I was confused. I've never heard anybody use that term at all about services my ds would receive and who would be working with him if he were there. Teachers, IS, self-contained, blah blah, but never called special ed. Not here at least.

[Lecka]

Really I feel like the primary relationship is between my child and the teacher.  The teacher and I are both wanting the best for him.  

I think that is the ideal, to have that level of trust.

But frankly a lot of things work against that trust and your parents may have had bad experiences or just unpleasant or disappointing experiences, and then they may not be looking for that.

I want that now but for that to happen, my son has to be stable.  He hasn’t always been stable and then — I have to try my best to get him stable, and on some level I will feel like if he’s not stable then something is not being done the right way.  But that is not the same as feeling like it is anyone’s fault.

But it is a different relationship on my side when *my son* is doing well or not-so-well.  

But it’s not that it’s anyone’s fault, it is just how it is sometimes.  

But it is all so much easier when he is doing well!  

[Lecka]

If your son had a different placement you might hear it.  

I hear it for one of my kids, but my older son had an IEP for years and was never considered to be in Special Education.  

He was also in pull-out into a resource room for two years and was never considered to be in Special Education.  

But as I found when we moved, “resource room” doesn’t mean the same thing between here and there.  Here they call it “Academic Intervention Services,” and resource room is much higher-support.  

[Lecka]

Peter Pan — I think this terminology matters for you.

A few years ago, didn’t you have someone from school tell you your son wouldn’t be in Special Education, and you thought that meant he wouldn’t get any IEP services or have an IEP?  

So your son is probably not considered to be in Special Education.

I think this could come up with you for high school, if you want him to stay in high school longer.  That is more of a Special Education thing.  We can already say — my son most likely will qualify for that.  It’s most likely not something where I will have to “make it happen.”  

If your son is not someone they see as needing to stay in high school longer, it may be something where you need to work to “make it happen” when he is older.  

It might not matter since you are homeschooling, but if he might do any programs when he is older, they may look at his IEP for eligibility and some things are more for kids in Special Education or kids whose parents got their IEP changed in high school because they think those programs are a good fit.  

Because having an IEP is not the same as being in Special Education.  

I don’t know all about this — but it has been this way both places I have lived.  

And — many, if not most, kids with autism are not in Special Education placements.  Ime most do have IEPs but are not in Special Education placements.

But you would have to ask around locally to see how it is where you live.  

But as far as what I mentioned to you, they only mention to you what applies to your situation, or what they perceive as applying to your situation.  

I really see this with having all 3 of my kids on an IEP at some point.  One — speech therapy only for a couple of sounds, for part of first grade.  One — speech, OT, resource room, diagnosed only with dysgraphia.  One — all kinds of services, originally diagnosed with severe autism, now diagnosed with moderate autism.  

It has been totally different between the three of them.  Only my son diagnosed with autism is in Special Education.  

[Lecka]

It’s true though too, things are called different things in different places.  

 

[Kanin]

3 hours ago, PeterPan said:

I really think this is true. And personally, if I never hear again from an IS or an SLP or an OT "Oh, but my dc does that too!" I'd be much happier. I can't tell you how many times people do that as a way to gloss disabilities, and I get SO tired of it. How about actually going back to the LAW and DATA??? Nope, they just tell me their kids do that so it's not an issue. And then what am I supposed to do, point out that their kid's IQ is 30 points lower and that it PROBABLY isn't a sensible comparison??? Nope, obviously I don't say that. That's why I was finally like CC is the law, so use CC and actual test data and don't blow me off by referring to your kids. 

The other thing, which I KNOW Mainer would never do, is tell a Mom to go on a medication because she's on it and it's GREAT and would solve her problems.  For real, someone in an IEP meeting ACTUALLY SAID THIS to me. It was unbelievable. So then I got paid lawyers and more people on my team and it stopped. That person, toast, no longer on the team. LOL But see Mainer is so sensible, she would never do that. We don't even have to say that, lol.

Ha, yeah... I won't suggest a kid go on my own personal medication. Lol. 

[Kanin]

2 hours ago, PeterPan said:

Guess I'm missing whether Mainer is going to be in a classroom as a teacher. Around here the IS are pullouts and they run the IEP meetings. That's what I was referring to. But you're right, if she's in a classroom it's different from what I was describing. The IS coordinates a lot with the IEP around here, so things like providing a draft to parents and having that conversation would be with that person, not the classroom teacher. But really, I don't think they call anyone special ed anymore in our area. That's why I was confused. I've never heard anybody use that term at all about services my ds would receive and who would be working with him if he were there. Teachers, IS, self-contained, blah blah, but never called special ed. Not here at least.

Sadly, I won't have a self-contained classroom this year. Or maybe that's a good thing? I'll let you know. On the one hand, it might be less pressure because you aren't responsible for every facet of a kid's education... but sometimes I really liked teaching it all, language arts, math, social studies... so I could be sure things were done my way. Maybe a little controlling? ?

Lecka, thanks for sharing your experience. I agree with you that the relationship between the child and teacher is the primary thing. I just worry that, though my relationship might be great, time limitations and resources may dictate a less-than-excellent learning experience. We shall see!

PeterPan, I have read that special education teachers frequently last just 5 years, and that lots of general ed teachers take a special ed job, because schools are just really desperate and can waive the requirements for special ed teachers, and then they switch to a general ed job as soon as they can. 

[Lecka]

Well, from what I have seen, you may be able to have kids as much as they need.  Some kids can learn in regular classes but still need extra help, and then some kids aren’t getting much out of regular class time.  I think that is a big thing they look at.  And then if some kids are spending less time with you because they are benefiting from time in the classroom, hopefully that is a good learning experience for those kids.